Less ordure would have been heaped upon the august head of the former Attorney-General, Lord Goldsmith, had he recommended the humane gassing of all Britain's cats. Even the tentative suggestion of a national oath earned not just the condemnation, but the contempt, of every section of British expressed opinion, from the termini of the League of Empire Loyalists to the New Communist Party and all stops in between.
Temperamentally I had my bucket ready. From my earliest days as a young member of the St Pancras Socialist Sunday School, I have hated all this ceremonial stuff. Going up to Oxford (not long before being sent down again) I discovered an incapacity for taking part in any of its daft rituals. Matriculation in the Sheldonian Theatre sounded complicated and unnecessary, “handshaking” with the Master like something out of Gormenghast, and the requirement to dress for examinations in a tatty gown and to flutter round town, as an ailing vulture might, like a piece of generational sadism. And for what good reason? No one could tell you.
But there weren't many as institutionally incompetent as me. In general my contemporaries - even those who led semi-violent Trotskyite sects and went on to become human rights lawyers - sucked it up. They put on their robes, they shook the hands, they matriculated together. And today they, like everyone else, express their outrage or amusement at the very idea of the oath. They now put on QC's wigs, prelate's robes, dog collars, medals, accept knighthoods, peerages and membership of the Garrick, watch their infant Cubs and pubescent Guides parade around church with the Union Flag, and yet express instant outrage at the notion that we might do as the Americans do, and pledge allegiance.
It hardly brushed their consciousness on the way to rejection, as far as I could tell, that Lord Goldsmith had been trying to solve a genuine problem - the difficulty of consolidating a national, British identity, in a time of unprecedented demographic change. Had they drawn breath they might have reflected that the American pledge of allegiance, created by a Christian Socialist for Columbus Day in 1892, was partly motivated by the scale of new arrival into the US. Ellis Island had opened earlier that year, and in 1891 half a million immigrants landed in New York alone.
The objection to Lord Goldsmith, taken in the round, seemed to be that an oath, like a motto or even a national day, was somehow un-British in conception. Either because the very act of affirming Britishness was antithetical to British reticence (we don't do that, we don't have mottoes, national days etc), or because governments and politicians cannot call these things into being, but rather they must be the products of genuine organic tradition. Like, shall we say, the State Opening of Parliament?
One of my favourite books, published (alas!) nearly a decade after my Oxford démarche, is a book of historical essays, The Invention of Tradition. In its pages historians such as David Cannadine show how the tartan was a 19th-century marketing device, the great medieval Oxford ritual of the Chancellor's Inauguration goes back only as far as 1911, and Queen Victoria wouldn't open Parliament in person between 1861 and 1876, the current ceremony being created later by her son, Edward VII.
That this might be done successfully seemed unlikely to Lord Robert Cecil, later the Marquess of Salisbury. “Some nations have a gift for ceremonial...,” he said, but “this aptitude is generally confined to the people of a southern climate and of Non-Teutonic parentage.” Hardly 60 years later Richard Dimbleby was confident that Americans would have to “wait for a thousand years before they can show the world anything so significant or so lovely” as a British royal ceremony.
Tradition, then, can be invented, even in Britain. The Mail on Sunday is running a campaign to “save” Britannia on our coinage, and has managed the extraordinary feat of eliciting support both from David Cameron and from the senior Liberal Democrat Chris Huhne. Britannia was, said Mr Cameron, an ancient British symbol, having appeared on a Roman coin and a “British” one in 1672. Said Mr Huhne, in a comment I like to think was written for him by someone on work experience: “Britannia has been an enduring symbol of British pride and history for millennia.” I may be wrong but I imagine that the 1672 coinage was English, and that Huhne might as well have invoked the Pliocene as the past “millennia” in search of “British pride and history”.
Well, if a bint on a rock with a stick can be a vital British symbol of togetherness, then why can we not have an oath? No more, apparently, than we can have a Museum of Britain. When one was mooted recently, the excellent young historian Tristram Hunt described it as a “deranged idea”. Fair enough, part of his objection was to having Kenneth Baker associated with any such project, but it is also true that Hunt could not seem to bear the notion of a museum devoted to British (as opposed to London, Scottish, Welsh or working-class) history.
