The blowtorch of media scrutiny is steadily taking layers of gaudy paint off
the happy caravan that is Barack Obama’s presidential campaign. Last week
his hometown newspaper, the Chicago Tribune, subjected some of the
claims made in his compelling autobiography, Dreams from my Father,
to the unforgiving audit of the fact-checker. It turns out that the title
might have been even more appropriate than it seemed, since some of the
incidents Mr Obama eloquently relates about his early life may have been
more the stuff of idealised reverie than reality.
But all politicians embellish their life story a bit. No election can be won
without an appealing “personal narrative”. If George Washington didn’t
really cut down that cherry tree, then surely Mr Obama can be forgiven for
misplacing his role in some of his earliest recollections of the civil
rights movement.
Of much more interest is the flak that the Democratic senator is taking for
some remarks he made about the Middle East. Hillary Clinton, his main
opponent for the Democratic presidential nomination in next year’s election,
has seized upon them as proof that the senator cannot be trusted with US
national security nor as a true friend of Israel.
What exactly, was the young senator’s offence? Did he, in an unguarded moment
of adolescent radicalism, say something nice about Yassir Arafat? Did he
call on Israel to give back the occupied territories?
Here, for the record, is precisely what he said, in a speech in Iowa a few
weeks ago: “Nobody is suffering more than the Palestinian people.”
The response to this little aside, the shower of invective heaped on Mr Obama
from all sides of the political arena, is instructive and depressing. In
American political debate, saying something sympathetic about the
Palestinians is evidently now deemed unsayable. Even as mild and neutral an
observation as noting that Palestinians are “suffering” is considered a
gaffe somewhat akin to expressing a kindly word for KGB pensioners.
The potential political penalties for such dangerous talk are well
demonstrated by Mr Obama’s own rather pitiful response to the incident.
Under pressure for his remarks, his spokesman “clarified” them, saying that
what Mr Obama meant was that Palestinians were suffering because of the
cruelties of their own, Hamas-dominated leadership. Phew! Thank goodness he
cleared that one up. We thought for a horrible moment he might have been
offering just the minutest criticism of Israeli policy.
It is sadly true, as America’s critics contend, that US debate about the
Middle East is constrained within an impossibly narrow field of discussion.
In fact it is striking that it is much easier for an Israeli to say things
critical of the Israeli Government than it is for an American to offer the
same critique. No one questions the anti-terrorist bona fides of those who
express concern for the plight of the Palestinians there.
A popular view outside America, occasionally expressed inside the US, is that
the limits to debate about the Middle East are set by some powerful group
called the Israel Lobby. This shadowy bunch, depending on your favoured
conspiracy theory, either bankrolls all American politicians or plants its
own members in critical positions inside the US Government. No politician
dare step out of line from what is decreed acceptable by the Lobby. Last
year two academics gave public voice to this view in a paper that quickly
earned notoriety.
But fixation on the Israel lobby is not only misplaced and, with its evocation
of wealthy bankers and unscrupulous political consultants, just a tiny bit
antiSemitic. It also misses the real reasons that the US can’t seem to have
a sensible discussion now about the Middle East.
That there is an Israel lobby in American politics is not really in dispute.
In a political system as vast and complex as America’s, all kinds of groups
seek to influence the outcome of the policy debate. There is also an Ireland
lobby, a Taiwan lobby, and for all I know a Liechtenstein lobby. The Israel
lobby is certainly among the more influential, but its influence is still
much less than its critics think, and much, much less important than a range
of factors that keep politicians on the straight and narrow with regard to
the Middle East.
Some of these reasons are to do with internal political developments long in
the making. The rise of evangelical Christianity as a political force,
especially within the Republican Party, has something to do with it. The
belief that the Jews must be returned to the Biblical lands of Judaea and
Samaria before the world can end has driven up support for an aggressive
Israeli approach to its neighbours in the Holy Land.
Those of us who are not evangelical Zionists will feel a little queasy about
that idea. But there are two good reasons why Americans are sensitive about
criticism of Israel that have nothing to do either with the power of the
mysterious lobby or with the millennarian theology of certain protestant
groups.
Most Americans, whatever their religious or political views, feel a special
solidarity with Israel. Part of it is to do with strong similarities in
national consciousness, a sense that both America and Israel were founded as
refuges for persecuted national Americans believe — rightly, as it happens —
that if it hadn’t been for US intervention, the Holocaust might have
succeeded in annihilating every last Jew from the earth. They feel — again,
correctly — that without staunch US support for the past 40 years, Israel
would almost certainly have ceased to exist. Since September 11, 2001, this
sense of solidarity has only deepened. The same jihadism that wants to
destroy Israel, and has murdered thousands of Jews over the decades, now
targets America and its people.
But none of this should be allowed to prevent a proper debate in America about
the Middle East. The lesson of Mr Obama’s “gaffe” is that the rules of
American politics mean it is impossible for politicians to express sympathy
for Palestinians in their plight or to argue that Israel must bear at least
some responsibility for alleviating it. Playing by those rules might pave
the way to the White House. It will never smooth the way to Middle East
peace.
