I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you. I live in Finland and I'm not depressed... sorry if my spelling is wrong, I'm not very good at English. Actually, today, after school, I went out with my best friend, and it's almost winter allready! it's getting darker day by day... but I enjoy the darknes 'cause winter is the only time of the year when I can sleep properly and it's not too hot for me... non of my family members ows a gun, by the way, I have one kilometres walk to school, my dad doesn't allow me to use internet more than an hour a day, actually even right now he's watching what the hell am I doing... I don't see my friends very much at summer 'cause I'll spend it in Spain. But normal kids usually are out for whole day with their friends at summer. I don't take my phone to school with me, and my parents pay the bill so it's not allowed to be over five euros, othervice I won't get my monthlyallowance. yeah, and we don't have a lake between our neighbour's and our house.

Iida, Kotka, Finland

I lived in Finland for several years while studying the language and I must agree with the journalist's analysis. It is a very lonely society with very little real communication. Men only talk when they are drunk or in the sauna (or both) so women have to do all the social networking. As a foreigner I find it much easier to talk to Finnish women than the mute Finnish men. Talking to strangers is however a rare thing in Finland (no-one sits next to you in the bus until all window seats are takes). Only the Finnish Swedes seem open to foreign visitors (maybe as they are living on the edge of Finnish society). It is a beautiful country, a wonderful language and there is lots of great art, but the Finns are generally not easy to get to know. They send zillion of x-mas cards to each other, but like with sms's it is just superficial relations. When you finally get to know someone, it can become very, if not too intensive. Finland is basically an acquired taste. Good luck to any expats!

John, Ã…rhus, Denmark

The beauty of Finland and its people surpasses anything I have witnessed anywhere else in the world, and I am sorry that Roger Boyes has found none of this. I have already married a Finn, have adopted their beautiful. peaceful President as my own, and feel fortunate to visit Suomi each year.
Sick people such as the young Finnish killer can be found in every corner of modern society, and Roger Boyes' attempt to psychologically analyze Auvinen by such specious reasoning exemplifies the reporter's lack of knowledge of Finnish life and of psychology itself.
From his English library, he has extracted some names from the Kalevala, calculated the average number of Finns per square km, and somehow equated the quantity of guns with this tragedy.
Perhaps, as part of his next article in the Times, Boyes might do a little more research. Visit the country you are discussing, and walk a kilometer in their shoes.

Charles Sendrey, Huntington Beach, California, USA

Mr. Boyes, my simpathies. I am afraid I have to agree with almost everything said in this article and lots of my friends does too. And about the comments...well...I think it is very sad to see a nation which does not have self-criticism...just like to point the problems of others...

There are certainly good things in Finland too but still...Why to be ofended? I can't understand... Why to believe that all evil comes from outside???? Oh...is that the reason foreign people is not very welcome in Finland??? Ok, that is another thing...let's not make such unclever relations as comparisons I have seen in the comments...

People who have education should use it to make impartial conclusions...and make intelligent critiques. Not critiques full of emotion and patriotism... Did not know Finns are so emotional...and partial...

Christina, Sao Paulo, Brazil

Sorry, I am deeply sorry, this is the first time that I read an article from "The Times" and is like if I were reading a cheap yellow press newspaper. I am spanish citizen living in Finland, my girlfriend is finnish , I have finnish friends and I know how is the living in this country, even in the most isolated areas of Lapland. The onion in this matter, in my opinion, what is the main issue in the Jokela institute tragedy is the lack of control of the firearms in Finland, specially among teenagers. The rest, weather, the finnish culture, mitology..... stereotypes and more stereotypes. If I read a tourist brochure about Thailand, Could your newspaper hire me as special correspondent of South Asia, please?

Alberto Santos, Tampere, Finland

Well, the weather is horrible, wet, can't stand still in the winter outside so star gazing is almost impossible.. then again its always cloudy too.. rains all summer.. but when you have friends in finland, even though you only see them once a month or year, when you see them its as if you saw them yesterday. Silence is golden in finland, as uncomfortable as that may be for the rest of the world. They are a people not afraid of being alone, as many people in the rest of the world are. That is the Nordic way. The only thing that matters in a Finn's life is being better than Russia and beating Swedes at any competition. The crazy boy was not the first child killer in Finland and he won't be the last. The only one to blame is the local policeman who authorized his gun license.

Akso, Tampere, Finland

According to the strictest definition Finland does not belong to Scandinavia. I recommend all of you to use Nordic Countries or Fenno-Scandinavia when you refer to the region including Finland.

Konsta Sirvio, Zandvoort, Netherlands

As an after note : You wanted to start discussion in Finland. And you did. There's been some debate in the press over media differences between Finland and UK. Also, on how on earth did you manage to upset so many people here. But that is it. Whatever else you wanted to convey to your readers never materialized in the Finnish press. I have to say that if your point was that in Finland people are depressed and homicidal due to the winter darkness, noone got it. Summertime it's never dark so does that make overly active?

Just for the future. In Finland Kaurismäki has always been considered to depict a weird, gloomy view of Finnish life. But that's what the foreigners love to watch. They are humorous movies with funny characters, not to be taken as documentaries. After 8 trips to Finland you should know that.

Timo Ahlstedt, Espoo, Finland

This troubled child is in no way indicative of the Finns as a people... just like O.J. Simpson is in no way representive of Americans... and By the way..I am an american.. a geek and a gun owner and a hunter......

mike, chicago, illinois USA

hey guys i am turkish i was an exchange student in finland for over 10 months. and finland is the only place which can be said a piece from heaven in all meanings. and people are really cool and extremely peaceful. ok i admit that when they drink some small problems can occur . but the problems are not more than some pushing stuff each other... god this article is so full of so funny stuff. i wonder if the writer has ever been to finland. has he visited some southern countries like italy turkey or so on... he should try those ones

Burak, Istanbul, Turkey

I really laughed when I saw this. I have always thought that Times were a magazine that can be taken seriously, but apparently I was wrong.
How Finnish ancient gods are related to this?! Really, most of young people doesn't even know them. At the same way it can be claimed that all American school shootings are caused by that the shooters pictured themselves as Indians...
Yes, we are maybe quieter than people in other countries. Why it is such a big problem? It just belongs to Finnish culture. It doesn't mean that we were depressed or something, it's just in the habit of Finland.
And yes, there is winter and in Lapland, where I live, it's cold, dark and long. Why couldn't we meet our friends in winter? Could you have thought that there would be streetlights?

Saana, Finland,

Anna Helsingistä tämä ei taida olla oikea foorumi valittaa palkasta. Mieti vähän.

Maria , Jyväskylä,

Interesting to see writer’s opinion that in Finland kids do not meet friends cause it’s dark in the evening!!

I have been living out of Finland and I have to say that in Finland kids socialize with friends so much more than in middle Europe or Asia where they are not allowed to move around alone.

In Finland it does not matter if it’s dark or light, after the school they just take their bike (anyone older than 7years) and go to meet their friends. If first is not at home or available they go to next – so convenient and great for kids!!

Com Bo, Tuusula, Finland

Finland as many other countries is on the verge of change; I think you can't blame only Internet, Finnish culture or parents that can't connect any more.

The younger generations in Finland spend their xmas in surfing paradises with their international friends, but if you look at faces in a bus during the darkests months you can almost touch the depression.

I personally and sadly knew many Finnish people that passed away by their own hand, so even as a Finn I wouldn't deny that certain darness engulfs our thoughts easily.

It's all there in the mix. And of course it's a bit early for a nation touched deeply by a tradegy to look into this as a phenomenon to be coolly analyzed.

I personally can't feel offended by the article, but I find it very understandable that people feel that way. We Finns usually prefer to mourn in privacy, not on the pages of newspapers.

Peter, St. Petersburg,

Very offensive article about moarning country.These stereotypes were far from the truth.