This, of course, leads one to reflect on the three genuine British characteristics displayed in the oath discussion and in so much else. The first is our capacity for instant negativity. On Thursday last I sat with two charming couples in early old age, listening as they itemised the reasons why the Olympics would be a disaster. The clinching catastrophe was the prospect of our local high street collapsing from the weight of passing Olympic cyclists. One of my American friends, who loves Britain, often describes it as “the Land of No”.
The second is class pessimism. We of the newspapered classes might get the idea of an oath - though of course for us it would be redundant - but the hooligans and teddy-boys, they'd just snigger and stab each other while it was being administered.
But overwhelmingly, for good or bad, what characterises us is our complacency. Love everything that's old, even if it's rubbish. Dispute the value of everything that's new, even if it's desperately needed. Campaign against stuff - from incinerators to airports - but never for it, whether it's new schools or green power plants.
Now, I don't want my kids to swear an oath particularly, but if it helps national cohesion, I am eccentric enough to prefer that to having them troll around a modern British city forcibly dressed as medieval monks. Which other commentators can say the same?
Christopher T, Lewisham, UK, and what do we do with those who refuse to take an oath to the Monarch and God.
Do we throw them in prison or reduce their civil rights such as refusing to issue a passport until they obey?
When the people of the World gets past this nationalisitic rubbish it will be a far better place. Until then Wolves will try and manipulate Sheep to support them by introducing ideas of shared collective defence.
Neill, Maidstone, Maidstone
Incidentally, how many people are aware that officers of the Grenadier Guards do not make the 'loyal toast' to the Queen routine in other British army messes?
When originally required to do so (after the Restoration), they took the view that their loyalty was beyond question, that such a toast was little more than a gratuitous insult to themselves, and that they would resign their commissions first.
I suspect the attitude of most (or at least a great many) patriotic Brits towards the proposed loyalty oath is similar.
As for those who feel very differently - well, I really don't see why republicans, inverted patriots, nationalists, Euronuts, anarchists and wotnot should be forced to lie under oath. They are entitled to hold and express their opinions; they are not entitled to act treasonably.
It would take a government dedicated to a national population database and dog-licences for all to come up with this stunt. They really don't understand Britishness at all.
John C, Bangkok,
As the article hints at, the whole idea of identity and nation is one of tradition. Tradition is invented / artificially preserved. And the tradition of Britain is weak. There is no national anthem (its England's). The flag doesn't represent Wales. So the only thing a rather confused Scotsman's monkey could grope at to justify the continued existence of this outdated Britain is the queen. Unfortunately she is also used in Australia etc etc, so allegiance to the monarchy is not something uniquely "British".
A sense of British-ness never really did exist, and it won't much longer either. Britain will always be a geographical term for this island (never Northern Ireland), but in political reality devolution has already destroyed what little concept of one Britain there ever was. Time for England, Scotland, and Wales to enter the EU as separate member states. Those are our only true heart-felt identites. Bye bye Britain.
Steven, Edinburgh,
We should welcome children into adulthood with some kind of ceremony and one that is about the contribution they can make. One also that links them to their fellow Britons and to the history of Britain . Leaving secondary school would be a good moment. It should include an oath to support the country and the humanizing symbol of it which is the Monarch. It should also include a reference to God. Atheists and anti monarchists can mumble that bit and still pledge to honour and contribute.
Christopher T, Lewisham, UK
"A bint on a rock"? DA is either suffering from adenoid problems or was brought up in Swadlincote fifty years ago.
If our kids could be shown something or someone to be proud of these days, apart from our servicemen and women being shot at daily in Iraq and Afghanistan on behalf of Tony Blair, they wouldn't need to swear an oath of allegiance, would they surree?
Theo Nelson, South Hams,
People campaign against things like toxic waste incinerators or airport expansions not out of complacency,but because of rational reasons like,for example,dioxin or greenhouse gas emissions and the needless polluting of the environment.
