David , Wolverhampton: "How many people have read Dawkins' book from cover to cover and been persuaded of its 'truth'?"

For starters, go to RichardDawkins.net, look for link at foot of page - 'Convert's Corner' - and start reading.

James, Cambridge: "From a scientific point of view it could be argued that the correct position must be agnostic. Those who are Christian, like me, or atheist, like some of my friends, must take a step of faith."

Which field of science studies personal belief? Or did you just throw in 'scientific' in the hope your argument would hold water? It doesn't. An atheist - someone who holds no belief in gods. It takes no leap of faith, it's the default position.

It's one of the great religious fallacies that atheism is a competing belief system - it's not, it's complete lack of belief due to complete lack of evidence. It's the rational position, which is evident when viewing the quality of competing arguments on forums, such as this.

Molcom Ansell, London,

"Oh how secularists/athiests make me laugh. There is no God, no, there cant be a God is their cry (and their belief in their faith system), Science proves it, there is no such thing as the Creator/God ... Interesting how most atheists believe in the big bang, in its self a creationist activity not evolutionary one just a though, a little thought."

Firstly, one can believe in a god and in secularism at the same time. Secondly, belief in a theory is not the same sort of belief as a belief in a god. Thirdly, there are mathematical reasons for accepting the big bang theory as the best current explanation for what happened just after time=0.

David Jones, Loughborough, UK

Here is a way of looking at it: If there's no way to disprove that God exists, no conceivable experiment that would disprove his existence, what does it mean to say that God exists? Inability to invalidate the hypothesis does not mean it is true. What is the difference between an invisible, inperceptible, ineffective God and no God at all?

Tony, London, UK

Let them believe there is God, if you dont good for you. Let me BELIEVE what I want to believe. Not believing in God does not make me better off in any way. Untill it does please keep your hate arguments to yourselves.

Muhammad, Cambridge,

Ken, you really ought to withold your belief in dark matter if evidence doesn't justify it.

Kirsty, Reality based Community, Texas

Oh how secularists/athiests make me laugh. There is no God, no, there cant be a God is their cry (and their belief in their faith system), Science proves it, there is no such thing as the Creator/God…... Interesting how most atheists believe in the big bang, in its self a creationist activity not evolutionary one …just a though, a little thought.

HC, Perth, UK

Phill the Wirral, I'm assuming you are a christian of some kind, as such, you should be aware that your faith considers it a sin to lie. I just consider it a silly and unnecessary thing to do, and one which shows a lack of respect for those around you.

Kidd Garrett, Bristol, UK

I believe that the word the Rev was looking for is "anti-theist"- an atheist who not only disbelieves in the existence of 'God' but also believes that organized religion does more harm than good in our society.

2,000 years ago a majority of Romans believed that the sun is pulled across the sky by Apollo in his chariot; this nonsense has since been replaced by other equally ludicrous fairy stories.

Isn't it time that common sense finally prevail? As an anti-theist, I am dedicated to bringing that day forward!

ForestersRus, Forest of Dean, Glos.

Excellent article by Mr. Baker, as usual. The Anglican Church is contributing to its own demise by split the middle compromise and by the pronouncements of the Archbishop regarding the nativity. Europe's churches are empty tombs, Christianity is dead there. Smile your smug, self-satisfied grins at having chased the superstition of God away, but not so fast... God is coming back, as Islam sweeps over your spiritually hollow continent. Cheers!

foutsc, Colorado, USA

It's a very well written piece, very interesting. Thank you.

I would say that as Chrisians we shouldn't be so concerned with trying to point out all the darkness in the world, that is evident in itself, and instead we should try to be the light-bearers we were born again to be. (Matthew 5 v14-16)

Becca, Midlands,

Hang on Rev, How can one be a 'fanatical athiest'? A 'fanatical christian/muslim/jew' believes the totality of their holy book, and a moderate only those cherry picked, still relevant bits. So a fanatical atheist surely believes that there is no God, (as this is the only thing that atheism means). Does then a moderate atheist believe tht a part of God doesn't exist? His legs perhaps? Maybe a holy Toe? This absurdity should show that one cannot be a 'fanatical atheist' only an atheist.

However, I think you mean to pick fights with those who would like to see more of a divorce between church and state. These are secularists, and they exist among the believing community also.

Perhaps a cleaning up of terminology would help clear the muddy water on where the arguments lie, and lead to constructive discussion rather than just slander.

Edward Hazzan, Leamington Spa, England

Hang on, guys! some of you don't seem to have read Gerard Baker's article to the end. I think it's a well-written and thought-provoking article. He has a go at the fanatical atheists as much as the fundamentalists from different religions.

But surely his main point is that Christians who believe the Christmas story is true and relevant are being so half-hearted about fighting our corner. Thanks for the challenge, Mr Baker!

Rev John Castle, Sandhurst, Berkshire

Believing a higher force created the universe is the easy answer. It takes brains and a bit of study to understand that there is no need for a god.

Ian P, Benfleet, UK

So the more unbelievable and inexplicable the story of Christ's birth and presumably the Bible more generally the more likely are they to turn out to be still true two thousand years or so after they were allegedly recorded.Once again after reminding us of the complexity of the history and near impossibility of the science surrounding the coming of the Son of God we are still meant to believe that the multi-faceted Christian God is the one to follow.

Man remains so insecure and consequently in need of a hidden deity to seek out and adopt as his guiding mentor through the travails of his short existence on earth that no amount of logic or historical research will deflect him from looking to the supernatural to try and conquer the finiteness of everything around him including his very self.

Tragically the way that the Christian message has been passed down through the centuries has ensured that no one can be certain that there is a higher Being yet many still refuse to let go.

BILL JACKSON, NOTTINGHAM, UK

"But He chose instead to come in a way that ensured just about the maximum room for doubt". This is, of course, the central premise of intelligent design: God as a divine trickster, set on testing faith by concealing historical fact. You can chuckle along as the our Lord seeds the planet with misleading artefacts, chooses to manifest (like those pranksters aliens) to only the strangest and wierdest people, and generally conceals the truth while leaving little clues for His initiates. The great punch line, of course, is that this loving deity (and occasional mass murder) blesses believers but sentences anybody who is taken in by his deliberate and cunning ruse by sentencing them to an eternity of agony and suffering. It's wit like that that made the inquisition so fun.

