Your last chance to get tickets to Top Gear Live

In a back street in the East End, a seven-foot map of the British Isles looks down over a small, spartan office where a few men are typing feverishly. This is the headquarters of the Muslim Council of Britain, the organisation that wants to put the mosque at “the heart of British society”.
Dr Muhammad Abdul Bari, the Secretary-General, has been at the helm for an eventful year that began with the Forest Gate shootings and ended with the recent failed terror attacks in London and Glasgow. He has steered British Muslims through a Holocaust Memorial Day boycott and protests at Salman Rushdie’s knighthood, but retains his enthusiasm for the role. “We can only thrive and prosper if there is ease and peace. That can only happen if Muslims are at the heart of the wider society … I want young Muslims to feel emotionally part and parcel of Britain, that’s my passion.”
When we meet, he is on the way to his day job, teaching children with special needs. A former Royal Air Force engineer with a PhD in Physics, his position in the MCB, liaising between the Government and the country’s most powerful Muslims, is voluntary.
“There is too much expectation on the MCB,” he says, “We are expected to do everything on behalf of our community - to be the voice of British Muslims, address the issue of terrorism, address all sorts of things. As a voluntary organisation, it’s just not possible.”
The MCB will celebrate its tenth anniversary in November. From humble beginnings in a town hall in Wembley, it has become the Government’s first port of call for Muslim opinion and leadership, representing over 400 Muslim groups. After the botched terror attacks earlier this month, the MCB were quick to convene a conference of 200 imams, denouncing the perpetrators as “criminals”. But would he call them Muslims? “If some Muslims create some violence, the community shouldn’t be blamed,” he responds. “Every criminal will use certain language; because someone uses Islam that doesn’t mean Islam should be blamed.”
Dr Abdul Bari says there is “tremendous pressure from Neocons and Islamophobes” to use Islamic texts against Islam. But, he argues, “Islamic texts, like Biblical texts, can be misinterpreted … At the end of the day it’s a social crisis and we are at the forefront of this difficulty, at the sharp end. We know there is a tremendous amount of fear in the wider society and people cannot live with this fear for very long. There will be a backlash.”
The answer, he says, lies in the mosque. “Mosques have to be the hub of the community. It’s not just a plain prayer place.” If they reach young Muslims who feel vulnerable and rejected, he argues, mosques could be a “source of regeneration for the community”.
He admits though that unless the number of imams who speak English is raised, that aim is never going to be realised. A recent survey showed that fewer than eight per cent of imams in Britain spoke English as their first language. “When they [young people] hear Arabic, Urdu, Bengali, and Gujarati they haven’t a clue, they switch off and cannot relate to the mosque”. Once separated from the mosque community young people are more likely to fall prey to influences on the Internet and from certain teachers in the street, Dr Abdul Bari, says. “They might get wrong information and that could lead to radicalism. Politics and religion could mix up like fuel and oxygen. Some people always try to blame religion for making them radically extreme. To some extent this is true because the interpretation of religion by half-educated people could be explosive.”
In a population of two million Muslims can the MCB really bring together such a theologically diverse community, which includes Sunni and Shia groups? “In the past we have been lacking in unity in our diversity, but I think diversity could be our tremendous strength. We don’t discuss those issues that divide and make us different … The thing that binds us together is our Muslim interest in this country, how we can bring the Muslim communities into the mainstream society.”
What about those groups that set themselves against mainstream society, like Hizb ut-Tahrir (HT), which works to re-establish an Islamic Caliphate and has expressed anti-Semitic views? “I personally know some of the leaders and they have changed a lot”, he insists. “They used to always call ‘Khilafah, [Caliphate] Khilafah, Khilafah,’ without charity work … many of their activists are now engaged in all kinds of charity work.” Isn’t this like a wolf playing fancy dress with a sheepskin? “We can’t suspect people’s opinions. If some people want to do good positive work we take this at face value … we cannot be thought-police on this. We don’t have any love for HT but we thought that if they were banned that would be worse.”
He laughs at accusations that the MCB’s aim is the Islamicisation of Britain. “That’s the new thing we sometimes hear. No. MCB is an umbrella organisation, and we have groups which speak in the language of Da'wah, or preaching of Islam. Islam is a very broad church, if I can borrow this term. Apart from someone going away from Islam through direct denial, everyone is in the fold of Islam.”
Last week Dame Eliza Manningham-Buller, the former head of M15, recommended the establishment of networks of Muslim spies throughout Britain. The Government’s new Security Minister, Sir Alan West, also called for people to inform on their neighbours if they had suspicions about terror attacks. The concept of Muslims “eavesdropping” on each other is “wrong” and “dangerous”, says Dr Abdul Bari. “Whatever is required as a citizen in this country, Muslims should share that. That is it. But if people start spying on each other, eavesdropping … that will create suspicion amongst each other.” Such calls are made “out of desperation” and “will be disastrous for any community,” he adds.
