It worries me into thinking what kind of place Britain will be very soon, The thought of some of these people who make these quotes is shocking, that they think they are correct and the only thing they will believe in is there own religion and there own ideas.....

This sounds like another Hitler out burst. Where he thought he should have the only race

......What i really dont understand is fair enough we may try to get along with other races, but when they dont get along with us i dont see the point in even trying if there not giving anything back .....

This world looks like it will have a very glum future and there is nothing we can do about it because its already starting to spiral out of control....

When will there be an equilibrium?

Sribrolwm, UK,

"Loathes Western values" - why pick on UK Muslims when UK academia is doing precisely the same thing? Try doing a 'Humanities' course to see what virulent divisiveness really is - all funded to the tune of billions by the UK taxpayer.

Alan, Haslemere, England

There may or may not be a God.Islam seems to be pretty
arrogant in proclaiming that it knows best.
I find the use of "kuffar" to be a disparaging remark for people not sharing the Islamic viewpoint.
We need a new religion or better still a philosophy incorporating humanist ideals.
A philosophy would be better as it does not pretend to know
but asks that we all continually ask questions.

Richard Brady, wallington, england

Sooner or later Britain will get a Government with leaders who don't worship the opinion polls, then somebody will reap the whirlwind. The question is who will be the government & who will be the opressed. Muslim or Christian?

Not a nice thought, but as long as Political Tollerance = Looking the other way very little can be done to avoid this destiny.

Nick, Emsdetten, NRW

What these people preach is sedition. I'd like to see a major newspaper investigate why these criminals are not being prosecuted.

John, Berlin, Germany

Barrie, of Perth, Australia, says: "The extremists take advantage of politically correct cultural relativism." Hmm...I would suggest the term "politically correct" needs to be located geographically, since it cannot logically be in accordance with the political constitution of every country. If we follow this route, we find that "political correctness" originates in the USA, and refers to the American Constitution. And since the USA is constitutionally a secular republic, "political correctness" cannot apply to the UK, which is constitutionally a Christian monarchy. A lot of people are quite determined that it is going to stay that way.

Edmund Burke, Kingston upon Thames, England

Muslims have problems living among non -muslims but they have no problems taking the benefit for years. Money earned from kaffirs, however dub ious the means are, is completely Halal. Hyprocrisy at its worst form.

harry, london ,

I didn't read this completely, but i got the picture. Im a student from India, doing my masters.Im a Christian (not converted).Not all Asians are muslims OK. I come from a place where quite an anti-muslim feelings exist (sadly, most places in India).While studying i used to work part-time in a garage as a sales assistant here.I had customers calling me names like Paki (Im not from Pakistan), black b*****d (Im not black :) , terrorist (Im not so).Now, you may say those people are brainless Jade Goody's. But some were really educated high flyers! Just 'coz Im an asian that means Im all these? My experience reached a point where i could understand why British muslims are like this (Im not justifying terrorism and I Never will).You guys cornered them. British people (generally) never let muslims or asians integrate into the culture. It takes two to tango. Until you do so the problems will persist. I have never heard of home-grown terrorists in America. Why? Why only in Britain? PEACE...

Sunil, Edinburgh, UK

I am sure that Mr Riyad Ul Haq is an educated man and the Times an extremely fair newspaper. I was just wondering why all these Muslim men have to write to this column and defend him. Can he not do it himself ? or does he not want to justify himself to a mainly Kaffir readership in a Jewish owned newspaper ! I am fedup of Muslims defending Islam by calling it a religion of peace, love thy neighbor and all the rest of motherhood and apple pie stuff. The facts are for all to see. A Non tolerant religion not only towards non muslims but towards other sects within Islam.Conversion to other religions is punishable by death. Conversion into Islam of followers of other religions at any cost is an obligation of every Muslim. Anyone marrying a Muslm must convert to Islam, whether a man or woman.Homosexuality punishable by death. Women have almost no rights. Can be beaten, divorced at man's will, has no say if the husband chooses to bring a new wife ....One can go on and on. These are facts.

Mocho, London, U.K.

Muslims have a right to reject Western trends like teenage promiscuity and drug abuse. If they want to live in a Sharia society they have the human right to move to a country where they will feel more at home. There are 57 Muslim countries. However, they do not have the right to incite hatred or violence here in the UK!

Joe, London,

"Muslims are brothers and sisters, we have pain for each other, we unite as one"

If that is so why did Muslim kill each other by the hundreds of thousands in the Iran-Iraq war?

Roger, Cambs, UK

"This does not mean that every person who resembles being a Muslim should be targetted or blamed. "

Ach, but they should. Do these so called moderate Muslims _do_ anything to oppose those radical ones?

No, they don't. Talk is cheap, deeds are much more convincing.

I do understand them, they are too afraid (of radicals) to do anything and basically they don't care what happens to "kuffar". Term, which only function is to insult people, like pig or dog. Racism in pure form and who cares if a dog gets kicked.

I see that the situation is like being a member of SS after second world war, you are guilty, because your organisation is for killing people and it doesn't matter what you personally do. It's enough that you are a supporting member and do what you have been told to do.

So every Muslim is being held responsible for every stoning and murdered girl, they accept it and see it as inevitable, ins allah. As long as they _do_ something about it.

Tuomas, Lappeenranta,

Last week Sadia, a sweet Pakistani girl who refused to be sold in a marriage set up to bring her future husband to live here in Belgium, was brutally murdered by her family as they sent her brother to pump bullets into her. Something to do about their so called "honour" apparently.

Islam, the religion of peace we all should take the time to get to know better? Right.

Teddy, brussels, Belgium

Hey Omid in Dubai,

EXTREME=Impose your will and beliefs on others.

MODERATE=Live and let live.


Peace!

Miguel

Miguel, LA, CA

Islam teaches peace, equality, it teaches to love each other, do not force anything upon anyone.. islam is taught through actions, not force.. why are the western world so scared ?? why always attacking muslims ? why not look into ISLAM.. and see for yourself.. its the perfect religion...causes no harm to anyone, and teaches to live with JEWS, CHRISTIANS, HINDUS, SIKHS, ETC ETC ..together !! does not mention aything about HATRED for any other religion... Why even bring religion into this WAR of terror ! has anyone ever thought about the oil in middle eastern countries, the amount of money generated from WAR ?? this is what its about,.. STOP PICKING ON MUSLIMS ! they have done nothing wrong, look at ones self first ! before judging others..LIVE AND LET LIVE...

Ashleigh Warner, coventry, UK

This article is a load of nonsense and written from completely an anti-Islamic perspective. What's even worse is reading some of the absurd responses to the article. Mohammed Khan of London and some other brothers have already responded along the same lines and they're right. Firstly, the Deobandis are just normal traditional Muslim's from the Sunni Hanafi school of thought and we're certainly not a sect. So before one comes out with remarks such as this one needs to REALLY know what they're talking about, otherwise all you are doing is adding fuel to the already raging fire and just feeding Islamaphobia and hatred of Muslims. All the Masjid's (or mosques) are independant of one another and are not controlled by any one figure or group and therefore, this fact simply destroys the entire argument of this ridiculous article. And more pertinently, whether you know Sheikh Riyad-ul-Haq or not, it is blatantly obvious that this article is completely one-sided and lacks balance. It's a joke.

Batman, UK,

The threat to islam is not comming from the west, its comming from the hardline muslims splitting the religion into various extremist sects bent on destruction. If peaceful muslims feel threatened. Then they must look within their own religion and their own people. Stop using other cultures and peoples as an excuse for your own problems.