Eric Norton, London,

It was a bad year for believers? How? Typical of a secular world wrapped up in willful ignorance to not notice how the Christian faith saves millions of people every year, and not just their eternal salvation, but to recover the joy of their present circumstances. You missed the War on Christmas - it's not using Christmas for other purposes that's the war on Christmas - even christians do that. It's the attempt on doing AWAY with Christmas, or any portrayal of it , as offensive to others (as if so much of the modern world isn't). Christmas isn't offensive to anyone, unless you seek to actually attack christians. As for atheist intellectuals - hmm, Richard Dawkins wouldn't last 3 minutes in debate with a legitimate christian intellectual - not that the modern media would ever set that up - instead he engages believers but intellectual lightweights. Typical. If you didn't notice, christianity is flourishing in the one western country that continues to succeed - the United States.

Daniel Canales, Point Pleasant, USA / NJ

First of all, atheists who lump all "organized religions" and belief in God together, show their ignorance and lack of learning. Biblical Christianity (as opposed to what most established institutions masquerading as churchs in the West practice today) has as much similarity to Islam or Hinduism as your beloved mother does to a storefront mannequin; they may have a passing resemblance, but only to a man on a galloping horse.

Secondly, yes Christians must rely on faith since the existence of God cannot be empirically proven, and are ridiculed as ignorant, weak or foolish by "enlightened" atheists. But statistically, there is a higher chance of an explosion in a print shop spontaneously forming a perfect copy of James Joyce's Ulysses, than Mr. Atheist, through millions of perfectly sequenced accidents, spanning billions of years, being decended from a blotch of organic matter (study for yourself). I ask, who is going on faith? And given the consequences of being wrong, who is a fool?

Dave, New York, USA

Are we really still having this debate? The true frauds and hypocrites are not the likes of Mother Teresa -who did her best poor love,but the founding fathers of tthe Christian church 2000 years ago who cooked up the most incredible hotch potch of jewish folk legend ,pagan tradition and assorted ritual flim flam to produce the most unbelievable reigious faith ever invented by man. What is always amazing is that they then persuaded not only tilliterate plebs but ultimately the educated patrichians of the Roman Empire to believe it all, using fanatical and murderous monks to drive the point home as in the tragic case of poor, beautiful,Greek female Mathematician Hypatia, scraped to death ,chopped up and thrown on the fire as a demon by the Christian Taliban! But given the current march of Islam across the rational world it looks like there is no hope of ever achieving an Age of Reason.As for Christmas cards , mince pies and a pagan Festival of the MidwInter Solstice -yes please!

David, Uzes, France

RICHARD DAWKINS is quite a surprising man. As a scientist he really does seem to have already made up his mind and set about fitting a theory around it. Maybe he's right; maybe he's wrong.

The Toaists observed nature and the world around them and sought revelations through this. That there was a 'way', or path, seemed to be evident to them. They thought it was 'indestinct' but somehow you knew when you where on it...or as they would say, conforming to the Tao (way).

Many centruries later, Jesus told us that he was 'The Way'. Interesting.

As Gerard rightly points out, many 'religious' people have shamed themselves. But is it God who is at fault, or is it the way that they have chosen? The Doaists had a surprisingly modern, almost scientific mindset; they tested their beliefs about 'the way' against what they saw as revealed truth: the natural world.

Richard Dawkins seems to be looking for proof of something that is staring him in the face: creation, the work of a creator.

Joe, Berwickshire, Scotland

Interesting article. It is always good to have a perspective from another country.

Be advised though that the "squadders" are going strong here in the US though. In spite of the revealed hypocrites, Rev. Haggard, Senators Craig & Vitter and etc. Being a 58 year old agnostic in the middle of it, my observation is that my fellow "boomers" are feeling their mortality and fleeing to faith in droves.

...newly impassioned by the "chill of the coming night".

Bill Perney, Kansas City, Missouri, USA

David, Wolverhampton - I agree as well. Anyone else?

anna , Kendal, UK

It never ceases to amaze me how misplaced dogma and stubborness, coupled with brazen opportunism, can compel one to pen an article that so shamelessly takes out of context its main points so as to challenge its credulity and integrity. In fact, the belief in God in those who profess to have such beliefs is considerably strengthened, not weakened, by the somewhat ghastly events of this year.

I have a question. Can someone please give me an example whereby there is a clear increase in the genome of an organism that confers an advantage to the species in question. What is happening in Hiroshima and Nagasaki as a result of gross genetic mutations?

I do accept that the belief in God can cause discord. What about social Darwinism used be tyrants such as Hitler and Trotcky to further their agendas?

S Ali, London,

Faith can be a beatiful thing, a light to guide our short path through a cold world. Why are so many who have lost their faith so angered by those who have kept it? Why are they so determined to stamp out a benign, positive religion? Let people find comfort where they may.

B. Brisket, St. Louis, USA

Andrew, from NSW: religious and magical systems are a form of basic (and presumably evolutionary) social policing and thus are universal and transhistorical. Most societies have them, and magical systems are if anything, tougher than religious systems. Try being a Zuni , sometime!

Dectora, London, UK

I agree with your point that faith itself entails doubt, but it is through that faith that we conquer our doubts and emerge stronger in our belief. It does not help that the Christian teachings are watered so much in an attempt to attract the non believers.

Genta Mali, London,,

It's a belief. It's a waste of time to impose your beliefs on others. You either believe in God or you don't. One day, the human race will kill itself. The earth will either freeze or heat up to the point where life is no longer able to flourish. All of our holy books and shrines will be destroyed, and all of this bickering will finally be put to rest.

Jeff, Sacramento / CA, USA

When Europeans really believed in God, they were strong, feared, respected around the world. Everyone imitated Europe. But Europeans reject God and now believe in nothing except themselves and is now foolish and weak. They have no backbone. The world is fast becoming richer and more powerful than Europe because its now morally weak. Your own bible says this will happen. Like your ancient Rome: watching your games, drinking wine, having sex with boys while younger, stronger men take your treasures and women. Now much the world laughs at you: Poor, lazy, fat old, drunk football maniacs who still think theyre special. Like the crazy old woman living in a big broken house down the road walking around in a old bathrobe mumbling how beautiful she was and lecturing others. Europe is poor, weak and old. And because you cant even sustain your populations, your culture will disappear soon or become an Arab colony first. Sorry

Ming Der , Shanghai, China

If you think that the implausibility of "the manger, the stable, the ox and the ass" is actually evidence that Mary gave birth to a demigod, you might want to reconsider the strength of that evidence. Neither of the two radically different nativity stories in Matthew and Luke mention a stable, an ox, or an ass.

Before you offer commentary on Biblical stories, you should probably spend some time actually studying your Bible. Of course that can be dangerous to your Christian faith. Reading the Bible has probably produced more atheists than any other activity.