It is a grown up debate. On one side, a democratic country that was formed by UN mandate that was set upon by its neighbors three times. It has equality for women, other religions, it is industrious and modern. On the other side there's terrorism, intolerance and sharia. I know which I support.
David Alexander, London, UK
Here we we go, time began 9/11. US was pro Israel before then. It was not Palestinians that caused the Holocaust, but Europeans (& again in Bosnia & Kosovo). 1000s of Jews killed by Palestinians - well hundreds of thousand Palenstinians killed by Jews, millions of muslims killed by Judae Christians
Shaffiq Mahmood, Halifax, UK
The highhanded opinions of land return (aboriginal Indians, Palestinians, etc., of certain Englishmen will be of more value when Scotland, Wales and Ulster receive their unconditional independence.
Scott, Atlanta, USA
at the end of the day,israeli have been occupying the palestinian state for the last god knows number of years.its ridiculous if you count the number of resolutions the isralis have breached.only solution is that U.S. stop its supply to israel and give back the land the palestinians own and break down that stupid wall.
afzal, london,
The non-Jewish boys at my grammar school outside London during the 1940s came from a complete cross- section of the local population, and the vast majority of them were anti-Semitic, no doubt as a consequence of the sentiments that were expressed at home. We Jewish boys were constantly told (often with accompanying violence) to "Go back to Palestine".
Today, the sons and grandsons of those non-Jewish contemporaries of the 1940s have changed the lyrics, but the tune is still the same . Much of anti-Semitism in the UK and Europe today takes the form of vilification of the Jewish State and denial of the right of the Jewish people to self-determination in its ancestral homeland. No other people on earth has been denied the right to self-determination ! Jews in the UK and elsewhere must stand up to be counted and support our brothers and sisters in the Land of Israel.
Gershon, London,
What people found objectionable about Mr. Obama's statement was not, as you allege, his observation that Palestinians are “suffering.” What people found objectionable was his assertion that "NOBODY is suffering more than the Palestinian people.” Had he merely said that BOTH Palestinians and Israelis are suffering, no one would have objected. Mr. Obama's selective phraseology was his mistake. The subjectivity of his conclusion was in itself grounds for objection as well as grounds for doubting Mr. Obama's political, strategic, and moral compass.
Jeremiah, Washington, DC, USA
Many thanks to Gerard Baker for his analysis of American apathy for the plight of the Palestinian hopefully more courageous journalists will speak about as it is imperative that the American public are made more aware of what is happening in the Middle East.
Deborah Hilal, Manchester, United Kingdom
No, TK, we can’t criticize Hezbollah in Europe. Or Iran will start taking more hostages. We say these folks are freedom fighters. In Europe we criticize Israel. This is safe.
Gary, Toronto, Canada
Those who blame Israel usually don’t find arguments to blame the other side of the conflict or even acknowledge the existence of the armed conflict imposed on this country from day one. This rule works well in this article as well. With the price of oil we have today the ignorance is getting more and more profitable.
Gary, Toronto, Canada
Judging from these comments, one needs more guts to say something positive about Israel in Europe then to say something negative in the US. Mr. Baker is obviously not taking his chances.
Gary, Toronto, Canada
The author ‘heroically’ mentions the Israel, Taiwan and even Lichtenstein lobby, but cowardly afraid mentioned one other lobby, which with access to unlimited oil money is arguably much more powerful than those three all together. The author ‘heroically’ blames evangelicals for Israel’s policies toward its neighbours, but is cowardly afraid to mentioned the neighbours itself who started every single war against Israel. So much for open discussion on Middle East.
Gary, Toronto, Canada
Thank you for this excellent, well thought out commentary. It highlights a number of important issues regarding the relationship between the US, Israel and the Palestinians. I look forward to to seeing more commentaries of this high standard in your paper. Thank you.
Aula, London,
Gerard Baker has made some welcome observations, but despite some similarities regarding the founding of Israel and the USA, he omits an important one: both nations came into being by brutal landgrabs and massive ethnic cleansing. Moreover, Jews were persecuted in Europe, particularly in Eastern Europe, but lived peacefully with their Arab, Indian, Persian and Ethiopian neighbours. The Zionist project, from its inception - which was in the late 19th century - was to have an almost exclusively Jewish state. In Israel it's possible to be critical in newspapers, but anyone daring to oppose Zionism altogether becomes a pariah. These days increasing numbers of Israelis, especially academics, are leaving Israel for good.
Having grown up in the Jewish community in what was Palestine, I know only too well how difficult it is to see through all the histographical lies we were fed with.
Hanna, London, UK
I found the article to be articulate, concise in describing the attitudes towards Palestinian suffering in America, and very courageous in exposing injustice rather than ‘reporting’ the status quo as is.
Journalism at its best; I look forward to more eye-opening commentaries in your esteemed paper.