The west cannot deal with it, that would be seen as racist and interferance by most muslims. But if muslim people as a whole will not try and stop the exstremist side to islam, then you cannot blame countries like Britain for defending its people against quite obvious and direct threats to our way of life.

Mr G Courtney, Earlswood, England

Ok, lets get down to cases. I have just read a book , the author is a muslim and he fell into one of the very many islamist organisations in Britain which preach that the islamist state or caliph will take over the world, by force if neccessary, and make war against the kaffur or kaffir, in other words non muslims. Its a well known fact that islamists and many muslims consider in the world anyone else as inferior. This word kaffir/kaffur is extremely racist. The gentleman I speak of, after he realised exactly what these extremist islamist organisations beleived, left the particular one he was with.

What I`m trying to say is, is that there are deep rooted muslim people out there and very close to home, who wish to end quite literally the wests way of life and replace it with a caliphate run state. One, this won`t happen, because the west, despite its faults is far more resolute and organised, our ancient history shows this. Two unlike a caliphate, we in the west value individualism.

Mr G Courtney, Earlswood, England

“We are in a very dangerous position here. We live amongst the kuffar, we work with them, we associate with them, we mix with them and we begin to pick up their habits.”
Bet he doesn't have a problem accepting welfare though.

jon crow, townsville, australia

Excellent point carolyn of London, the fascists get their teachings direct from saudi arabia, the wahabbi teachers from their are crazy.

Adiel, London,

sikhs have lived under extreme islam.......better to go down fighting for freedom of expression than a life lived under tryanny.

charlie, GRAVESEND,

I always hear, Islam doen't promote violence against the innocent, well that might be true. But it seems to work, that certain Muslims (that's what they are, brothers ans sisters, aren't they) declare non-Muslims as not innocent and then they can kill them and feel good. And please don't come always with the cruisades of the long- gone- by middleages! Everybody should have learned from the past's mistakes and avoid them, instead of using them as a lame "but they used to do it, too, 1000 years ago". I really miss true action against radicalisation from within the Muslim community. What I hear is blaming the British government for not providing and not propagating. If only non-Muslim minorities in Islamic countries could enjoy a bit of the freedom, respect and consideration that Muslim communities in Britain are entiteld to!!! I am deeply disappointed by the passive and defensive attitude of the majority of the British Muslims.

MM Noble, Glasgow, uk

Good morning. What about my reply top Mohamed from Leicester?

WHAT AN ARBITRARY CENSOR !

Rodrigo Diaz de Vivar, Londonistan,

Good luck in next two decades, British. A new age has become. An age of Islam. Good bye, anglo-saxon Britain...

Jonáš Pospíchal, Brno, Czech republic

Interesting points brought about about the Jewish community.

barbara kline, Boston, USA

Some of the things that have been transcribed here from Ulhaq, especially on the topic of Jewish Fundamentalism, raise many questions. It is quite clear to any discerning reader that UlHaq could not have just fabricated these points. Unfortunately, this has made it important for the community to discuss these matters and Jewish leaders need to respond to them. If there is any truth in them, then this means that there are some ugly truths that the Jewish community need to provide explanations for. We constantly hear many evil things in the media about the Muslim community and their beliefs, but this information goes beyond anything seen before about Muslims. It is quite shameful for the Jewish community if what UlHaq has said is true.

Barbara Kline, Boston, USA

They say we pretend to be the victims "look at what we did in the former yugoslavia". The only reason the west stopped the extrimism of the Serbs is because the Serbs intended to expand thier atrocities further afield and certainly not because muslims were being killed! We will do well to remember that all the atrocities commited on the "moderate" muslims was during UN's prescence in the country (one could not tell a muslim apart from a christian! but the massacres on these "moderates" still took place so i don't believe in this moderation codswallop that we are continually fed). The UN was in the country whilst muslim men and boys from the ages of 16 to 60 were still being massacred. How selective memories become that only bits of the not so long ago history are remembered at opportune times!

asma, Walsall,

What a load of rubbish!!!

soheil, lancaster, UK

We talk about sects within Islam being at war, is the Irish affair any different between Protestants and Catholics. Or the difference between the orthodox Jews and Zionists

Who were the killers of the Muslims in the spanish crusade?

Im sure you are all educated to judge yourself.

This is certainly no defence, but the foreign policy especially of the USA has to be looked at especially as they believe it is ok to go around the world and do whatever they want. Does this not give these nutcases more ammunition?

Within Islam the killing be it a person of any religion or race is strictly wrong!

As well as this we are taught to abide by the laws of the land.

Once again i reiterate bring the people to account for having these views or promoting any form of hatred, dont blame every Muslim you see.

Mohammed, leicester, uk

I find it rather annoying that for the sake of a few the name of the whole Muslim world is tarnished. Let me make it clear, that i AGREE with the conclusion that the newspaper has come too. In my opinion the Deobandi/Tablighi sect is a group which has fundamental views. However the people who are responsible for these crimes or promote hatred should be held to account. This does not mean that every person who resembles being a Muslim should be targetted or blamed.

Islam in no way promotes violence, but it condemns attacks on the innocent. For all those who make false allegations that Islam was spread through violence in the early days, can they give one account where the Muslims went to war out of choice!

What is further annoying is all the American who are coming and provoking the matter further. I wholeheartedly do not agree with innocent lives being lost be it 7/7 or 9/11. However it is acceptable for the IRA to be funded in the USA and take the lives of the British?

Mohammed, leicester, uk

part 2. The article on Sheikh Riyadh-ul-Haq is apparently another misfortune for the media as they have shown their lack of common sense in relating issues without full understanding and thoughtful consideration of the impact it will have on the society.

Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth. Marcus Aurelius
Judging others against our own standards is being egoistical. Respect everyone's right to be different! Wai-Fatt Yee

suhail, oldham, england

islam is a peacefull religion and mr Riyad ul haqs speaches are very inspiring and benificial if they are mentioned in its true context not pasted

shabir, leicester, u.k.

assalamualaikum readers

Please take a step back and ask yourself, who are you to judge anybody? Only God can judge, before pointing fingers and taking small parts out of his speeches, paint the whole picture and take his talks into context with times. the media do not expose the suffering muslims are having in the world today. Muslims are brothers and sisters, we have pain for each other, we unite as one, read and understand before publishing stories about our scholars. May allah guide you on the right path, aameen

Aftaab, blackburn, england

Edwin Thornber, Bucharest - I fail to see how or why a return to Victorian values should be supposed to be the antidote to Islamic fundamentalism, not least because that scourge was one of the few problems absent in Victorian times.
If what is being proposed is the execution of terrorists, then I entirely agree, but there is no point in attempting to return to Victorian values in general, because that option has already been decisively rejected by the British electorate.

Dave, Southampton, UK

This has completely been taken out of context and I believe this is a conspiracy against the great Scholar in Britain. His speeches do not incite to racial hatred and are not anti semitic in any way. All the Imams mentioned in the above article are pious men and have sacrificed immensely for the Musilms of GB. They certainly do not preach hatred against other religions and this is evident as a great deal of their followers predominantly live amongst other communities and faiths and are tolerant towards them. The issue of Deobandi mosques, is absolutely ridiculous and I do not think I have come across any article as pathetic as this. If anything the followers/students of these particular Schools are the most disciplined, tolerant, well mannered, respectable than others. In all the speeches that I have heard of Shaykh Riyadh ul Haq they have never incited hatred amongst jews, christians and Hindu's, can't see where this false information has derived.