Patrick Quigley, Irvine, USA/CA

Everyone should be entitled to their faith, privately practiced and personally. But they should also expect to be regarded as lacking a certain something; information about the history of religions, of nations, and of the dangers of conformist thinking to all societies. It really is ridiculous, knowing what we know about the hierarchical political nature of religion, that so many continue to believe in these medieval male-centered clubs. My favorite quote, from Newsweek: "What kind of religion worries about whether children should pray in school instead of whether they've eaten before getting there, obsesses about the beginning of life instead of the end of poverty, and concerns itself with private behavior instead of public generosity?"
A person.

JOHN CORBALLY, ALAMEDA, CA

Islamic extremism is only representative of Islam -it has nothing to do with any other religions. It's typical of the Times and the spurious relativism that most of its journalists engage in to attempt to equate backward and primitive Islam with other religions. As usual we have a defense of the indefensible because the people involved are too cowardly and scared to say what they undoubtedly think -unless that is the whole government, the BBC, all lawyers, all so-called human rights activists (aka neo-stalinists) all judges, the list goes on - all firmly believe in a literal interpretation of the Koran. What can you say about a man like Pullman? Despicable, self-serving and money grabbing will do to start with. Dawkins is a crackpot and unfortunately cannot write at all. Boring as an epithet will do for him.

E. Purgold, Cambs, UK

The irony of it—some believers acting in ways that profane the faith they say proclaim. Anathema, for they deserve it. However, for all the evil some do in the name of Allah, or Jesus Christ, far more millions of Muslims and Christians and Jews contribute to the material, intellectual, and spiritual welfare of the world in the name of God. If the Dawkins, et al. knew more about the contemporary world and about history, they would see Islamic terrorism and the occasional deluded “Christian” or “Jew” as the aberrations that they are.

As those books by Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens—whose works are admirable when they write about something they know about—alas, Dawkins’ God Delusion and Hitchens’ god is not Great …ARE... NOT GREAT. The best one can say about Dawkins—and for that matter, the pathetic Archbishop (who often appear to be afflicted with a disease—“Anglical Archbishop-ness” perhaps)--has a juvenial understanding of Christian theology, biblical scholarship, and history, and this being gracious.

As for Hitchens, factual errors abound. For example, in his treatment of the New Testament there are at least thirty scholarly errors or misunderstandings or distortions. Hitchens does this throughout his book--not just thirty errors, but hundreds. As one who has graded thousands of undergraduate and graduate school papers, and written professional reviews of books by scholars you can almost always see the quality of a writer’s thinking in how he or she deals with factual details. ‘A’ papers generally get the dates and names right in addition to the persuasiveness of the main arguments and logic. In god is not Great the main arguments are long tirade of non sequiturs and special pleading.
Hitchens may be right—God does not exist—but his book falls far short of making the case and is in truth an embarrassment. Fortunately for him, he is preaching to an atheistic choir, which accounts for best seller status. In the 300 million population USA there may be upwards of ten million theoretical atheists as opposed to those who are believers of some strip so you can write almost any atheistic-themed book of whatever quality and you are bound attract enough gullible people revel in it because they don’t know any better. If this is best that the atheists can do—and apparently it is—Christians, Jews, and Muslims have nothing to fear from them. Believers have more to fear from themselves when they exhibit “Anglican Archbishop-ness” and when they do things their founders never taught and would condemn.

Gene R. Marlatt, Denver, Colorado, United States of America

Gene R. Marlatt, Denver, Colorado, United States of America

Just remember, atheism is a belief also.

Michael Gray, Pontotoc, Mississippi/USA

Agnosticism is a cop-out for intellectual and moral fence-sitters. You either believe in God and act accordingly, or you don't; there's no real middle ground. Moreover, most atheists are also intellectual and moral cowards, loath to follow their assumptions to their logical conclusions, which are that life is without meaning and purpose, and that any and all morality is illusory. As Dostoevsky observed, if God doesn't exist, everything is permitted.

David Adrian, Pontiac, Michigan, USA,

Good stuff! The sooner we dispose of all the stupidity of Christianity and Islam the sooner we can get on with our lives and recover from the thousands of years we've been crippled by fairy tales.

Mike, Runcorn, United Kingdom

As an agnostic, dyslexic insomniac I lie awake night after night wondering if there is a Dog.
If the 10 Commandments are a guide then I hope there is and they are probably the reason why most contributors hope there isn't.

Terry, Radstock, England

Fred Pearce, get off your religious high-horse!

Its people like you that are described in the article as "no match for the behaviour of believers themselves." Your type of belief discourages others from wanting to be part of established major faiths, sounds very similar to the tone used by religious extremists and puts me off knowing I'm associated with you by being part of the same religion.

With your comment "'Then sudden destruction shall come upon them.' Believe it or not, it's coming", some may argue that it is your country trying to lead us there!

Nick, Stevenage, U.K.

Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, Idi Amin. What else besides the fact that they were/ are psychotic, mass murderers, do these men have in common? They were all atheists. Just pointing this out because I'm constantly hearing from people like this author that "more people have died because of religion than anything else, blah, blah, blah" Thank GOD, I live in America. We are a God fearing and God loving people. That is why God has blessed us so greatly.
I'm proud to live in the greatest country in the history of the world!! If you don't like that, too bad. There's no doubt that it's true. Our churches, temples, mosques are packed every week. Every single child, every single day, pledges allegience to their flag, and "one nation under God" in school. Someone once said that without God everything is permissable.
I feel sorry for England and for all of Europe. God Help you.

Donna, Pearl River, NY, USA

To Fred Pearce, Cairo, GA, USA

you say "Thanks for reminding us Americans why Europe is indeed the real dark continent.Unbelief,idol-worshipping"

Can you tell me of a country that

-worships money more than the USA ?

-is involved in (starts !) more wars than the USA ?

-is doing more damage to the environment than the USA ?

clive, Epsom, England

I can picture the scene; The world's press in a manic feeding frenzy as the "Son of God" arrives in Washington/London/any capital to a tumultuous welcome of brass bands, red carpets and suitably sartorial leaders.
The headlines would be "Son of God comes to save the world". This euphoreia would be short lived as his message fell on the deaf ears a world bent on consumerism, political and religious control and self seeking. What has loving your enemies and a moral lifestyle got to do with economic growth forecasts and a decisive military response?
After all, we should be free to serve the gods of money and pleasure shouldn't we?
Perhaps the real message of Jesus Christ was best delivered as the son of a carpenter in a political backwater of the Roman Empire. Born into obscurity , his true nature only revealed to the poor and needy through his moral teachings and miracles. Only the Son of God could promise eternal life and rise from the dead, but then, who really wants eternal life?

David, Bournemouth, UK

Wow. No wonder Old Europe finds itself in a moral crisis where you are being over-run by the poor and with 1% economy growth. Moral relevancy makes you believe that turning off your lights makes you a good person. Sorry, giving your money or food to the local homeless shelter still does that.

