Surveying the wreckage of another family and its surrounding community, Assistant Chief Constable Garry Shewan, of the Cheshire Constabulary, had no doubt of the way ahead: “I think society is beginning to see the events of today, and the murder of Mr Newlove, as a tipping point where we all have to take action against antisocial behaviour,” he said, sagely.
Not all, Garry. You. Specifically you. You, Garry Shewan, and the officers under your command, have to take action against antisocial behaviour because that is your job. We're done. We're finished. They've got us licked. Garry Newlove tried to take action against antisocial behaviour and he was kicked to death outside his home, as his children watched.
And do you know why? Because it is absolutely impossible for a rational, civilised human being to confront the perpetrators of such a crime, as there is nothing in the mind of the average individual that allows him to challenge such wickedness and violent relish on equal terms. That is why we need law enforcers, with experience and back-up and a mandate to deal with any incident in the manner they see fit. When Mr Newlove was lying on the floor having his brain toed into grisly submission, his horrified family was not looking for society to come around the corner and save him; they were looking for coppers.
Considering that the little gang of human effluence that gathered nightly outside Mr Newlove's house was prepared to commit murder if challenged, then to match the intensity of that blood lust, the 47-year-old sales manager would have had to leave his house armed with a semi-automatic weapon. There were three of them, so he could not have taken them on in a fight or a reasoned discussion, as his death proved. He had previously explored the correct process of involving the police and the local council, but to no effect. Violence and vandalism were endemic in the Station Road North area of Fearnhead in Warrington, to the extent that the community felt under siege. In the ten days before Mr Newlove was murdered, seven local householders were attacked, four on the night that he died.
Just about everything that has passed the lips of the police subsequently has been a mealy-mouthed abdication of responsibility: “Unless we challenge the drinking culture of today,” said Mr Shewan, “this is a tragedy that can happen again and again. We have to send a very strong message that the availability of cheap, strong alcohol is not acceptable.” With this statement, the Assistant Chief Constable involves the Cheshire police in something over which it has no jurisdiction - off-licence sales in the Warrington area - while refusing to admit control over an issue that is entirely its concern - crime committed by known criminals on its watch.
If Cheshire police had put an officer, or two, on duty in Station Road North, just hanging about, breaking up the gangs, identifying troublemakers and dealing with problems as they occurred, Mr Newlove would still be alive. The access to cheap hooch, the absence of parental control, the failings of modern society are all outweighed by that simple fact. Another decent guy is dead because the police found better things to do than protect a vulnerable section of the community.
Mr Newlove had no chance because confronted by such base, compassionless, evil little men, nobody has. In a street fight, while Joe Average is still trying to compute the rules of engagement, whether violence is justified and what the ramifications could be, while he is still trying to overcome feelings of fear and confusion, and adapt to a world in which all the conventions and tenderness of humanity have been abandoned, those who are well versed in violence are stamping on his head until it cracks.
It must be presumed that police officers, although no less decent, are familiar with the territory and better prepared to tackle it. They have the training and the authority of law. Mr Shewan's belief that society will heal itself unaided by the police, therefore, is at best optimistic, and at worst, self-serving and negligent.
The police have lost sight of what matters. On the website of Cheshire police there is a policing plan leaflet headed, “Keeping it local to deliver the service you want”, and beneath it is a picture of grinning bobby miming with an acoustic guitar in a record shop as amused staff look on. This is the service we want, apparently. Not coppers; singers:
“And here he is, all the way from the underpass Fearnhead, please give a warm Warrington welcome to Assistant Chief Constable Garry Shewan. Good to see you, Garry, and what will you be playing tonight?”
“Well, Jim, I'd like to do a medley of the classics, starting with that old duet, Don't Go Breaking Your Skull, then the Tony Bennett standard I Left My Teeth In San Francisco and finishing with what I'd like to think has become my signature tune, If I Had a Hammer.”
On the website, Inspector Stuart Woodcock, of Warrington South, explains: “The focus these days is more localised with the aim of understanding what the problems are in each neighbourhood, and getting to know the residents as well as the local criminals.” Presumably, given his record, Cheshire police “knew” gang leader Adam Swellings, but did not care enough to make sure he had not returned to his old haunts, to link up with his murdering rabble of toe-rags. Everything that is wrong with modern policing is contained in that one sentence, in which the notions of knowing residents and local criminals are equated. Maybe the inspector could organise a meet-and-greet, to get the communities together. Maybe the singing copper could come along and give everybody a tune.
Or maybe Cheshire police could go back to doing the job, which does not involve knowing murderers but nicking, bullying and frightening them out of their wits. There is a tipping point, all right, but not where the Assistant Chief Constable thinks. If contributory negligence were more than a common law defence, Cheshire police would be beside Mr Newlove's killers in the dock.
A 'gardener' effectively stole our money and didn't give us our house key back after agreeing to do some work, being paid and then not turning up. It's taken 3 months of small claims and badgering, but the Police are going to arrest him today for not returning the key. On the other side of my Police experiences, I hit a noisy youth in the head with an egg from my balcony once, at 3am in the morning and him and his friends attacked the building. I called the Police, who said my flat didn't exist (new build) and hung up on me. Both incidents were in central London. I''m sure there are incidents which have been avoided because the Police were there at the right time too, though it's always awful to hear about such tragic events. Shewan sounds a bit liver-lillied, but what are the crime figures like in his constituency? I willfully avoid getting too excited about Press headlines on crime, just as I avoid reading too much into Paris Hillbillyton's antics.
