David by a length!

The usual ranting of a failed politician, Matthew.

mark, London,

I would go so far as saying that Bliar's only success (as far as I'm concerned) is proving that he's been responsible for producing the worst government in the history of western civillisation (if not the world). If this does not put people off trusting the left ever again, then we deserve to live in the hell that this country's become.

stevgillamos, Romford,

To Peter East, Grays, Essex

If you want to site a short memory, please get your facts right. Three day weeks and power cuts were part of Edward Heath’s government (1970 to 1974) a full five years before Margaret Thatcher came to power. Yes pernicious strikes were a part of the 1970s but the winter of discontent was greatly exaggerated; the strikes were largely over by February 1979.

Gary, Southsea,

Slightly off-topic, but could we PLEASE get rid of this idea that France's new Foreign Minister is PRO the Iraq war. Much as neocons (real and crypto) would love to believe this, it is wishful thinking. Yes he did consider Saddam Hussein to be a murderous tyrant (but then so did most people, including Jacques Chirac). For example, at a speech in Harvard in March of 2003, he said, "Nobody is taking into account the Iraqi people. They are the only ones who can say yes or no to the war ... I am not supporting Mr. Bush, I am not supporting [French President Jacques] Chirac. I will support to the end of my days the victims, and they are the Iraqi people", and went on SPECIFICALLY to OPPOSE the proposed American war there. According to the report in the Harvard Gazette, he repeated his opposition to war several times in his half-hour speech and during a subsequent question-and-answer session.

Bernard Kouchner never supported or nor supports now the war in Iraq.

Chris, Avignon, France

While I agree with Robert Nye, I would add the caveat that a certain Mr Brown seems to have bucked his trend.

David Marusza, Cardiff, Wales

However you view the Thatcher years it was at least possible to feel that those who governed generally did so with the best interests of Uk Ltd. in mind. Effectively politics was the servant of government. Today it is much more likely that the ruling classes are populated by career politicians. Our political system itself and the way in which it selects potential candidates is perhaps the primary reason for the problems we experience. We no longer value age and experience. There is a drive for ever younger representatives, which in itself predicates against serious life/business experience. A political degree(s) or a (very short) 'career' in law, which often now seems synonymous with a political career, is followed by a few years brown nosing the Palace of Westminster. Eventually a position in government. Up to the this point all the incumbent has learnt are the skills of politics. Little wonder government has become the servant of politics.

Robert Nye, Horsham, West Sussex

Blair a great man leading a people who were drifting into small mindiness and defeatism. He taught us that politics could solve some of the worlds problems and that we as a nation can achieve great things. The rest of Europe has accepted that but we still don't. There is now a French foreign secretary who backs the Iraq war and a more supportive German Chancellor. We are now a social democratic country but in our own British way. He has changed things for better in this country and the people who voted him in realised this.

Thank you Blair.

Warwick King, Penzance, Cornwall

I haven't the inclination to read all 102 comments - but just in case no one else has said it this is brilliant stuff, one of the few genuinely enjoyable political pieces I have read in years.

For my tuppence I think Blair's big appeal was the "big tent" conciliation after the economic reforms of Mrs T . He failed in this and what is more has left a country as angry as it was in 1997, but without any real acheivement to show for it. Interestingly the Conservatives are playing the same conciliatory card now with David C.

Won't get fooled again?

Benjamin, Fairford,

Count yourselves lucky because he is leaving. Us poor souls in Zimbabwe have no such luck. We cant even critize Mugabe the way you critize Blair. And with regards to Mugabe leaving, it would take a lot more than just the wish of the citizens.

Hauza, Harambe, Zimbabwe

Well done, Matthew, in your comparison of Mr Blair to the Cheshire Cat. Indeed, in ten years, all the good he has accomplished has been accidental. When Alice asks the Cheshire Cat which way she ought to go, "so long as I get somewhere," the Cheshire Cat answers, "Oh, you're sure to do that, if you only walk long enough."

10 years is a long walk, and Mr Blair has indeed happened upon "somewhere." Progress in areas happened to occur while he was PM, but coincident does not imply causality.

Kevin Johansen, San Francisco, California

Tony Blair's legacy on 'moral issues' over the last ten years, are probably a more accurate measure of how he and his government have affected British society over the last ten years:
A more violent society, a broken society, a divided nation, gay rights more important than peoples faith, values and beliefs, highest teenage STDs and abortions rates in Europe. The silent majority and traditional family ignored, Christian traditions and heritage ridiculed. Secular/ Atheistic liberalism and militant minorities rule. ( just to name a few). Tony Blair claimed to be a Christian but the reality of 10 years of Tony Blair and his government, was often an 'anti- Christian agenda'. In my view he and his government have done much damage to the moral fabric of our nation and caused deep divisions in our society with his politically correct secular liberal policies. It beggars belief that so many Christians are now praising him. What short memories they must have!

Simon Icke, AYLESBURY, UK

Apart from restoring peace to Northern Ireland which was a great achievement, Tony Blair has been an ignominious failure. Debate as much as you like about his legacy, but that can ultimately be summed up in one word- Iraq.

In terms of the economy, England has been economically stable for as long as Brown has been Chancellor. Blair takes credit for this, when really it was Brown that has been the mastermind behind England being one of the strongest economies in the world.

Tony Blair is a man, who in office cared more about presentation rather than policy. In stark contrast, Gordon Brown is a hard-hitting politician who gets to the heart of the matter.

'Hand on heart I thought I did the right thing,' was what Blair said during his resignation speech. Hand on heart, I think that Blair has overstayed his time in office and Britain is now worse off for it.

Charles Perrin, London, UK

I think Mr Blair is the worst Prime Minister in living memory,but I think he was correct to invade Iraq.It is wrong that he should have taken so much personal abuse. I think the country owes him an apology now that the 3000 thousand tons of WMD and all the labs and manufacturing equipment are known to exist.

Eddie Ward, Llandrindod Wells, Powys

Douglas said "At least Mr. Blair managed to subdue the IRA."

No he didn't . He surrendered to them.
Martin, Marlborough,

Agreed and well said, however I think Clinton did more for the Irish than any British PM in the last 20 years.