Think if Finnish press would have accused British society about London bomb attacks and said that it was very British.

Antsu , Espoo, Finland

Would Mr. Boyes perhaps comment the case of Mr.Peter Tobin
(see today's news) as being "a very British Murder Case"?

Anita, London, UK

Slightly amusing for me to see all the upset on behalf of scandinavians when simplistic archetypes are used to explain away an event. Has it not occurred to you that this is how you rtray America and Americans? No? Well, then you deserve what you get......

Paul, NY,

My husband and I, with our 2 daughters moved from England to Finland just over 2 years ago. We feel so much safer and happier here than we ever did in England. Yeah its dark a bit in winter but it is full of happy friendly people and we have no complaints at all about Finnish culture, it's a damn sight better then the UK one we have left behind. Get things in perspective!!

claire maurice, oulu, finland

As a general comment I'd like to add that us Finns are highly educated people who have a lot of knowledge of the outside world, i.e. the world outside of Finland. We do not have the luxury of thinking that we are the centre of the universe (as do the old empires, such as Britain). Mr. Boyes's article shows his patronising attitude towards a smaller nation and its people. Perhaps he should learn Finnish to understand more of the Finnish mentality? But, oh yes, I do remember how difficult it is for the British to learn foreign languages properly. I commend my fellow citizens on their language skills which is the key to understanding other cultures.

Tiina, Kuopio, Finland

I must say it's been heartwarming to read all these nice and friendly comments about Finland by peole from all over the world. Thank you. I was touched by the words of many of you!

Jonna Malinen, Tampere, FInland

For me an elderly female Finn this tragedy means a touch of the outside world in our safe secure Finnish "lintukoto" that is in English a bird´s nest. The psychotic young killer had obviously found his models from the news and violence in American schools. Internet and computers are fine for anybody of any age, they do not by itself make you lose your brain. There just was something in him that sensitized him to pick the bad influences from the outside world.

For me the Finnish society is cozy and safe. When I travel abroad, I feel safe if I find my countrymen around. They are so helpful and honest. Some Finns love to talk and keep company, some are more quiet forest men enjoying solitude. There is room and understanding for all of them here.

But this Massacre in Tuusula Jokela, this is for me the frightening touch of cruel influences of the outside world in Finland.

I pray with many others that this will be the last time.

Solja Elina, Hämeenlinna, Finland

Funny, Mr Boyes article was the same sort of commentary that Pekka Mykkänen writes in the Helsingin Sanomat when a tragic event occurs in the US. High time for the outraged Finns in this string to have a taste of their own medicine. Now you know how it feels. Mr Boyes, our son spent 11 years in Finnish schools and agrees with many of the points you make.

Alice, Espoo, Finland

Indeed Mr. Boyes, your article(s) does hit the target with great precision as far as I can tell by the number of years I have lived in Finland. I could not agree more with your writings.

Excellent observations.

Jan, Hyvinkää, Finland

I have to admit, I actually started laughing when I read "Lakes often separate neighbouring farmsteads." My first thought was that the writer has never been to Finland, or has quite a strange sense of humor.

Yes, depression and suicide rates here are high. But you seem to have made quite an error, in drawing a connection between this tragic event, and seclusion - due to the winter? - from other, errr, farmsteads.

This incident actually happened in something like a suburb, close to Helsinki. The killer was introverted and didn't seem to have many friends, but that was certainly not because of long distances or seclusion due to lakes.

As for the youth of Finland using the internet as a tool for social networking - that happens everywhere, not just in Finland. To the vast majority of our youth, the internet is not a substitute for human contact, it's a tool.

Noora-Maria, Oulu, Finland

I moved to Finland from Sydney two years ago, and I am very happy here. I actually had the choice, to move either to Helsinki to take up a promotion, or London, to take up a promotion. After visiting both cities, I easily chose Finland as my new home. (says a lot about London, if this story is true, right?) Thankfully the truth in this story is only about 2%... I hope Finns don't take this 'story' to heart, as I love your country and think you are wonderful people.

Adrian , Ruoholahti, Finland

Mr. Boyes paints a very odd and grimm image of Finns. True - Finland is a land of many lakes and wintertime,wast areas of forest ad wintertime is not fulfilled with sunshine

- but we are not isolated, nor technology mazed, nor do we all want to go to holidays in Asia, or consider Friendship a summertime luxury. (I'd love to see some statistics how many britons travel to Asia..or sunny Malta)

Myths such as Tuonela and Ukko are myths - can be found from most of the cultures.

It has been said that Finland is the most USA'nized country in world after USA, these shootings may well mirror the USA influence. For example - baby-mobile phones were developed in USA, not in Finland.

School shooting is a national tragedy - in it's crimsom colours I believe it helps us to adjust our view of moderin, global world and the meaning of caring about yout neighbour.

Päivi, Mäntsälä, Finland

I have been very fortunate because I have had the opportunity of living my childhood in two different cultures, the first ten years of my life in London and the rest in Finland.

When we moved to Finland, I gained more friends then in England and I interacted with them much more. In London my parents always had to pick me up from school because of the risk of encountering a child molester or a similar type of low-life. My friendships were restricted to football practices, cubs and the occasional weekend over-night stay at a mate’s home. I also remember the frustration of not been able to kick my ball unsupervised in our backyard. Our own backyard was not even a safe place! But in Finland I was able to play with my friends after school, walk home with them, do all the stuff little mischievous boys do and be completely safe.

Now with a child of my own I have no doubts in what country I want to raise my child in.

Karl Filtness, Tampere, Finland

This article is of exceedingly poor quality, containing mindnumbingly stupid, ignorant and subjective opinions and childlishy simplistic and naive assertions which would bring disgrace upon even the most alarmist of tabloids.

It really makes me wonder what kind of staggering constellation of editorial and journalistic failures have allowed Mr. Boyes to command a pencil, let alone call his appallingly misguided ramblings "analysis".

Daniel, Tampere, Finland

Finland has'nt been in war since 2WW. Britain was also participating in the same war. What are GB doing in Iraq? I think that tells us a lot of what is going on in the world. In Finland it is safe to travel by metro, bus, anything. In GB you have to be afraid to get killed because if you run, you are treated like a terrorist and get killed.

Why do terrorists attack GB and USA but not Finland?

Andreas, Stockholm, Sweden

Mr Boyes

If your conclusions are what they are, how do you then explain the acts of the killer at Virginia Tech, Columbine and Erfurt? Are these typical American and German affairs, and if so, which is your analysis about the Amercian and German society and mentality?
A serious journalist cannot write as you did and if your article was ment as a joke of some kind (I'm a Finn living in France and I love to joke about myself and the Finnish people, and about other nationalities, too, especially the French), some kind of decency and respect for the dead and their families in this tragedy would have been of the essence.

Collin Karin, Thionville, France

Why the baseless arguments? In my opinion, he's addressing the problem by associating it with some contributing factors. There's no need to trash at him like that. And he didn't say Brits are any better or worst, or did he? I must agree, set your petty minds aside and ponder about the root to the cause.

Daphne, Helsinki, Finland

Dear Mr. Boyes, dear Finns, dear other nationalities,

I would like to point out one thing:
The one big reason for this active and somehow self-defensing debate on these three writings of Mr. Boyes is: The huge difference in the media cultures in Finland and in the UK. Finnish media culture is (even if it has been changing during the past years by a few magazines) very objective, non-scandalous and kind. I'm a Finnish journalist and already in my studies of journalism this fact, the difference of Finnish and some other countries' (England and Germany, for example) journalism was very clear, and having made my
master thesis on comparative journalism (The UK and Finland) and having followed the media of many countries for years, it's obvious that Finnish media is different from many other cultures. To put it in a few words: We are not at all used to reading this kind of articles heavily loaded with very subjective views, and that explains much of our heated responses here.