SID, London,
I served for over 30 years as a police officer and it saddens me to see the way we have gone. 25 years ago on night duty in the town centre there were at least 6 foot officers plus 8 single maned cars and one double crewed, this is a town of 120,000.
Friday and Saturday aslo had a double crew van until the clubs turned out. Last time i looked there were two cars and a special on foot. Officers still serving have come to me and said that there is no supervision as the sergeants have no teeth due to human rights etc. The lazy officers leave the jobs to the hard workers. Because the sergeants anr too well aware that to take a hard like could result in a complaint of bullying they leave well alone. We used to respond to all calls working on the basis that 95% of the public only deal with the police once or twice in their lifetime and so need help when they ask.
Yobs were met headon and they soon learnt that if they did not behave they they were in trouble. We need an overall from withi
paul, ipswich, england
An article which seems to articulate my feelings on the matter much beter than I would myself.
"Members of the community" (Joe Public a.k.a. You or Me) are too frightened to intervene to resolve local anti-social behaviour and the case of Mr. Newlove proves that they are correct to remain indside and do nothing. Death is not an acceptable price to pay for the avoidance of nuisance behaviour, rudeness and thuggery.
That a serving Police officer might suggest that such incidents might happen "over and over again " unless someone takes action and yet fails to understand that it is he who is being paid to take that action is a terrible indictment of the politicised modern service.
Could I withhold that part of my considerable Council Tax which goes to Police? The Police might then refuse to respond to my calls, presumably failing to understand that my calls to date have not been "serious" enough to produce any response. I don't appear to have anything to lose, except money.
Bob, Reading,
Basically any Government body, from the Immigration Service to the Police blame everything and everyone else but themselves when incidents like Gary Newlove occur! Part of being responsible is taking responsibilty! If stopping these youth gangs means enpowering the public to assist then let's do it! I'm not suggesting vigilantes, but giving the public the right to defend themselves, their families and yes, God forbid, their property!
Shane Lancaster, Preston, UK
A textbook example of why we in Britain should have elected District Attorneys who would direct the Police as to their activities - thus responding to actual public concerns, If the DA fails then he or she is out of a job. Concentrates the mind wonderfully.
So why don't we have elected District Attorneys the ? Too many vested interests in the present system I suspect and an unwillingness to be publicly accountable. When did you last hear of a Chief Constable being sacked - not "retired early" but summarily fired ?
Dennis, Wolverhampton, UK
Politicians and police have allowed the streets - and our homes - to become unsafe by their determined efforts to disarm the law-abiding and to prevent any effective means of self-defence.
"Fire Brigade" style policing - which is what we now have essentially - can work, but only if the law-abiding classes can supplement the efforts of the police effectively when trouble breaks out.
Lewsi Thomas, High Wycombe, Bucks UK
Excellent article and very true. I notice the only dissenting postings are from Inspector Gadget and Dan Collins (his publisher)
John , Chelmsford, Essex
This same police force spent three months planning for the Crewe v Leeds match and posted a very self congratulatory note on their website stating that there were no offences for public order and just one for theft.
Of course we'll never know whether the behaviour of fans was in spite of or because of the massive amount of planning put into the game but perhaps if this police force put the same amount of effort into ensuring bail conditions aren't breached then Mr Newlove may be alive today.
Amanda Jacks, London, UK
I have been a Police officer for 20 yraes. In that time the majority of senior management posts have been filled by men and women whos main priority is their carreers. The spin, obsession with meaningless statistics and all important diversity issues which dominate new labour have been taken up by these people leading to the ludicrous statements made by this buffoon. Twaddle about partnership and problem solving is all these people are capable of talking about.
However, the officers responsible for the area, did arrest, interview, collect evidence and charg this man. Knowing he would take no notice of any bail conditions and that he was a dangerous thug, they put him before the next available magistrates court asking he be remanded in custody. The magistrates in their wisdom ignored the advice and bailed him. Officers on the ground do the same job they have always done, the difference today is after each task or interaction with the public they have to fill in a form before moving on
Paul, England, UK
You must remember that Senior Police Officers have weeks, even months, attending courses learning to address the press/public so "sagely".
An excellent article by Martin Samuel.
roy stevens, colchester, essex
The annoying thing is that the police can happily use 2 police officers manning a speed camera with catching motorists doing 35mph on a road that was 40mph the previous month . (cash generator for Gordon Brown) yet they can't be bothered doing proper policing showing a presence on our streets and dealing with these thugs. Britain has become feral, our streets aren't safe, yet if you retaliate to this thugs it will be you who ends up in court.
David, Burnley, Lancashire
I have been emailed your article in Australia and whilst I agree fully with the sentiments, the problem is the restrictions placed upon modern policing by the vocal civil rights minority. Until we get back to the stage where the Police are allowed and encouraged to do as you suggest and not suspended or charged then nothing will change. The silent majority needs to stand up and be counted. I served for 15 yrs in the Met and was stabbed 3 times, 2 crushed vertebrae and a broken leg were just some of the injuries I received in that time. Most coppers are willing to risk their lives and bodily injury provided they get the full support of the law and their Force especially the Chief Constables!