D Aspinall, Vancouver, Canada

As my grandfather used to say , your best friend in the world is the pound in your pocket,so why not let's ask Matthew and David if Tony has been a good friend to them and their pockets...
.How much were you worth in 1997 and how much are you worth in 2007?
Be honest now!

Iain Kennedy, Glasgow, Scotland ,UK

Douglas said "At least Mr. Blair managed to subdue the IRA."

No he didn't . He surrendered to them.

Martin, Marlborough,

At least Mr. Blair managed to subdue the IRA. For that alone, he deserves a certain amount of respect.

Douglas, Fleet,

To Matthew Parris
Dear Matthew
I read your latest comments on Blair with thanks. Your commentaries over the past 10 years have been a great consolation. A period in which Britain has been demeaned by a prime minister who has never been anything but a shameless charlatan. A 'Labour Party' led by a man who has taken his instructions from and played to a gallery presided over by Murdoch. A 'Labour party' which has ended up espousing the cause of giant casinos . A 'Labour party' which has gloried in raising the prison population from 50 to 80 thousand. Making Britain a tax haven for the world's rich. Worst of all by taking the Tories' policies under a false banner Blair has devalued the whole political debate in this country-no wonder votes have declined - and we who cannot even prevent barabaric treatment of women in immigrant families in this country dare to think we have the right to export 'democracy' to Iraq and Afganistan!!
Please keep up the good work.

Brian Hooper, Malmesbury,

Sometimes it seems as though David Aaronovitch simply likes articulating the case of the Devil's Advocate, whether or not he has any facts to back it up. Some of the things he mentions are difficult to assess without conducting a survey. New school buildings? Could be. Lower hospital waiting times? I lost faith in the NHS a long time ago so I haven't noticed. Higher education standards? That's one I have to question. The day I can casually employ polysyllabic words in ordinary conversation without someone saying, "Ooh! 'Polysyllabic'? That's a big word!", will be the day I believe that education standards have risen. Don't you think so, innit?

Where, moreover, is the debate about the tremendous assault on civil liberties during the Blair era, as well as the introduction of thought crimes? Reduction in real crime is another claim I can't buy. Only a person who has perfected the ability to avoid either thinking the wrong thought or entering the wrong area could believe it.

Kevin, London,

The Firearms (Amendment) (No. 2) Act 1997 was the first significant piece of legislation introduced by the new Labour government of Tony Blair. This Act victimised an estimated 57,000 people - 0.1% of the population, or 1 in every 960 persons for the actions of one nutter. The incompetence of the Central Scotland Police service, Procurator Fiscal and the Crown Office in administrating Firearms Certificates may have also contributed in setting the stage. Yet no one mentions this. Why?

Russell M, Stirling, Scotland

David offers -

‘The invasion of Iraq has been a disaster, maybe even more of a disaster than not invading would have been. We still don’t know.’

Please tell us David when we will know this – will it be anytime soon? This is a classic Blairist lawyerly muddying of the waters – interpolating some equivalence between invading and not invading, as if it was some agonising moral dilemma for the British people. Perhaps I missed it, but was there another million man march in 2003 demanding an invasion? What do we want? – war in Iraq, when do we want it? – now (we just cannot wait for UN authorisation).

Four years on, Mr Blair wants us to defer judgment – for how many more years, and at what point does this become simply denial or NPD? I don’t see the need for any further adjournments. To suggest that the consequences of not invading Iraq in 2003 could in any way amount to a ‘disaster’ comparable to the present situation is shameful nonsense.

Ju , London, UK

Matthew Parris is such a skillful debater! He has quite successfully ripped apart all of Mr Aaronovitch's arguments with his brilliant, reasoned criticism. All of Mr Aaronovitch's arguments were badly-reasoned, highly rhetorical, and worse, quite irrelevant, like bringing John Major into it, which was quite ridiculous. Go Matthew!

Tanjil Rashid, Ilford, UK

Ten years of Blair rule and yes, a lot of things have improved, but most of what he did and the way in which he conducted himself leaves a bad taste in the mouth. And of course, when we “whip the cover from the elephant”, the Iraq war negates every attributable good thing that he did do…forever.

Gary, The Home Counties,

Only read the first few comments - that was enough - what weird people read your paper to make such unjustified, wrong and nasty comments.
Well done David Aaronovitch for your sensible assessment of Tony Blair's years - as for Matthew Parris I think he must be living in a world of his own - he protests too much - I think he's secretly in love with Tony Blair.
I thank Tony Blair for 10 successful years of a Labour goverment.

A. Macfarlane, Milton Keynes,

Blair did a fantastic job. Given the circumstances, couldnt have had anyone else.

John Bain, Kingston upon Hull,

The only things that I think of when hearing 'Tony Blair' seem to be uncontrolled mass immigration and the disastorous Iraq war. The future for Britain doesn't look good to say the least. You foolish voters should have gotten rid of him a very long time ago.

Jon, Newport,

But hey cheer up folk....he is going in 6 weeks................yihaaaaaaaaaaa....
Thank god he is going and good riddance and may he rot in hell for the damage and suffering he has bought to the world....
As for his foundation for bringing religions closer...pah.....what a farce..he is only doing it in the hope that he can assuage the hurt feelings of muslims in the hope that one doesn't get angry enough to give him or his kids a good kicking or beheading......his kids will never be able to lead a normal life without body guards...THATS his legacy to his family...

ruby cooper, Nice, France

As far as defending quality of life, e.g. fighting overcrowding and overbuilding, he was a resounding failure, as have been most modern leaders except Japan's (gone back to 74% of their land, forest land!!!! -- Germany has only 33%!!!) and criminal cleansing was also a failure.

But he was a great public image and speaker, and best of all kept the liason with America alive, understanding as many do not in the UK, that the balance of world peace depends on international Anglo-saxon unity. Each country should strive for peace, but follow the other into Hell if necessary.

Eugene, Heidelberg, germany

What is the difference between Parris and Aaronovitch?

I suggest the difference between gratuitous rudeness and genous courtesy.

H Prideaux, Gosport, England

You could have had George W. Bush.

Bruce L. Northwood, Washington D.C., USA

The 3 greatest Prime Minsisters in the modern era Churchill, Thatcher and Blair. Whose next?

Brian Cordery, Tours, France

Bliar has been an excellent Prime Minister....