Such campaigns can bring people together in a way that knee-jerk jingoism never can..
Swearing an oath of allegiance would not bring me an inch closer to the warmongering,neoliberal,civil liberties-crunching crooks who dominate our political system,or indeed,to the likes of David Aaronovitch,so I don't see why anyone else should have to swear it..
al w, birmingham, UK
What really bothers me as an Englishman is that i don't feel British. I don't feel wanted here anymore. As an Englishman i struggle to feel i belong anywhere on these islands. An oath to Britishness is an acceptance of the social stigma that it has become to call yourself English. Let the rest of the 'Isles' keep their cute Celtic carricatures and we'll crack on as normal keeping ourselves to ourselves. Keep your oath, i don't want it. We're becoming the exodus reincarnated...we'd prefer to live anywhere but Britain.....unless your posh then it's okay, or you've sold a house in the south east in the last five years. I'd rather swear allegience elswhere.
Neil, Nottingham, England
Will DA ever forgo his slavish defence of everything that comes out of Labour HQ?
Even once?
"Think outside the box" as the modern parlance has it.
JC, London,
'A bint on a rock'? Ah the international people. Don't you just love them?
Edward, Lincoln, England
I was born in England to a Maltese mother and a Scottish father but I can thankfully place a hand on my heart and say that I have never 'felt' British or English. This is a truly pathetic country - over-priced, over-hyped, miserable with perhaps the most apathetic attitude prevailing. Rooted in the past, pretentious, politically correct, lacking any real identity other than football and the pub, I can't think why anyone with the means to do otherwise would choose to live here. As for an oath to the queen - the mind truly boggles. An unelected leech with Germanic and Russian roots I find the ignorance of the British people regarding their head of state quite overwhelming. Aaronovitch makes a good point regarding the for-nothing, against-everything mentality. Such is the British way. Far easier to put up with something as is than to make positive action and change things for the better. Another year and I leave this truly awful country for good.
Jon Brook, London, England
Up until I was 11 years of age I had to sing, 'God save the Queen' once a week every Monday morning for school parade. Then overnight, my school was banned from singing, 'God save the Queen', instead we had to sing, 'Advance Australia Fair'. Apparently, every child at my school was unpatriotic even though the Queen of England still Australia's head of state. Now I won't sing or stand for either. And I certainly won't be bullied into either, even though many people have tried. I firmly believe patriotism can only be shown through ACTION and not WORDS. Patriotism can be summed up by JFK's "Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country." As for pandering to minorities, I'm really not sure that the Scots, Irish and Welsh are still not at all to happy about being under the Queen's thumb.
Rose , London,
Here's a suggestion. Rather than trying to make me pledge allegiance to the country that I am proud to have been born in, why don't the government look to stop the cultural rape that is happening in this country.
Off duty officers were recently told to stop wearing their uniforms in public to save them from abuse in public. How very English of us!!
1, Why are the people that are doing this not being dealt with severely, it is tantamount to treason to such a thing, it is the Queen's uniform after all.
2, Why on earth are we YET AGAIN pandering to the minority just so we can 'all get along'. Do the government not realise that they are slowly driving us towards a civil war??!
3, Do you think this abuse would ever have happened in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland? I VERY much doubt it!
The sooner we get rid of the PC brigade and stop allowing this country to be dictated by the minorities - both racial and otherwise - the better!
Sav, London,
It depends if what is to be sworn allegiance to can be subverted. Blind faith is a favourite communist ploy and should be treated with deep suspicion.
AL, LONDON, UK
Contrary to the views put forth on this forum, American schoolchildren are not forced to repeat the Pledge of Allegiance. Many children, for one reason or another, do not say it.To bind ourselves together, we have an idea, several documents, and a flag. America, surely the most diversified nation on the planet, manages to hum along without needing a royal family. We don't even consider very often what it means to be an American because the American experience is very much an individual thing. Jose Morales in Dallas, Phan Nguyen in San Francisco, and Stanislas Witkowski in Chicago have little else in common besides the flag that they pledge allegiance to, and about which they sing in the National Anthem. Old Glory rippling in the breeze is a potent symbol, but only a symbol, to us of what America is about. So we salute it, or rather the idea behind it, as free citizens, and respect it for its symbolic value, just as you have the Queen as your primary national symbol.