Geoff, Brisbane, Australia
I noticed that of all the respondents to this article ----only A Yank--- actually DID SOMETHING! GOOD JOB GC Stoppel !!You Brits are all wasting your breath. That's why I don't live in the Uk anymore.The UK Courts put the VICTIMS in jail for defending themselves and let the Buggers that COMMIT CRIMES go. Coppers want us to Take Back the Streets---then are scared the Ruffians will sue THEM! Get some Bollocks, as Gordon Ramsey says! Did you see where the lady got into trouble for STOPPING the yobs tearing up the Memorial Garden? She'll be worse off the Neds that done it!
retiredscot, Illinois, USA
Tremendous piece highlighting a problem we all seem to share. Police leadership which has become politicised and dedicated to spin. Sloganeering and motherhood statements instead of putting police where problems are known to exist.
Tolerance of minor street crime emboldens those responsible with the message of weakness and or indifference on the part of police. Escalation of criminal behaviour becomes inevitable.
Police rarely need more power - they have to exercise power they already have and confront criminals. PR statements won't do it.
S Bourke, Sydney, Australia
Perfectly put. I was the victim of a crime last year. I told the police who had committed it. They asked me, did I have any proof? I said no, except my word as witness. I asked if they would question him. They said, "unless you can find proof, there's nothing we can do"...
Huh? What was that Mr. policeman? You want ME to get proof for YOU, before you'll even go and question a SUSPECT?
Claire, Hemel, UK
I agree with the article and all the comments below, especially that from Leonard C of Australia re the emasculation of the police by those who have no idea what it is like for law abiding people living on rough estates.
The priority must be to protect the majority. This starts with dealing with the so called "minor offences" of nuissance and anti-social behaviour. I don't understand why it is that repeat offenders are out on the streets causing more crime.
Think about it : why on earth is it that sentences are handed out in court? How can a court possibly know how long someone needs to be in prison in order to ensure they won't re-offend. Criminals should only be let out when the authorities are satisfied that they won't re-offend. If that is never, then so be it.
Empower the police. Lock up the "human effluence". Then invest in deprived areas to instil hope, a healthy level of fear, and a sense of responsibility in the youth.
The Times - pls- lead the way!
Dan, London, UK
You think it is bad now? Just wait until the current generation of "feral" children strart breeding and producing their own offspring.
James McLeish, London, UK
The saddest thing is, as an earlier contributor wrote, the main target of modern policeing is the law-abiding majority.
jim, lincoln, uk
England as a country is now just rabble.
Realistically it is far too late to fight back.
We have lost.
Carl, Leeds, England
A Pensioner recently shouted at a group of youths who were throwing bricks at ducks. Guess what, he was arrested and accused of attacking them (yes well a 73year old would attack a group of teenagers wouldn't he). Later the Chief Constable offered his apologies. Well what does this tell you.
GILLIAN HUTCHINSON, LYMM, CHESHIRE
Correct in every detail.
Will the police and government take notice?
Do they ever?
cb, london, uk
Right to Carry Laws have worked very well in the USA. All of your gun bans have done nothing but embolden criminals.
Doug Deavers, Naples, Florida
Absolutely right.
Alex, Torquay, UK
Good job nobody had a gun, or someone might have got hurt.
James, Hatfield, England
Rather sadly, it doesn't look as if things will improve very much as long as government policy is to create more and more laws to control the largely law-abiding whilst allowing those outside of the law to run free and unchecked. The police need to be told to stop acting as revenue collectors and to move against this country's outlaw gangs instead.
Martin, Stratford, Worcestershire
Surely the root of the problem lies with the secular liberal establishment which has controlled the media and secular state education for nigh on half a century and relentlessly set out to destroy any respect for, or fear of, authority.
James, London, England
'BE SAFE, FEEL SAFE'.
Surely the most inappropriate strapline of any organisation or company in history.
I only hope Garry Shewan that for the rest of your life you see these words every time you close your eyes.
Chris Parsons OBE, Kouklia, Cyprus
Unfortunately, as with global warming, there is a lot of talk and very little action. We all know what should be done but is it being done?
Nick, London,
I recently called my local police station to report a neighbours burglar alarm going off. I was told the police 'don't deal with those anymore'.
Exactly what do the police deal with these days?
James Smith, London,
This is utter rubbish. In my County, the police answer 1300 calls a day. The deal with 120 prisoners and are constantly under a barrage of road accidents, domestics, assaults, child protection issues, etc etc etc to expect to have a cop on every street where society has allowed feral youths to breed, is ludicrous. Stop abdicating your responsibility as a member of society; they are your kids, not the police's.
Inspector Gadget, Ruraltown, Ruralshire
Unless the powers that be start to wake up and allow the Police to arm and defend themselves -thereby protecting the community,I fear that the UK is headed towards the babrbaric crime ridden state which is South Africa today.
God help you all.
CC, JHB, South Africa
When are we going to have a Royal Commission on policing - or rather the total lack of it?
ACPO equals abbrogation.
Bramshill equals Blame everyone else - see the last post.