Basima, London, UK
Just have alook at all the jewish neocons in the bush administration and at the pentagon and at the nsa and the cia and at the list that goes on and on. gibson was right the worlds problems all start with the israelis and your media are too gutless to face it.
Israel takes billions and then trillions off of your taxes and have your kids go and play with all that lovely military gear you guys know so well how to make. Both countrys give with one hand and take with two.The world is quickly starting to loathe both countrys.
It has to be a sacralidge that you guys need to utilise so much of this planet's resorces producing all that military might. And while you both are the most mighty you say you are the most paranoid of someone terrorising you.
It's like Woody Allen trying to fight Avander Holliefield.
And Avander wants the whole world to take his side and whoop that terrorist Woodie'
Democracy Maybe you two countrys should try it. It would do you good. PROMIE
MICK, Byron Bay, Australia
Reading the comments to the well-reasoned article, I have come to the conclusion that while Mr Baker is mosty right in his observations, he is quite wrong to print those observations in mainstream European press and allow comment. Because quite frankly, on the subject of Jews and Americans I am increasingly finding it difficult to discern the difference between mainstream European comment and mainstream White Supremacist comment.
Inna, Sacramento, CA
I commend Gerard Baker for his attempt to introduce balance into the arena of Palestine- Israel, and we need much more from journalists who can see things from both sides.
But I take issue with some of Mr Baker's assertions, where he still is unable to see beyond the horizon. The idea that "Most Americans...feel a special solidarity with Israel" surely has more to do with the fact that the US media has already completed its propaganda job of indoctrinating the population to feel that solidarity at the expense of the Palestinian side.
And to say that if it hadn't been for US intervention in WW2 the holocaust may have succeeded, surely misses the far more shameful point that if it hadn't been for US corporations' support for the fledgling Nazi party in the '30s, Henry Ford for one, who took profits from sales in Germany up to 1944, Hitler would never have got going.
Israel gives The US a military foothold in the Middle East, pure and simple. It's oil, not people that is paramount.
Steve Andrews, Leatherhead, UK
I heard rumor there was a 'pro-Palestinian' commentary in The Times and eagerly leaped over to look- but found nothing at all pro-Palestinian in this protect AIPAC & Israel column. A shame really that so many people think anti-America means pro-Palestinian... All that does is help an Israeli made 'clash of civilizations' become more and more true.
Anne Selden Annab, Mechanicsburg PA, USA
Humm, Now lets see, Jews are Semites, SOO if you are Anti-Jewish, you are an Anti-Semite. Right?
Now, Arabs, (Palestinians) are Semites. SOO if you are Anti-Palestinian, you are an Anti-Semite. Right?
If this is the case, than which Racist Anti-Semite are you, or are we?
Take your pick!
Jim Johnson, Framingham, MA.
One of the unstated reasons that much of the West sides always with Israel, apart from the tie-up in oil in the Middle East and the boon to arms manufacturers that use Israel as a supply and testing-ground, is simple racism. Let's face it, a lot of the Israeli Jews are American, British, French, Russian, German etc In other words, they're white, like "us". Dammit you can't even pronounce those Arab names—and they're not white!!
Only racism can really explain the attitude of the Israeli Jews to the Palestinian Arabs. Only racism can explain how it is thought reasonable to litter the residential areas of Lebanon with hundreds of thousands of cluster bomblets in the last three days of when the conflict was agreed to be over.
Racism, that's the word to remember here. But don't say it too loud or you'll be flooded with responses calling you "anti-Semitic"!!
Tom Older, glasgow, scotland
People have such short memories. Israel did withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip, and was rewarded by the Palestinians voting in a party whose sole purpose is to destroy the state of Israe. Hamas was considered a terrorist organisation by the US, the UK and the EU. Now Britain is urging Israel to negotiate with them.
I am not saying that the Iraeli government's actions are perfect, but people must not forget to look at the big picture. Palestinians have more rights in Israel than in any other country in the region, such as Lebanon and Jordan, but by the same token are used by these countries, and others, as examples of Arabs/Muslims being persecuted by non-Arabs.
L, London,
Ted, it's people like you and YOUR ADVOCATION OF ETHNIC CLEANSING of Palestine who will ensure that the fight goes on. Palestine for ever!
ps. Respect to Peter Marshall, London, uk: not only common sense and sharp analysis but intelligent original thought ... pity it's not "Prime Minister Marshall".
Marco, bhm, uk
The author of this article is 100% correct. The U.S is often reluctuant to criticize Israel for not offending the Jews .... who are paranoid about the antisemitism created by the innaccurate portryal of the Jewish lobby....The Jewish lobby has a certain degree of influence but thats it.. It does not control world events. The reality is that the overwhelming majority of Jews in the U.S and throughout the world want peace and realize that will only happen with a secure and thriving Palestinian state. The U.S does need to prod Israel and should be openingly critical as well as supportive. Israel is a democracy and strategically important to the west...but needs to cease settlements, withdraw from all of Gaza and throw the ball in the Palestinians court. This should hopefully reduce antisemitism and anti Americanism in the world.