Dr Abdul Bari is not fond of knee-jerk reactions but defends unreservedly the calls to revoke Salman Rushdie’s knighthood. “If someone criticises my way of life I don’t find any harm in it. But people have to understand how sacredly people can think about the Prophet, peace be upon him. He is next to God. Although he is a human being, according to our Muslim understanding he is dearer to us than our own life.”
On the need to integrate the Muslim way of life into British society, he is emphatic. “From a theological and a historical point of view, wherever Muslims engaged with the wider society they succeeded; they became prominent community leaders. Where they were ghettoised they became lost.” His aim for the next era of the MCB is to see the Muslim community become “fully, emotionally, politically, and socially part and parcel of British society”. Leaving the MCB’s office for his day job, he is clearly a man who relishes having his work cut out.
Explore your passion for food with the delights of Thai, Indian & Chinese cooking
In our new series, Tony Hawks takes a dry, wry look at modern life - junk mail, interminable meetings and snooty sales assistants
Read the training tips and advice that helped our London Triathletes
Read our exclusive 100 Years of Fleming and Bond interactive timeline, packed with original Times articles and reviews
The latest travel news plus the best hotels and gadgets for business travellers
Shortcuts to help you find sections and articles
2007
£30,000
2006
£14,337
2008
£39,937
Great car insurance deals online
c.£75,000
GlosFirstmeansbusiness
Gloucestershire
£32,795 - £41,545
Universitry of Southampton
Southampton
£
£32,795 - £41,545
Universitry of Southampton
Southampton
Competitive Package
Npower
West Midlands
Some of the finest Apts & Penthouses
Across London
Great Investment, River Views
Luxury properties within exclusive development in
Chislehurst Kent
A new experience in Luxury Living
Las Vegas SALE!
£POA
With Ramblers Worldwide Holidays!
£POA
List your property with two leading travel websites
£POA
Great travel insurance deals online
Contact our advertising team for advertising and sponsorship in Times Online, The Times and The Sunday Times. Globrix Property Search - search houses for sale and rooms and property to rent in the UK. Milkround Job Search - for graduate careers in the UK. Visit our classified services and find jobs, used cars, property or holidays. Use our dating service, read our births, marriages and deaths announcements, or place your advertisement.
Copyright 2008 Times Newspapers Ltd.
This service is provided on Times Newspapers' standard Terms and Conditions. Please read our Privacy Policy.To inquire about a licence to reproduce material from Times Online, The Times or The Sunday Times, click here.This website is published by a member of the News International Group. News International Limited, 1 Virginia St, London E98 1XY, is the holding company for the News International group and is registered in England No 81701. VAT number GB 243 8054 69.
Oh dear, L Traore of London UK needs lots of history lessons. Christianity recognises the idea of self reform, self criticism. Any violence or persecution it has permitted is now judged unchristian - map it against Jesus' life and death instantly reveals it conflicts with Christian faith. Church leaders have in the middle ages eg been unchristian.
But Christianity itself roots from a man who gave up his life for others.
Mohammed was prepared to take up the sword and force faith on people, going back to the Old Testament warrior prophets like Joshua.
And it was the British navy that stopped Arab slaving of Africans, and the British protectorate stopped Arab slaving in the Sudan. It was a British crime not to have ensured the South of Sudan was split from the Arab North in 1952.
Lots more history to be learned....
BigT, Witney , UK
Mr Mohammed,
You are completely misleading people about India. India ia not a Hindu nation. It has no national religion (secular country) unlike Pakistan which is definately a Muslim country. About 15% of Indian population is Muslim. Most of my Muslim friends from India are not asylum seeker but they are well educated and working here on work permit. I and most of my Muslim friends from India totally disagree with your comments about India.
sajjan, aberdeen,
The lack of historical knowledge by people in the West about the Christian faith never ceases to amaze me. The fact of the matter is that all religions have at one time or another been hijacked by extremists. It has happened in the past and it will happen in the future. Now the focus is on Islam. To look down on the faith as being barbaric is short sighted. It shows how we know very little about others outside of what our historians, philosophers and media tell us about other and not what these other know to be tru about themselves. Christianity has been far more extreme than any other religion. The Bible was used in the burning of women at the stakes for being witches; less than 70 years ago the Church still espoused the idea that women did not have souls, SLAVERY was based and expediated through the Biblical teachings. Thats what made it ok to treat black people as animals who had no names but intead numbers and who were branded with hot irons. WW1 & 2 were faught by Christian states
L.Traore, London, UK
Should the question of the existence of God be 'that simple'?
Is it more absurd to recognise that maybe nature, the universe, our digestive systems, aren't all the result of a chance accident, and that maybe there is something out there, not only beyond the grave, but in the now?
Something is True, regardless of what people choose to believe - and if the truth is the existence of 'a God' surely that's something worth getting a bit het up over.