...if you define an excellent PM as one who can avoid domestic catastrophe, maintain a sufficient power base and get out in time. Yes, Bliar's oration and teflon-like coating has been masterfull.

By any other measure, he has been a worthless chameleon who leaves an inverted pyramid ready to collapse.

Matthew 1 David 0 (but well written stuff both of you)

MarkS, Leeds,

What a fantastic article. Superb work Times.

I think MK hits the nail on the head when he says

"It took about 4 years for them to stop behaving like an opposition, and about 8 to get back on the path that the tories were on in 97"

The Tories under Major were a slightly right of centre party, exactly where Mr Blair has been since 1997, except he has been there without the support of most of his party who have just been happy to be in power. I suspect we will replace the red with the blue again in a couple of years time.

Andy, Northampton,

Matthew's point about a small improvement in public services for a large increase in public spending sums up the Blair years for me. The '97 election was in large part about public services ("24 hours to save the NHS", "education, education, education") Many of us thought Britain deserved and could have better public services, and thus had high hopes for Blair. But what has happened? He has spent many tens of billions of our money, and we have, er, well, slightly better public services. The lack of reform, and the continued generosity of public sector pay and pensions (in ever starker contrast to the private sector) is the real problem, Matthew has the nail squarely on the head.

Jonathan Cooper, Bishops Stortford, UK

If I remember correctly, "the Ireland thing" happened because both the IRA and the British government both concluded that the battle was militarily unwinnable. The IRA could not force British withdrawal the British army could not completely destroy the IRA without using such draconian measures as to prove the IRA's political point and raison d'etre giving rise to an even bigger and more determined IRA. This realisation came in the early 90's and resulted in talks and then the Good Friday agreement. The end of the recent troubles in the north of Ireland is no more the Blair's personal achievement than the start of the recent troubles was Harold Wilson's. Both events had to happen on someone's watch, he was just around long enough for it to be his and to claim credit. This was a process and not an event. Mrs T forced the issue by upping the military anti. Major made the first moves Blair took over. Claiming all the credit was a cheap shot not an heroic one.

Samuel, Farnham, UK

"for the first time since 1788, more people emigrate from Australia to England than the other way around".

Stephen of Canberra, Australia, you forgot to mention, India, Pakistan, West Indies, Iraq, Nigeria, Zimbabwe, Somalia, Romania, Poland, etc., etc. The failure to control immigration of one of out biggest complaints.

I cannot help but notice that most of the words of support for Mr Blair are coming from people who have not had the misfortune of living in Britain, under his leadership (if you can call it that).

Chris Long, Thirsk, England

You are absolutely right, David Moss - John Major very nearly pulled off resolving the Irish problem, and all thanks should go to him, and to Margaret Thatcher before him, for making today's achievements, under Tony Blair, possible. Without their hard work, Tony Blair would not have been able to put that particular feather in his cap.

And as for this idea that before 1997 we were all living in "Bleak House", or something akin to the dark ages, too right again - it is in fact Margaret Thatcher we have to thank for putting Britain on the road to recovery & economic success, as without the incredible turnaround she achieved whilst in power, Britain would be nowhere today.

I am, yet again, astonished as just how short the memories of most people are....

Helen Wagner, Paris, France

The 2 major criticisms seem to be the Iraq war and corruption. The Iraq war was the right thing to do. Such a fuss was made about a lack of WMDs. But nobody listened when Polish troops FOUND CHEMICAL WEAPONS just after the invasion, and everyone forgets the attacks on Kurds with chemical weapons.

Ben, York,

One of the problems with assessing success is that we don't know what it would have been like if the money had not been ploughed into education and health. Whatever you criticise, you cannot say that they did not attempt to control how the money was spent - that it failed in health is more to do with the greed of those able to use their power to gain most.
One thing for sure - if the money had not been spent the economy would have stalled in a similar way to the rest of Europe.
Matthew Parris is far too bitter and twisted about Iraq to see the real benefits delivered by New Labour. I have had the good fortune to carry out several research projects in deprived areas where the genuine attempt to make a difference is clearly visible. Too many people are making judgements that are either based on ignorance of the facts or emotionally charged by with the smell of blood from the spoils of the witch hunt.
The strength of the economy had nothing to do with Blair?Brown

Sam Singer, Sheffield,

Of course, it's all entertaining reading. But the views of Matthew Parris probably are less important to people in the Street than how many peas are in a tin - or even the views of Jeremy Clarkson!!

Tony Blair's ten years in office have been flawed. For one thing he has stayed on far too long. But Iraq has been the disaster. I seem to remember Blair once quoting the words his late father Leo, and how Leo highly regarded the Americans for their actions in WW2. Well, yes, - don't we all; and Blair's actions after 9/11 echoed all our sentiments. But Blair not only failed to try and convince the USA of the folly of Iraq, but actually joined in.

I look at the positive points however. Economic stability, investment in Public Services. Within a week or so we'll have the Architect as Prime Minister, as opposed to the Salesman.

I also, as a resident of Tatton Constituency, have a good memory. Heaven pray my memory nevers falters when I walk into the ballot box . . .

AWG, Wilmslow, Cheshire,

So I can take it that you don't like him then?

T. Bishop, London, UK

It seems that you have both reached the same conclusion: that Blair is an ordinary bloke with few of the leadership qualities his spin doctors would have us believe. The fig leaf began to slip fairly early on, with a lack of robust policies to fix the NHS. WIth the fig leaf gone, it became increasingly and disappointingly clear that the emperor's clothes were indeed an illusion. I said in 1997 that it would all end in tears, that they were too clever by three-quarters etc. I sincerely hope that Brown will prove to us that their Granita pact was a horrible and catastrophic mistake.

John Lancaster, Stratton,

If Blair had caused the deaths of a thousand British civilians rather than one hundred thousand Iraqi civilians, it would be farcical to imagine that this Aaronovitch would be allowed by The Times to peddle this revisionist nonsense.

joe, brussels, belgium.

Blair had a rare opportunity in 1997 to achieve great things. He had a massive parliamentary majority and huge public goodwill on his side. What he lacked was vision and purpose but then charletans usually do. In reality he was photogenic, unthreatening, a PR dream and a vote winning phenonmenon - totally suited to the Big Brother age- all surface but no substance but then that's what the public wants in its politicians these days. Can anyone say with any certainty exactly what he stands for or believes in, apart from being re-elected? What a wasted opportunity.