Abdullah, Birmingham,

if you hear the guy speak,he is found to be so gentle,and in actual fact he is one of the most intelligent people you will meet

muhammed, manchester, england

All the above people want peace and yet look at how racial the above opinions are. Muslims are not allowed to do certain t ings like listen to music or drink alcohol etc, so it is not a case of not integrating. If Muslims did drink,then they cannot be muslim if they are not following their religion. Why don't you ask people from other faiths to change their religion?And they say Britain is a democratic society where free-speech is allowed....haha

David Lawson, Preston, UK

I would just like to say please, please and please listen to Sheykhs lectures and audio tapes before making any assumption over this noble person.

Ask yourself this question? Isn’t it funny how some people are partaking in forwarding negative views against Shaykh and by GOD not a single of them read or listened to any his talks?

I have been attending Shaykhs lectures for a number of years now, and have found NO fault with his teachings. In fact his teachings had encouraged me to distance myself away from having any kinds of hatred thoughts towards other people.

Mr ‘Andrew Norfolk’ is out of this world, a dangerous man whose sole purpose is to incite hatred into people’s hearts. Surely he is looking for a promotion through his deceitful allegation (may God forgive him).
Men like him needs to be arrested and eradicated from position of power so that innocent people maybe protected to live harmoniously together.

Ahmed, Brimingham, England

I have known about this Scholar for a long time and I urge non muslims to research for themselves-go to these mosques,speak to the people and make your own mind about Islam.

Dr A I Sange, Blackburn, England

islam promotes peace and not violence. u cant judge a book by its cover.the same with islam you cant judge the relegion coz of a few ppl who are not bothered.these people might be promoting violence but that does not mean every muslim is the same.you need to study islam for yourself and then you will know what islam really is.if it was what people say it is then it wouldnt have been the fastest growing religion in the world would it?theres a saying every dish is not the same.in the same way every muslim is not the same.

mo, leicester, uk

I have read through all the comments - a lot of them from foaming at the mouth fundamentalists and equally, reactionaries - trying to find one that I agreed with. I finally found one from Terry, London, UK:

"Replace suicidal Anglo-American liberal ideology with democratism, the rule of the democratic majority. Once this is accomplished we will be in a position to deal with Islamism as a secondary threat.

First, we must deal with liberalism - and liberalist extremism. "

Here is the answer. Great Britain’s once great and staunchly held values and the intricate society that was its result has been debased, traduced and obliterated by Social-Liberalism (and paradoxically, later, by socialist based totalitarianism).

In their quest to destroy what they perceive as the ruling classes, Britain's historical institutions, ancient values and law and order have become its innocent victims of socialists' pipedreams. Multi-culturalism could be the last piece of the jigsaw.

Edwin Thornber, Bucharest,

Dear Readers
I have heard many of the lectures produced and delevered by Riyadh ul Haq and he is a decent, intellectual and intelligent man and scholar, never has he promoted any form of extremism. Perhaps the Time has overlooked the fact that despite so many who have benefitted from his lectures none of them have turned extreme measures or terrorist acts.

Also the islamic schools mentioned have produced many graduates and we conveniently ignore all the good done by Riyadh ul Haq and the other graduates in harmonising the society and interfaith relations etc.

Wake up folks, dont believe everything you read in the papers and go spend some time with real Muslims from who you can learn about the true teachings of our beautiful religion.

Ahmed, Leicester,

Wake up,Brits! Can't you see what's going on in Sweden,Finland or anywhere in the world?
What can you expect from a religion that claims to be THE ONLY TRUE RELIGION?
This is no fanatism,no radicalism,it's Islam,simply!
Apostates should be killed and infidels have the choice between conversion or death.The Koran MENTIONS THIS!
To make matters worse,politicians and leaders are so afraid to offend Muslims that not even the slightest criticism of Islam is possible.
What else do people need to understand?

Andre Medigue, Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia

mixed views i see!

one comment reads "these muslims should be sent back to where they came from" - maybe they should?

but an observation to point out, maybe they would, had it not been for OUR 300 years of colonial and neo-colonial endevours. we still rule their countries of origin.

maybe we should go out of their lands and let them be. then maybe they might leave ours.

maybe, just maybe.

e.cook, manchester, uk

As a nonbeliver of any religion, I am always amused by the way the brainwashed muslims respond to other peoples' opinion. You cannot back up your claim that islam is a peaceful religion so you have to repeat this same phrase again and again which becomes more and more like a black humor when I consider how many of your Shi'ite brothers have been killed by you Sunni brothers, and vice versa. Some also want us to learn Koran to see how it really is a good religion. Then why should I give a damn to your religious script? I don't want to understand you, just want you to behave yourselves.

terry, London,

Islam is like the snake in the Garden of Eden, hissing it's lies and half-truths to Eve. If radical Islam is not destroyed, it will take over, and when it does, the "moderates" of this so called religion of peace will fall into lock step, right behind the mantra of jihad. What? Do you think they would abondon Islam and convert to Christianity?! Not on your life!

Mike Taylor, Palm Bay , Florida

islam has no place in a modern society, this religion breeds hate of everything non-islamic.
these preachers will do anything to get closer to there ultimate goal

BRITAIN UNDER ISLAMIC LAW

and the cheeky beggers will use the democratic system to finance it.
Everyday we here the same thing islam is a peaceful religion and it is just a small minority which preach hate this is only because the ones that are not preaching hate are denouncing democracy and western values.
Islam segregates itself from main society in order to control and brain wash its followers.

It is about time this country woke up and realised islam can no longer exsist here and it should be sent back to which ever hole it crawled out of. and banished from here forever.

mark , leeds, west yorks

Islam will only be a religion of peace when Saudi Arabia allow the building of churches and temples in Riyadh. So, can all the moderate Muslims please petition the Saudi government and the Wahhabis to practise the tolerant part of Islam?
Furthermore, moderate Muslims must also preach the true message of Islam to the Wahhabis, the Deobandis and Osama etc instead of forever telling non-Muslims to read the Quran. I am happy to be a kuffar because of the conflicting interpretations of the Words of Allah.

Carolyn, Surbiton,

Sheikh Riyadh Ul Haq is one of the most prominent & well spoken scholars in the UK. He's not an extremist, & it's amazing how an article like this can blow things out of all proportion. Riyadh Ul Haq has immense knowlege of Islam & for any of you that believe the "media hype" in this article, I ask you to listen "fully" to his talks, which are widely available & have been for over a DECADE. Don't fall into the trap of this article & make someone guilty by extracting snippits of 2hr lectures & edit them so much so that the interpretation is completely misinterpreted.

The deobandis aren't an "extremist" organisation. There'is no head leader & the "UK masjids/madressahs" have no network. It's as if the media are makingout they are "terror cells". Come on, wake up !!!

It's like another "Iraq has Wapons of Mass Destruction" "We have intelligence to back this" . And what happened on that incident.....nothing...NO weapons. The world was fooled.

Riyadhul Haq is no danger

Shabir, Leicester, UK

Deportation of potential jihadis is a complicated issue. First of all: islamofascism is like a disease, a viruse, and the terrorist is a sick person. Hence deporting extremists is only a shorterm solution, since that virus will spread elsewhere and come back in another form. This is reality, we live in a globalized world. Secondly; Which country will accept them? zThe countries your talkin about has their own problems and will certainly be reluctant on importing more trouble. And even f they will, the legel process is long and expensive.