Sylvia, Oxford,
"The more I read , the more comments like those here, the more I realise there actually is no chance of Islamisation /Muslims taking over a western democracy" -- Maggie Millington, Brittany , France
Dear Maggie, I am very happy to hear that you now finally realize that most Muslims have come to UK mainly to escape oppression from brutal dictators/poor countries. In my case (and majority of Indian Muslims in UK), who have come here to settle, would have no 'home country to escape to, if we were kicked out from UK. India is a Hindu nation, they do not welcome Muslims over there. British people are most kind and welcoming to people of ALL races/ethnicities. God bless the Queen!. Muslims and Christians in UK have to fight terrorism together and Islamisation is out of the question.
Mohammed, London, UK
The more I read , the more comments like those here, the more I realise there actually is no chance of Islamisation /Muslims taking over a western democracy.
A. they are incapable of getting their own act together.
B. they fundamentally disagree with each others sects.
C. they are like all bullies fear a back lash .
E. the backlash being kicked out of the country which sheltered them, this would be their biggest deterrent as no way do they want to be sent to a Muslim country [even though this is what they seem to want ] & live in a backward , hardline dictatorship.
Time they appreciated us more, because the way things are going , nonMuslims are the ones getting millitant.
Maggie Millington, Brittany , France
Mohammed you said:
"We are all individuals practising our personal faith."
If only that were true for all believers but those of us who know that God is all wishful thinking at best are never left alone to our rational life-view. If the religiously inclined could only keep their absurd beliefs to themselves then there would be no problem and we'd all live peacefully together.
It IS that simple.
Bill, Glasgow,
Far too much disunity in the house of Islam for any one body such as the MCB.
A broad church it maybe, but also too many splinters !
As for saying the Mosques were the key place to educate young Muslims, well excuse me , wasn't it the Mosques who were blamed for radicalising some terrorists ? or suggesting they went to Pakistan ?
I suggest Dr Bari maybe a nice but naive man, unaware of just how much trouble Islam is in.
We that can read the Koran in English , can see only too well what is written, there is no mistaking words about the ' unbeliever' & what Muslims are supposed to do to them.
We do understand the word, ' Jihad ' & the rewards which are promised to those who do such things in the name of Islam.
Don't treat us like ignorant people who cannot read , please Dr.
We , the nonMulims have found our voice, & I have only one thing left to say, to all Muslims, moderates, pacifists, terrorists , & for those who don't speak out when you should, WE trusted you , you let us down
Maggie Millington, Brittany, France
"The Muslim Manifesto" that is- the constitution of the the council established in the 90's called on Muslims in the UK to support Islamic armed stuggle around the world. The manifesto is still available to read online and though the council removed it from their own website- they have never retracted this. The claim that the MCB is somehow a force for integration tends to be supported by wishful thinkers and confused liberals with poor short-term memories. All that the MCB offers is an easy means for public institutions to insist they have "consulted" with the community, forgetting that the MCB is not even democratically elected.
Not that democarcy is ever the ideal model for any Islamist organisations.
Rich, Birmingham,
A very good article. Muslims in UK belong to many different divisions, sects, traditions and so on. They come from different countries/backgrounds. There is no single united group whose mission is to Islamicise Britain, that type of thinking is pure propaganda. Furthermore, MCB does not represent the majority, although i personally agree with what they've said in this article. We are all individuals practising our personal faith. By all means every Muslim citizen in UK should denounce terrorism and voice their disapproval, but not because it was perpetrated by a Muslim, but because it was a criminal act. We can't all be held responsible for them misusing their religious belief.
Mohammed, London, UK
Ahmadis: Who says MCB condemns Ahmadis? Islam stands on the centrality of two maxims: belief in God, and the finality of the Prophet Muhammad. Ahmadis don't subscribe to this most basic of Islamic precepts. As the letter below in the Times says, none of us have any right to condemn anyone. If Ahmadis wish to call themselves Muslims (just as the people from the hardline Nation of Islam), good luck to them. But why should other Muslims be forced to consider them so.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/debate/letters/article851994.ece
Mahmud, London,
Dr Bari has said 'MCB is an umbrella organisation.... which speak in the language of Da'wah, or preaching of Islam...is a very broad church.... Apart from someone going away from Islam through direct denial, everyone is in the fold of Islam.â Please explain why does he not include under the umbrella of muslims, ahmadiyya muslims who preach Islam, and who say that they are muslims, and yet he condemns Ahmadiyy muslims and does not bring them under the fold of Islam. As Ahmadiyys say and believe in the same Kalima as you do, are they under the fold of Islam that you speak about? MCB is radical in itself. MCB condemn Ahmadiyy muslims and yet they preach tolerance!!!!
Salma Nasser, Buckinghamshire, UK
This is an activist group trying to throw its cloak over all Muslims, even those who wish for a much looser, more private version of faith. The MCB has conned its way into acceptance by the Labour government, and should be resisted. No such group should be taken to speak for Islam in the UK, it simply does not.
Ibnez, Hackney, UK