What is more likely? That we are the result of random chemistry and molecules or that the miracle of the human mind, body, and soul was created by a God who loves us? If you found a car in the middle of the woods, would you think someone put it there or that some big bang created it?

I am proud to believe in the one true God and know him in my heart. It was just 8 years ago where I did not know Jesus Christ and believed that religion was for the weak. I have pity on those who believe this junk above that we are not special in any way. My hope that they seek out the true meaning of life. Because I believe that if you truly seek, surely you will find.

Merry Christmas and God Bless!

Jeff Schroeffel, Pittsburgh, USA / Pennsylvania

Matt, you'll find the aswer in around 70% of our population. Would you say that they are all stupid?

Merry Christmas to you too.

Chris, Epsom,

So, Gerard, you think this guy Mohammed or Allah is a load of old codswallop. Wonder why so many people got upset over a couple of cartoons satirising him? However, if I were you I would take Saudi Arabia off your holiday list for a while.

John Bell, Nottingham,

Don't worry. President Huck will prove you wrong. Again.

Jim, San Jose, CA, USA

One hit, let's say about 1,000 micrograms, of LSD and all you atheists' faith in nothing would be shredded, in total tatters. All your science would be blown away. We all know so much less than we think we do. But, while you enjoy your atheism, don't forget to feed the poor and care for the father less and widows.

Mark Holmes, Mill Creek, USA/WA

The tone of this article is that religion and theism is in decline. I dont see that myself, I sense fundamentalist religion is in its ascendancy, including Muslim and Christian flavours.

What scares me is that people who believe in an afterlife, (and even worse, believe that God has designated them as somehow special) should have access to nuclear weapons. I am currently more worried about American Evangelical Christians than I am about Islamic Fundamentalists, but only because the Christians already have access to the US military nuclear arsenal.

Life on this planet has never before faced an emergency as grave as the current paradox that science has let us unleash nuclear power which is unimaginable, and yet, anti-science like religion still renders us incapable of understanding each other or finding a rational basis to resolve disputes. If we cannot bring ourselves to drop our attachment to religion, it will be the end of us all.

Pity.

Eric Dormer, Ottawa, Canada

The belief in God by Americans is why the US has been blessed by God. We are the greatest nation in the world, and Europe is a continent of past greatness. Amazing that the decline in European power and prestige coinsides exactly with the decline of their religious beliefs.

VG Grantham, Charlotte, NC USA

"That God would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe."

If its inconceivability compels us to believe, what about the Greek myths, where each god and goddess had their own miraculous birth, in some instances to virgins, or, like Pallas Athena, from the head of her father? Given all the beliefs about life, the universe and everything that have been around since the dawn of man, every religion and mythology, one needs a rational basis to choose one from another, and starting with this rational basis, the same rational basis we use in our everyday lives, it's no great step to dismiss all such gods.

William Quill, Trinity College, Dublin,

why this caustic attack on christianity? Is there an ulterior motive here?I thought a free press in a free society should champion and respect the rights of other people to choose.

I choose to believe and serve christ Mr Baker,why do you have a problem with that? You have exercised your God given power of choice to become an atheist why not respect the choice of Christians?

Over almost 2 millenia,Christianity has outlived the so called civilisations that have tried to destroy it,the one you are championing will be no different.I hate to see who will have the last laugh.

Dr Seun Akande, Guildford,Surrey, United Kingdom

"Thanks for reminding us Americans why Europe is indeed the real dark continent."
Yeah Fred - thats why most of the EU countries jumped on the chance to invade iraq with us...Because THEY are the ones who are reconstructing the roman empire, because THEY are the ones with no moral compass. that is why they strive to improve the quality of life of each individual in areas like education, health care,etc.. Here we are so much better than that ! We elect our politicians based on thier faith, not in the ability to actually care about our people. our wise leaders can kill hundreds of thousands of people including alot of our own without thinking twice, but You must be anti-abortion! we must love our neighbor unless they are gay,or foreign, or believe in another version of God
There was a time when christianity did rule in Europe, they refer to it as "the dark ages"
BTW- I wonder how bad it needs to get for Jesus to return- crusades? inquisition? holocaust? world war?

Troy, Omaha, Neb. USA

As I understand it....

We are all agnostics. In the sense that none of us can truly 'know' of God's existence. Christianity explicitly asks us to take that leap of faith, and sceptics will never gain the 'evidence' they demand.

So, the key question is whether you believe or do not believe in God.

But then.... what is God??
Perhaps.... "The feeling of being so overwhelmed by awe at the beauty and wonder of the world and beyond... making one feel small and humble...."
Is there anybody out there that hasn't had that feeling in their life??

I know I have. So, which church should I choose? Ahhh... now the problems start! Perhaps I should just be content with 'awe at unknowable wonder'. And shy away from those arrogant enough to presume to 'know'! But I will keep an open mind, keep considering and keep humbly asking rational questions.

And, until God is 'revealed' to me. I'm happy enough to be an 'atheist'. By default. Does that make me a bad person?

David Speed, Bedford,

You mock people who call themselves Christians for believing in a Savior born to deliver mankind from a despotic nature of corruption. You fail to see this because in your infinite wisdom you embrace corrupt behavior as though its a noble and honorable thing.

You'll have to forvgive us dumb Christians, Gerard. We so stupid that we haven't learned how wise it is to honor God through Jesus Christ who gave Himself as a sacrifice for our eternal salvation. This is because you don't believe in the ressurection or the day of judgement.

Mock Christians all you want, but it comes down to this simple things. We believe sin is real and worthy of eternal punishment by a Holy and Righteous God. We believe Jesus Christ is the only pure sacrifice for our sin and is the savior of all who call on Him. We believe in the coming judgement and the ressurections.

You keep worshipping the gods of your belly and wallet. And in the judgement, then repeat these words with the arrogance you use now.

James, Chicago, IL

To Phill, The Wirral: if the vast majority of people believe in God that doesn't prove God exists; truth and belief are different things.

John Flanagan, Singapore,

While it ofttimes makes for interesting--if, unfortunately sometimes, heated discussions, I was brought up to believe that religion was something between you and God.

Personally speaking, I enjoy a serious religious discussion--if it's done calmly and intelligently. But, that's the problem these days: too often, instead, it's forced down your throat or gets violent or bigoted, or the writer/speaker is just trying to be radical for no apparent reason other than selling his/her book/programme, and I find that sort of thing rather ugly.

On a side note, Christ has his extremists as well as Mohamed: recently, a woman told a friend that God gave her husband cancer because he refused to be "saved," and that she was "glad" God was "punishing him". Oh yeah, that's a religious view to be proud of (not).