The best solution as I see it, is building "un-radicalization" facilities, in remote, sparsley populated areas. These are not Guantanamo Bay type of prisons or camps, but a guarded communitiy where potential terrorists stay put until psychologists declare them sane. Until that they can live almost a normal life but they don't have the freedom to spread hate and promote death and destruction.This is a tough solution, but these people are like nazis

Mikael, Stockholm, Sweden

Its like the 2 minute hit and run that was portrayed by 'Undercover Mosques', disgraceful. To understand a 'one liners' you have to understand the whole 5 hour speech that was given by the speaker. If a pastor at a church says 'do not delve in the mainstream society as this is Satan's work and follow the path of Jesus', then what is wrong with this statement? wasn't it Religion that got us this far from the negative times of our past?...Just because a speaker says 'do not lay about with Christians' doesn't mean 'kill them'...again its like the Pope saying 'Islam is a Bloody religion so stay clear of them', which everyone is entitled to an opinion...but lets look at the raw facts, Christianity has got a Bloody History too....so lets not blow something out of Proportion, which will lead to more extremism especially for the ones that are going to cornered, and we know what happens to a rat when its cornered, it jumps at you! by far this is Islamophobia. peace.

Joynal, Birmingham, UK

The quaran is the word of god whether you like it or whether you dont. It can be proven with modern science but the ignorant will not spend the time to learn.

. Pornography , Gambling, Disrespect to parents and mankind , Illicit sexual relations , Alcoholism ,Child Abuse , Drugs are prevalent in society and those involved is such things are ignorant to the commands of god.

If the reader carefully considers whom is extreme with sincerity they will conclude that it is those that ignore the code of god and make problems for people . We all have a responsibility to god as it is gods planet and not an atom is owned by anyone.Thus the statement such as it is our country is made by the foolish ignorant and the deaf and dumb and blind.

The time in our life is a test for the hereafter and we will all be accountable to god. It is high time that respect be shown to the creator. We are all the children of Adam and Eve and should learn about god and what gods commandments are .

im, leicester, uk

The last thing the world needs is more religion. Listen to these people! They want to wage a war on an entire civilization because they do not follow the same invisible man as they do. The only cure for this sort of thing is education and laws that prevent religious organizations from gaining too much power.

Why do people feel they need these archaic superstitions? Why not try cracking a science or history book instead? Education is the true key to enlightenment. Think, do not believe. Please.

William, Euless, Texas, United States

You fools who kneejerk this as just a hate-piece had better start studying Islam for yourselves. This is not radical, not fundamentalist, not militant, not hardline; this is Islam as it really is.

Clay Marley, Phoenix, USA

Paul Owen made an amazing point.

"if you believe that your religion is the one true religion how can you then show respect for other religions? It's a logical impossibility. Thus we get the bitterness, rancour and eventual violence we are seeing."

I commend you for such a DEEP statement.

But after you have made that statement, I want you to ask yourself, why is all of this chaos surrounding ISLAM.

And for everybody else, always ask yourself how CREDIBLE is the information you are receiving, whether from the paper, tv internet...the question is how credible is it.

Islam is not a religion people, Its a way of life. In Islam, life is about struggle. A poor man has his struggle and a rich man has his struggle. Islam is about who you turn to for ease, and relief from struggle, and who you thank once it has been relieved.

Abdullah, WILMINGTON, DE, USA

i dont care what university you came out of, or what kinda degree you got. what we all need is education. we need to create a system that will educate and elevate the true colours of islam.

p.s no matter who rules this world, it will never be peaceful again. peace ended when the last kalifa died.

naima, seattle, usa

All you people have one thing in common, you try and use your intelect against divine revalation. The whole world has watched centuries of your violence and debauchery based on freethinking principles and a ardent desire to plunder each others wealth and resources, never even contemplating death and the reality of the life to come. You may detract and argue all you like but this religion is coming to liberate the hearts of mankind from the slavery of materialism and a life of carnal desires and oppresion. Women all over the world are embracing Islaam, donning bthe veil you hate so much. Let me tell you straight, if youve got a problem, look the other way and keep it to yourself.

Tariq Ziyad, Birmingham, United Kingdom

There is no religion in the world that agrees perfectly with the man-made personal values of 21st century Britain. So if you wish to deport Islamic lecturers because Islam forbids music, then you will have to deport Sikh lecturers because Sikhism forbids alcohol (or do you really think you can go without that pint?), Hindu lecturers because they forbid the eating of beef (no more Big Macs), Buddhist lecturers because they forbid materialism. Who will be left, except the atheists? But they forbid believing in God so will you deport them too?

Abu Khadijah Ali, Leicester, Leicestershire

islam is a peacefull religion, not spread by the sword but the Characteristics, if islam was as it is being Portrayed then why is it the fastest growing religion in the world? we have to study islam for ourselves. we cannot let the world decide for us.

abdullah, cardiff, uk

If those who profess to follow hard-liners of Islam and they hate non-Muslims, why did they leave their homeland and to to Britain or the United States? If their religion is so great and their countries, then let them return to their homeland! Let them go back to the country of their religion and practice and leave the rest of us alone. They can't even get alone with others of their own religion. Look at how the Shiite's , the Sunni's and the Kurds fight amongst each other. Then there is the sects that have broken off from mainline Islam and think they own the world. Britain is having the same problems with people who get Visas to visit and out-stay their time, just like the Hispanics in the USA. They have no education, can't get a job, then turn to drugs, and other illegal activities, then after arrested, get free legal representation and all the fee social services help. Let a single, white female in need of help ask and they are turned down.

Mikki, Afton, Iowa, USA

Even a cursory study of the foundation of Islam reveals that Western European governments have foolishly tolerated it. Anyone who seriously wants to follow (or study) a religion will surely have to examine it's foundation. The PC brigade in the West have either failed to do this or have been reluctant to speak about it because of the potentially adverse reaction from Islamists. African and Asian Non-Muslims who have suffered deadly, persistent Islamic violence are not so lily-livered. The best form of Islam (to which any serious adherent will return) was practiced by Muhammad and his immediate followers. It yielded a lot of violence towards Arabs, Jews and Christians. Violence was so endemic that within a few years after his death, Muslims were killing each other leading to the Sunni/Shia divide. Islam's violent root is still producing fruit and needs to be stemmed.

Bolaji, UK, UK

The old saying ``You give some people an inch and they'll take a mile'' comes to mind. I cannot believe how an intelligent modernized nation like Britain would allow this type of scum to walk all over the British people. I can guarantee it wouldn't happen here in America. If word ever got out that some sub-human pig (look at his picture in the article, oink oink !) like Monsieur Cul was preaching anti-American sermons on our own soil, well he wouldn't be doing it for very long. Somebody would simply cruise on home, grab their shotgun and that would be the end of Monsieur Cul. Oh, I'm so sorry!! Was that too violent for you ? Offend your sensitivities, does it ? Well if it does then apparently you've forgotten all about July 7. Fortuneately, we haven't forgotten September 11. If we ever do, then we deserve to be attacked again. Good luck to you all. From the way your spineless politicians are handling this thing, you're gonna need all the luck you can get.

M. Nolan, Schuylerville, NY , USA

What is particularly worrying about the spread of the Islamic religion in the UK is that its radical elements are the people who represent it most truly. Muhammad was above all a military warrior and a conqueror. A true Muslim will ultimately aim to convert the whole of the human race to Islam, that's what is meant by the phrase 'Islam is a religion of peace'. The only solution to the problem of Islamic extremism in the West is to remove any form of religion from every public institution. People should be allowed to practice their religion in private, as long as they are eighteen years of age or older. There should be a ban on underaged girls wearing the hijab, not only at school but anywhere at all. The NHS, the courts and any place where purely public matters are dealt with should be free from any religious symbols and regulations. What we need in Britain is to recognise that religion is a private and cultural pursuit that has nothing to do with our material welfare and human needs

Andre de Souza, London, UK

For 1400 years, islam has been at war with every other culture and religion on the planet. There is nothing new about jihad, or the theology that drives it. Mohammed led his followers in 70-odd battles after moving from mecca to Medina. When he and his mslims were victorious, the defeated Bedouin were given the choice of converting to islam or having their heads chopped off. After Mohammed died, the first Caliph had to fight a War of compulsion against people who had been forcibly converted. After that, islam spread through the Middle east and veyond through aggression and conquest.