We read about about one policing fiasco after another; it is time for a change. Scrap psychobabble management; bring back leadership, coppers who are prepared to get stuck in and police vans, cells & court houses full yobs who won't move on when they are told.
Gavin Robertson, Fyfield, Essex
Change the law and give the Police more powers - great! Then we'll be able to read more rubbish in the press on how the Police are harrasing teenagers.
alan Stewart, Stockport,
On the basis of his reported remarks, Assistant Chief Constable Garry Shewan should resign. The police have a job they're supposed to to do, and they're not doing it. I have been on the receiving end of "antisocial" and criminal behaviour from youths in south London & the police display little interest. I'm pushing 60 & haven't been in a fight since I was 14 (& that was reluctantly). You just put up with it. The police cannot just delegate responsibility to the ordinary citizen in these matters. These kids are, as Martin Samuels points out, not open to civilised discussion. Where do we go from here?
John B, London, UK
I am a serving officer and there is nothing i would like to do more than your sentence below....
"Or maybe Cheshire police could go back to doing the job, which does not involve knowing murderers but nicking, bullying and frightening them out of their wits."
Unfortunately the red tape, ridiculous mountains of paperwork, complaints and possible criminal charges that come with these complaints make it exceptionally hard to do!
The problem is not with the Police itself but the overseeing government....give us the freedom to work the way we all want to!
Karl, Essex,
Someone up above said there will soon be vigilante groups. See the Immigrant Representation Party's platform for just that!
john problem, winchester, uk
How I heartily agree with what Martin Samuel writes and what a pity no other media source has taken up his views for wider publication. I believe he speaks for most of us 'silent majority' who are barricaded into our homes during the hours of darkness when the lawless rabble take over the streets.
andrea solomon, Manchester, UK
A Remington 12 gauge pump action in each household?
terry, roxbury, nj/usa
I couldn't agree more with every word you have said Martin the Police of today are more concerned with issuing tickets to motorists than anything else, try ringing them for a disturbance and 90% of the time they either don't show up or show up too late to catch the culprits, whatever happened to the days when a copper seeing a group of youngsters hanging around told them to move on, they hang around in groups of 10/15 today and nobody challenges them, when I was a youth if three of you were standing around you were told to move on but then we had respect for the uniform not surprisingly nobody has anymore.
Bob, London, England
I served thirty years as a front line officer, retiring ten years ago.I took intense pride in my job, my uniform, my professionalism, my ability to control the street and my unrelenting pursuit of the bad guys. I look back on my working life with a sense of a job well done. I did my duty.
Now, I am ashamed of what I see and no longer describe myself as a former officer.
I live where I worked and have never seen an officer on patrol since I left.
The ones I do see are diminutive, scruffy, and without any presence.
The uniform is shapeless and outdated. I have to avert my eyes.
It's a generation thing. I saw it all coming. Senior Officers wanting to be right-on businessmen new recruits being poisoned with political correctness. In the end the ethos seemed to be that we mustn't upset anybody or hurt their feelings.
I could go on, getting it all off my chest. It was a good article and every senior officer should be made to read it.
No more claptrap and pathetic excuses.
John, Nottingham, England
It never ceases to amaze me that the brave people who stood up to the Bavarian Corporal have become cowards in the face of some drunk children. Get out the garden rakes and shovels, the pitchforks, or use a good right upper cut or kick where it counts and purge and remove that odious spot from your nation.
Two years ago on holiday 3 of these vermin jumped me outside of St Martins in London. It wasn't a fair fight - only 3 of them, but they were determined to have their sport. I warned them to leave, but they chose to play. In less than a minute 2 were writhing on the sidewalk, the other one fled. My tool of choice - a good stout Burberry umbrella.
Just quit coddling this pond scum. A few broken noses or cracked skulls is no great loss. You wouldn't have given in to the Hun in 1940, so why put up with your own 'barnyard organic fertilizer' sub-humans today?
Dangerous? Perhaps. But as dear old Winston said, "You can at least take one with you."
GC Stoppel
G C Stoppel, Saugatuck, Michigan 49453
The police have become an advisory service. They'll let us know how to cope when we become victims of crime, but as to actually doing anything to prevent it - no chance. Politically correct to the point of being pointless. I think Samuel makes a fair point that if the police fail in their duty 'TO PROTECT AND SERVE' (that's a joke), then they should be accountable. But then of course, they'll claim they are under too much stress and retire early on fully pay. Ever likely nobody respects them anymore, they're so ineffectual.
Barbara, Bath, UK
An excellent summation of the failure of British policing.
My condolences to the Newlove family.
r spriggs, chesterfield,
Nonsense, Mr.Samuel. The police have much more important things to do. Without them, who there be to ensure that dangerous plastic swords are kept under lock and key at the local panto? http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3207010.ece
Sarah , Dartmouth, Canada
I had not seen any comments and views of the parent of murderous youth. It is the responsibility of the parents to bring up their offspring properly. Then only society, government and police come. Unless the parents takes responsibility the heinous crime can not the stopped.
Appan, Hounslow, London
The problems which led to the police effectively having to fight with both hands tied behind their backs began when the Police and Criminal evidence act of 1984 came into force, coupled with the introduction of the Crown Prosecution Service. If my memory serves me well, this was an era of Conservative government.....