One journalist, Nice, France

Why is it always young men? Young women have all these same problems, but don't respond with violence against others. Where are we failing the boys?

Deidra Baker, Dundee, Scotland

I do not know wether to laugh or cry... It makes me frightened that there are poeple, not even that far away from Finland, who are claiming to be educated professionals but do not seem to know much of the subject they are writing about. What about everything else we read? Is this a test in how we should be more critical agains everything else media is feeding us with? How many other articles/news/tv-shows etc. contain as much incorrect infomation? I sincerely hope that no one takes this seriously, how can a newspaper even publish something like this? Maybe I missed the irony in all this and I am just a boring humorless person... I really hope that is the case... The only thing I can say for sure is that this article seems to be a desperate cry for attention, and I really feel sorry for you Mr Boyes.

Annika, Stockholm, Sweden

I think the article has a point. The reason this guy became mentally disordered could have something to do with loneliness and lack of REAL social contacts, combined with multiple other factors, (youtube and internet surfing are not good substitutes for social life). Of course this article is a bit one-sided, he was just an individual who flipped out. Just like in Germany and the US. Individualism and loneliness is not a Finnish only phenomena. This can happen anywhere where individuals become alienated.

Mankka, Espoo,

The shooter was a deranged right-wing extremist who suffered from depression. He had interrupted medication some time ago. This could certainly have happened almost anywhere.

MS, Tampere, Finland

Perhaps something comes of all this.
Maybe the writer has left a mark even through a poor piece of journalism ( we all make mistakes).

I suspect that this whole on-line comment will be used quite reasonably in Finland. I suspect that this is just the beginning.

There is enough cultural text here to fill many years of study.

I, for one, save it all and do my best to make sense of it. I will not be alone.

Who knows i might even learn something from this.
One Finnish way is to allow time to think without speaking even if silence is not popular.
I will need many long silent hours to handle this cultural event.

lapland voice, kemi,

As I have already commented on the actual article and its offensive tone, I won't bother to do that again. Just wanted to add that it is in poor taste to have a link to the video of the perpetrator of this tragedy to publicise his twisted logic. Sensationalist and more suited to another publication. Sad to see The Times has sunk to the levels of The Daily Mail and The Sun.

Maria, London,

This is completely ridiculous. I'm an Aussie exchange student now living in Finland, and I go to high school here. Yes it gets dark in winter. It's getting dark now at four o'clock. Finns usually keep to themselves, and get quieter as winter comes in. But that's not to say they're depressed. What you mean when putting the shooting with the comments about Finns and technology, is that Finns are depressed and spend all their time on computors thus mass shooting! Which is disgusting on your part. This shocked the whole country. This shocked everyone of my fellow exchange students here. You know why? Because we all thought Finland was the last place on earth where something like this would happen. It's got nothing to do with Finland, you don't know anything about this country. That bastard was deranged. An "antihuman humanist"?? I mean come on! People talk in Finland, friends go out, bike ride, do things like other normal kids. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Penelope Berkemeir, Sydney, Australia

Wow. This is the dumbest thing I've ever read. So, this shooting happened because it's dark in Finland during the winter; there's a low population density; and Finns are keen on mobile phones and the internet? That's brilliant. Any facts to support your "theory?" I had a good laugh after reading this guy's article. I want this guy's job...getting paid for posting crap on the internet.

Darren, Dallas, Texas

I have been to Finnland and I thought it was a beautiful place. One mentally person is not enough to brand an entire country, which is what you are trying to do in this piece of so called journalism. Also his name has nothing to do with any Norwegian heavy metal band, once again the media is trying to paint a genre of music as evil. I am a heavy metal fan, I am also a classical, RnB and techno fan, doesn't mean that I am going to go and buy a gun and go on a killing spree. Like the kid wrote in his note, don't blame the music he listens to. Its what happens inside the head that affects how people act, not what they see on the television or hear on the radio. Nice attempt at trying to change what we think though, kudos.

Luna, Kent, England

I think this was a work of a lonely person who felt rejected by people around him. He had really not much to live for so he went deeper and deeper to his own world where he imagined being a king of this whole universe. So sad. :(

Marika, Helsinki, Finland

I have to say that when I first read the article I was upset by it. But why? Finland is at the moment dark, rainy and depressing. People commit suicides (i should know, my father did), people buy guns and spend all the free time in the internet.

I admit, that when I get home I turn on the computer, open msn messenger, check facebook and read the news from the internet. I am 20 years old and I have been doing this for years. Talking to people online is easy and convenient, but when you actually meet them I atleast often find my self speechless. I have absolutely nothing to say to most of them.

I moved from Helsinki to a much smaller city this fall and I have to say that at some point of the week I start counting how many days it will still be before I get back to Helsinki. Not because there would be more light and sun or because a small city is a bad place, but because when I go to a store I see more than 10 people on the way...

So all in all, I have to agree with Mr. Boyle

Hanna-Mari Blankenstein, Mikkeli/Helsinki, Finland

Dear Roger Boyes,

sorry about the F1.

Ellana, Helsinki, Finland

Funny, Mr Boyes article is the exact same type of commentary that Finnish newspapers publish when there is a tragedy in another country, particularly in the US. Half truths, stereotypes as facts, all informed by general prejudice. Maybe it's time to deport Mr Boyes and pass a emergency legislation to forbid any cricitism of Finland.

Alice, Espoo, Finland

the overheated responses on this site are more interesting than the fairly standard article itself. it's customary when tragic incidents like this happen for the international media to look at the cultural context -- people write articles like that about incidents in the UK, Germany, France, Japan, and lord knows in the US. and boyes' article wasn't particularly savage -- it simply looked at some aspects of finnish society that could create the circumstances for an event like this. and yet all the finns on this site went ballistic. apparently finns -- or at least those on this site -- are offended by even mild criticism from foreigners. is this a sign of arrogance or -- despite Finland's considerable accomplishments -- insecurity? Interesting revelation.

drew, NY, USA

Dear Mr Boyes,

I was schocked after reading your article, how a senior writer like your, could have forgotten the basic principle of journalism, which we were thought in university; check your facts and do your research! ;)

I agree with 99% of the responses here. It is also fascinating to see how we Finns are proud of our "cold and dark" country. In fact darkness and coldness at winter mainly seem to be a "problem" for some of you foreign journalist, like yourself. People in Finland are too busy skiing, meeting their friend over a hot glass of glogi, and enjoying the outdoors, to worry about winter, neither they have any urge to move abroad thanks to our country's safety, education and booming economy.

Lolitocha, Helsinki, Finland

Haha, writer has never ever been in Finland, I suppose! What a generalization, if there is a one school shooter, can we really make these kind of generalizations of Finnish people?

Anna Lehtolainen, Espoo, Finland

These are sad times and placing blame on the whole Finnish society is just plain wrong. Yes, we need to reflect on what happened but this not the way to do it. Get to know the facts before you blame the victims.

Salla, Espoo, Finland

Yes indeed, amazing.
Having written my own newspaper piece at 14.30 hours on the day this sick event became world-wide news and as it was all unfolding I do appreciate the need to publish quick. Such is both on-line journalism and Nokia-land fast-time world as it is. I can sympathise, a little, with this writer.

However I feel with the many Finns that have written in as readers who are rightly angry at sick stereotypes and fake links. Indeed this writer does not know or even feel with everyday Finns.

But, at the same time, the responses are also interesting and are educational.
As many Finns struggle to see the wider socio-political aspects of this sad event ( see the many academics and journalists that have been in the public domain) the typical response here lacks any critical awareness at all.
Often, not always, a kind of surge of imaginary nationalism is displayed although given that the writer showed such poor awareness this is in some way understandable. More?

laplander, kemi,

I wonder to where some of the comments are disappearing. Anyway, Mr. Boyes is very wrong about our nation and has no idea what he is writing about.