Robert Shapiro, Las Vegas, Nevada. USA
Neil, London, UK: I wonder if you have ever set foot in the US or met a Jewish American? So I wonder what "Jewish criticism" you are referring to? Because the vast majority of Jewish Americans I know support Obama. Of course if the UK was as just and as impartial as so many of the claimants here either state outright ot imply stating this fact would not be necessary.
Inna Tysoe, Sacramento/CA,
Mr Baker should be commended for his thoughtful comments on such an explosive topic. Criticism of U.S. policy towards Israel---and by extension, the entire Middle East--is routinely smeared as anti-Semitic no matter how well reasoned and free of overstatement it may be. Unfortunately, Israel-haters on both the far-Right and far-Left swiftly jump in with vitriolic comments of their own, which quickly poisons the discussion and leaves everything just as it was. Many of the comments on display here are as good an example as any of this.
Theron, Austin,
Whatever happened to American democracy and freedom of speech ??
A, Belgium,
For both sides, why not live together under one state and government! Surely in age where everyone is equal under the sun, stars and the Law - it shouldn't be difficult.
Even in South Africa where a small minority forcibly excluded a majority (due to something called skin pigmentation) and even built small homelands (i.e. bantustans) did not work. And it has been proven that living together under one state has worked.
But this can only be considered if both sides give up the notion that the 'other side' must go...
Paul, London, UK
I agree with the author that most Americans side with the Israel but disagree that it has anything to do with "similarities in national consciousness". For the average American, any leanings of favoritism toward Israel stems more from viewing the indiscriminate killing of civilians by so called suicide martyrs. While most American find the resulting military response by the Israeli government to each suicide attack unacceptable, it is easier to undertstand their rationale. It would be refreshing to find a politician who wasn't afraid to speak his mind about really needs be done in to create a lasting peace in the Midddle East.
Alan Baker, Omaha, USA / Nebraska
Wait a minute...It seems it was only a few years ago that Cherie Blair was blasted from one end of the country to the other for saying something sympathetic about the Palestinians. Pots, Kettles and glass houses do come to mind.
a landis, washington dc, usa
Ted Baines' odd interpretations of history are a good example of why, when you try to have a rational discussion about Israel in the U.S., you get nowhere fast. Suddenly, we are thrust into a world of the Bible being a land deed and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from what remains of their homeland as some kind of reasonable "solution" to the conflict. Here in the world of nutcase American psychosis about Israel as a state with certain policies, as distinct from the Jewish people, is why the U.S. has never been, nor ever will be, able to deliver any kind of solution to this problem.
deborah , Wichita , KS
I sympathise with Mr.Priest who says christians are also being oppressed and their land being taken away to build more settlements...yes, i believe that there are narrow minded israeli zealots who are intolerant of christians and muslim palestinians who merely wish to live in peace in Israel and still seizing properties from them to build new settlements.
But the Palestinians made a strategic mistake to side with the Jerusalem Mufti in 1948 in his desire wipe out all jews in Palestine and not accept the u.n mandated 2 state solution.They are still paying the price for their actions.
The Isrealis have now lost the upper moral hand and the U.S must pressurise Isreal that they are still accountable for their actions and not invulnerable and to treat the foreigner in their midst kindly.
TAMIL, Dublin, Ireland
Yah … America’s prejudices are a barrier to Middle East peace; Europe, on the other hand, does not have and never have had any prejudices when it comes to Jews or to Israel … therefore one can relay a balanced and fair approach to Israel in the European foreign policy and Media ...
IbnKhaldun, London,
I am, statistically, one of the few Americans who is opposed to the constant and un-relenting backing of Israel. While many Americans (as mentioned by T. Roth) are losing patience with BOTH sides, there are a few of us who believe that a more extreme approach needs to be taken to resolve the conflict (including, but not limited to: returning all of the illegally-taken lands to the Palestinian families who have lost them, a re-drawing of the boundaries of territories, a tearing down of the wall currently being built, and a push for aid to be given to the Palestinians who, as a general rule, are living in poverty). Can we really blame the Palestinians for siding with whichever political party/military power is most likely to achieve these things? It's not their fault that the UN made an extremely poor decision generations ago.
Unfortunately, I seriously doubt that the hard-lined approaches of the US government and media will be changed any time soon.
K. Mansager, Staatsburg, New York
Leila nadar
true Muslims have lived side by side peacefully with Jews but only if the Jews agreed to be dhimmis or second class citizens. You must have heard of the yellow caps Jews had to wear in Egypt after Islam took over. That was somewhat better than the "Off with your heads approach" of prophet Muhammad.
Ted Baines, New York, USA
We need more such articles in the press!!!! The author has my full support and I hope he does not get intimidated by the torrent of Jewish criticism that is sure to follow. American support for Israel has been unquestionably single minded and too many people outside these two countries feel that it is not justfied!!!!