Chris, London, UK

If as Matthew says Mr Blair and the Labour party has achieved so little, what about his beloved Consrvative Party? Four leader and still not a policy to put before the people.

I will give one personnal example of the improvements in the NHS, under the last government my father waited four months to see a cancer consultant, four weeks ago my brother saw a cancer specialist two hours, I repeat two hours, after visiting our GP.

I judge on my own experiences, not the media hipe.

AMJ , Alton,

I'm very disappointed to see Blair go, though not surprised that our politically illiterate public revile him so, regardless of the facts.

You fight an admirable fight, Mr A, and kept your head when all around you were losing theirs.

Goodbye, Mr Blair - you thanklessly did good things and our nation is better for it.

Henrietta Forbes Hamilton, London, UK

Unanimous verdict - Matthew by a distance.

Tony, Edinburgh, Scotland

The Mahatma Blair routine which we will be subjected to by the spin machine in the next 8 weeks will be the last straw. His monument will be a mountain of corpses in Iraq, fortunately (for him) barely visible on the radar of our sycophantic, celebrity-obsessed media.

Mike, Glasgow, UK

On balance a failure. It took about 4 years for them to stop behaving like an opposition, and about 8 to get back on the path that the tories were on in 97. Too much tinkering from the centre and adherence to the cult of managerialism, encouraged by the media that want someone in Westminster to be 'responsible' for every school and hospital.
Some things would have got better just because the world economy was getting better. I suspect things would have been even better if TB/GB didn't always feel they had to do something.

MK, MK, UK

Why can't the media just ignore Blair and then he might go away faster?

simon, UK,

It's not Blair's fault that more than half of UK is in debt. People decided to borrow money, not him.

With regards to Iraq, i'm sure 90% of the people who criticizes his Iraq policy now, supported it when it was just in it's infancy stage.

What i don't like is that criminals now have more rights than victims. Their prison cells are a picture of luxury. They can get compensation for injuries which in the first place wouldn't have occured if they are law abiding.

Fred Diggler, Southampton, UK

Oh my! If one were to eliminate the parts refering to the UK and the "K" word one could knock out the name Blair and substitute Bush, especially in the rejoinders authored by Matthew. The fit would be near perfect--and corrrect.

In my experience, UK public transport has improved, though I'm not sure where the credit lies. I am told by people who live Britain that the NHS has had some improvement at the margins, though, I would think, not if you live in a Torey constituancy where the NHS has closed the local hospital--a move that can only be described, charitabley, as misguided, and more realistically as politically thuggish.

Leaders are remembered for the big things. Here in the US Lyndon Johnson is still, some 40 years on, remembered only for the Vietnam War. Never mind the Civil Rights Act and Medicare. This does not bode well for the Blair legacy.

Jim Walton, Washington, DC

Poor Matthew. As a commited Tory He never has been able to forgive Tony Blair for having had the cheek to win three general elections.

LordCopper, horsham, uk

Once he leaves number 10 I hope I never have to see Blair's face on television again. Perhaps he can go to Australia and much up that fine country the way he has Britain. Better still, Papua New Guniea. I'm sure they'd like him there. Cometo think of it, The times should hold a competition: where in the world would you like Blair to go. That could produce some interesting comments.

Adrian Gilbert, Tonbridge, England

Have Blair and those who support Blair seen this data? https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2079rank.html
How can any Briton get into sleep when they have the highest debt per capita in this planet?
At first look at the CIA data, I just could not believe my eyes, and I still can not believe it, as everyone is talking about Briton is enjoying good econmoic and leading Europe in many areas due to Blair's talent, so they also lead in debt?
I'm really wish someone to tell me that I'm wrong, that the debt is insignificant compared to the prosperity.

DZ, ipswitch, Qld

It is amazing how people abroad see Blair in a positive manner. They have not lived through this decade of hell. When I experience an incident and read about it in the newspapers I hardly recognize being there. The overseas view is similar. Blair inherited a benign economic situation from the ghastly Major.He has wasted it.

Education and the Health Service are no better for all the billions thrown at them. One has as good a chance of seeing Kylie walking down our street as a policeman. Law and order is in turmoil and evil people are being released early from prisons because they are full. Nett migration numbers are distorted by the collapse of immigration controls. We have swaithes of the UK now refusing to integrate and become British. Many in fact loathe us and want to murder us. - some did ! The public sector is bloated and private retirement pensions have been destroyed by Blair.

Blair has been the great deceiver - We English are the losers.

Mike, Leatherhead, England

It still surprises me that otherwise intelligent people like Matthew Parris seem to expect that investment in an institution like the NHS should produce benefits equivalent to the size of the investment in the short term. It is obvious that it can't.

If the government had decided immediately in May 1997 to fund a large increase in the number of trainee doctors, the cost would start to impact by 1998 (universities could not have organised the expansion of their medical schools more quickly than that). It takes 7 years to train a doctor, so the first benefits of the decision would not come on line until 2005 - which is just about the date of much of the data on which the argument is based. Similar issues affect the investment in new hospitals, but to a greater degree. In both cases the investment produces no benefit for several years. But without the investment, the NHS would not have stood still - it would have continued to get worse, as it had in the years up to 1997.

jim brant, Daventry, UK

Let's see - what did bliar achieve that other post war PMs haven't here's the big 10!

1) Not peace in northern ireland - that was John Major
2) Not saving the NHS - that is is a worse mess than ever, saddled with vast debts and an even greater number of unproductive administrators
3) Not keeping taxes down
4) Not fighting wars wisely within limits and clearly defined objectives - Churchill, Thatcher, Major
5) Not keeping labour's share of the vote above 27% - even Callaghan did that
6) Not improving social mobility - that has collapsed even further under his regime
7) Not providing homes for key workers, for the first time in history a british couple on modest incomes cannot afford to buy a house in much of the country
8) Not keeping the country united, rather he has driven the Union to the brink of destruction
9) Not keeping inflation down
10) Not reforming the public sector

- The man is a star!

edward green, Upminster, England

Blair did not "fail" for he is a spin doctor. Neither did he succeed for he lacks substance. His cabinet colleagues are equally responsible.