I have lived abroad for several years, but I am very proud of my country and will always be. Finland is still a very good and safe place to live in. This one sad day won't change it .

Akka , Na, Europe

Ugly writing! This really made me mad! Don't like of reading Times nemore!

a Finn girl, Jyväskylä, Finland

To all Finnish.

As an UK citizen who lives and works in Finland I have to say Im sorry for mr. Boyes words. Ive been living in Helsinki for 10 years now and I've discovered that Finnish people are kindest, most open hearted people I've ever met.

Times used to be a quality paper but this article is so sad and show of poor journalism that first time in my life Im embarrassed for my countryman.

Roger, not a good show. Shame on you.

John, Helsinki,

We have 1,6 million legal weapons in register and only 650 000 (civilian or community)
legal permit holders for them. How does this make 56% ownership? More likely 30,5 per 100
people (some 12 per cent). 60 per cent of those legal guns are used for hunting reasons. And permit holder app. owns 2,49 guns.

Oh, sure. Some foreign research result vs. Ministry of the Interior register, now who would I prefer to believe...Ministry of the Interior also estimates that number of legal guns are more likely some ten thousands comparing to Swiss research's 300 000 illegal guns. Police also corrected these numbers in medium after that research was published. Never minded to check those figures too?

Comparing to quantity of guns in Finland, cases of public shooting are extremely rare. As well as some 20 per cent of all those high-rated suicides are made by gun. So, what "a very Finnish affair"?

Kristiina Korhonen, Jyväskylä, Finland

I'm English. It's November and it's dark here too. I wish I could visit Finland, now.... or in your 'endless summer,' but I can't:
Because Finland is too wealthy -like the rest of Scandinavia, so I'll just have to miss out on the grandeur and majesty of your country. I've never met a Scandinavian/Baltic citizen who wasn't interested, curious about England. It's sad that we resort to cliche and stereotype in the wake of this tragedy. Shame on England.

AndyM, Birmingham, England

I feel sorry for you Mr Boyes...you obviously have now idea what you are writing about! And tell me now, how does something that happened about 500 years ago (worshiping Ukko) have anything to do with these days?

Ellie, Kokkola, Finland

Pathetic and offensive. Speculative journalism at its worst. I will never buy the times again.

I am a British national who has been living in Finland for over a year. Finland is a beautiful country with a wonderful society. Countries like England have a lot to learn from the way things are done here (education, healthcare, environmental policy etc etc).

Finnish people are lovely and unlike this pathetic excuse for a journalist they get their facts straight before offering an opinion.

I mean is he really serious or is this a very sick windup? This summary based on the actions of one crazy individual in a country of 5 million!

James Durston, Helsinki, Finland

I lived in Finland until I was 9 and found that it was nothing but a peaceful, well developed country. Now that I've lived in Ireland for 5 years I see how good we had things in Finland, and I can't wait to come back. The incident in Tuusula was the first in Finland's history, so 'a very Finnish affair' is a completely wrong way of describing it. This boy was most probably mentally ill. There are mentally ill people in all countries of the world. Roger Boyes says that the dark winters of Finland affect the depression rate. They do not. Finland's winters are one of the most beautiful sights in the world. Going into a Finnish forest on a sunny winter day, nothing beats that. This piece by Roger Boyes gives a totally wrong impression of Finland.

Julia, Letterkenny, Ireland

Well, that article is wrong in many things but there is a little truth behind those words. I, at first, laughed at this article, becouse i'm a finn and have lived in Finland whole my life. And i'm only 14 years old. This incident is very awful, even though at first I didn't even really care. When I heard that this shooting had happened, I said "Oh, that's terrible" and then continued my life as normal. But when I got home, my little sister, who is 7 and just started school, came to me and asked that have you heard what happened today, I put the tv on and saw all the channels filled with news of this tragedy. Well, even then, i didn't even care. This incident happened so far from my home VILLAGE that it doesn't conserne me. OH YES, I LIVE IN A VILLAGE. and this is the time of the year that it's very dark. but you should know, that i LOVE this time of year. i LOVE this dark place and it's cold winter. and i don't love the writer of this article. We might be melancholy, but not depressed.

silja , hoho, finland

What a delightful insight into the psyche of Finns. I can't wait to read an equally well-written and fact based analysis by Roger Boyes on the recent incident in UK, where during the bonfire night a gang of vicious teenagers knocked a lonely man unconcious with a burning log, then pushed him in the bonfire and let him burn to death. And on why this incident, which any sensible nation would consider to be a brutal murder, is here considered to be something called 'happy slapping'.

Surely the only conclusion that can be drawn is that Guy Fawkes is the reason for everything that is wrong with British teens, and excess happines is putting them on overdrive?

And Barnabas Allen-Mersh, has banning of the handguns removed them from the streets and schools of UK? Or have you perhaps lived in Finland so long that you have become to think that the rest of the world is gun-free as well?

The only one, London, UK

I wish Mr.Boyes had a short vocation to Finland and not only to Helsinki but also the west, the east and the north of the country to see what Finland and whom the Finns are in reality before he had written this article. Then he'd probably change his mind or would choose the same way of expressing his stereotypes with journalism audaciousness. Yes there are wreckages of truths in his article but his selection of expressing them and the vital points he's missing precludes him reflecting the reality about the Finns and Finland.
I'm sending my condolences to the victims' relatives and friends. May them rest in peace..

aresus, Florya/Istanbul, Turkki

my friend wanted me to write this: "FINNISH PEOPLE ROCKS!!!!"

silja, hoho, finnland

FACTS

Sports participation in Finland is among the highest in Europe.

Britains spend more time on the internet per month than any other country in Euope.

James Durston, British National, Helsinki, Finland.

James Durston, Helsinki, Finland

Mr Boyes, an individual madness is not typical to the whole nation! Or was for instance the Dunblane massacre a typical British one? Doctor Shipman, Yorkshire ripper, Rosemary and Fred West etc, were they representatives of Britishness?
We Finns are not hermits and it is easy to make friends. The houses are not in the least so isolated as you in your article wrote them to be. In towns the most common way of living is to live in flats and mostly the detacheds houses are concentrated in villages or suburbs with neighbours near you. Children in school age have a lot of hobbies other than sitting at the computer. My sons are grown up and educated in England and there if anywhere the young ones' only social activities were to sit at the computer and play the games, chat etc. It actually is much easier here for the children to make friends as they safely can go out to meet each other. Shortly: you have given a wrong picture of Finalnd and Finnishness.

M.T. Persson, Joensuu, Finland

Dear Mr Boyes,
Your article is simply awful.

Please stick to the things that you know about......

Tommi Sievinen, Jyväskylä, Finland

Who cares about the petty arguing? Eight innocent human beings were murdered. That is the important focus. We should be discussing what we can do to stop this from ever happening anywhere in the world.

Kim Righetti, Upland, Calif. USA

Finnish people have a teflon-coated resistance to the environment around them. They call it sisu. Darkness, cold, etc. may be a bit depressing, but people in this country can deal with it pretty well. People are doing well when they aren't complaining, so people say when asked how they are doing.

Your analysis of the situation is out of the twilight zone. This incident is very similar, especially to the Virginia Tech incident.

If it was a Finnish affair, then this would be happening a lot more, since Finland has a very high gun ownership percentage. Try giving guns to British hot-headed football hooligans and see what happens. This is a different culture from yours for certain.

Sirkuspelle, Peräseinäjoki, Finland

If you want your readers to believe this then should we think that England is the country where when people are underaged they brutally kill eachother and when they grow up they just have tea parties all day long?