Neil, London, UK
what is this non-sense about no one suffering more than palestinians...to be honest there are 10 times more indians crammed into smaller slums in bombay living in far miserable conditions...but they dont expect a single penny in free handouts or 'aid' and they dont get any...all they want is to be left alone to make their living.
If the palestinians had the sense to accept the 2 state solution in 1947 instead of following their jerusalem mufti to slaughter all isrealis jews then they would not be in this position of living in slums begging for U,S dollars and Euros.They have only to blame their failed blood thirsty leadership and the Mufti for their predicament.
TAMIL, Dublin, Ireland
Ted's fascism provides for only one out come and that's more hatred nd misery. His iron fist view reflects Israel's policy since the 67 war when everyone in the west, including we europeans watched in wonder, support and a little smugness at the rout of the arab states. But magnanimity seems to be a word missing from Israel's grammar. In a negotiation one needs to understand and strive to achieve what both sides will at least accept, not grab everting at the cost of the other party. No, Israel lost us in europe a long time ago with the daiy reports and pictures of death and misery at their hands.
That is not to say that we in europe do not share a significant share of the responsibility for this 70 year long nightmare, we do. The Jew's suffered the theft of their possessions, lands and lives by nazis and collaborators. And the Arab states have not helped ease Israel's understandable paranoia. With the Saudis taking the helm will the hope of peace be made a reality? Willie France
Wlillie Paciej, st Jorioz, France
Mr. Sebastian from Buenos Aires, i think you are straying into rather dubious territory with this comment: "By they way, why do jews need their own apartheid-style country? Why cant they integrate with the rest of world?" One answer would be that something happened about 65 years ago. Many Jews deplore what is happening to the Palestinians. It is terrible, but your rather dubious contributions to this discussion are also very worrying.
No need to apologise for your ignorance, its understandable.
JimmyMac, London,
Israel/Palestine is, in computer terms, a loop. Every time a report appears on radio or TV they could appropriately provide a backing of the theme from The Thomas Crown Affair. Since neither side wishes to settle the matter in any terms that are on offer, and, one has to admit, the United States finds the disputation convenient in it’s own political terms, the notion of a settlement is merely a necessary background. It is almost thereby more a part of American political culture than it is of the Near or Middle East.
Henry Percy, London, UK
Perhaps the underlying bond between America and Israel is that so many Americans believe that they now share the mantle of god's chosen people with the Jews.
Scratch the surface and you soon reveal the god nonsense. American needs a good dose of atheism.
RFB, Maidenhead, UK
Mr.Baker noted that: "the same Jihadism that wants to destroy Israel , and has murdered thousands of Jews over the decades now targets America and its people". It amazes me how often people forget that Jews and Muslims have lived side by side in harmony for hundreds of years and that it was indeed the peoples of EUROPE who were responsible for death of Millions of Jews. Moreover, who are these "thousands of murdered Jews" over the decades? which decades ? which Jews?, maybe he felt to need for a gross exaggeration at the end of his article to make sure that he is in keeping with the views that he appears to be berating earlier on in his piece. Make up your mind Mr.Baker and in the mean time note that - perpetuating untruths won't "smooth the way to Middle East peace" either.
LEILA NADIR, BRISTOL, uk
"Most Americans, whatever their religious or political views, feel a special solidarity with Israel."
Despite the 24/7 efforts of the US TV/print media to make it so, the above statement is false.
Most Americans outside the fundamentalist Christian sphere feel no particular connection with Israel at all.
Scott, Toronto, Canada
If the Palestinians are "victims," it is of no one and nothing but than their own viciousness and stupidity. In 1948, they were offered the same opportunity as the Jews to create a prosperous future for their children. Instead, they chose the path of terrorism and aggression and have continued doing so unrelentingly ever since. On four subsequent occasions, most recently in Sept. 2000, they again rejected offers of independence and the chance at a peaceful, prosperous in future in favor of war and terrorism. No other people on earth has been offered its freedom so many times and rejected it so many times. These are the facts of the matter and the Palestinians have no one to blame but themselves for their predicament. If they are suffering, they deserve to be.
Stevie J, Paris, France
As usual, European commentators who declare, "Americans think like this..." usually get it wrong, and the peanut gallery of simpleton commentary that follows is always happy to fill in the blanks with their own prejudices, most of them laughable and nauseatingly sanctimonious. My experience is that American sympathy for both sides is starting to dry up.
T. Roth, Danbury, CT, USA
Sebastian,
It is very revealing that between the Pheonicians and Philistines and the Romans you do not mention the Jews and Samaritans.
Of course, the agenda behind this glaring ommision answers your earlier question of why the Jews need their own country.
Steve, Montreal, Canada
We all believe in God and fair society. God punishes the people one form or other for their misdoings. Palestinians suffering can be attributed to the killing of innocent Jews by Muslims in South Arabia. But the same token suffering of present day Palestinians should not lead to the sufferings of our future generations. We need a fair solution to Palestinian problems. For which America has to be a honest peace broker. .All democrats and republican leaders can not antagonise Jews. Hence America can never be a peace broker. Only European countries can solve Middle East problem and possibly the problem in Iraq. All American Presidents have been doing what the present President Bush is doing, Try to solve Middle East problem during their last two years of office.