Gareth, Cardiff,

Why should Hindus be classified with these people as Asians , is it just because they come from the same continent?

sarang, basildon, essex

- sarang - if u grew up in the UK you know a white person can rarely mention a specific race or religion without being called racist.
political correctness is how this problem came about

Daniel Lee 86, Melbourne , Australia

Its time the West took a look at its Christian past and revived its values. It is depressing to read of converts joining Islam, a heresy of Christianity. Any impartial observer of atheist governments that appeared in the 20 century, can see a trail of mass murder from the Soviet Union to Cambodia all the way to China un paralled in human history. This recent attraction to Islam is a response to the 20th Century failures of atheism and neo pagan socialism (aka Facism) and now the soul destroying aimless material secularism we call liberal democracy. Secularism creates deformed people and radically deformed societies, and in response we are getting radical Islam. The answer to this extremism is a return to the peaceful loving values of authentic Christianity.

Peter Doyle, Raleigh, NC USA

Winston Churchill said it best in 1899, "How dreadful are the curses which Mohamadism lays on its votaries.The effects are apparent in many countries, improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. ... Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world."

Bill Silver, Coral Gables, FL, USA

Himmler set up an S.S. Division of Moslims, the religion obviously lends itself to manipulation by rabid weasels of one sort or another. Perhaps its time to bring back the Knights Templar.

Brian Leslie White, Carmarthen, Wales

i really think about daobandis are of a modret movment which can be used in all area but the sect of beralwe are not of what the last prophe did. Re: Ul haq is not what the times have said really. they need more purification on there reserch.

moynul, stevenage, herts

One message to everyone reading this, listen to his speeches!! He (or Deobandi or Deobandi institutions) does not preach to hate, quite the opposite. The Times and the majority of the media do not reveal the full story ,and therefore this represents a distortion of the truth. Typical of the media to make these more headlines, sell newspapers, get more hits on their web sites and overall, more profit. How many times has this happened? Please approach a muslim in person and ask about Sheith Riyad ul Haq and his sermons and do not fall for this nonsence. How low can the media go??

Irfan, Preston, UK

what can i say all lies, if only everyone knew the truth about islam and the people and sect mentioned in this, yet media distorts the truth and manipulates it. it is sad to say many people absorb and belive the media without any research. all i can say islam teaches peace and love amonsgt all religions and cultures throughout the world if they dont then islam is not amonst them. the people mentioned having heard them they arre nothing like what this article says and it just makes me laugh reading it as i cant belive lies with no evidence can be published.very sad

Salim, leicester,

me and my tax paying family are finaly leaving this anti ENGLISH country,i am sick to death of living amongst non ENGLISH people,so i urge the rest of us to do the same before we get persecuted by our scotish government for being ENGLISH living in our ONCE great nation ENGLAND........

karl, birmingham,

as someone who has been to numerous lectures of shaikh riyaad ul haq i believe i speak for everyone who knoows him that he is one of the most tolerate and peaceful scholar alive and someone whom both muslims and non muslims can vastly benefit from. this article is pathetic, its taken one sentence out of a full hour lectures and presented them in a vile manner. SHAME ON YOU.

MOHAMMED KHAN, LONDON,

How can you say that the peace loving shaykh is inciting terrorism?
I am a revert to Islam and from a Hindu background, in fact my whole family are Hindu's would you believe, as are many of my ancestors for generations.
I have read and heard what the Shaykh has said, I don't see any incitement to religous hatred. Some of the words that you have supposedly transliterated from the lectures are wrong. Listen to the words carefully before you start posting them and interpreting them onto the net.
You can't pick out a few words from a speech and expect to make sense of it. If this is the case we are bound to take it out of context.
When you watch a movie do you watch a little snippet and say 'Hey we don't need to watch anymore, we get it'. Didn't think so!
One more thing I love my family very much although they are Hindu's and you people are 150% wrong on this one.
Oh the Word Jihadi, it means to struggle not to war, so look it up, don't just read paper and make assumptions

Hamza Abdur-Rahman, Staffs, United Kingdom

It is clear that most of the comment has been taken out of context. Why doesnt everyone concern conduct their own research. I am willing to contribite £100 for those who sincerely wishes to listen to the talks and sermons by Mr Haq. I can assure that never does he incite any hatred, if he did do you think Mr Haq would be doing what he is doing?

You will always get a group of people trying to dishonour someone like Shaykh Riyad, hatred does not start by a religious cleric by inciting killing and hatred. Real hatred starts when people are misled and someones respect and honour is brought to disrepute in a very derrogative manner. Thisgives birth to many assumers and haters of Islam.

Muslims have nothing to hide, please make effort to do your own research and save yourself from creating hatred in your own heart. No one tolerates hatred, this is not Islam. What you have read about Mr Haq is fabricated and conspired behind his back without any verification and ascertation

muhammad, Lancashire , UK

I advise all to listen to his thought-provoking lectures which sits firmly at the heart and sould of every individual, it strengthens moral fibre and increases community cohesion. I am a better person now than ever before, Sheikh Riyadh lectures has tought me to to look closely at myself through means of self rectification ensuring that I adhere to Islam by adhering BEYOND the laws of the land. I would not lie nor steal (exposed or otherwise) as my affairs are dealt with the Almighty directly. And all this is, as a direct result of Sheikh Riyadh-ul-Haq. As a highly qualified Software Consultant I mingle with people from all walks of life, the author of this report is greatly at fault and wholly one-sided. For example, it is incorrect to write 'Mr Ul Haq', it is either 'Riyadh ul Haq' or 'Riyadh', just goes to show Mr Andrews half hearted research or should I use Mr Rew - doh!!

Abu Khawlah, Leicester, UK

To Linda Heywood

to call another muslim a hippocrite is unislamic, you say you don't need a man to teach you islam, your whole religon of Islam is based on a man's (saw) word which was revealed to him in the form of the Qur'an.
Its these sort of comments and thinking which seperate not only the muslims but the whole of the UK, why do you think this article was printed? Try to understand before producing articles and blogs.

Hamza Abdur-Rahman, Staffs, United Kingdom

Deobandis are Problems of Sunni Muslimseverywhere in the World . These People have brought abd name to islam by their borrowed ideology from Saudi arab .
World need to recognize the True Islam and Majority sunni Muslims.

Shahnawaz Warsi, Delhi, India

We have more traitors in our country than at any time in our history. And where is the leadership?

Akbar, Cambridge, UK

The great Winston Churchill must turning in his grave...

William, London,

The war on terror is not against a country it is with Islamic Jihadist. Wake up England!

Debra, Claremore, Oklahoma

Com'n everyone ,just try to have your own research about The Islam and The holy Quran, The Islam is religion of peace and brotherhood, never ever the islam preaching for hateful Or any kind of sedition, I'm muslim and i'm married with a woman who converted to Islam, My wife was Christians and she never believed in that the islam is religion of sedition before she converted to the islam, and this kind of people like this (Imam) they're completly wrong, nobody can agree with him,only who really doesn't know (THE FACT OF THE ISLAM)

Adel Bashir, fray bentos, Uruguay

How can one judge a man in his entirety from one small article? How well does Andrew Norfolk know this man? His views on Riyadh ul Haq appear to be one-sided. He and the media continue to mislead the general public with facts, by manipualting the truth to achieve there own agenda. Those who choose to believe Andrew Norfolk and not question him, need to re-think there position on all of this. One can only understand a man from spending time with him. Perhaps people who are just constantly attacking him should resort to other ways of learning and understanding his teachings. For example, listen to his talks in a collective manner, and not just those which may fortify your hatred for Islam. Don’t rely on the media for the whole truth.