The reality is he left a big mess in terms of education, health, transport, housing
and the social security system.

People in power can do much good and yet once in power they forget themselves and do not do justice to the people who put them there in the first
place---it is confusion all round.

ian, singapore, singapore

I sometimes wonder if people are living in the same country as me. We are one of the most successful countries in the world and under Blair we have become more so. It is easy to forget that the recessions, high unemployment, low growth, house repossessions were an all too regular occurrence in the past. Then there's the minimum wage, help for the poorest pensioners, reform of section 28, peace in Northern Ireland, anti-racist legislation...


Sure mistakes have been made. All governments and all politicians make them. But on balance, Tony Blair has been a successful Prime Minister and that is how history will judge him. As for Iraq, we can never know what the consequences of doing nothing would have been but ridding the world of an evil dictator can never be a bad thing.

Sorry Matthew you are wrong, again.

Tom Horrocks, London, England

Neither success nor failure.

A disaster.

By the way, has anyone thought of warning Africa?

John Chuckman, Toronto, Canada

The British are the World Leaders in "MOANING".I agree with David ,Blairs done a great lot of good for the UK.Above all a strong economy and better quality of life compared to the Tory Years.
Matthew will always bad mouth anybody thats New Labour after all he supports the Champion Spinner and PR expert Cameron.When we do one day see some substance and policies from Cameron we may be able to compare him with Blair on what he has to offer. Mind you i think we will have a long waite.

Bill Rees, PIEUSSE, FRANCE

Whether it is Mr Blair or over here Mr Schröder or Ms Royal in France: Once all the "Labour" parties had a solid ground from which they acted. The traditional social democratic movement had achieved what they once had struggled for. Today the industrial workers class has nearly vanished. The "Labour" cause had vanished too. In Germany we call it "Zeitgeist" which is ruling these traditional policies of any social democratic party. What can be their cause today? There is no easy answer. The "class societies" do not exsist anymore. So be fair: It's easy for tricksters to pour into that political vacuum. And that is why Blairs was in troubles: emptiness in his cause...

Dirk R Bode, Hamburg, Germany,

Bravo! Your retrospective prophesy on Tony Blair is infinitely closer to the mark than those mindless jeremiads against “spin”, with their reflex ball-tampering and wicket-fixing rhetoric.

John Corbett, Paris, France

For Tony in this neck of the woods, his decision to join Bush in going after Iraq will overshadow in a negative way everything that he has accomplished. Immediately before March of 2003, he was extremely well liked and was viewed as having more upstairs in the attic than Bush. Instead of standing up as a friend warning the leaders here of the stupidity and possible dire consequences of invading Iraq, instead of saying "Hey, if you go in, you are on your own on this one", he gave high credibility to what Bush, et al proposed to do and their reasons for it. It was like a punch in the gut to those of us here who were fighting hard to convince Congress to avoid such a conflict . For this, frankly, I cannot forgive him.

joe yurgine, bourbonnais, illinois, usa

Blair got quite a bit wrong and quite a bit right but then again he had a good teacher for the wrong bits. Thatcher invented spin, remember the 100,000 will be laid off then reducing to 50,000 soon after and everyone breathing a sigh of relief. She played out that stunt several times along with the "I was on holiday" excuse. Thatcher had a huge oil bonanza and still couldn't stop boom-bust. Blair had none of her advantages and he did far better. Thatcher promised to get rid of quangos and we got more, fewer civil servants, we got more, .... and so on. The foundations for the disasters of todays education systems and pension debacles were laid back in Thatcher's years and we should never forget it. Blair should've attacked the vested interests of the doctors, lawyers, police, teachers, etc so Brown will have to get stuck in to reduce the list of public employees and wasters such as lawyers for better or for worse.

John, Dundee, UK

Every con-man gives away a little, that's how he gets people to swallow the duplicity that comes with it: Also, this flim-flam man had another master of legerdemain at his side, to handle with byzantine skill the complexities of finance, that are only exposed in their deleterious effect some years later.

Yes, improvements in NHS and elsewhere, but at what price? We are, (except for the wealthy, who have been more enriched) more in debt than ever, we are a fearful and more endangered nation, we are increasingly scrutinised by cameras and handicapped by inane acts of law from the department of wizard wheezes, and created criminals faster than we have the capacity to deal with them. And the waste of billions due to ineptitude and ill-thought out schemes! More waste probably, than any government in our history.

In all, it has been a bravura performance of a consummate actor-politician-snake oil salesman, with luck on his side, that has blinded millions to the truth of his phoniness.

Peter Day, Doncaster, UK

The 20/20 hindsight we apply to most politicians' behaviour, motives and achievements always seems very curious to me. The faults assume massive prominence whilst the good deeds fade with time - the usual "what have you done for me lately".

With regard to Tony Blair, what were we all expecting, a combination of Gandhi and Caesar? Blair is who he is, another human being who craves attention, approval and power. To get those three things he at times follows the herd (fuel strikes) and at others tries to be the leader (the balkans, iraq, privatisation).

He's done pretty well I would have to say, the U.K. is still an excellent place to live and if there are still problems, and even new problems, the good still outweighs the bad.

Warren

Warren, Sydney, Australia

The 11+ exam was great way to tell kids they´re failures.Kids now receive a more diverse education for a more diverse world. That costs, alongside everything else.
18 yrs of Conservatives saw
Political Scandal
Nationwide riots from all sides of Joe Public
Dome agreed
Immigration screamed about
Education failure
NHS sold out to private healthcare
Public owned property sold to the greasiest palm
Millions unemployed
War
worse crime and disorder

Without Labour i would not have a job in the Creative industries in whom they believe
The Conservatives want to end the New Deal Scheme which has supported me and over a million others back into work.
Tony and Gordon have turned around the way we use the resources we have, and who benefits.
Labour are more about equality of opportunity.
The labour govt has fought a difficult battle with the all crying out for their own individual needs but, to paraphrase, you can´t give everything to everyone all the time.
10 more yrs pleas

Colin, Cheltenham, UK

David/Matthew - interesting and entertaining banter, but time alone will tell the ups or downs of Blair's reign (and reign it was). The people of Britain are far more intelligent than Blair (and most politicians) give them credit for. We all see through the constant spin, little "not quite the full truth" utterances designed to deceive. Blair is/was the master. We serfs know the real facts on the ground. The next election will allow us all to vote on Blair's achievements. You win Matthew.