Viswanath, Herts, UK
The land that Muhammad stole from the Jews was land that the Jews had control of : plantations etc. Jews were half the population before Muhammad started massacring them. I agree.Once the Muslims return half of Arabia to the Jews we can start talking about the land that Indians owned in the Americas. Lastly we can talk about returning any land that jews stole from the Muslims and vice versa. Of course this would need address the lands Jews occupied in Egypt and other Muhammadan countries before the Muslims threw them out.
Ted Baines, New York, USA
I would suggest that the jewish lobby is a little stronger than Mr Baker suggests. Sharon was as guilty of human rights abuses as Milosevic but the West took no action becuase he was Israeli. Also support of the illegal Israeli occupation must have been a motivating factor for Al Queda and 9/11.
In addition the main proposers of the Iraq invasion were the jewish noecons such as Richard Perle and his buddies. If we had dealt with Israel in the same way as we dealt with Serbia, established a Palestinian state several years ago and had not invaded Iraq, think what a safer place the world might be now.
peter marshall, london, uk
'Nobody is suffering more than the Palestinian people'? I guess in Darfur or Chechnya it won't go down as 'mild and neutral an observation'.
'It is impossible for politicians to express sympathy for Palestinians'? Does Jimmy Carter know that? Bill Clinton? And Dr Rice expressed 'sympathy for Palestinians' just this week. I guess, they are all breaking 'the rules' Gerard Baker has set for US politicians
sheni, Tbilisi, Georgia
How about giving aborigine indians their land back too? Can't see our 'freedom loving' american friends doing that.
Unfortuantely our american friends tend to see things only in 2 dimensions - good and evil, black and white, them and us. And they're not alone as plenty of arabs think along the same lines. That must change and the American people need to wake up to the fact that the world is larger than America and Israel. As for historical matters, lest we forget that the Jewish claim to Palestine is founded on a god given right to a jewish homeland. Whilst theologans can debate to their hearts content as to this god-given right, there is a far more important god-given right - the right to live; Jews, Christians muslims alike. That right extends to everyone not just those who bank roll the "democratic" USA.
simon, London,
Mr. Baker is being disingenious. A blind man could discern that Israel has entirely co-opted the American political system,
Mike Miller, HSNP, AR, USA
Mr Baines,
Please check your history. Palestine was not "always Jewish". It was founded by the Pheonicians (later Philistines) and then conquered by the Romans who named the area Palestina Caesaria.
No need to aplogize for the mistake, its understandable.
Sebastian, Buenos Aires, Argentina
Mr Baines, how about the american government return all of North America stolen from the American indians? By they way, why do jews need their own apartheid-style country? Why cant they integrate with the rest of world?
Sebastian, Buenos Aires, Argentina
Ted doesn't speak for all Americans, not by a long shot. There's a LOT of sympathy here for the Palestinians and a LOT of frustration with American policy AND Israeli policy, right-wing talking pinheads notwithstanding. The American media have completely skewed the discussion in Israel's favor, and Israeli lobbyists have gained too much influence in American politics.
A lot of us are very tired of the whole thing. We want peace, not more belligerence, name calling, finger pointing, posturing, lying, and all the other regular political ploys. Where is a real statesman when we need one?
Personally, my heart goes out to the Palestinian people and I pray they have their state and the chance to live in peace. And I hope Obama wins the nomination so I can vote for him.
Ralph Huntington, New York, USA
Sirs,
Mr Baines of NY is apparently suffers from paranoid delusion by generalizing that all Palestinians want to kill Jews and (North) Americans. Some do, however, and this probably due to the fact that Zionists (fascists) and their main bankroller (the US government through aid) have stolen their land; land for which they held deed and title to.
Another fact that Mr. Baine needs to keep in mind is that he should not equate Palestinians to Muslims. there is a significant portion of Christian population in the area called Palestine, whom have also had their land snatched.
Lastly, I must let everyone know that today God has told me through scripture that I and my tribes have a divine right to a homeland in a place called Manhattan. Therefore, we will forcedly relocate all the current inhabitants to Queens and the Bronx, build a wall around them, siphen off their freshwater supplies and blockade their harbours. So that I and I alone can enjoy what God has willed me :)
Sebastian, Buenos Aires, Argentina
Of course it's sad that he can't do so without political attack. That's the way it is, unfortunately. Norman Finkelstein is jewish but he spoke many many truths about Israel and its misuse and abuse of the Holocaust, as well as the term anti-Semitism. Consequently and unsuprisingly, his climb up the career ladder was stunted. He's achieved many great things and has a great job, however, but he could have done so much more.
This whole Israel-Palestine problem won't go away until the UK and USA acknowledge that Israel is an occupyer. At present, and ever since 1948, Israel has been occupying Palestine. I can't believe the UK and USA just gave Palestine to Israel, in compensation for the Holocaust. No one gave a damn about the Palestinians.