Edward Johns, Lannion, France
The time is fast approaching when local vigilante groups will be necessary to do real policing; leaving the constabulary to their political correctness absurdities . I'm already drafting the recruiting campaign and training manual.
F Kimbal Johnson, Louth,Lincs, UK
Well said. If you can use your platform to shame one politician, one senior police officer into speaking up you'll have performed a public service
Mike, Maidstone,
One of the best articles I`ve seen in this paper.Our police forces should take a leaf out of Guiliani`s New York approach of the `80`s.I suspect the actual crime figures are signicantly higher than the stats show because a large number of people can`t be bothered to report a crime because the know the response or lack of.I`m one of them.
j harris, surrey,
I live not a mile from the road where Mr Newlove was murdered. The Police presence is nil. I served in GMP during the 70’s and 80’s and my Officers and I dealt with the hooligan element with strong but fair policing and those intent on causing trouble were left in no doubt as to who ruled the streets.
There was then, as there is now, ample legislation to deal with these hooligans. What is lacking is the will to carry out the task. Constables used to swear an oath to ‘protect life and property and prevent and detect crime’. It clearly set out the priorities in which he/she was expected to execute his/her duties. Sadly, these days it seems that the primary function is to take the soft target of the motorist, or the poor victim of crime who has the temerity to fight back in protection of his family and property.
Cheshire Constabulary’s website bears the legend ‘Be Safe, Feel Safe.’ This is certainly not possible at the moment and I suspect things will get far worse before they improve.
Ian Gossop, Padgate, Warrington, England
The police are today's highwaymen and bandits. They only accost road users from those noisesome police cars and demand their money and their livelihood. No interest in anything else. The whole force needs to be closed down, the fleet of cars sold off, and started all over again.
Philipppa Pirie, London, England
I don't know how anyone could disagree with a word that Martin Samuel has written. We live in what estate agents call a 'prestigious location' but we have seen police officers in strength here. There were 6 of them recently, hiding behind trees in a leafy avenue in the hope of catching a motorist or two exceeding the speed limit. This was early afternoon when the road in question was very quiet. We noticed them because, initially, 4 officers in a police car doing well over the limit roared past 2 of their colleagues holding radar guns. They screamed to a halt and, when they all met up, had a good laugh. So, they had a pleasant, untaxing afternoon out, unthreatened by the local, mostly retired, residents, a couple of drivers passing through got their come uppance and the world was a safer place.
anne, bournemouth,
Excellent article, just a shame that it had to be based on a family man 's murder.
Suggest that this article be copied and pasted into the following website.
http://www.supportcheshirepolice.com/sign_up.asp
Interesting question there on whether you would pay more in council tax for policing!!!
Kevin, Newquay, Cornwall, UK
Back in the day, the police were not alone in controlling crime. The citizen could be armed, had a positive duty to intervene in crime, and could expect afterwards to be praised by the police rather than insulted as a "have-a-go hero". In the case of teenagers, he could scold and take a stick to them without fear of the law. These presumptions were changed, and they can be changed back. Lets start by legalizing chastisement of teenagers, and repealing the gun ban for law-abiding adults.
Julian Morrison, Reading, Berkshire
As agonising as this incident is, it has happened many many times before - with equal outbursts of (deserved) condemnation from the general public and the media, and probably with the usual reaction action from the Government - lip service, indecision, and ultimately no action.
Lets hope that this incident, and this article, will finally be the turning point in tackling violent Britain. But sadly, I doubt it.
Samuel, Sheffield, UK
Here, here martin Samuel and T Rodgers.
Its the holier than thou parenting and ridiculous PC state that we live in that now means than a senseless and mindless yob cannot be clipped around the ear and told to bugger off anymore, the dispenser of such actions are sued for ABH. No, we must wait now for such children to carry on thinking any action will go unpunished until they actually manage to seriously hurt or kill someone before anything can be done. It’s about time that Officers and teachers and parents were allowed to take back control of these kids. Enough of all this namby pamby, you can’t touch my kids; wrap them in cotton wool, attitude that has now taken over. You might think your protecting your kids that way, but are you protecting the future of society by raising children that think that they can do whatever they like and it will be acceptable.
gareth, Oxon,
Brilliant article, but I would go further and make it a remit of the
Home Secretary to stay a few nights in some of these areas in secret. Then maybe we would be spared the banal statements made, or even the local MP and perhaps the Chief Constables.
And another point , when I was a teenager along with my mates
we would get seriously drunk, but we would never dream of damaging other peoples property or beating anyone up.
We were brought up to respect people and property.
This is lacking in too many families,today.
I could just image in the police station - Hands up who wants to tackle three thugs with knives- no one - ok you will have to go out and catch some motorist instead.
A Walton, Leicester, England
Trust me Police Officers want nothing more than to arrest criminals but our hands are tied.
One of the youth had been arrested the day before and released immediatly, a decision by the criminal justice system, not the Police.
The prisons are full, proof that despite the bureaucracy, the targets, the complaints and 50% of our time spent on paperwork will still arrest criminals, we know it's not enough though.
We would love to "teach them a lesson" but we can't as we get no support from our hierarchy-the Criminal Justice System or the public.