Marshall Floyd, Coventry, UK

As a self professed moderate white middle class person the tone of the comments on here read like something out of the 19th or 20th century which is distinctly worrying.

The idea that the UK is some iron clad and static entity is both false and dangerous because it is always used to defend religious bigotry. It seems that we are reverting back to the era of popish plots and suspect loyalties; I just hope we keep the facists far enough at bay to stop a return to the stakes!

As for Islam there are internal debates that are being had and are ongoing. Sadly the media seems more content to whip up histeria in the public interest rather than report (the boring) reality of the Islam of the majority of the young people in this country!

John, london,

Dear readers of the Times…. I would just like to say please, please and please listen to Sheykhs lectures and audio tapes before making any assumption over this noble person.

Ask yourself this question? Isn’t it funny how some people are partaking in forwarding negative views against Shaykh and by GOD not a single of them read or listened to any his talks?

I have been attending Shaykhs lectures for a number of years now, and have found NO fault with his teachings. In fact his teachings had encouraged me to distance myself away from having any kinds of hatred thoughts towards other people.

Mr ‘Andrew Norfolk’ is out of this world, a dangerous man whose sole purpose is to incite hatred into people’s hearts. Surely he is looking for a promotion through his deceitful allegation (may God forgive him). Men like him needs to be arrested and eradicated from position of power to protect the innocent people so they may live harmoniously together.

Ahmed, Birimingham, England

I fear for my gandchildrens life,our goverments are weak not one will dare to speak out at these islamic tyrants, they are allowed to preach death and destruction to us in our own country. For gods sake lets start to say enough is enough and get them out! Who are these do gooders human righters!? please can we have names and faces to these law makers, who make up human rights laws for these kinda tyrants, western haters?? and a completly differant one for us! WHO are they.... OOHHH could they be muslim?! Laws for the foreigners and a law for us Brits, GOD help us.

jan, yorks, uk

If we continue to allow this teaching and radicalisation of our Moslem population we will have in about 7-10 years time all of the violence and bombing that we see and hear about in Iraq.

Islam wants the world to be at peace, not peace and goodwill as preached by chritianity, but the oppression of Islam obtained by the gun and the bomb.

If they hate the west so much, they can return to their country of origin and go back to living in tents and mud brick buildings and we won't visit them. We can build a wall around them and forget about them.

Osiris, Leeds, Yorkshire

Can someone give me a projection for how history may unfold from this moment without bloodshed and tears?

Muslims: For goodness sake, time is running out for you to sort yourselves out so that you can actually live within western society.

Even if it's just 10 or 15% who wish to 'talebanise' and segregate themselves, don't you see that this will come to affect all of us, but you worst of all?

If you don't wish to live in a liberal western civilisation, then please, for all of us - non muslim and 'integrationist' muslims alike, leave the country and emigrate to Saudi or some other islamic nirvanah.

The people of this country might have been totally clueless about the problem for the last 30 years and they might still be dulled by 'PC', but when they do finally see the scale of the problem, it is going to get out of control very quickly.

Andy, London,

Story after story from England reveals a once proud country voluntarily concealing its flag, its patron saint, its culture, language and history, all in a cowardly attempt to appease those who cannot be appeased.

Those preaching violence and hatred must be held to account for their words and actions.

I pray that England wakes up.

Mark, Chicago, Illinois, USA

Talk is cheap and views opinionated by perceptions from the media have no value. As for the radicals, when someone is pushed to limits from the incompetence of those governed by them locally, nationally, internationally, then they resort to making statements in insane ways.

Having read earlier comments, I’d love to see how followers of a religion are ousted from this country.

As for Sheik Riyadh ul Haq, I think he is a god send and many will do well to follow his example.

Hussain, London,

Omid, Dubai - you can do what you like in Dubai for as long as like, but don't bother doing it here.
Bin Laden a "Noble and civilised character"? "Giving one's life to bring Justice"? Oh, sure!
And when you can prove there's a "God", perhaps you could explain how you did it.

Dave, Southampton, UK

Why does everybody learn things from the Media. I call you fools for thinking Islam is from what you see on the Media. Go to Shaykh Riyadul Haqs lectures and learn for yourselves. Get your self off youre sofas and learn the truth.

Muhammad Rahman, London, UK

Folks, we have more important things to do, like finding those weapons of mass destructions in Iraq.

stanzler, ny, usa

In my experienc eof reading Muslim apologists I'd want a second opinion on the validity of the label Deobandi, besides the poster above - from a non-Muslim or an ex-Muslim. A Muslim who hands out the usual accusations of hatred and bigotry and calls for peace and love without regretting or even mentioning the myriad acts of violence committed in the name of his religion in recent years, is, quite frankly, a man whose word is not to be trusted.

wally greeninker, newport, gwent, UK

Whether you are Jewish, Christian or Muslim, Islam will never convert the entire world by violence. America won't tolerate another 9/11 and neither should any other country. I suggest England quit funding at home education of any violence wielding sect. This Deobandis sect who speak of blood shed in the name of Allah. Personally, thinking of a God who is so full of hate and rage is a God I'd rather not think of meeting. How many Jews and Christians call for their members to commit suicide and take those within range of their body bombing with them? And yes, the Jews thrived when Islam ruled but they were treated like second class citizens and Christians were killed. And you are so correct Mr. Petrov, Muslims have already decided but I chose not to think like Deobandis and I refuse to wear something that looks like a phone booth because I am a woman. We all need to be intolerant of those propagating violence just because we don't believe as they do. No football, no chess? Think not.

Anita, San Diego, USA

EXTREME = Binge drinking
EXTREME = Hooliganism & mob culture
EXTREME = Teenage pregnancy
EXTREME = High crimes
EXTREME = Breakdown of family structure and moral values
EXTREME = Bombing people in the name of freedom, democracy and human rights

-->
MODERATE = No intoxicants
MODERATE = No sex before marriage --> healthy family life
MODERATE = Noble & civilized character
MODERATE = 'Giving one's life' to bring Justice
MODERATE = Serving God and people
MODERATE = Oppose the disbelievers in God

Don’t Panic!
I’m Islamic!

Peace!

Omid, Dubai,

Please stop villifying the most peaceful and tolerant religion on earth, which is islam. These statements are all taken out of context and misinterpreted because your thoughts processes are tainted with islamophobia. Please learn about islam from the right sources and turn off the TV a little bit. The most prosperous time for jews was under islamic rule (read about muslim in andalucia)

farima, Rochester,

My Dear Brainwashed Tariq, It is apparent that you attend one of these radical professing mosques. I'll go real slow so even you can understand...Isalm is not the problem. It is the radical fundamentalists that have perverted your religion, and you, to barbaric acts of eveil that will be repaid by the one true God. the god of the Bible (or as you say the "book"). Ismail, if you actually believe and feel whatyou say...STAND UP and be counted and defeat these dark-ages radicals who desire to rule the world with sharia law.

Malc, New York, USA

Even when Islam isn't being used to sponsor hatred, intolerance and war it still has the potential to turn this way at any time. Look at the way "moderate" Turkey and Malaysia are going - and one of these is a future EU state! Islam is simply incompatible with Western culture. One day we will have to choose, but mst Muslims have alredy decided.