Dima, London,
Andy
As we speak there is an offer on the table from the Arab league, exchanging Israel's recognition by all Arab states, in return for the restitution of the 1967 borders. So much for the idea that they cannot lose face.
Gavin, Sussex, UK
Israel including Gaza and the West bank have always been Jewish lands. If you wish to talk seriously about the return of lands then let us begin by returning half of Saudi Arabia to the Jews. Prophet Muhammad stole Jewish land after exterminating thousands of Jewish males.
Ted Baines, New York, USA
There is little new in this. Mayor Guiliani of New York deliberately ignored and slighted Nobel prize-winner Arafat to gain a few cheap points with supporters of Israel's excesses.
Hillary Clinton, under pressure, completely reversed her fair-minded statements on Palestine.
Arafat said 'I accept you.' Look where it got him. A menaced prisoner.
John Chuckman, Toronto, Canada
Abdul, who should Israel give the occupied land back to? it was taken from Jordan, not "the Palestinians" and Jordan doesn't want to have to deal with the "palestinian" people as none of the arab countries ever have in the past.
Also, what is a govermenant?
Sam, London,
Solution:
Palestinian Authority say the following
"we accept the State of Israel"
problem solved, free money arrives from rest of world, poverty decreases, living standards increase, etc etc -unfortunately they (as do the majority of the Arab League) cannot lose face and do this and the problem. This is the crux of the problem. To accept that the combined armies of Jordan, Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon and Syria got beat by a rag-tag bunch of jews and refugees in 1948 is just to much for them to ever forget
Andy, london,
I am a staunch supporter of Israel and, frankly, the western (mostly UK and European Union) media coverage of the mid-east situation can almost border on the level of the ancient "blood libels". However, I have no problems in hearing or reading valid, factually correct criticism of Israel. No state is beyond criticism, but reading some of the articles in journals such as The Guardian or The Independent makes one believe that some journalists were trained at Der Sturmer!
Neil, Liverpool, UK
The Arab nations offered a peace deal in 2002, based on the 1967 borders, and renewed it just now. But Israel already rejected it..
How can negotiations ever be succesful with a country that claims it has the right to occupy land on which their very far ancestors once lived? On this basis you could restart all wars, because very many people have ancestors who once lived in a different region.
The USA should push Israel to withdraw to the 1967 borders, and make peace with te Arab world. But Bush & co. and the Israel lobby of course will torpedo any attempt to accomplish that.
bill, Bristol , UK
Is Mr. Baker somehow persuaded that politics in the US is about fairness? After all his years living in that pit of partisan rancour otherwise known as Washington, DC I find this innocence fairly amazing.
The fact is that an american politician can say sympatheticc things about Palestinians; Obama Barack proved that by doing so. The fact that he could not do so without political attack is a little sad. It's also symptomatic at this time in the political cycle. Barack's myrmidon's are doing the same thing to Mrs. Clinton, and the attacks the Barack and Clinton camps are exchanging are nothing as compared to the fury of the assaults upon President Bush for having the temerity to win the 2000 election.
Don S, London,
Palestine is our country you know that Mr. Ted Baines
Alain Najjar, Tunis, Tunisia
@henry laycock,
"the present American mentality is quite incapable of rational thought on the topic of Israel and the Palestinians."
I absolutely agree. However, America is the most powerful stakeholder in international politics (where there is no Russian commitment). Instead of procrastinating, the UK should come up with a reasoned exposition of principles for Israeli withdrawal and Palestinian governance and statehood. Or is that antisemitic or anti-American?
Jens S, Oslo, Norway
Over 2000 years Judea (Israel) evolved from being a Jewish State, whose population over a period of time became christian, only to covert to become a premominantly muslim population / region at the time of partition in 1947. I would suggest that time and nature will correct human imposed anomalies as it will and is doing throughout the world (ie North/South Korea, North/South Vietnam, North/South Ireland, East/West Germany etc.)
Kevin Sulivan, London, UK
Oh my word - aliens have landed and replaced the Gerard Baker whose anti-BBC diatribe was printed a couple of weeks ago with a clone that can actually speak some sense.
Adnan, Reading,
Having spent some time in American academe I can report they they are dominated by exactly the same Western-self-loathing anti-zionist (read anti-semite) activists as any in Europe.
And has the writer actually heard of Jimi Carter who has written a highly critical book about the Israelis.
Let me venture an alternate idea. When was the last time you read in the UK media an article asking why Hezbollah needed to place it's rocket launchers next to civilians?
TK, Edinburgh,
To Ted,
You said 'I do not see any solution other than to resettle every Muslim from Gaza, the West Bank and even from Israel to Muslim countries.'
Surely it would be more sensible if all jews were resettled in the US.
Coolbreeze, London, UK
So muslims the world over are jealous of our 'freedoms'?
Yet the 'world's greatest democracy' and the 'land of the free' is incapable of an open debate on what is, without a doubt, the single most important issue in world politics.