Steve, Manchester,
Funny isnt it that there never seem to be 'enough resources' when you really need the police. You've only got to watch one of the reality TV programmes to understand why. Notice how many police cars are in the background when a bailiff is removing a car - i spotted 3 in one programme last week.
carol, Leicester, UK
Two problems Martin –
Firstly the great British media. If a Police Officer was to work in the old ways and give an individual a “beating†and start physically dominating our streets and towns they would be sacked following moral outrage from the BBC, and all the papers including the Times and Telegraph. Numerous examples have occurred in the last 12 months including the incident in Yorkshire with the girl who was restrained after falling down the steps.
Secondly – The government policies undermine the Police at every turn with everything having to be accounted for in paperwork eg even a stop and search. In any one shift in an area there is probably only ever 6 police officers available, one incident will suck in all of them and then that means other incidents are not being attended to promptly and efficiently.
People in this country are soft, unless they are prepared to turn a blind eye to some “rough justice being handed out†then we will forever have this problem. Ultimately humans are animals, they need to have a fear of the law otherwise they will never be respected. That is the reality of human behavior, unfortunately it is not perceived to be just and civilized in our current society.
Maybe Chief Constables should be elected rather than be a pawn to government policy and the latest fashionable thinking. You can apply the same rationale to schools and teachers and the results are a lack of discipline in many schools.
Lee, London, England
Thanks Martin it needed saying but it needs following up and being constantly hammered at our MPs. Not one of them is
as unprotected as the majority of the citizens of this country now are. They live in a different world.
If the 50's I lived in a village where the local Sergeant and PC (only the two) knew every adult and child. I had my ear clipped on two occasions by them. Now they would be in serious trouble for actions that kept us all in order. On the other hand when I was stranded in the dark with a punctured tyre one of the mended it and sent me safely home.
The nearest police presence to that village is now 15 miles away! Not local - not part of the community and they don't know local people.
Please Times start a campaign to get more discipline on our streets. You may be very surprised by the support you get!!
JohnB, Waterlooville, UK
All the coppers I know are interested in is how they can wangle a nice early retirement on ill-health grounds -which usually involves an indiagnosable bad back complaint.
GrahamB, Warrington,
A brilliant piece. This should be sent to every MP, our barmy Home Secretary - who wants to devote more time to tackling "cyber terrorism" - and, more importantly, every Chief Constable of every police force in the country.
Where are all of the coppers ?
RJA, Nottingham, UK.
If Martin Samuel can find the time to write such an eloquent and well written piece in a week when his colleagues are obsessed with the arrival of Mr Keegan at Newcastle, then the police should be able to find the time to start policing. This situation must not be permitted to continue and the willingness of Mr Samuel and others to hammer this point home to our useless and hapless Government must be applauded.
Graeme, Liss, Hampshire
This last couple of decades I've noticed an almost hysterical reaction to the merest hint of authoritarianism directed towards deviant or criminal behaviour, a promotion of the "human rights" of the barely human, a total rejection of morality (remember the Tory's "Back to basics"?), a feminisation of law and order, all propped up by the Holocaust. It makes one wonder if it has been done deliberately to destabilise and ultimately to destroy our society.
proud to be British, Manchester, uk
I implore the editor of the Times to take note of the anger, frustration and fear that exists nationwide and to mount a sustained editorial attack against the government who refuse to admit that their policies have delivered a country fit only for thugs and criminals. Anarchy is just round the corner.
Martin Pilcher, Hertford,
I agree entirely with Martin Samuel's views. I retired from the police service (note it used to be police' force') 12 years ago after 30 years service. During this time I watched as political correctness, increased political interference and the latest innovative silly ideas took root. The sex discrimination act meant an increasing number of young women patrolled the streets, brave though they are, they are no match physically for drunken youths. Height limits were removed and discipline relaxed. Increasingly senior officers dreamed up new ways of solving society's problems, each one to be quickly abandoned with the arrival of the next new innovative career enhancing idea. The police need to go back to serving the law and enforcing it. There are plenty of experts whose job it is to influence the mind of these criminals, the police should concentrate on removing their bodies from the streets thus making them save for the majority.
T Waters, Girona, Spain
RULES OF ENGAGEMENT
This is our War Against Terror. Whether the government likes it or not.
It was a strange sight to see a Police van go through an estate being pelted with bricks...and no response. The kids who were doing it realise that they are immune, it's just a game.
Had the Police the power to arm themselves and confront any gang throwing bricks and other lethal objects, then we might soon see a change of attitude from such kids.
The Police must retake control of our streets and that means some rather instant, forceful crowd control. Rubber bullets? Why not.
Let's get with the programme. Many, many decent people want to retake their streets but are stopped by the courts - the good guys end up being prosecuted.
And if it comes to a stand-off between an armed gang, then we need armed Police and possibly Army. Once the rule of law is brought back then kids will know instinctively who the adults are again...and 'everyone' will be happier for it.
joe, berwickshire, scotland
It had to be said. The police have been reduced to the level of social workers no longer interested in protecting those who pay their wages. Get them out of their cars and nice warm offices and onto the streets where they belong.
Mark G Gambrill, Whitstable, UK
Excellent article and goes right to the heart of the matter. The police fiddle while we burn.