Nancy, NY state, USA

"That faith, by its very nature, entails doubt. If we could be really, truly certain, about the existence of God, what, really, would be the point of it all? "

Hang on a minute. So are you saying it's true, or it's not true? It sounds like you're just glorifying wilful self-delusion in the face of contrary evidence as somehow virtuous. What is its virtue, exactly? Are you saying it's just more fun to make stuff up than find out the truth? Because it's isn't all that difficult to find out the truth on this subject.

This is even wierder: "That God would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe. " In what way, exactly? That's so silly it's not even poetry.

Eleanor, London,

Charles Darwin, Albert Einstein, Galileo Galilei, Johannes Kepler, Erwin Schrodinger, Neils Bohr...are just a few 'rational' men who believed in God.
The 2001 census showed that 76% of Britons believed in God
The vast majority of the human race believe in God.

Phill , The Wirral, England

It wasn't exactly a good year for the god-less squadders. It's never wise to judge ideas by those who profess to follow them. Nor is all the talk of atheists about being rational to be taken seriously. No ideology is capable of rational proof. And given that we all have some ideology, however imperfectly formed in our minds, we're all religious - whether we believe in god or not.

Bruce, Birmingham, UK

Simon, London- I almost split my sides. Spot on.

Will Slack, AMERICA, AMERICA, GOD SHED HIS GRACE ON THEEE!

Drawing ones morality from a mythical higher power or writings 1000's of years old is the cause of much of the worlds problems nowadays. I am an atheist and still manage to live by a moral code that enables me to get along with others. I don't need to be told what is right or wrong by a holy book. I can see for myself.

Mike Farren, Manchester, England

Strange isn't it? Christians the world over will debate and wonder about the simple and poor manner Jesus Christ was born while celebrating it in the most expensive way possible. Heard the wish "MERRY" Christmas!

Benjamiin Alvares, Mumbai, India

I sat in Fat Daddy's - a burger bar in Raleigh, North Carolina this week. A family was saying a prayer before munching. My mate said "Get them while they are young you see" as the kids followed their parents' lead. Surely this is some form of child abuse?

crofty, greensboro, north Carolina, USA

I submit that one's opinion on religion, and specifically towards Jesus, will be somewhat determined by the vision that one has for society and of one's own place in it.

Simplistically: either wanting a contentious world restriced to the visiccitudes of human reason, where one lives in the polytheistic morass of self-worship in which every man seeks to be his own god; or a world that through our faith, with ourselves as channels, is open to the interventions into our society, of the one God's unique mercy, forgiveness, morality, wisdom and authority.

When God appeared in human form, he did not reject reason, but did not appeal to it as a means of encountering him. However, he did declare unequivocally his love and merciful intent towards mankind, and that he has irrevocably identified with us.

It is undoubtedly a personal resolve. However, we bear the consequnces of our elected paths, and like it or not, our choices impact, for good or bad, our fellow members of society

Keith Cantrell, Johannesburg, South Africa

It was a bad year for hack reporting about the war on X-mas.

Fred Johnson, Jerico, USA/Kansas

Amusing to see quite a few egoic entities puffed up with self-importance denying the existence of a force that meant there was something as opposed to nothing at all.

Remember that each person reading this is essentially a psychological construct. Do YOU really exist either ?!

Merry Christmas

Luis, London,

>Any Europeans know of anyone intelligent and well educated that "believes"? <

Since you asked, Matt... My church has a the highest concentration of intelligent/well educated people that I've ever seen. We've got lawyers, doctors, researchers, lecturers, teachers, politicians, professional sportsmen and many more.

I personally hold a PhD, and my wife has a postgraduate medical degree. We're off to dinner tonight with a guy who is researcher/lecturer at one of the world's foremost institutions. He's an evolutionary microbiologist... He works out his faith and work quite happily. So, you see, these things do happen :)

Interestingly, most of the new Christians that I'm meeting these days, are students, particularly postgraduate students. God is visibly working in that section of society. It's good to see!

Merry Christmas to you too!

Luke, Cardiff, UK

Tolstoy nailed in the last chapter of Anna Karenina. Comfort and luxury enable atheism. As soon as comfort and luxury are stripped away the most confident atheists hit their knees. Christianity spreads like wildfire in Russia and China while "advanced civilizations" talked confidently about God's death. Europe is a crashed socialist state away from the next great awakening.

Adam , Dogpatch, South Carolina

Why does Gerard Baker say that the Archbishop of Canterbury said, "that we were obliged to treat the Christmas Story really as just a legend." ?
This is not true. He distinguished between what is in the Bible and what was added to the story later. Whatever your view of the truth of the Bible, why not tell the truth about what Rowan Williams said?

John Bennett, Sprowston, Norfolk

One thing about it. No one requires belief. It's just that in my 60 years on this insignificant bit of astronomical dust I've found as many or more situations in which it was difficult not to believe as to believe. I really don't understand how the concept of arriving here by accident is any more plausible than the notion that we arrived here by design.

Jim Walton, Washington DC,

Garry, I rejoice that I can spell . . . but seriously, can't we recognise that not everyone who has a faith behaves in ways that the general public find offensive? Most people live lives that are generally commendable to people of any or no religion. Those of us who focus on living lives of service to others and loving our neighbours vastly outnumber those who weild their religion as a weapon against everyone they don't like or agree with.

Beth, London, UK

Do people actually still believe in God these days? - the developed world has outgrown such fairytales. What is so strange is why (the middle of) the US is still so backward on this issue while the rest of us have moved on.

Any Europeans know of anyone intelligent and well educated that "believes"?

Merry Christmas

Matt, London, England

Thanks for reminding us Americans why Europe is indeed the real dark continent.Unbelief,idol-worshipping, and faux merrymaking shall, when you least expect it, usher in a time-via the revived Roman Empire-which the world has never seen and never shall again. "Peace and safety," your papers and pundits shall trumpet. "Then sudden destruction shall come upon them." Believe it or not, it's coming.

Fred Pearce, Cairo, GA , USA

Matt S from Conneticut: Very well put, but you do realise that the description you give in the second half of your post makes you an atheist not an angostic. If it helps you to call yourself an agnostic then so be it, but your views are similar to just about every other atheist I've ever known, myself included.

Mark Allen, Nottingham,

I dislike the hostility of some of the comments rejecting the existence of God, god, or gods. Nevertheless, I have to question the relevance of the existence of the divine. If God is invisible, infinite and immutable (not to mention unprovable), we-ell, that means there is not a lot we can do about it/him/her. There's nothing we can do about God. The argument is really about morality and the contract between people and their environment. That seems like a far more worthwhile point of discussion and I fear that the rabidly religious tend to muddy those waters with serial claims to the absolute truth. We are entering into a negotiation about how we all live together and yet all parties to the discussion are jabbering about things we cannot change, assuming positions from which there can be no negotiation (my God's bigger than yours) and trying to prove their superiority through sneering or ownership of "THE TRUTH". Where is the righteousness in that?