Miranda, Lahti, Finland

Hey you Finns, don't take this article too seriously, because the writer can't be serious. Otherwise he can't be too intelligent.
Why would anyone assume the population density of one country means the people are evenly spread around the country?
Why would anyone tell in a newspaper about how easy or difficult it is to buy a gun in a certain society if he doesn't know about how easy or difficult it is. The fact is that Finns are not a nation generally interested in guns. Why would any one come to write about Finnish people and guns without picturing the reason why so many people in Finland have guns? What does it has to do with the case someone shooting other people with a gun?

huck, Kuopio, Finland

Mr. Boyes,

I stand corrected.I was one of the many who "knew" you could have never visited Finland.

I'm also happy to hear about your successful encounter with the Finnish healthcare system. I myself wasn't so fortunate as the NHS refused to see me and my infected and bleeding mouth without a two-month wait.

The Times is supposed to be a reliable source but your analysis paints a very black and white picture of Finland, which unfortunately will lead some to believe that Finns really do hibernate and still believe in ancient myths. I'm not saying we are a perfect society. I will be the first to admit that Finland has issues with alcohol and depression, even domestic violence, but at the same time I tend to point out the good things about the country too. I hope you understand that no one wants to speak evil or hear anyone else speak evil of the one they love and we Finns certainly love our country!

I miss my (real)friends and hobbies in this lonely, unsafe place that is London.

Sirja Moilanen, London,

congratulations to that masterpiece of journalism !!
the youth here is sitting trapped in the frozen darkness and only communicates via mobile and youtube. of course.
one frustrated teenager who obviously had mental problems and didnt see any other solution than commit homocide makes the finish youth a disturbed isolated dangerous group of people.
says the journalist of a country where there is a law allowing to take 10 year old children to prison
where teenager are killing in gangs children and the age for education should raised up to 18 preventing bored youth roaming on the streets
where teenage pregnancy in the industrial areas is the answer of young girls escaping unemployment and having to perspective for their future
i seriously wonder about the understatement of friendship by mr boyes ? I wonder if he would say that to the face of the people here where candles are lit in the gardens and windows for lost friends.... have you ever been to finland mr boyes?

Vera Kertesz, Riihimäki, Finland

Here are some facts about depression. According to the article "Depressive disorders in Europe: prevalence figures from the ODIN study" by J. L. Ayuso-Mateos et al., published in British Journal of Psychiatry (2001, vol. 179, pp. 308-316), there is no difference between the prevalence of depressive disorders in rural Finland and rural UK. In the urban UK, however, depressive disorders are about three times as prevalent as in urban Finland. As a whole, the UK had the highest prevalence of depressive disorders in this study, while Finland had the second lowest. Please do your homework before making any such claims.

Pete, Stanford, U.S.A.

Summertime the sun is up almost 24h/day for months.

Morokolli, Finland,

Youtube is global. Fairy tails are global (druids, sonehenge in UK example) Mobiles are global. I don't see Finnish label at all in this.

Tero, Tampere, Finland

way to go boyes...u should be shortlisted for a pulitzer!

farid, Beirut, Lebanon

unbelievable! great journalism. yes its so cold and dark and its all oh so depressive sob sob i will go to cry my self to sleep now. alone. all alone.

Johanna, Helsinki,

I have been living in London for 5 years and I found comments of Mr Boyes somewhat funny, especially in relation to Finnish friendship! According to my experiences, friendship does not exist in England-or in London anyway. So, in my opinion he does not really know what he is talking about! My English husband and I are going to leave UK just in order to move to this 'dark and depressing place' as soon as possible. One reason for this is that I miss my dear friends so much. At the moment I only have Internet and my mobile, right Mr Boyes?

Sanna, London, UK

Just take any indicator and look: there it is, Finland in top 3 or 5! Where is England / GB?

Kari, Pirkkala, Finland

Never been prouder to be Finnish than I am now, reading these comments.

Johanna, Nottingham, UK

hmm... I'm from finland... 20 years old boy... and when I read this story... i have to laugh about it... if you dont know what you are writing about do not write it... come to finland in winter... kids playing ice-hockey and skiing and lots of other stuff... Im very sad for yoy mr.boyes

Anu Saukko, Nokia, FINLAND

Who does he think he is, to decide who is fit and who isn't!!??? This is a very dangerous mentally-disturbed boy. You have the right to think whatever you fell like, but there are laws, bodies and moral boundaries. Nobody should check his video, he is not worth the attention...

Vanessa, Belgium,

Yes, I would say it s about true. We are pretty much like mr. Boye says. It s sad but true.

Jokke, Lahti, Finland

Mr. Boyes. You should know more about that country you write. Good links to know Finland are www.suomi.fi and www.visitfinland.com. I think that you get educational information from those links.

Timo Hanninen, Sysma, Finland

Writer of this column should visit Finland before writing such nonsense. Hopefully you will improve you knowledge about our beatiful land in the future, before writing another "true, fact -based" story.

Juha, Turku, Finland

Wow...

Somehow I have a feeling that you have been isolated to your little island a bit too long now...

Marko, Helsinki, Finland

I suppose mr Boyes thinks London policemen are shooting innocent people just because the city is too crowded?

Tervo, Helsinki, Finland

Great journalism!
Two thumbs up!

Jarmo Muhonen, Lempaala, Finland

Roger Boyes said Tuusula was a very Finnish affair. He never mentioned the School Massacre at Dunblane, UK.

Doug, Vantaa,

I wonder if Mr. Boyes has ever met a Finnish person or visited our beautiful country. His opinions portrait total ignorance of our culture.

Jarno, Helsinki,

Well I think this is pretty correct analysis from a foreign perspective. If we were still living in the village comunity none of this would have ever happened. Our culture got 'westenized' only few centuries or decades ago (depends on the viewpoint). Auvinen's agony against modern democratic society is evident in his writings.

Ville, Helsinki, Finland

Still upset about F1, are you Mr Boyes?

Karolina, Helsinki, Finland

nice to speak what ever u want... u don´t know our great country..

-=Finland=-

Kim , Finlandia, Finland

Good luck with your terrible attitude mr boyes..
you dont know what you're talking about..
Julia, Devon

Julia Smith, Devon, UK

I think that mr Boyes is living in a tiny box. You fail!

Pasi, JYASKYLA, Finland

Mr. Boyes doesn't have a clue.

Arthur, Kuopio, Finland

This text is shocking. I'm from Finland. Have you ever been in Finland? Have you liven here more than one or two days? Do you really know what you are talking about? I wouldn't be so sure. I hate those people who denounce without any evidences. Or do you have any proofs about our depression?

I hope that your idea about Finns would change. This is a small country. In Finland there are not very much people and we have to "live in harmony". This whole thing what happened in Tuusula was very sad and terrifying. There was just one person who made a mistake. One person and you blame all of us? Think again, write again.

Lara, Kouvola, Finland

I find the "article" above wholly inaccurate, sensationalist, insensitive and, quite frankly, insulting to anyone mourning this tragedy. To be sure, Finland has its share of social problems, but placing the blame on technology is simply ridiculous and insults any reader's intelligence. Also, by branding this as a very Finnish tragedy, Boyes seems to suggest something like this was bound to happen sooner or later because of geographical or social factors.

In reply to the readers who agree with Boyes's assessment, I am a Finnish native who has been living abroad for years and I do not find this has changed my views - rather, it has made me treasure our beautiful, safe and saddened country even more.

Eeva, London,

Oh yes, when I heard of this tragedy, I instantly thought of the dark powers of Tuonela and the mighty Ukko. I would like to call my friends and talk about this but I can't, because it's already dark and I'm feeling depressed. All I can do now is wait for the summer and just hope that my friends are still alive when it arrives. Thank God I still have my YouTube.

This piece of "analysis" was not good journalism.

Riikka, Tampere, Finland

Shame on you.

Matti Meikäläinen, joensuu, Finland

It is generally considered polite to offer condolences when a tragedy such as this occurs. Instead Mr Boyes is hinting these children deserved to suffer because they were born in a cold, dark country.

Perhaps the readers of some less sophisticated paper would appreciate this kind of reasoning slightly more.