Stefan Petrov, London, UK

From the crusaders to current none Musilm leaders, the fight against Islam continues, yet the messege of failur has not been recognised.

Is it not time you None Muslims remind youselfe that Islam is the true and final religion, and you will never defeat the word of Allah.

What have you learnt? The weapons of MASS DISTRUCTION IS YOU THE NONE BELEAVERS....

Aurangzieb , Nuneaton , UK

I have just been listening to the home secretary, Jackie Smith, where Andrew Marr asked about this problem. Amazingly it was a 30 second question & answer, ' our methods are working' she said !
Frankly I feel this whole thing is a powder keg, when I hear the words ' hearts & minds' it confirms how far off the government is on this problem.
Trying to get Muslims to change their minds on all they have been brought up with is insulting to them & a waste of time for us.
I feel strongly that any Imams preaching like the ones now exposed should without doubt be deported, no second chances, no PC rules applied, if Imams wants Sharia law , don't come to England.
No more Mosques should be built, minarettes silenced & no more Korans in schools, no faith schools.
Schools should deffinitely be secular.
Any brain washing of religion can be done at home not in school.
Islam conflicts with our way of life, Muslims should stop flaunting their dress & constant disappoval, if you don't like it leave

Maggie Millington, Brittany , France

I've seen repeated comments on this board expressing consternation as to why these folks would choose to live in the west if they find its so abominable and suggesting they might emmigrate to an Islamic paradise of their choice. But that won't happen . . and the reason why is expressed quite clearly in another article published today in TimesOnline by Andrew Norfolk, and I quote:
___________________

"Justice Muhammad Taqi Usmani argues that Muslims should live peacefully in countries such as Britain, where they have the freedom to practise Islam, only until they gain enough power to engage in battle.
His views explode the myth that the creed of offensive, expansionist jihad represents a distortion of traditional Islamic thinking. "
____________________________
They will not leave because they are required to expand the borders of Dar al Islam by imposing Islamic law on the populace.

It's just that simple.

Omar, Plains,

First of all Deobandi is not a 'sect' it is a word derived from the name of a city in India called Deoband. That city has an old and famous religious seminary which over the years must have trained thousands of scholars, many of whom started their own seminaries in different parts of the world. If you take an aggregate of total number of scholars produced by all these seminaries combined then that number must be in hundreds of thousands if not millions. Just quoting one person out of all the scholar and then to paint everyone with the same brush should not be called an 'investigative report'.

Secondly, if an Oxford-educated person starts his own school than the new school would not be called an Oxfordian school. Similarly, these seminaries started by Deoband-trained scholars should not be called Deobandi madrassas. The original Deoband seminary has no control over these other seminaries.

Thirdly, let us all (including the media) spread love and peace instead of hatred and bigotry.

Manzerm, Boston, USA

So yet again we are trying to twist people's words and create more divisions and mistrust of yet another religious group. Riyadh Ul Haq is a very decent, intelligent and thoughtful person who strives to apply his skills and knowledge in the best way possible. Shame on us for being so ignorant and blindly believing these newspapers who are only out to increase their sales. Why can't we focus on the millions dead in Iraq which only happened because a few liars said the words "weapons of mass destruction". What did Afghanistan do to derserve a state terrorist attack? Instead of dealing with issues, we bash Islam, the only logical and proven religion in the world, with countless followers (all of which could not possibly be terrorists). Funny that we didn't have such a religiously biased media when dealing with the IRA terrorism issue.

Zubayr, Birmingham, UK

It is a total an utter lie against Shaykh Riyadh Ul-Haq. I've never met such a peaceful, calm and collective person. In no way has he ever incited racial or religous hatred.
I have read and listened to the so called transliterated texts in the papers. You have definitley taken it out of context and taken snippets out of a lecture and placed it into a paper.
You would have to listen to whole speech to understand the context of the speech. When you watch a movie would you just watch a small snippet and say 'Hey we know what its all about, we get it' and stop watching the Movie? Didn't think so. You can't take little bits of a lecture and expect to understand it, obviously it wouldn't sound right.
The articles suggested that Hindus are also ridiculed, well get this I am from a massive family of all Hindus and embraced Islam many many years ago. I have listened to the lectures and they don't suggest any religious hatred. The papers are 1million% wrong on this one.......Peace

Hamza Abdur-Rahman, Staffs, United Kingdom

I am one who was converted by this man the only reason i came to terms with islam is with the words of peace as Scholar riyadh has said the mercy of god is far more greater than many men or anyone you can think of. He did not express any hate towards anyone in his speechs nor did he not mention any form of hate towards the west. However he has said their are many current issues that revalte around the east and god help all of us (does this sound anything like a man who would create destruction as he wants god to help all). We are all aware of the easts problem through media but never have i such heard words of violence or any form of conflict against anyone.

Steven Arkwright, Kent,

After reading this article I am gob smacked, I mean this is the furthest one can go away from the truth. Obviously this is an unfair and an indecent attack on a man or a group that has endeavored to enlighten the youths of today to lead a just and a fruitful life by realizing their objective in life which is to please their creator, and for those speculative people it means to be just and kind to all human beings whatever their creed or color. I would also encourage people to buy Riyadh ul haq’s audio tapes and CDs to find out for themselves if he is a threat to this country or an exemplary role model for the youths and Muslims.

Asad, Bedforshire, UK

congratulations to Andrew Norfolk evidently he is an expert in cut and paste. Ihave personly known riaz-ul haq for a long time and heard many of his speeches. mr norfolk has gone through hundreds of his speechees and has distorted his words.once again this seems a greater campain to discredit the peaceful religon of islam. well done!

Z TAYLOR, LEICESTER, UK

Dear readers of the Times... I would just like to say that I have been listening to Shaykhs lectures in audio and attending his seminars for a while now and have not heard him say anything harmful to any sects nor people of different faith, these are false allegations made by the media and they have taken things out of context, which they are very well known for. The Shaykh is a well respected person and has a vast knowledge of the Hadith and Quran. I would kindly suggest people to listen to his lectures and attend his seminars before making any conclusions to his character.

Muhammad, Burnley, United Kingdom

I cannot personally see what relevance any religion has in present day society. Society has been evolving and developing rapidly in the UK, whereas religions evolve and develop at about the rate of continental drift, or not at all in the cases of Catholicism and Islam. It follows that religions will always be centuries out of date, and their dogma therefore of no practical use in our time. We have the law to deal with differences between right and wrong, and we obviously need to use it.

Dave, Southampton, UK

Shiek Riyadhul Haque is a very fine person anyone who have met him will have the same view.The media always make false allegations just to make up a good story and to confuse people why do you have good person look bad.

Saif uddin, wednesbury, west midlands

As an English convert to Islam, I find the criteria of the Deobandi contradictory to the instructions from God in the Quran. Islam, Submission is between ones soul and its creator. My faith and how I chose to follow Islam, Submission has nothing whatsoever to do with the Deobandi or anyone else. God says He gave us ears, eyes and brains and as individuals we should use what we have been given to decided for ourselves. We do not need any man to teach us faith. Faith comes from God and He will be judge over all of us. So maybe the Deobandi would do well to remember that God is in control of everything. God doesn't need their brutal intervention to bring people to Islam. Down with the Deobandi I say. Ungrateful hypocrites. I have God on my side too!

Linda Heywood, London, England

England has seen better days.

RM, New York, USA

It is time to make a stand before it is too late and we have a re run of Germany in the 1930's.