Leanne Reynolds, Lille,

Ha ha. Nice one, Simon from London.

The same evidence is there that "Big Bang" theory.

Mary Catherine, Elmhurst, US/IL

From a scientific point of view it could be argued that the correct position must be agnostic. Those who are Christian, like me, or atheist, like some of my friends, must take a step of faith. Don't lets have any of this elitist rubbish that one view is intellectually superior to the other.

Incidentally, most people I know, from both sides of the fence, are united in their opposition to the new militant evangelists like Dawkins and co.

James, Cambridge, UK

God is a placebo effect.

Lawrence, London, UK

Dave W, Couldn't agree with you more, problem is, until state and church are totally seperated this will never happen. Tell me why anything in my life should be effected by religion when I find the notion of an almighty creator so daft?

Chris Rowley, Newcastle Upon Tyne , England

here's a quote i like:

let a handful of sages, who know the truth and can live with it, keep it among themselves.Men are then divided into the wise and the foolish, the philosophers and the common men, and atheism becomes a guarded esoteric doctrine - for if the illusion of religion were discredited, there is no telling with what madness men would be seized.'
Irving Kristol.

It helps me control the impotent rage i feel when i read basically anything about religion.

Lewis Midds, manchester, uk

I proudly admit to being a confirmed agnostic, some would call that hedging one's bets but it's a position I've come to after much contemplation of the meta-physical issues surrounding religious belief. My central stance is that Christianity, Islam and Judaism (btw why can't they all get on given they are essentially the same religion i.e. worship the same God? - just a thought) are incredibly arrogant and I leave aside earthly politics. The fact is that we are on a insignificant planet on the outer edge of a not very special galaxy and one that isn't even that old Universally speaking. What could make anyone think we are special in some way? We are as a species insignificant, no one can convince me that we are the pinacle of life in the Universe which to me is the central tenant of being created "in His image". Personally I think it's much more humble to realise that perhaps we are just an accident of chemistry but lucky us to be here to be able to ask "why"?

Matt S, CT, USA

David, Wolverhampton. You have a point!

Archie, Thrapston, England

I'm sorry? What harm do Christmas cards? Christian religion is deliberately pushed aside in this country!

Don B. Rogers, Amsterdam, Netherlands

Just to paraphrase some of you;
"That scientists would choose to come among us with such a theory is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe."

“Equating science with understanding is as fashionable as it is foolish.”

“Give me a theory from any source and I will find you a scientist who disagrees with it.”

I have deep faith in the theories of science, just as I have great faith in the reality of God. Unfortunately, those who believe, indeed know God, they do not need the billions of dollars or euros which scientist need to prove their beliefs. I believe in dark matter even if the present generation of scientists in the US and Europe are unsuccessful in finding it. I believe in God because I have already found Him. For those of you who are looking for a free handout or a quick fix, you need to get your head out of your own dark matter and come to grips that God is not the Knight in Shining Armor who throws coins to beggars, but rather throws us the wonders of eternity. Lets pray for that and for the scientists

Ken, Wuhan, China

Like a lot of people, I've lived my life as if there were no God. That's a wager I've made with myself, and I'll be very disappointed if I some day find myself up on charges before St Peter at the Pearly Gates.

On the other hand, I might still have eternity to contemplate my errors at leisure with the likes of Phillip Pullman, Richard Dawkins, and all the other easy scoffers up above.

(Maybe Sartre was right about Hell after all.)

slinkybender, New York, New York

Not sure why people look at 'organised' religion(s) and then seem to take their definition of 'God' from these?
Even the term 'organised' suggests that any religion we can name is not necessarily taught/portrayed in it's most purest and most truthful form of origin!
Might be an idea for those who are interested to do what Kevin from Norwich (above) suggests, which is to take the time to try and ascertain - given all the possible evidence - what 'God' might actually be? Just a suggestion!

Tarni, London, UK

What a learned article. I am disgusted that this only showed one side of the story.


Whatever happened to tolerance?

Sarah, Liverpool,

I think Henry Smith someway down the page has hit on the crux of the problem here. It seems quite clear that before any sensible discussion about the existence of God can take place, a coherent definition of 'God' needs to be developed and agreed upon. Until we have such a definition any other discussion is nonsense.

Kevin, Norwich, UK

This article and the subsequent comments raise a number of questions.

1) Why do atheists resort to personal abuse?
2) WOuldn't a pink unicorn be visible? After all its pink.
3) Who is Phillip Pullman?

James Hughes, Bristol,

"You'd have thought (and certainly the pre-Christians did) that the Son of God, when He chose, would enter the world in a way that would leave no doubt who He was or that He existed."

Some of us still do, and are looking forward to it. Events are all lining up nicely, keep an eye on Russia, Israel and the EU.

Good luck with the Christmas shopping, enjoy the apocolypse :-)

joe, england,

hopefully a person will right correct english when they express they're views on this websight. Less mistake's is what I want to sea. I have no patients with uneducated folk's who cant spell the queens english as it is known.
(We used to say: "Catch 'em young.")

alan, cologne,

That Zeus would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe.

No, it compels us not to be so gullible, and to endeavour to use that grey matter between your ears, that Thor put there.

Vaal, Newbury, England

Whatever happened to tolerance? If people want to believe in something then let them. Sounds as if someone is having a bit of an existential crisis to me!

People deal with the seeming futility of life in different ways - some choose religion some choose Ikea and some people think all people are reptiles - go figure.

Whatever gets people through the days is fair enough with me, as long as we tolerate each other's freedom of choice.

Dave W, Shoreditch, London, UK

Whatever Mr Baker might think, this country was a much more pleasant place to live when it was still nominally a Christian country. The Church was one of the pillars of the country and we all,or most of us, were brought up to know, or educated in, its teachings.

When we turned our back on the Church we lost sight of many of those teachings and drifted into the Godless, amoral morass in which we now find ourselves. So some of our writers make pots of money out of knocking religion? Who cares? How may of their books are actually readable? How many people have read Dawkins' book from cover to cover and been persuaded of its 'truth'?

You take God away and waht do have left? - ourselves. And what a great job our politically correct and agnositc/atheistic politicians have made of things in the last 50 years!

David , Wolverhampton,

Where was the Jewish God when Hitler started killing millions of Jews.
Where was Allah when Saddam and then the Allies invasion resulted in the death of hundreds of thousands muslims.
Where were the Hindu Gods when the Muslims and then the British invaded India.