Zac, Sheffield, UK
People in the US need to appreciate that Palestinian Christians have suffered as much by the creation of Israel as Palestinian Muslims. Christians are under occupation or in exile. They are Catholics, Protestands and Orthodox Christians. Logic would suggest that American Christians sympathise with their long suffering fellow Christians in the Holy Land.
Gabriel Priest, London, UK
To Ted: How can you say the Palestinian have been given ample chances to end their misery? When has Isreal offered to get out of the occupied land? If you bother to look into things a bit deeper, you will realise every aspect of the Palestinian lives are controlled by the Isreal. It's all good saying that the Palestinian should re-settle but why can't the Israelis get out of the occupied land and settle back into Israel. If you analyse the situation, the Israeli govermenant continuosly builds new housing within the occupied land. It's like a parasite/virus growing and devouring away the land until nothing is left.
Abdul, London, UK
What does Mt Baker mean that the same jihadism targetting America is responsible for the deaths of thousands of Jews? Most Western supporters of the GWOT insist the jihad has nothing to do with the Palestinian-Israeli conflict and is about hating Western freedoms.
Ted Baines: What evidence do you have that Palestinians will want to kill Americans? They have for the past 50 years since their land was taken from them by force, been attacking Israel, and only Israel.
Raashid, London, UK
As much as it is not an acceptable part of 'adult debate' to ignore real Palestinian suffering so it is equally unacceptabe to demonise everything that Israel does. One is sometimes left with the impression that to many the real problem is not that Israel is being difficult, rather Israel's being is difficult.
Lawrence Littlestone, London, UK
European countries, including the United Kingdom, whatever the political discourse is, dislike Israel. Jews were persecuted for over a 1000 years in Europe, and there is no reason to believe that things have changed. At the U.N. all, without a single exception and again including the United Kingdom, European countries vote all the resolutions against Israel. The U.S. values and likes Israel, and is rightly concerned because the U.S. knows that Israel cannot count on Europe.
Elisabeth, Coventry,
yes, Ted, "let's resettle every"... erm, hang on a moment, isn't this how WWII started? Learn from history!
Marco, bhm, uk
the comments here from our American friends rather tend to confirm the gist of this article, that the present American mentality is quite incapable of rational thought on the topic of Israel and the Palestinians.
henry laycock, kingston, canada
The Palestinian Muslims have been given ample chances to end their misery. But the billions in aid given to them were stolen by the PLO. They refused to pursue peace with Israel and started intifada II. the rest is history. I do not see any solution other than to resettle every Muslim from Gaza, the West Bank and even from Israel to Muslim countries. I have personally talked to Palestinians and they only thing they wish upon the Jews is death. Next it will be us they will want to kill.
Ted Baines, New York, USA
The "gaffe "was the thought that no one is suffering more than the Palestinian people. There are two points to make, one it just isn't true on its face. since there is a Darfur or a Zimbwabe, and two did their Arab brothers not bring it ion themselves by violence against Israel for nearly 50 years.?
It is interesting how easily the press forgets the history of the conflict including attempts to destroy Israel, the three Noes, the boycotts,the ceasless and somewhat mindless UN resolutions the antiJewish education and a general lack of understanding of the issues by the Arab street
Noel, New york, USA
If the Palestinians and more specifically the ruling party Hamas was to accept Israel's right to exist and stop preaching hatred, the United States and more importantly a majority of Israelis would be in favor of negotiating a final deal. But this hasn't happened and probably won't. How can you negotiate with someone who calls for your destruction?
mb, cleveland, ohio
Indeed political debates should be frank. US campaigns can be pathetically childish. On the other hand, a pro-Israel stance is a welcome antidote to, for instance, the UN Human Rights Watch which relentlessly condemns Israel for what are peccadillos compared to genocide in Darfur, systematic Chinese annihilation of Tibet, Pakistani massacres of Christians, Muslim oppression of women, including 'honour' killings.
And finally! Palestinian poverty is a sad reality. But where are Arafat's $4.5 billion [as 'revealed' by Al Jazeera after his death??]
jacqueline joseph, london, uk
A well argued piece..Israel at present is led by a weak Prime Minister who led them on a massive over reaction war in Lebanon that totally failed its stated objective. He is now a lame duck.
I see real signs of a desire for compromise from the Palestinian side (but still the Hamas problem remains).
The only country Israel take any notice of is the US (something to do with money aid and arms I would believe ).
What is needed now is a strong open balanced discussion of the issues with the US acting as a fair broker .Rice is doing a bit but I feel somehow that it is all photo opportunities and no substance. George is out of his depth and Bagdad fixated.
...and the rest of the US leaders ..well your article sums it up........narrow and one-sided !
A sad situation ..it is truly tragic that the two men strong enough and capable of dragging Israel to compromise and true peace were removed..one assassinated and the other incapacitated by a stroke.
neil Ferguson, melbourne, vic
Americans have trouble relating to people who strap bombs to themselves and blow up in night clubs and pizzerias.
David, Gainesville, FL