Martha, Miami, Florida USA
It is utterly amazing how even the seemingly clever can get things so spectacularly wrong. There are people born and bred within the borders of the Englnad, not to mention the other nations that make up the UK, into families who have resided there for generations but who have no allegiance to a monarch on principle. What does Mr. Aaronovitch suggest should be done with such conscientious objectors? The Tower? Get a grip,
Jim O'Sullivan, Sligo, Ireland
Under no circumstances will I swear an oath to the Queen, the State.. or any other such thing. I am British by birth, British by belief and no fancy words will make a blind bit of difference to that!
jakiG, long sutton, england
I always eagerly read David Aaronovitch: he is my moral compass. Almost invariably if he's for something I know I should be against it: the Iraq war for example, and now this. In fact I wonder if he does this deliberately. I won't swear an oath to anything, never mind an unelected monarch. It's a ridiculous concept and rightly doomed to failure.
Ricky, Bakewell, UK
As a Lancastrian I have stong feelings for the north-west of England but feel little for the rest of the country.
Would swearing an oath of allegiance to the queen make me feel any different, I don't think so.
You can't be made to feel a part of something, it has to come from within.
If the government and people could create a great country to live in this would surely be the best way to bring about a shared pride and togetherness, which I would assume is the objective of the oath.
J Whiteside, Lytham, Lancashire
We should not pledge an oath to the state. The state should pledge an oath to us. Who is the master and who the servant?
Andrew Gallagher, Galway,
I have lived in Alabama for the last 4 years.
I have my own views about why Nationalism became an idea which Britain shunned. I'm sure that WW2 was a bad advert for Nationalism, but I do think there is room for it in the 21st century.
I was appalled to hear that British serviceman were being advised not to wear uniform when in public. The idea that the Queen's uniform should attract ridicule is a sign of how far things have slipped. American servicemen wear their uniform with pride - its not unknown for them to be bought lunch by a grateful civvy.
Go to a ball game in the USA and the National anthem of the US (and any other country) is treated with reverence.
I read recently that there is a movement afoot to get a memorial for those who served in Bomber Command during WW2. I also hear that there is some resistance to the idea. I wonder if the 55,573 or so who gave their lives would imagine that their modern day couterparts would be treated so badly by their own countrymen.
Clive, Birmingham, Alabama
We dont want an oath of loyalty to deal with the cultural rape of Britain, because we dont want the cultural rape of Britain to carry on
Dominic, Manchester, UK
The Britain that the author and all those who have commented here is not Britain but England, and the reason that Britain is dying is that devolution allowed us scots, and welsh and northern irish a say. We were no longer just regions of england to be drained of talent, resources and money and used to house power stations and illegal nuclear weapons, ignored at all other times.
We have woken up and found that small nations work very well in this new era of globalisation. Britain is dead, fiscal autonomy for scotland "defacto independance" will come along soon and the others will follow with nationalist administrations in all devolved areas.
So frankly you can forget your oath and trying to make me feel british, because i never did, i never want to and it is too late.
Tam, Glasgow, Scotland
I think the rediculous amount of taxes I pay is allegiance enough. An oath would just be a farce, what would it prove? If it had an legal immplications, then there would not be anything to stop people lying.
Pointless and simply another way to waste tax payers money!
Mike P, Kent, UK
For the definitive low down on loyalty oaths refer to Catch 22
martyn, calvia, spain
I totally agree with the article. I'm living in Spain for a short while, but I am British and I will be returning to live in England soon. Everyone should take an Oath and be able to pass a basic English exam. If you refuse the oath or refuse to learn enough English to take the exam, then we should wave bye bye as you leave Britain.