Gordon, Surrey, UK

Mainstream groupthink is that the developments in Northern Ireland should be considered a success story for Mr Blair and his colleagues. The language of substitution allows no comparison to be made other than between the situation now, and that which existed during the bombing campaign. Like President Bush's concept that one is either for him or for the terrorists, it paints rationality into a corner, preventing reasoned discussion from taking place.

What has happened in Northern Ireland is that the bombers and the bigots have been given recognition that their mindless dogmatism, with its impossible and unjustifiable ambitions, has gained them the right to dominate the political process. This has been at the expense of marginalising the serious, thoughtful statesmen. It's equivalent to stopping playground bullying by giving the ringleaders lollipops, and making them all prefects in place of those who have demonstrated citizenship.

This is where the Middle Way inevitably leads.

Simon Stephenson, Windermere, UK

All the claims and figures sound good, but when (as an ordinary citizen, but one with serious training in statistical analysis) I've investigated any of them, they melt like snow. Anybody in the real world knows that many competent and public-spirited front line staff in education, the police, or the NHS, loathe this government and its obsession with looking good. Personal accounts (such as on blogs) are spookily, and frighteningly, reminiscent of Soviet tukhta, with which every political commentator should be familiar.

As for Ireland: the current settlement has been reached without either govt, or Nationalists as a whole, acknowledging that IRA terrorism was wrong. Without that, there will be no genuine, long term reconciliation. And without it, British society cannot draw the rigorous moral lines that would allow us to effectively campaign against other would-be terrorists and their sympathisers.

Alex Swanson, Milton Keynes, UK

name me any politician that is remembered in history
except for sir Winston Churchill OUR history is full of people
remembered for doing something like Brunell and George
Stevenson and numerous other great men MEN ARE REMEMBERED FOR DOING SOMETHING ,NOT THINKING
ABOUT IT ,ps I forgot Oliver Cromwell.

george william taylor, hull, uk

Why do you Brits allow one big mistake(Iraq) to overshadow all the positive things Mr Blair has done for not only your country but the world?
Blair is the only g8 leader who has consistently and passionately supported make poverty history and efforts to help African aid and debt.
If Blair is a US poodle how was he able to get US support for the intervention in Kosovo? He also successfully intervened in Sierra Leone.
Your economy has consistently grown under Blair, more disposable income.
Then there is his greatest achievement in the Northern Ireland peace process. He has without a doubt been the most successful British prime minister who has ever dealt with the issue and made UK/Irish relations the best they've been since the foundation of the irish state. As an Irishman for once I agree with our tosspot taoiseach(PM) when he says Blair will have a special place in Irish history and has been a great friend of Ireland.

JC, Dublin, Ireland

David Aaronovitch claims that "In 1997, after nearly two decades of Conservative rule, 43 per cent and 46 per cent of primary schoolchildren failed to achieve the average standards expected in maths and English respectively. Those figures are now 21 per cent and 24 per cent."
If you keep on lowering the standards by making the exams easier, what else would one expect ?

Geoff Riggs, Chepstow, Wales

Rather too predictable from Mr A, himself a spin meister of New Labour ilk. Let's have none of this 'few would dispute' stuff and some hard figures - eg MRSA figures, school leavers who are unemployable figures, social trends figures about a fragmented society etc. As to the vague phrase 'lifting children out of poverty' what does that mean, and it is meaningless as long as inner city schooling is in so ghastly a state as Liam Byrne pointed out. As to pensions, come Mr A, the real story there is the destruction of the private pensions industry. Selectivity selectivity selectivity, journalistic shuffling of the pack - just like New Labour. In fact there we have it: the connection between New Labour = Journalism = spin. No one believes politicians any more at all, just as journalists, and now of course even our 'satire industry' is deeply rooted into this soil.

Ib, Hackney, UK

"Tony Blair has been Britain's best Prime Minister in decades."

Yes, clearly you liked it so much that you fled to the other side of the world.

If you don't live here, how the hell do you know what it's like under Blair? And if you did, and left, then it can't have been all that good after all, can it?

Martin , Hereford, England

What a juvenile level of debate!
Anyone who has ever been in office of any sort knows what it is to become the villified hate object regardless of acheivements or high ideals.
Mr. Blair made Labour electable and if he had been supported by his own back-benchers and quite a number of his Ministers he might have acheived more.
In over sixty years I have never voted Labour, and probably never will, but surely have found Mr. Blair more tolerable than say Harold Wilson, James Callaghan, Michael Foot and a whole raft of red flag wavers such as Wedgewood Benn and Ken Livingstone.
Could we have a somewhat more dignified assessment and discussion please or has The Times "dumbed down" like the BBC.

David, Cheltenham, England

D. Twist should know that the figures showing massive decreases in crime over the last 10 years are assembled painstakingly by the statisticians who supervise the British Crime Survey. The BCS has been in existence since the 1980s. Interviews are conducted with large, representative samples of the British public using the most reliable research methods. The police are not involved. Via the BCS, the British public tell us their own direct experience of crime. The results prove conclusively that fewer and fewer of us experience crime. Or are the British people Bliars?

P Flatters, London,

Thank You Mathew, and thank you David too, for a nice fisticuff of words and comments, charges and counter charges veiled under the pretext of a satire cum buffonery. A very entertaining write up, it perks up the spirit of journalistic writing. But frankly, I am still puzzled, which barmy army was supporing Blair, and which branded him as Bliar. His ten years of tenure at 10 Downing street ,proves one thing that he was a master spin caster , who could bowl out any one with his camouflaged googly and "doosras"...the wrong ones. He supported the US and took Britain to war in Iraq, for WMD...whudunit , where were those weapons of mass destructions. Call him a political trickster , for he make-believe the commoners in Britain that the war was inevitable. His career as Prime Minister is chequered with a few little nasty bad things, but his naive and sauve demeanor in facing the opposition , while handling issues like London Bombings, NHS, Public security , shows his deft subtle approach.