Then when they do go in, armed police in civvies put seven dum-dums into the head of an innocent foreigner who understandably tries to get out of his underground carriage.
What happened to common sense and responsibility in policing? Where is Dixon of Dock Green?
Frederick Fernackapan, Kingston,
A clear, concise article. All those weak, ineffective cops involved in this tragic affiar should be sacked and their pensions dissolved.
This poor familly.... I used to live on an estate with a quickly growing thug problem and, probably unwisely, confronted groups of lads on many occasions. Once, in two years, I saw a copper on the beat - actually on foot patrol.
I asked him how I could help, as he was most obviously lost, else he wouldn't be onfoot.
The police in the UK have given up on us - middle England.
Currently, I live in New south Wales on a limited visa - I am dreading the possibility of having to return to the UK.
I hope this mans family can recover.
I hope the ACC can see the shame he has brought upon himself.
Mark Bullen, Kiama Downs, Aus
I have been reading (and agreeing to) articles like this for the past 3 or 4 years now, and still nothing has changed.
So much for democracy.
My son tells me that he feels safer and less fearful of the PC-police in .. guess where .. Communist China!
Pete, Cov,
The problem is that the general public are all to ready to accept the police at face value:
The police complant about the pay award, the public and the media sided with the police, even though with equal experiance a PC gets twice that of a soldier in Iraq
On a cold and windy night far easier to write up a car without a tax disk, in the warm comfort of the station, than out confront ing the yobs smashing it up.
It all the governments fault, even though there are more police now than ever before, or do they expect ministers and MP'e to patrol the streets for them.
The police have all the numbers and powers to keep the Queens highway safe, its about time the general public and the media demanded the service we pay for.
This article is a good start, hopfully at the next police media event the media (TV and press) will follow it up and make it front page.
Anthony j, Alton , UK
"Who designs / decides, doesn't" is the basic principle of 21st C management, as in who designs economy airline seats doesn't fly economy, who runs rail networks doesn't ride trains, and, in this case, who emasculated your local police force, sorry, errh, "service", doesn't live where real police are needed (but, judging by this sad story, for how long?) The gutless politicians and the safe and comfortable academics who advise them are not in the firing line. Perhaps that more robust nation across the Atlantic has got it right: they may have more drug-dealers and crims shooting each other, but ordinary citizens with their right to bear arms are no push-overs for the sorts of low-life cowardly yobs featured in this disgraceful incident. To think that the British policeman was once universally admired.
Still, you've had 30 years of academics (of the soft subjects type), the BBC and dodgy schools teaching your youth to mock, diss and sneer at everything your nation used to stand for.
Leonard C, Launceston, Australia
A very good article. Is there no one with authority in this country prepared to stand up and articulate the reforms necessary to restore decency and order in our beloved country? If the answer is no, what can we, the ordinary citizens, do?
David Woodhouse, Lowestoft,
Martin, you are naiive. Yes, the police failed Garry Newlove, but this is actually not their fault.
Thousands of youths like these are now on our streets doing exactly as they please, thanks to the liberals who gave us broken families and took away notions of right and wrong and responsibility and punishment.
The same elite has created a huge, growing weight of bureaucracy, forms and targets which ensures that the back offices of our police stations are bursting and that as soon as a front line officer (of which there are very few) makes a minor arrest he is off the streets for HOURS.
The number of officers available on response on that day in Warrington was probably around 6.
You suggest posting one of them in Mr Newlove's street.
What happens when a crime is reported? What happens to the three other gangs in three other streets in the town? What happens if a car crashes a mile away?
Strip away bureaucracy, get cops on the streets and start jailing these yobs, not bailing them.
dan collins, London,
Well said! Your article is absolutely spot on, and reveals how those in charge of the police, judiciary and politicians are so out of touch with reality. As you say, it is not up to Joe Public to take on these thugs because they do not operate on the basis of restraint and rules of engagement. Another crucial issue here as to why decent citizens don't challenge these yobs is because unlike 40 years or so ago, authority figures do not back each other up like they used to. Back then, if you confronted lawlessness, the police and the parents would back you up. Now, not only is the perpetrators' restraint absent, but you cannot depend on the police to come to your aid. And where are the parents of these kids?
No, we pay our taxes for the police to protect our streets from lawlessness. Politicians need to end the obsession with targets, cut down the endless paperwork and let the police get out onto the streets to where the action is?
Mark Gollop, Poole, Dorset
OK as far as it goes, but the police are only there to deal with the symptoms of social decay. If we rtuly want to eliminate or at least reduce this problem (of alcohol fuelled violence) society as a whole has to change
1). We must STOP condoning and encouraging excessive drinking. It must become as unacceptable as smoking and drink driving. And all of society has t take part.
2). Parents have to be held accountable.
3). The police as per the article. They need to deal with the problem and not be social workers. ASBOS are a minor band aid.
4). Many of these thugs (but by no means all) come from severely disadvantaged backgrounds, so we need to clean up the sink estates.
5). Make alcohol hard and expensive to buy and punish those who supply youngsters.
Neil Murphy, cromer,
Well said, Martin Samuel. Your article should be sent to every Chief Constable in the country and to all those overpaid and underworked Government ministers and MPs who are basically responsible for the appalling state of criminality now pervading society. To learn what happened to Mr Newlove and why makes one feel physically sick,
How many more decent law-abiding citizens, trying to protect their families and communities, will have to die horribly before this wretched Government gets its act together, ups the penalties, locks these thugs away and protects the rest of us?