Neil Graham, Mula, Murcia, Spain
What surprises me is the comparatively little discussion of the notion of children being made to swear allegiance to an unelected head of state and by implication to swear allegiance to one particular form of politics and government. This is simple political indoctorination, akin to making children receive uncritical religious instruction or to take part in the faith rituals. It may be distinctively British that such proposed institutionalisation of political bias and anti-democratic practices into our schooling system causes such little alarm. We would probably have scant tolerance or understanding for virtually any other nation proposing that its citizens, including its schoolchildren, be made to swear allegiance to an unelected head of state whatever his or her constitutional power.
Paul, Oxford,
There is no longer any Britain to feel Btirish about . Devolution has seen to that.
This, as an Englishman, I do not mind at all, but ,unfortunately, if we stay within the EU, there will no longer be any England either, just nine regions of the UK, and England as a country and the English as a nation will disappear.
Don't you think it is time we stirred our stumps and did something about it?
Why not start by joining the CEP and the EDP and, for that matter, the OPT as well, because we cannot sustain a 50 million population!
Birmingham has just held its annual St Patrick's Day Parade.
After New York's and Dublin's, the biggest in the world we are told.
I wonder what April the 23rd will be like in Brum?
For the sake of your grandchildren, if not your
country, why don't you apathetic English WAKE UP!
j.b.windmill, brierley hill, ENGLAND
WOW a newspaper article that is capable of looking to the future while not blindy accepting "tradition" for being tradition!(all we need now is to question the welfare state and we might be onto something!)
at the end of the day what is the national anthem, if not an oath in song?
while i dont particularly like the idea of people being forced to express love for country, i would like to see people being allowed to be proud of being english and british. Why for example do we celebrate St Paddys with great gusto and then nobody has a clue when St Georges is?
I think the more important thing is to teach english history properly. Rather than just doing greeks and romans when your in junior school why not teach kids about the industrial revolution, the napoleonic wars, Magna Carta and of course WW2,adn the plethora of other great things then surely it would be impossible for them not to be proud of being english.
will, london, england, britain! lol
I believe that the surviving former members of Monty Python would be just the ones to create a national motto for the Brits. Perhaps a combo of, "And now for something completely different," with "(Says Palin) Look, I came here for an argument...(Says Cleese) No you didn't!" with "They're goalies, David....they're romantics..."
Ian, Washington DC, USA
I have always been disturbed by the fact that American school children have to repeat their mantra of allegiance every day. It's basically brainwashing isn't it? Isn't this the sort of thing wacky cults do? And I firmly believe that it contributes towards a tendency on the part of many Americans to blindly believe in their country.
Being proud of where you're from is a good thing, but not if it also means that you're so enamoured with your country that you forget to criticise it for the things it does wrong. Bush got the Patriot Act through because he was able to hijack patriotism and make it the mirror image of dissent.
I think part of "Britishness" is the ability to self deprecate. It's one of the most wonderful things about the British. I think the oath would undermine this without achieving anything.
Steve, London, UK
It is not a case of identity, what has happened in this still wonderful country is demoralization. Through ten years of mismanagment and constant threats to our liberty. A corrupt government browbeating the population on a daily basis, listen to any commercial radio station , the advertising revenue taken from government, (taxpayer) must be a kings ransom. Fines for this offence, retraining by yourgov!! The point of being British is we don't think about it !
Wills, Soton, UK Province of EU
Oaths of allegiance should not be necessary. They are only thought so by a government that has undermined so much of our sense of nationhood - primarily for the English. They are quite content, rightly, to support Scottish, Irish & Welsh nationhood within an overall British umbrella, but deny the English the right to be English (as in the 2001 census, where they were defined as 'white British').
This is not necessary. The government should not be afraid to support English nationhood (it is, instead, stoking up English nationalism, which is to be avoided). And the English should stop confusing England/English with Britain/British. Then we can all live peaceably together as British, within our separate but united nationhoods.
Dave, Wrexham,
I am an immigrant with British citizenshp now...when people ask what I think, I answer honestly and thell them I love the country. Of course, it never pays to be too serious as a Briton, so when they ask why, I reply 'The Weather'.