Finnish pride, London,

Feels pretty weird to read such a "analysis" right now. Few clicks from internet (is it openly available in UK?) and many of mentioned "facts" would have corrected.

I spend yesterday evening watching news and surfing internet, talking with friends (oh yes, in IRL) and waited information if there were any friends involved in this violence.
I would smile to text if it was published with different news, but when its included with such a shocking news it just makes me think what kind of people lives in UK? Are they all walking dark foggy streets under umbrellas eating fish&chips from newspapers, watching football from tv and after matches fighting on streets and bars? I guess not, but i could say that now.

Such tales like this "analysis" feels unbelieveble, how average people know which part is true and what is fairytale if they are not earlier familiar with the subject and are reading "news with analysis" from well known newspaper?

News vs (Historical) Fairytales, where is the line?

Marko, Vantaa, Finland

I´m very sad and abashed - I´m a Finn and not believing that a real journalist has this kind of thoughs and stereotypes about Finland and Finnish people! Please, let me correct your claims.
Finnish youngsters have friends and a social life in wintern - and we really see our friends in winter too. Winter is also a very nice season, for example me and my friends love snow and snowboarding.
I have a Nokias mobile phone and I use Internet a lot - still no signs about madness or depression. Even if technology is an important part of finnish lifestyle it can never replace our social life! If you didn´t know, Finnish people are not robots yet.
I really don´t have time to correct claims about the gun- things, but I hope that Mr. Roger Boyes will read other comments in here.
I am very dissapointed on this article.

Kia, Helsinki, Finland

This writer has probably never even been to Finland. He should spend a few weeks here and write again

Santeri, Lievestuore, Finland

I'm stunned to see that the population details in the article (16-17 people per square kilometre) have been corrected, presumably as a result of the comments here, but the rest of this drivel has been left as it is!

I hope and trust that Mr Boyes has actually been to Finland, but like other commentators wonder where exactly he's stayed and for how long. That the article above is called 'analysis' is laughable.

It would be great to be able to sum up instances such as the shooting in Finland as resulting from something cultural, or indeed dark winters... Unfortunately though this case like that at Virginia Tech can only really be explained as actions of mentally disturbed individuals.

Kat, Kingston, Jamaica

Person who wrote this does not know my country. Most of the finns live in smaller or bigger urban dwelling, Area were this happened was almost sururban dwelling for Helsinki. There are some large areas with small population in northern Finland which affects on average number of inhabitants.

And the most guns in finland are on the country side were households own several guns or in hand of hunter (popular sport here nation wide). The most of the those weapons are long-piped hunting weapons.

This writer wants to insult our nation in morning. He should also check simply FACTS.

With who we communicate if we don't have friends. We rarely send SMS to santa claus more likely to arrenge hobbies, meetings or ask simply how are our FRIENDs.

We have high rates of suicides. But most violent acts to others happens between drinkin buddies deprived from society or unfortunately in families.

Some youth are deprived in our countrie which has best level of education according to OECD studies.

Ville H., Tampere,

Don´t know what to do after reading this. Should I laugh at it or cry... :/

Juuso, Tampere, Finland

If I were you Mr Boyes, I would tread carefully, this is close to being downright slanderous

David Allen, Edinburgh,

This goes into the same category as this incident I witnessed when I was visiting England: An English man asking us Finns if we knew how to use a mobile phone...

Leena, Helsinki, Finland

University of Cambridge study on happiness:

National average happiness

1. Denmark - 8.311952

2. Finland - 8.056492

3. Ireland - 7.981235

4. Sweden - 7.841779

....

9. United Kingdom - 7.469677

http://www.admin.cam.ac.uk/news/press/dpp/2007041601

VV, Helsinki,

I guess, that the writer doesn't even know where Finland exists. The article was so old-fashioned, that I couldn't believe my eyes!

The funniest thing in this article was this: "Friendship in the traditional sense is often a summer luxury." :D :D I really recommend that you visit in Finland. I'm sure you will be surprised, positively.

Heidi, Salo, Finland

I'd really like to get closer look on this article but it's time for my montly nightswim. Mr Boyes, if you ever visit Finland I have a free bed for you. Maybe we can go shooting wolves or something.

Janne, Hollola, Finland

You have obviously never met a real Finnish person before, Mr. Boyes. My heart goes out to Finland and I am completely disgusted by the ignorance displayed in this article. Where is your journalistic dignity? Do some research and don't condemn an entire country because of one person's mistake.

Hannah, University Park, PA

Let`s see.Shipman ,Crippen,King ,Christie...shall I go on?

nee Mattsson, Jokela,Tuusula, Finland

I'm sure a lot of finns are trying to make sense of this all by browsing the web, newspapers and tv channels for information and analysis on the incident (like I am). So publishing a story like this on a time like this is guaranteed to attract a lot of comments from (pissed off) finns. The story just doesn't make any sense and consists of made up 'facts'.

Antti, Helsinki, Finland

I think that this article wounds Finns as much as Britons would be if there'd be a huge flood sweeping over London, and then joking about how "it always rains in England".

Well, it doesn't always rain in England, nor are Mr Boyes' descriptions real.

Ismo, Helsinki, Finland

I'm a swedish speaking Finn. What is stereotyping if that isn't? This was the worst text I have read in ages.... what does this say about journalists in the United Kingdom? What are your sources and what make you have the right to write such a thing. "Friendship in the traditional sense is often a summer luxury" .. For real... Come on!

Patricia Ström, Vasa, Finland

How wrong can you get? I've lived in England for 3 years and never felt so alone and unsafe. Public transport was barely existent outside London and the schooling system and enthusiasms of the pupils was very poor. Finland is nothing like you say it is. People are happy and family and friends are respected more then anything. Sure the winters are dark and cold but that doesn't make us all crazy and suicidal!!! High suicide rate and third most handguns per capital. Finland's' capital in under 6 million ( a small amount per small amount makes a big amount. You should think about your facts and how you present them). Most of our guns are used for hunting due to the fact we have great nature here in Finland were animals and people love to spend time. I really recommend you visit Finalnd to really see what it is like. It is extremely beautiful and the people are extremely friendly.
I hope you have the decency to write and post an apology to the Finnish people.

Chris Tenlenius, Helsinki, Finland

Sorry Finns for this lazy piece of journalism.

I share your sentiments entirely as I too can remember a time when this newspaper was based on unspectacular but solid journalism. You have to feel for the poor guy though, maybe he had to go all the way to Wikipedia to brush up on his Finnish mythology instead of just copying and pasting from Facebook as they did with the suspected killer of that poor girl in Italy.

From my experience of Finns (in England) you guys must have a very interesting country which I'm sure is superior to the UK in terms of social responsibility (and most probably journalism) if not weather as the this reporter so smugly pointed out.

Matt, Nottingham, (now Paris)

Can't belive what am I reading...!!! Have to say that I have had respect on the Times, but this was something really unbelivable....

MickeyMan, Perkele , Finland

Considering the details and the background of the tragedy,it should be clear even for The Times that it's waste of time to weave reasons for the tragedy from the Finnish society. In this case it's actually quite racist and inappropriate.

MoMark, Bath, England

It is true. We never returned Napoleon's servant to France from St. Helen. We do not practise gardening to find someone's bones berried. We have no polluted island as we do not run biological or chemical tests. We have no village demolished during the II WW as we never cracked the Enigma-code. Our Church never taught us our God would be only a seat with some figure sitting on top of it in the tabernacle and someone would spray once a year blood on top of this. We haven’t got ClickOnLine for Berkeley Univ. people to smear unknown. We rarely steal private property overseas. We have no tanks to protect air-bridge. As true is in the 60’s Finns having believed Santa Claus and sauna was invented in Finland. And Lenin did visit the place since most of him has unfortunately still remained here. But one thing is true - something is wrong also with us. Let's get to know each other a bit better - shall we? Disturbed Times. God Save The Queen!