Sandy, New Delhi, India

I think Tony Blair will always be remembered for the war in Iraq, which no one wanted. And also for letting too many illegal immigrants stay in our country, and be a drain on our economy. I also feel that Gordon Brown should not even stand for the Prime Ministers position, he is a Scotsman and should be in parliament in Scotland not in England, and let Scotland have their independence. It should be an English person that runs our country, which is England by the way not Britain.

Christina Hawkesworth, Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire

Primary school results have improved? Of course they have.
Because of the published league tables, children do little else but rote learn and practise on old test papers in their final primary school year. That's why children appear to regress in their first couple of years in secondary school.
Their grade levels have been artificially inflated.

john, Fleet, England

"I'll give you Ireland"?. A conflict that claimed the lives of 3,000 people on these islands over 40 years and you denigrate it by saying it was Blair's deceitfulness that brought peace to fruition. This is an oh so typical British Conservative attitude. Think back as Blair said in his speech to the 80's in the North and the UK mainland. The Conservative party and vast swathes of British people are ignorant or worse simply do not care for the death and suffering caused by both sides in that conflict. The fact we now have Sinn Fein and the DUP in power together is monumental and unthinkable under a Conservative government. Of course Tony Blair does not deserve all the credit (see Adams, Trimble, Paisley, Hume) but his willingness to engage, along with Bill Clinton brought about a climate where conciliation was made possible.

So please Mr. Parris do not be so blasé about Northern Ireland and what has been achieved.

Jason , Cork,

A resounding victory for Mr Parris. Our economic upswing has had nothing to do wih Mr Blair and everything to do with a steady global economy. All those children lifted out of poverty - this has nothing to do with a caring sharing government and everything to do with easily available and cheap credit.

One thing missing from this exchangeis the degree to which Mr Blair's political approach has had an infantalising effect on political discourse. Politics, under Mr Blair, has been gutted of philosophy, and reduced to the easily-consumed soundbite. There is no thinking required when listening to Mr Blair. All that is required is to open the ears and to allow the meaningless postulations to caress the ears: meaningless, pointless, anaethetising to the point of removing the need for the listener even to think. Not for Blair the poetic visions of "sunlit uplands". For him, the cumbersome "education, education, education" - as if shouting at a child.

"Cheat," is exactly right.

S.P.P., London,

It's clear that mathew is right, all the spinning i n the world can't get away from the wasted opportunity Blair has had. More than his lies, his deceit over tax rises, Iraq, his defence of indefensible actions by cabinet lackeys, his fraudulent peerage actions, his personal involvement in the Kelly affair, his failure to tackle the immigration issue with any sense, his spin, his lacklustre negotiating skills and his fawning with the americans it is something much simpler which markes out his premiership as an abject failure.

He claims his actions as regards health and education mark his greatest success in fact they mark his greatest failure. He claims putting 30% extra funding into the health as a success... even I could have done this. To be a success he would have to have had delivered a 30%+ increase in peformance rather than the 3% reality. he has wasted our money recklessly and yet claims the very spending of it as a success. He is pure spin, with no delivery.

anthony harrisson, london,

l'affair Blair

Tony Blair's tenure at No.10 has been pretty noteworthy – it’s has been an earnest attempt to shape a better world as humanly possible! So, like all human endeavours - it has had successes as well as glaring faults. At 54, he would still have a lot of time to reflect on them and see how he could have done differently. Hopefully, his introspections would guide the future leaders to tread their passions with greater maturity. With his incredible understanding of the world - he would make a great United Nation's Secy. Gen and contribute in making it an affective world body. But before that he deserves a long break from the limelight and recuperate from this decade long l'affair Blair;

with best wishes,

Rajeev Mehta, Auckland, NZ

I agree with Matthew. And I think Blair's biggest failing has been on Iraq where there has been such terrible bloodshed.

Ali, San Francisco, USA

Putting Iraq to one side we can balance achievements against failures and come to own views on the success or otherwise of the Blair premiership. But bring Iraq back into the equation and it lands with such a thump on the negative side that the result is failure of epic proportions.
This government smells like the Tories did in the late 80s; displaying an arrogance of power that comes with longevity. Brown displays this just as much as Blair and is incapable of changing this tone.
Paradoxically Labour in 1997 showed that relatively inexperienced politicians can manage the state in a reasonable fashion. I want a real change of government and I no longer care what flavour it is.

Ged Parker, Washington, Washington, England

Was it a failure to control the borders, or a deliberate ploy to increase the labour pool, to keep down the wages of the low paid.
This has two effects - make more people dependent on state handouts, which means they keep voting labour, and the immigrants themselves will in time also become labour voters.
The other disastrous effects of mass immigration mean nothing to these ploiticians compared to labour staying in power with these dependent voters.

tony, birmingham, uk

You have both missed something about Bliar which sums him up to a tee in my mind.He has just resigned and given us his departure date(not a moment too soon),but it has been missed by all of you that in his last days he will sign the UK up to the latest EU treaty to get us part of a European Constitution.We were supposidly going to have a referendum,but Bliar has gone ahead without that.
Would any CEO of any Company agree to a takeover having resigned.NO,it would not be allowed.
Bliar seems to think he is better than the British Public,that is why so many are glad that he is going,and his last act confirms the man as what he is.

Nigel Wheatcroft, wimbledon, UK

I'm disappointed with your grasp of foreign politics, Mr Aaronovitch. Particularly in the Middle East. Reg was the leader of the People's Front of Judea and most emphatically NOT the Judean People's Front (splitters!)

Kevin Browne, Reading, Berkshire, England

Poor Mr Parris; he's obviously suffering from that deadly late twentieth-century English debilitating malady: a hatred of success. Fortunately only a diminishing number are now afflicted but those that are still too often resort to the tactic of rubbishing greater men's achievements presumably in the forlorn hope that their own shortcomings will somehow thus seem less awful!