Christopher , London ,
Pointing out that getting schoolkids to swear an oath to the queen is a silly idea, in 2008, and hardly a solution to youth crime, is not being negative. It is positively stating that we are above such silliness. Most of us are also unmoved by Gilbert and Sullivan-esque pageantry, if anyone bothered to ask.
But David, you really seem to think that anything the government does is simply marvellous, and anyone who objects is either too stupid or lazy to have thought the policy through like they, and you, have. This is getting a bit creepy.
It is possible to vote Labour and still have doubts about some areas of policy.
Chris Nye , Lewes, UK
How long before Broon gets it into his head that Brtain is dead and only aways the funerary rites.
Alan Clayton, Oban,
I did not agree with the oath itself, to whom we would be swearing it and the general air of pomp which would no doubt pervade any ceremony and which I find horribly painful.
I would suck up those objections however because of what an oath would really mean, its a recognition which we currently never give of a love for our country.
I wouldnt agree in making students do it (All too often at school the "voluntary" would in fact be mandatory, I would prefer a real opt out method.
Alex Griffiths, Aberystwyth, Wales
I am British and English and I feel both. Studying history and seeing a lot of the good people around me and the beautiful buildings and monuments that surround me (and their history), and having traveled and seen some (please note here the word 'some', before I get bashed) of the impact of our history makes me proud.
I'm perfectly comfortable with being both British and English and sure there are some elements of this country that need serious improvement - but then that has always been the case. I do agree that something needs to be done about those among us, certain immigrants of 1st and 2nd generation, who feel no connection to this country or our culture. An oath almost certainly won't bring about the necessary change, but it's a start at least.
If we weren't so soft, we'd give them a choice - either stay here in which case this is your country, you accept our way of life and don't segregate yourselves from the rest of us. Otherwise, please shut the door on your way out.
Louise, London,
The idea of an 'oath of allegiance' being taken by citizens of the UK appears to have been taken from the USA. However nowhere in all the discussions have I seen it pointed out that in the USA, pupils in schools pledge their allegiance to their country every school day, so that it becomes part of their subconsciousness. That this could be achieved by a one-off oath seems more than a little unlikely.
George, Nottingham, UK
An oath of fidelity to the ruling class ?
Peter Vernunft, Berlin, Germany
I find the description of Britannia as "A bint on a rock with a stick" rather offensive. Frankly, its hard to imagine someone who described the great symbol of our nation as such, move onto condem those who question our nation's stability and do not have faith in our strength can be seen as anything other than a hypocrite.
I love Britain, I am British, I always will be. I would certainly swear an Oath to Britain.
Its clear to me that David is mistaking common sense for negativity, caution for pessimism but complacency is well placed. You assume the populace should all be unwavering in thier support of the Olympics? The goverment spends £50million (approx) on the Olympics, and refuses Police Officers as 1.25% pay rise? Nothing quite as clever as prioritising a sporting event over national security...
I disagree entirely with this article, it is well written and coherent, as I have come to expect, but I know an Oath would be a joy to me, but no so most of this great nation.
Richard Wilcox, Liverpool, Britain
Most people, including myself, think of themselves as either English, Irish, Scottish or Welsh, even though there are a lot of genetic, ethnic and historical nonsenses in that. "British" is what it states on my passport, and, as another contributor has noted, is a euphemism for foreigner. You can be British if you are from India but you cannot be English, in other words. In addition, those of us who don't see themselves as little Englanders are starting to feel an allegiance to Europe, not just Britain. It's where I work, buy a house, holiday and shop. Britain is becoming an outdated concept with no intrinsic meaning.
Dave, Slough,
As a Quaker, I will not be taking any oath at any time. The collective memory of the Society of Friends goes back to a period when the requirement of swearing an oath was a device to uncover 'disloyalty' and carried serious penalties, usually involving long and indeterminate incarceration. Be careful what you wish for.