Ann Keith, Cambridge, uk
Well said Mr Samuel. And well said Chris from Reading. May I add my vote to the idea of the Times (not just one of its columnists) dedicating itself to pursuing senior police officers relentlessly on our behalf. They won't listen to us, but they just might listen to you.
Charles, Dorchester,
A worldwide trend in policing has been to mold police officers into social care workers, while "demilitarizing" the police service, in an effort designed to more closely subscribe to the Peelian principles. Alas, it appears that in their zeal to modernize policing, those in charge forgot or ignored the first and most important principle, "to prevent crime and disorder!" The result of these "progressive policing priniciples" can now be found in just about every community, demonstrated by the out of control anti-social behaviour, the growth of gangs, the availability of firearms and the rampant abuse of drugs.
Graham Hanlon, Toronto, Canada
I couldn't agree more with the comments made. The fact that the only evidence at hand was provided by a surveillance camera of an elderly neighbour says it all. My niece, a training nurse, and her boyfriend were kicked unconcious by a group of young thugs at the week-end. The reason: an act of kindness, but that is irrelevant.This was the second serious attack. The first police response to the attack was pathetic and took them seven months to arrest the person responsible. My sister had to cajole the police to prosecute; locate the persons address and obtain witnesses for the police before they would act. On this occasion our heroic emergency services took seven hours to respond! by which time the group had time to produce a different version of events. My niece was told by the police she is the one who could be arrested! The local police inspector has apologised. Unfortunately this government has been obsessed by political correctness and this is reflected in the appalling training.
Mike Smith, Ashington, UK
Spot on! If the heroic Mr Newlove had been able to fight back, and lived to tell the tale, I strongly suspect he would have been nicked.
Come on, plod. Do what you're paid to do.
colin, london, england
The Police in Britain, stop serving the public long ago. They are respected by no one and only feared by the law abiding majority because, that is their only target group. If this poor family were able to defend themselves, The Police would have taken over from were the thugs failed!
Ian Blaber, Brisbane (ex of Bristol), Australia
Yet another decent citizen pays the ultimate price for nulabor's failure and police dysfunction. When Blunkett and the South Yorkshire Chief Constable were publicly told of their failings the response was police bullying, abuse from nulabor thugs, and harassment from council officers. If citizens have their lives destroyed for telling the truth, it is no wonder that society is broken.
martin brighton, sheffield,
Too tru Martin, too true.
Bill, Sheffield,
The police are too busy to deal with real crime. They need to devote their time to serious pursuits like making sure you're not sitting in your car at traffic lights eating crisps.
David, Dubai, UAE
A couple of weeks ago my daughter-in-law had an evening visit from three - I'll repeat that so there is no misunderstanding - THREE 'uniformed officers', as they now seem to be known, and interviewed about the 'offence' of keeping an untaxed vehicle on a public road. It is a forty year old Land Rover exempt from tax, not being used while waiting for new springs. Technically the police were right - also technically if they are going to waste their time and our money on piddling little 'offences' largely manufactured by government to increase tax revenue, then of course real crime will increase. The yobs aren't daft - they know full well the police will much prefer to spend their days checking if your mother's car has a brake light out - though apparently even then they will need safety in numbers. Did the three North Yorkshire coppers sleep well that night, satisfied that a good day's work had been done? Did any of them wonder whether that was what they joined the force for?
eric campbell, harrogate, uk
Up until about 20 years ago, there was a police station opposite Mr. Newloves house.
Joe, Warrington,
Last week some one got beaten up in the Munich underground
It made National news, radio stations, local rags and uncle Tom cobbly and all was up in arms. Needless to say I dont suppose it will happen again, Munich probably being the safest city on the planet.
Well done Sir, I have had a pop before about journalists writing outside of their remit but this was spot on, even a tad tame. We need much much more anger, vitriol, digust and dismay. The public needs you guys to deliver 300% philippics aagain and again and again.
Gareth Davies, Munich, Germany
In simpler times, my uncle was a police sergeant in Handsworth, Birmingham. A new recruit was constantly being harassed, abused and provoked by three hoods on his beat, who hoped he'd lose his cool and get in a fight. One night my uncle went out with the novice, and when the trio started in, he beat them up. End of problem, and my uncle went on to become a Chief Superintendent who I'm sure would not have allowed the situation in Cheshire to arise.
Faustino, Brisbane, Australia
Strong article Martin, but it will trickle into the sand. Why not make it a front page splash open letter to the Asst Chief Constable personally, and pressure him until a reply is forthcoming? The Times has a huge power to make a change and remind these public servants of their responsibilities.
Editor: you have the space and the readership, use it!
Chris, Reading, Berks
Agreed; the police no longer police. Nor do they appear to care. Crime has won.
DSA, Glasgow, UK
Hear, hear, and again! All the emasculated pretentious cant that has so infected and dragged down public life - in large part because of police sycophancy to NULabour fantasies - needs a damned good kicking. Perhaps Adam Swellings could be 'retrained' to start it off.
James, Norwich, UK