Brian Hughes, Cheltenham, UK

Mr. Aaronovitch repeats the myth that new school buildings somehow make a difference to education standards. In 1956 -1958 when I first started school, our class of 45 children was taught in an ex first world war army hut, where the teacher filled the coal stove herself and the lavatories were 150 yards away in the main building. At the age of seven we could all read, write and recite out multiplication tables. Buildings are important but its the teachers who count!!

paul buckland, LONDON,

I spent 42 years working as a Psychiatric Nurse the latter twenty in Community Psychiatry where I would assess what ailed individuals. I have no doubts that Mr Bliar is a creative Psychopath, and Anne Widdicombe is correct "he is vainer than Narcissuss! Have a look in any encyclopedia for the definition of psychopath for a description of Bliar and Bush. Never have two such individuals worked together in such harmony as the murderers of the Clutter family epitomised in Truman Capote,s book "In Cold Blood"

Robert Hunter, Rothwell, Northamptonshire

some people have got short memories. when the tories got in after the last Labour government, they inherited a country on its knees, with three day weeks, power cuts,piles of rubbish in the streets, and rampant strikes. the UK was the laughing stock of the world.
They even gave it a name! the English disease. When Labour came to power after the John Major government, they inherited nothing as totally bad as that which the tories had to deal with, and a strong economy. Dont know where some of the posters here get their information, but many people here want to leave the UK which labour have now created.

peter east, grays, essex

"Blairophobes should not by our abuse build Blair up. Beasts have dignity. Ogres do big things. To convey the unsavoury yet flimsy qualities Mr Blair has brought to his political decade, we need a smaller word, a playground word.

It’s “cheat”. Tony Blair leaves, now, like the Cheshire Cat, fading to only a rictus grin, a mocking laugh and a lingering scent of cat’s pee and cologne"
Absolutely brilliant. Thank you Matthew Parris that`s made my day. No,made my decade.

jerym eedy, caerphilly, U.K.

"in schools, on the streets, in hospitals, in our thinking about the environment, in action over Third World debt and African misery."
If these are the achievements David, the progress has been marginal, the cost monstrous, and the hype sickening.
Blair will be remembered by most for "education,education,education", "24 hours to save the NHS" and "whiter than white".

Richard, London,

It is amazing that so much comment in the media has accepted without question Blair’s claim to have been successful in the war on crime and to have made our streets safer.

The statistics on which these claims are made have been cooked up by thousands of police officers diverted from their real duties to convert mountains of paperwork into supposedly achieved targets. They are yet another monument to Blairite spin and deception.

The real experience of the British people of security on their streets and in their homes forms a bitter contrast. No wonder that a third of us want to get away.

D. Twist, Warrington, U.K.

Basically Mr Aaronovich you are defendiing whar Anatoly Kaletsky called a year or so ago a fraudulent politcal trickster. Whilst Mr Parris you are basically correct you have forgotten to mention that Brown`s destiny, if he becomes P.M. , is to become the second Jamea Callaghan or possibly Sir Alec Douglas -Home a la June 64 by hanging on to 2010.
Regards,

Denver Watt, Osakaj, Japan

Matthew,

I've just been reading your exchange with the odious Aaronovich, and I'm reeling with excitement. I have disliked Blair for so long... You've always captured my thoughts exactly. The man is too sneaky for lofty discussions.

Hopefully the Aaronovichs and Mary Ann Siegaths (whatever) will now go into their wilderness. How such fine brains could be easily hookwinked by this trickster, I'll never know.

Thank you, Matthew Parris.

hometruth, San Diego, California, USA

Blair sent his children miles away to a selective school while a school was sitting next door to him in Islington availing Thatcher's concept of choice., while muttering 'education, education and education' mantra. His cabinet members did one better by sending their children to fee-paying private schools. These choices were not available to working class people whose had to send their children to local comprehensive 'sink' schools. His education minister Blunket then was preaching' watch my links, there will be no selection'!

Tony and his guys took selfishness to dizzy heights. They said 'don't ask us to practice waht we preach'. It is a 10 year disaster.
He greatest achievement? he made people cynics when it comes to politics and politicians.

Gary Reid, LONDON, UK

I am beginning to doubt my memory. It started slowly on Tuesday and accelerated yesterday. Press persons keep writing that we were living in Bleak House before May 1997 and broadcasters keep saying it. That's not how I remember it.

One thing I do remember is John Major's not inconsiderable efforts to bring peace to Northern Ireland. And, come to think of it, Margaret Thatcher's, too. A nicer PM than Mr Blair would have taken them with to Stormont the other day.

David Moss, London, UK

David, I would take you up on the following: "43 per cent and 46 per cent of primary schoolchildren failed to achieve the average standards expected in maths and English respectively. Those figures are now 21 per cent and 24 per cent" - this is pure Blairism - cite dodgy statistics in support of a sophist argument. Education under Labour has not been about reform, but it has been about grade inflation and lowering of standards. Is the average you quote now at the same standard of the average of 10 years ago? The only solution for education is to throw out all the progressive twallop which has been ruining it since the 1960s. Try putting an 11-plus exam from 40 years ago in front of the "average" 11 year old of today and you will see what I mean.

Richard Marriott, Kidderminster, England

Mr Blair is to blame for Iraqis no longer being fed thru shredders - now they are blown up by Al Qaeda/Iran (Mathew appears not see the connections, David probably does).

Success, or failure - time will tell.

David Williamson, Tucson, Arizona

Good try Mr Aaronovich but basically Mr Parris has got it right however he has fogotten to mention that Brown`s destiny is to become a second James Callaghan or possibly Sir Alec Douglas Home ,a la June 64 if he hangs on to 2011.
Regards,

Denver Watt, Osakaj, Japan

A booming economy, improved education standards, improvements in health, peace in Northern Ireland. That in recent years, for the first time since 1788, more people emigrate from Australia to England than the other way around ,ought to tell you something has been going right in Britain. Because they haven't moved for the weather. Before he became Prime Minister, Britain was going, and was seen to be going, backwards. Now it's the other way. Tony Blair has been Britain's best Prime Minister in decades.

Stephen, Canberra, Australia

A higher percentage of children passing maths and English tests, Mr A? Only because standards have been lowered in education - as, under Blair, they have been lowered in every other department of public life.

John Vincent, Christchurch, New Zealand

Mr Paris, you are a STAR :-).

Dave Bartlett, Kingsclere, Britain.

You do well Matthew, but he's been worse than that. Thinking specifically about his relentless efforts to bring about a British police state.

A. H., Glasgow,

What about immigrantion and the failure to control the borders?

Mike, Sydney, Australia