Ake Tyvi, Helsinki, FINLAND

I don't find it necessary to comment on the article, I guess its falseness is clear to everyone already.

In my opinion this incident could well have taken place where ever and when ever. Mentally unstable person got on the wrong track. What seems true is that the shooter copied some earlier events in America, but the reason of his act lies somewhere else. Blaming the society is easy and probably even justified. People need to reconsider their values of life. Parents and professionals need to really listen to the children, give them time, find out what is going on in their lives. We need to care! This incident could (or could not) maybe have been prevented somehow earlier on. But still, I believe that even in a different kind of society, with no internet nor cell-phones this person would have done something he shouldn't have done, with as or less tragic consequences.

Niina, Helsinki, Finland

Mr. Boyes, you seem confused?!
Do you even know where Finland is??? Look it up on the internet if you'd like or maybe your boss at the Times can send you to Finland on a fact finding mission before you decide to write another article, you seemed quite out of your depth with this last one.

Let me guess, you normally are in charge of the weekend weather....

Maria Malin, Seattle, WA, USA

"Yet despite the common features with other massacres, the shoot-up in Tuusula was a very Finnish affair."
I would love to hear the explanation for that. A very Finnish affair? In what way? This kind of tragedys happen once in a decade in Finland.
This article shows how stereotypical some of us can be, and most of all, the power of research!
Did Roger Boyes know that we have CITIES in Finland? And that we live also in FLATS? So we do have neighbours, even though we have lakes and summercottages near them. And in Finland we also have friends in real life. Is that so hard to believe? We do not worship Youtube and Nokia cellphones, we don't live in iglus and eat polarbears. And we do not look like Lordi and we do not drink alcohol like crazy.
I also assume that britons aren't in pubs every day, you don't only eat fish and chips and your lives are not like in Hollyoaks and Emmerdale.
You see? We even know what Hollyoaks is!

Not so narrow-minded, Helsinki, Finland

To choose a Swedish professor of psychology to be your consultant in Finnish mentality is the same as to choose Osama bin Laden to be your half-light leader in World affairs.

Ukko Perkele, Espoo,

Dear Roger Boyes,

I can't read your article without noticing you surely have found some dictionary and searhed for word "Finland".

To refer this part where you say: " Finland...is wide open spaces...16-17 people per square kilometre. Lakes often separate neighbouring farmsteads???. At this time of year it is sunk in almost permanent half-light and Finnish families count the days to their winter holidays when they can flee to the bright sunlight of south-east Asian resorts."

You should know that Tuusula is close to our Capital city Helsinki. And even it isn't so densely populated in global view. It's atleast town area all the way to Helsinki.

If you give blame for isolation to bear then tell me how many towns you have seen where people are living 16 per square kilometter? Must be rich area then.

Nice of you to offer your's condolences but I'm just worried you really don't care a bit of our crief when you don't even have interest to check the whereabouts of this massagre.

Mr. K.Villberg, Tampere,

I live in Finland and you are quite correct.Many finnish people are not only alcoholics but very sad and many cant even speak english.The self-denial is also nice and high in this country, you can see it in the other comments that this page is full off. People think that your critical comments about Finland,is the same as bad mouthing the victims which you arent.Almost everyday (at least one in a week) someone is murdered in Finland with a knife as its the weapon of choice in but now when someone used a pistol, it gets the headlines in most papers. Something 100 people die here yearly because they were driven over by a drunk driver but it gets no headlines. Thats a bigger problem than this one shooting tragedy.
Finland has a lot of problems and we the finnish people arent addressing them.
1:Alcoholism
2:Depression created by alcoholism/vice versa
3:We dont know much what goes in the world
4:Alcoholism
If we can cure those problems even a little bit, then we are on the right way.

Janne Kuusi, helsinki, Finland

And Polarbears walk all over... Right! The writer clearly doesn´t know anything about Finland and probably hasn´t been here ever.
"Friendship in the traditional sense is often a summer luxury."
"And so friendship becomes virtual."
The writer has an excellent imagination and irrational capability to put things together. Yes its dark here in the winter and we use a lot of high tech. But that doesn´t make us less social or totally depressed. "Nordic winter isolates the young in the small towns." ????? We keep on living despite of winter, cold and darkness. We are not bears or hedgehogs who sleep all the way through the winter. Our world doesn´t stop spinning because its cold and dark here in Finland. And about the tragedy; it is not a very Finnish incident! This has stopped the whole country; we are all grieving together.
I hope this never happens again!!!

Tiina, Helsinki, Finland

Wrong, UK murder rate is half that of Finland's.

Finland: 0.0283362 per 1,000 people
UK: 0.0140633 per 1,000 people

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita

Ian, Bristol, UK

"Friendship in the traditional sense is often a summer luxury. "

Oh my. I would be very curious to know where the writer got this idea from.

Maria, Oulu, Finland

I like rap and pop music, im so happy, i use computer 3x of week. i dont have much time to use it. :) yes, here (ordinary in lapland) are so cold and dark on december. Im young teen and i love youtube.com :D my life is my hobbies and friends (i dont mean net-friends) I think u wrote littledbit wrooong... try again after ur finnish-trip. ;) xD

greetings from here (where?:--D ) A: Helsinki.

Donateee, Helsinki, Finland

After bomb explosions in the UK Finnish magazines do not, as far as I know, write "such a UK tragedy".

I only hope that something similar to this Times article never ever get published in any Finnish magazine or newspaper.

I find your article very offending and feel sad that you can not check your facts better. Do not write if you do not have the facts.
At least you got some of the errors corrected during the day.

Yes, we do travel long distances. I personally have to travel 45 km to my office in Helsinki. That takes me 35 to 40 minutes.
I have a friend living in London travelling about half of that distance in 2 hours. That is twice the time. If the distance is a factor to a massacre then how about time. If time is, then isn't a school massacre then a very UK affair?

At least it is only 180 days left till when I get to meet my friends again. In a traditional way!

Thanks to all the persons in the UK that has responded to this idiotic article. All the best to You!

Johan, Sipoo, Finland

I would love to get my hands on a reliable study that shows how the long dark season and the lack of social contacts are related. This may come as a shock, but we have lights in the cities so we do find our way to our friends even in November.
Mr. Boyes, you could have as well stated how the constant fear of polar bears makes people somewhat homicidal.
My humble wish is, that when dealing with Finland or other fairly distant, northern countries, could You please throw the the ancient prejudices and myths out the window and do some research instead.

Annukka, Helsinki,

As a finnish man working for Met Police in London I found this article to be utter rubbish. Those 8 kids killed will propably be the only 8 kids killed for this year in Finland. Living in London and working for police I know exactly how dangerous place England can be. And there is a big difference between these two countries.I choose FINLAND any time!! It would'nt surprise me to read this kind of article in the Sun or the Mirror knowing how bad the journalism in this country is, but the Times........
And let's not talk about the 21 kids killed by a knife in this country this year. I have not heard the Times to write about the constant rain being the cause of it.Well done.

Markku Paajarvi, feltham, england

Thank you for this needless in-depth "analysis" of this unfortunate incident. How can you call this a very "Finnish tragedy"? Ridiculous! Maybe the killers in Columbine or the Virginia shooter for example had visited Finland before their well known actions and got their inspiration from here...who knows. It's clearly obvious that you're knowledge of Finland and it's people is very poor. The winter is very cold and dark, but that doesn't prevent us of being socially active. We do have normal, non-virtual relationships with other people, even during the winter. Finns have a lot of firearms, but still gun related homicides are rare. Finland has less gun related homicides than UK. Guns are strictly regulated here. It is true that our depression and suicide ratings are high, and they have been for years. Our mentality is a bit melancholy, we are aware of that well known fact. But that or anything else you described in your "analysis" doesn't even begin to explain this horrific massacre. Finland has a small population, that's why we consider ourselves to be a small country, regardless of our "wide open spaces" between "neighbouring farmsteads". In a small country people usually form a tight community, as they do in Finland. Because of that this senseless killing touches every Finn very profoundly. I'm shocked that The Times has published this Mr. Boyes's article. It's imaginative and degrading. There's nothing truly Finnish about this dreadful event.