John Punshon, Milton Keynes, England
What purpose will swearing an oath serve? Either one feels part of the culture and society or one doesn't.
Hamad Lone, London, England
How quickly migrants realise that in this land they can have their own way, why then should they pledge any aliegence to a country which is non other than a standard of living .
wayne, huntingdon, cambridgeshire
Britain is a tribal country - 'Britishness' (or 'Englishness' if you prefer) is just something people are born with and is devoid of ideological content. You can be un-American but you cannot be un-British (except in the parochial context of regional nationalism). In fact, what could be more British than the peculiarly English affectation of inverted patriotism?
This does not apply to 1st (and even many 2nd) generation immigrants, obviously, but if history is any guide, it probably will to their descendants.
An oath of allegiance is wholly inappropriate, as evidenced by the almost universal ridicule heaped on the idea.
Of course, lefty intellectuals like Aaronovitch and Goldsmith don't get it, but then they never did. How completely out of touch they are with their compatriots could not be better illustrated. The vast majority of Brits do not agonise about their national identity at all. They KNOW what it is to be British and have never been uncomfortable with it.
John C, Bangkok,
Maybe we British are cynical about 'Britishness' because of its source. New Labour has done everything in the book to fragment this island nation.
John, London,
Its not that I object in priciple of swearing an oath of allegiance to Britain, if it still existed, but what is the point, when we have already lost what it is to be British, mainly through NuLabours short-sighted aims to make everything multi-cultural and politically correct in order not to offend anyone! they obviously disregarded the feelings of the indegenous population. We are no longer the 'British Isles', we are in fact English, Welsh, Scotish and Irish, our current government has truly brought history to life!
Leslie Corrin, Southport, England
I refuse to swear an oath not out of any inhibited, stiff-upper-lip reticence, but because I'm not "British." I'm English. Maybe you've missed the last few years but we're balkanized beyond repair - the Scots are Scottish, the Welsh are Welsh, the English are English and the "British" are foreigners.
The liberal-left metropolitan elites have destroyed the country they hate, and it's too late to try and force the English majority to accept their disgusting policy of population change by appealing to our (previous)British pride and patriotism. Most would rather retreat to the safety of their English roots or emigrate to Australia, and there's nothing wrong with either of those options.
Steve Jacks, London,
Great article - after 6 exhausting years in the UK, this article sums up my reason for fatigue! Everything is disputed, nothing is made better, other people's ideas are relentlessly sneered at and history is invented to please thier own ideas of themselves and yet................ no issues are addressed, let alone acknowledged!
one to one, brits are great company, with a sense of fair play, humour and all the rest but collectively they are hopeless joke - time to outsource the fixing of the bitter isles to foreigners - probably Australians! (just to see the reaction!!!!)
Christian G, Hong Kong,
An oath is a real thing - a vow and a commtiment - to do something or not do something. It can't be broken or only with dire consequences. Marriage vows for example, or Christian baptism. Or to fight and die for one's country perhaps, in the event of war. Not to betray the country to an enemy. If that were what is being considered then fair enough, and I would think that one would have to be an adult to take such a vow. But somehow I think they have something much more vague and sentimental in mind, which will have the effect of denigrating the idea of what a solemn oath is.
Andrew Chapman, Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Thoughts on "Britannia on the penny". I remember reading in one of those old books of "interesting" facts that the model who sat for the Britannia on the back of the old penny was a lady from Denistoun in Glasgow... millennia indeed.
John R, Auburn, Washington
Timesonline recently carried reports of Christian vicars being assaulted by " Asians ". These " Asians " were probably citizens and, very likely, native born citizens. This being the case, Britain surely needs a wider debate about what citizenship means. And encouraging people to commit to the broader secular state is an important part of this. The role of the secular state was brilliantly explained by Matthew Paris on these pages recently. As to traditions being invented, this is self-evident. We like to think of ourselves as having long-held traditions. And one that went back to 1911 would be thought of as positvely ancient. If you want to see a national day at close quarters, please all consider yourselves as having an open invitation to visit on 26th January, any year.
James , Canberra, Australia.