The answer seems to be there is no one out there looking out for us, we are on our own.

Kris, London,

Rejoyce that common sense is prevailing... Rejoyce we are not Americans where the election for their President involves discussions on whether one candidate believes that the devil was Jesus' brother... Rejoice we do not force our women into a second-class role and multilate their genitals... Rejoyce we don't believe nonsense that was only invented to keep people in control.

Religion has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject of God. It's about power, control and oppression. Always has been, always will be.

Garry W, London,

"If you were lucky enough to be one of those shepherds on the hills around Bethlehem who got the news from the angelic host, or one of the wise men who followed that star, you were lucky."

Profound, that is. There must be some higher intelligence operating here !

Andy, Rugby, UK

"That God would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe."
In the early stages of Christianity it occasioned some mockery amongst the Romans that the Christian God was a simple carpenter. No longer. The Church has pretty decisively won that argument.

Malcolm McLean, Bradford, UK

Perhaps the greatest evidence for God's existence is that, despite years of trying, no-one has yet managed to prove that He doesn't.


Andy, Dinas Powys, UK

Ha Ha. Nice one Andy - The same evidence is also there for the Teapot orbiting the sun and the Invisible Pink Unicorn.

Simon, London,

Northern European societies have all but shed religious nonsense. The link in the chain has been broken and enlightenment values such as freedom of thought and enquiry are taken now for granted. We don't kill our daughters for doubting faith or wearing the wring clothes. However, at the same time, very large numbers of people with stone age viewpoints - eg. that apostates should be murdered - have arrived to settle in Europe. Secular values will be under greater threat in future years as the outlook of some of the newcomers conflicts with modern liberal societies. The new zealots are increasingly confident and will try to intimidate and threaten those with liberal values. That is sad.

brian jones, northumberland, england

As a someone with a scientific eduation, the likes of Richard Dawkins rantings on the God Delusion are offensive to me. why ? because this is nothing to do with science. We tend to overestimate our scientific prowess and draw conclusions that are just nonsense. Whether or not God exists is an interesting question but we should not let ourselves be impressed by scientists-turned-philosophical gurus who rant on the subject (like me). The question which we should simply ask is this... Which is the most likely the universe is here for a reason or it is here for no reason ? Honest scientists admit there is no help from science and both options in fact seem impossible to believe but logically at least one must be true. Of course if we define God as having created the universe by phisically doing X Y and Z then we find that X Y or Z did not happen then only that definition of God is proved invalid... why cant Dawkins see this could it be hes a good scientist but not much of a philospher ?

Henry Smith, Namur, Belgium

Alan, have you ever even met an Christian? I work with a campus-based Christian organisation and (based on my experience) I have a sneaking suspicion that half of Dawkins books are sold to Christians looking to respond intelligently to athiest friends and colleagues. As for being gullable and naive individuals carving for "some charlatan" to sell them a snake-oil remedy for the afterlife... well, if your want to label Mother Theresa, Martin Luther King, John Grisham, CS Lewis, Bono and Jimmy Carter as the most notable fools of the past 45 years, then I think you are stretching credulity a tiny bit. Come visit my church and you will find the exact opposite of your stereotype.

Luke, Staffordshire,

What you are trying to say is don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. When we say the saviour was born in a manger we are also saying see God (ie your most cherished person) as the person who may be poor, oppressed, or otherwise disadvantaged. The churches do do a lot of good and a lot of good people engage in activities which uplift them. We should not throw it away just because we don't believe in god.

Ruby, London, UK

God IS real. I talk to him and he talks to me all the time. You do believe me don't you?

doug george, antibes, france

The Bible is the earliest form of tabloid journalism.
I believe that there probably was someone called Jesus who was very charitable and a good and just human being. But how conceivable is it that the "miracles" and deeds he supposedly performed are Chinese whispers?
"He's a very good person.... very charitable.... he gave me shelter, food, water.... he cured my illness... he touched my eyes and my blindness was cured.... he walked on water... he rose from the dead". It reads like the ever more improbable development of a long-running story in a red top rag!
I could invisage him as a Gandhi-esque figure who tried to do a lot of good but was undone by fantastical deluded hype.
Also remember that the text of the Bible we see now has been translated and retranslated and in fact narrative was a mainly oral tradition in Biblical times, so how can we say with any certainty that what we get from the TEXT of the Bible is the truth?
Also, two words: Talking Snake. Come on, give over...

Graeme, London,

Your faith may entail doubt, mostly because it is about as well founded as a marshmallow skyscraper, it is not a relationship that qualifies for the adjective necessary. Such careless thinking deserves the rather dismissive responses which this piece has garnered.

Faith is the suspension of doubt, the suspension of rational consideration, because "somebody said so". It's not big and it's not clever. As you so ably demonstrate, it is the religious people who are doing the most to discredit religion.

Kidd Garrett, Bristol, UK

Howard,
"Strip away the rubbish, the lies the deciets and the ficticious storytelling and you will find there is good in the ideals"

Surely the point is if there is real good, there shouldn't be the lies, deciet etc ..?
You and Anne seem to think that there is good out there because of religion. Most Christians won't lift a finger to help anyone who doesn't go to their church, worship thieir god and basiclly support thier party.
But at least neither of you reach Kevin levels of delusion. Islam liberating the people from the oppression of catholics. Yeah, right, only to totally oppress and brain-wash it's people in to missing out on the short but wonderful thing called life, in order to carry out the expansionist desires of it's leaders.

"Religion is like piramid selling. Only those in at the beginning make anything out of it. The rest then pay for it for a VERY long time!"
Happy end of year party to all, and let's hope people can learn to be good without fear of god in 2008

Rosbif, Antibes, France

"That faith, by its very nature, entails doubt. If we could be really, truly certain, about the existence of God, what, really, would be the point of it all?"

There are Christians here on the Times Online comments threads who claim a personal relationship with their god. One even claims he has a 'dialogue' as with a real person. Some claim they get answers to their questions in terms of some sort of revelation in the mind. It's hard for me, as an atheist, to reconcile the idea that faith necessarily entails doubt if these people are so certain their god exists.

Of course, not all Christians are reporting the same experiences. The recent revelations about Mother Theresa's lifelong doubts and eventual return to belief suggest that at least she didn't have such a personal experience of god as some of the posters on these threads. Something's not quite right somewhere!

David Jones, Loughborough, UK

"If we could be really, truly certain, about the existence of God, what, really, would be the point of it all?"

If you are unsure of your epistemology, don't restrict your doubts to God alone: that implies that there are some things about which you ARE "really, truly certain". How do you distinguish them?