Satu, Lappeenranta, Finland

Roger that! Yet you managed to miss one thing; the life expectancy at birth (in Finland) is around 30. Facts, facts & facts...

Senior Citizen, TRE, Finland

This is not about our history or our gods in the past. Yes we have Kalevala and we are proud from it, yes we had "ukko" god but nowadays many people don't even remember those "gods" especially young people don't remember or even not know.. So this is nothing about our "gods in history". Just like you wrote, this young guy was very interested about Nazs, Germany (he even studied germanian language).

But one problem is here, many young people in school don't have friends and others are like gang and here everybody are not friends like in - America, UK, Italy!
in our culture we just don't speak with everybody we don't say hello to everybody we are not everybodies friends. This is because here it takes many years to have good friendsship until can know other person very well.
We don't know very well how small talk - but is it always so nice speak with someone in the bus, train when is busy or ill? it is not...

I know, Helsinki,

Mm, I don't really think that we Finns are like that - I know so many normal persons here that I can't believe you're right. Does the writer of this text know any Finns? Lots of young people in websites are angry because of this news, because we don't want to everybody think we're just some depressed, slighted people who can't have fun at all, because that's not the truth. Think so you have murders and killers in Enland too? But you're still better people? Really?
Please, don't blame the country about this tragedy.

Aino, Saarijärvi, Finland

You hav right. We become more and more depsessive every day. Why? If you work in Finland and belong to middleclass working people, like nurses, women in bank or in officies, your salary is so little after taxes, that you cannot live with it one month, only two weeks, because living in Finland is very expencive.

We working people are depressive and the situation becomes worse every day. And our children? They are sad and cannot understand that we working people cannot buy food every day. It is too expencive. If you don´'t work in Finland, you get money from state, you get money from our taxes, which we working people give to you.

We have a very sick system here, It makes uss depressive. Who had the worst situation here, is the middle class with high education. Taxes are high and we get no help from state if we should need.

Families are depressive and sad here.

Anna , Helsinki, Finland

I'm not that surprised (rather a bit amused) to see the overwhelming negative response to this article. I've been trying to tell the same thing to my fellow Finns for years but vast majority of them are in serious denial. Basically there are those you haven't lived abroad and then those who have, who know better.
Never mind the bit flimsy allegories with Finnish mythology, this is a very good article which provides clever perspective about Finland and, dare I hope, works as an eye-opener for some.

Touko Maksimainen, Loviisa, Finland

There is no utopia yet, there is nothing wrong in looking inwards and see how things can improve. This is an unusual situation in Finland or other Nordic countries, but then something must have gone wrong, seriously wrong for this young intelligent chap to have carried out this attrocity on his school mates and headteacher. I have lived in Finland and remember Sanna's shooting in 1999.

I am not putting Finland down, as most Finns would not like to be rubbished, but there are some elements of truth and danger when young children are exposed to high tech, little social contacts and over pampered by material things...

I do feel sorry for the affected victims/family. The world is a global village, the human race is one. The truth has no other name

Meehard, London, UK

Hmm.. A brisk winter day full of glittering snow and pale sunlight. What a beautiful weather we had today! I went to a walk with my friend (yeas, as a healthy 19-year-old Finn I have those) and our dogs, it was quite nice! Shame this wonderful time of year has to have this shadow over it. Whole Filand seems to be shocked about this all. Normally we would enjoy the fresh snow and we would pe expecting christmas and the real minus degrees to make it possible to ski. For me this is just the best time of the year.

For the writer to this article: I recomend you travel to Finland and see what this place is truly about. I bet you'll love it! We have lived with the cruel winter for ages and we do know how to make the best of it!

With all my love: I laughed a bit when I read this article...

Johanna, Kemi, Finland

Interesting how before the article said that in finland there are 120 people per square kilometre, and now it says 16-17 (which is correct and was pointed out in previous comments). Should these "facts" perhaps been checked before publishing this article?

Maria, Helsinki, Finland

Thats not true what you read about finland. That was pretty funny article :D sorry my bad english im only 14.

EEL, Helsinki, Finland

Let us stop battering this poorly informed journalist, Mr. Boyes. There will always be journalists telling stereotype stories wishing they would reinforce and please their readers' prejudices. However, I happen to be quite confident, the majority of those reading The Times, are much more up-dated with Finland, the Finnish culture and the way the Finns behave - regarless of the time of the year. They can make the distinction between an isolated abnormal behaviour to a very Finnish affair.

Jukka Itäkylä, Turku, Finland

This article is a travesty. Not an "analyses" but a mockery. "Small frozen township; "just about as frozen as Chicago.

I just got back from Finland via London, even though the whether was worse in London, there was no noticiable difference in the amount of daylight.

My experience of Finns is that they are very much contrary to your stereotypical picture

J. G.K., Alexandria, VA, US

I'm sure Mr Boyes was very pleased with his "analysis" of Finnish culture and its people, using "facts" from god knows where! It is warming to see the response that this article has got from both fellow Finns and other times readers, and hopefully in future the author will engage in some research and engage brain before writing such insulting rubbish. I feel proud to be a citizen of Finland and even more proud of the solidarity of us Finns.

Sebastian Walker, Helsinki,

As a finnish woman in my 20s i must look back to old days, my youth and say that im proud of being a Finn (althought i cant be taken as the most patriotic person) During my life I have lived in two other countries. Other was our scandinavian neighbour Sweden and another was a distant land in Asia, Japan. I would recommend strongly that you, mr Boyes, apologize.

If you dont know anything about what you are talking about, you should be mature enough to understand when to stop. I dont mean that Finland doesnt have problems, but study even the basic facts of Finland before you write nonsense.

Im proud to be raised as a independent, highly educated woman who got a lot of freedom in a very early age. Im equal to men. I had no need to be scared on my way to school and back. I didnt have to stay away from some areas in my home city. In Finland, the police doesnt shoot innocent people, no matter how stressfull would the situation be.


Come and see Finland, with its pros

Sofie , Helsinki, Finland

Dear Mr. Boyes,

It is unreal that a man of Your status writes something so totally unreal. You must have missed a few hundreds of years, for sure.

I am not aware that you know we have street lights and automobiles, nowadays, also in Finland.

Please, come visit us, and then make up your mind, what kind of people we are.

If you write something out of your "rabbit hat", that is not fair to anyone.

Jukka, Helsinki, FI

I was very surprised when I read your article, mr. Boyes. It seems you know more about us Finns than we ever can do. It seems you have answers to many questions I've been having on my mind yesterday and today, but still I don't understand: What makes a horrible school massacre a very Finnish affair?

I'm not a wise guy but I think your article tells more about something you would like to call the journalistic quality of the Times than about the tragedy what happened in Tuusula, Finland.

K. Hyvarinen, Joensuu, Finland

Just because one disturbed being takes his anger out on innocent people, we Finns are depressed and socially isolated people?!
I see, how easy it is to judge other nations, without knowin any better.

Kristiina, Hyvinkää, Finland

You have so narrow-minded picture of Finns! Shame on you! I´m HAPPY to live in Finland. And I´m HAPPY teenager from Finland. We should write an article concerning your country...as narrow-minded as yours! I bet you would be happy to read it! And I have to say that you have a great country cause you don´t seem to have any depressed people...yeah right!

Mie, Mikkeli, Finland

I come from Eastern european country, and I have seen our people outraged many times over documentary films or newspaper articles about our country.