You should also know that Mohammedanism is not to be tied with Catholicism. In fact, one could suggest a closer relationship between the former and Liberalism: both emerged after centuries of Christian practice and took for granted some of the latter's content in the process of leading people away from it. For example, Western atheists claim to be objectively "scientific" moral people when in fact their morality is entirely a matter of subjective assertion that is reliant on a Christian ethical heritage for its rhetorical effect.

Kevin, London,

You know, the real reason why people go for religion is because they're longing for someone to come along and tell them that when they die they'll live a blissful alterlife and see their loved ones again.
And they're so happy when some charlatan comes along and tell's them that all they have to do is worship some imaginary person in the sky. And they even believe it when they're told how he (!) is almighty, created everything (including himself), loves them and is watching them from upstairs.
People are gullible. They just enjoy being led up the garden path.

alan, cologne,

2007 may be a bad year for 'God Squadders' in the press, but for millions in this world they have been good news....

Good news to the poor (malnourished, homeless) through charities like Tearfund, Christian Aid, Besom (who help do up crumbling council flats and give people enough furniture).

Proclaiming release for captives - giving christmas gifts to the families of prisoners via AngelTree, or drugs rehab via the Nehemiah Trust, or for the homless via 'off the Fence' in Brighton.

Recovery of sight to the blind - through Christian Blind Mission International, and supporting hospitals throughout the world

Letting the oppressed go free - such as the Barnabas fund

And proclaiming gods favour to the world - via millions of volunteers giving time, money and resources. e.g. in USA 1/3 of population are christian and they give 45% of charitable giving.

Why demonstrate outside a shopping mall when there is so much hurt, and pain in this world to deal with instead?

Peter Bricknell, London, UK

Tony - "There is no God. Is it really hard to understand that?" - are you sure that you exist? Perhaps the greatest evidence for God's existence is that, despite years of trying, no-one has yet managed to prove that He doesn't.

Andy, Dinas Powys, UK

Excellent news. Harry Potter is real. Well he must be as his sheer unbelievability compels me to believe in him.

Michael

Michael, Down Under,

What has God to do with religions? I can´t understand it. God is a concept. Religions are more related to politics, money and domination than with the escense of life.

Amanda Avaro, Unquillo, Argentina

All very nice...but isn't it a bit simpler? What is the point in believing in bullshi*t that doesn't exist? I don't see a need for a debate. Whether some jesus character lived at a certain time or not makes no difference. There is no God. Is it really hard to understand that?

Tony, London, UK

"Get them while their young"--no, I don't think so. "Get them while they're young"--now I'll buy that. Sorry to notice this slip. Can't help myself.

bette latta, demopolis, usa al

Let me rephrase that:
[That a man who grew up to become a semi-legendary itinerate preacher and rabble rouser, was executed and stayed dead, would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe.]
strange, inexplicable, unbelievable???
Don''t think so.

Pejadu, Kawasaki, Japan

Doubts about religion were inevitable once scientific and other knowledge was able to confront and often disprove many previously accepted elements of religious belief, and marxism with its bitter hatred of all things traditional had infused all the major political parties to some degree or other.
With former values & standards undermined, the successful promotion of a greedy, self-indulgent, consumer-based society has just about finished us off.

In spite of all these pressures, Christianity might still have been kept alive had the British Clergy maintained its faith, and provided leadership for both Believers and social conservatives, who are so often natural allies.
Unfortunately, they have been prime examples of theological doubt and spinelessness (the Anglicans most of all) as they at best apologise for everything they once stood for, and at worst rush to reflect the opinions of the very people who have so very successfully sought their downfall.

L G Reed, London, England

Complete nonesense. I long for the day when the Christians get real!

J, Ott, On

The problem the religious have is to concentrate on the story and the need for belief in it. Whether it be the nativity, water into wine, burning bushes. moving mountains, by maintaining belief in props used to awe the uneducated throughout the ages they have shown themselves to not really believe in god at all, but want to belong to a tribe in order to feel special.
Te message , underlying in all the monotheistic faiths is the important part. Strip away the rubbish, the lies the deciets and the ficticious storytelling and you will find there is good in the ideals. .

Howard, Tokyo,

"Faith, by its very nature, entails doubt". Yes, if you have faith in something which cannot be experienced in this lifetime (any Christians become as Christ yet?).

Not all religions are religions of faith; the other half are religions of experience. Here, confidence (not faith) increases with deeper experience of beyond-personal reality, and everything is within reach, with enough work.

Equating religion with theism is as fashionable as it is foolish.

Merry Christmas! Peace on Earth, and goodwill to all men.

Paul, London, UK

"Nope, I think you'll find it doesn't."

Brilliant. Just brilliant.

No, really. Very good, very clever.

Fred, London, UK

"That God would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe."

No Gerard, it compels us to DISbelieve, at least those of use who are rational.

A Clark, Liverpool,

Have you ever considered checking your sources? I listened to the interview with the Archbishop, and he said that the Bible simple describes Magi coming to visit. It doesn't say that they were kings, it doesn't say there were three of them, and it doesn't say one was black. It was all these additional details he described as legend. I suppose "Archbishop defends the Bible's account of Christmas" won't fit your template.

Doug Chaplin, Worcester, UK

absolute rubbish although you are right regarding the god squad if only they new what the bible really teaches, jesus wasnt even born in december why would the shepard have the sheep up in the hills during winter? who really put the star in the sky and why, you will find the answer if you look at 1 john 5:19 its so simple its the truth

concerned, rossendale, lancs

"That God would choose to come among us in such a way is so strange, so inexplicable, so unbelievable, it compels us to believe."

Nope, I think you'll find it doesn't.

Cat, Glasgow,

A friend of mine once commented that the way to learn how to discern counterfeit money from the real thing can only be done by becoming very familiar with the genuine article. So it is with Christianity. Looking to the history of Christendom and studying its mistakes and divisions will not help us to appreciate the beauty of the genuine article. But looking at the lives of selfless individuals who have dedicated themselves to genuinely living this religion gives us a glimpse of the authentic message of Christianity and its value in society.

Anna, Victoria, BC

Dear Mr Baker

Please send me twenty pounds for a trip to the moon, where I will ask God to bestow good fortune on you. Surely you must believe that this strange, inexplicable, unbelievable request is true?

Neil Henderson, Kendal,

"Seizing on the old Jesuit principle of getting them while their young, Philip Pullman went Hollywood this year with the Dark Materials trilogy."

"...while they're young..."

Difficult to reject those adult fairy tales totally, isn't it? Takes a lot of moral courage.

Andrew Anderson, Neutral Bay, New South Wales, Australia