If you want a country that can live togeather, get on with each other, have various religons, work togeather then we need to take radicalisim in hand NOW!!

Otherwise all it will take is some carismatic hard liner of the far right to cause further problems. Then I ask my self who will
the "British" follow when there backs are against the wall?

So come on every one no matter if you are Muslim, Jewish, Christian, or what ever faith let's pull togeather before it is all too late, because that time may be sooner than you realise.

Smith, farnham, surrey

Islam - the ONLY truth!? This intolerance is one reason for all these problems.

Kannt, Monaco,

To All
Its easy to take a little from here and a little from there to distort the truth. I know sheikh Riyadhul Haq personally he is a good man out to do good and can do a lot of good to society in general if used in the correct manner.

Abu Yusuf, dewsbury, UK

You make your own terrorists by labeling the innocent in a world that has gone mad due to america's paranoia. Justice is not a word you people seem to understand how blind are you to whats happening to the world. open your eyes islam is not the enemy.

Shinta Oliman, Mutrailanga,

Dear readers, the ’Haq’ you’re on about, stands for truth, now to put things in perspective this absurd idea that Shaykh Riyad Ul Haq is preaching extremism is far from the truth, but rather tolerance, dignity and a code of behaviour which is enlightening society.

Today we are all facing unprecedented influences and encroachment in our lives, not to mention the degradation of communities and human values. I would sincerely advise all readers to listen to his talks or to attend his seminars before conceiving premature conclusions

A. Islam, Birmingham, England

The way of Islam is a slow but sure one. They are patient and determined. As they radicalize their growing following, they increase their numbers through immigration and larger families. Western Europe is in the process of changing, sitting on the sidelines and watching while the Islamic fundamentalists grow ever stronger.

Doug, New Orleans, USA

To Barry Holroyd
You dont know much & confused matters. The verse you quoted was specifically directed at PAGANS, the arab idol worshippers, who wanted to destroy the early muslims. Christians & Jews & other faiths like sabeans & hanifs are not pagans.
Secondly, that verse you say cancelled the previous verses is what extremists claim but its for their twisted goals to fool ignorant people. That verse does not abrogate previous verses that ordered tolerance & compassion.
You quote a site on the net, these sites are misleading, you are way out of your depth.

s ahmed, cairo,

Some people think right is wrong, and wrong is right. I fully support Shaykh Riyadhul Haq and I dont believe he made such comments without there being explanations.

Abdur Rahman, London, UK

When the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is so very kind that when Mecca fell to Muslims and the Holy Prophet entered the city victorious, all those who had treated him and his followers with cruelty received his free pardon, without asking for it. Thirteen years of persecution were forgiven and forgotten in one single moment. A True God (or His messenger) would not have the need to ask for persecution/compassion!
These are just 2 examples of compassion and peace that Islam sets forth... Bit likeJesus really, when he embarked on forgiveveness, starting with Judas.

Honestly, don't you think it is about time the British Council of Muslims and other related bodies bodies showed some backbone and show which side they are on? They are so cagey (AND OLD), aided by our own politicians but I do get the feeling we are dealing with an honourable lot, desperately trying, but disasterously failing to control reality in the UK. Don't blame them - just employ younger sensible people/politicians etc.

LH, Warminster,

When will the British people finally realize that those who are responsible for making the laws no longer believe in "nationhood?"

Your leaders equate love of country with jingoism. They regard the past as the repository of error and your proud history as nothing more than a shameful chronicle of oppression.

They're glad that Britain will soon be no more.

Unlimited immigration of alien elements who are hostile to your traditions is a means to an end, the end of your autonomy as a people.

Prime Director, Sacramento, Northern Californa

Having a mother who originates from the deobandi sect and a father who originates from the Barelwi sect, Having learnt about both sects, none preach violence and the values are very much the same. Henceforth the conclusion I come to as many young muslims that we are simply muslims- followers of peace , not followers of any sect. It is the older generation who have one foot in the grave, that have made the sects, due to power hungry struggles.But most muslims are simply muslims -thats it. As a beautiful women who covers her hair- I would also like to add that I started to wear it because I thought my voice,opinion,strength & personality was more important.Just as Mary, mother of Jesus was not oppressed for wearing the clothes she did, niether are we, so quit the pretence concern,people are just upset that they don't get to ogle at us.As a feminist ,I find many negative aspects of society (anorexia, bulimia, bullying,low self confidence, pride) to be eliminated through wearing the scarf

ANISA, LONDON, UK

Khateeb, islam means "submission". Why don't YOU take a closer look at islam.

David, Tampa, Florida, USA

The comments by Abu Musa, from Manchester, make me furious! They say, ' Britain just needs to put up with it. ' Why should we put up with people coming to this country and hating us and trying to destroy us? I will vote for any politician who has the guts to round up every last one of them and deports them!

Bernadette Collins, Kent, England

Who was the ignorant naive fool whose idea it was to allow Muslim hordes to invade Britain when they hate us and many want us to die?

Angry British Citizen, London, England

I do not understand radical Muslims wanting to live in a Western country if they loathe Western culture and values. Why wouldn't they want to stay in their country of origin where the values are similar to theirs? Just once I wish somebody would answer that question. It's the same with language. If I wanted to live in France or Italy etc, the first thing I would want to do is learn the language. That doesn't seem to be the case here in the U.S.

E Berg, La Crosse, USA

Dan, Oxford. Whats your problem? Ur notes seem to suggest that your views are to the right and not mainstream. You have no knowledge of the subject matter. Its pathetic what do you know about the faith ISLAM. You read an article and then want to debate..This has been blown out of proportion..Lets face it one minuite the extremists are flooding in from overseas so therefore the UK needs to ban overseas preachers and have homegrown imams. Now all of a sudden the homegrowm ones are radical therefore we will have to go for the ones that are deaf and dumb?....Anyway how does one become radical? do you become radical for speaking the truth or expressing an opinion that is different to the rest. What happenned to freedom of speech...

Abdul, Birmingham, UK

Why do the readers of The Times who I regard to be intellectual now go down the road of immigration and deportation. How can you deport people who have a different opinion to you? How was this glorious nation built? On the back of BME communities who fought in world wars for this nation? How many muslims fought in world wars? this is a pathetic debate..I have no problem with Mr Haq he is entitiled to his views? Has anyone asked why oppression exists in palestine? Why is their double standards when dealing with muslim countries? I have a lot of muslim friends and the religion preaches love, tolerance and peace. How many UN resolutions has Israel disobeyed? We are humans we have different likes and dislikes..i personally hate music and can't stand it how is this making you extreme?...I support my local football team and hate our derby rivals in the city does this make me extreme...lets wake up and get real

Danial, Birmingham, UK

Firstly it appears many posters on here are simply not reading the lectures in the first place, and amongst the muslim posters not many actually even understand the meaning of "deobandis" "wahhabis" "barelvis". They arent even "sects".The crazy things is any differences in opinion between them have nothing to do with matters talked about in this article.
The worst comments are just the silly ones that jump in with no relevance to the article just the standard hate mail that creeps in to all these forumns.

Ilyas, London, UK

Has no one also thought that- hey wait a minute the mosques have been around for years and years, and no attacks have occured previously. The attacks have only been started over the last few years and is not due to sudden brainwashing- give the youth abit more credit, what do you think we are? The older generation such as yourselves,that believe everything which is shown and read to you?

But hey? you know what it does coincide with the so called war on terror, which is wasting my taxes year after year, for a cause I don't give a toss about(again another stupid preliminary, power hungry cause) and the only thing it has given me is a feeling of insecurity in the country i was born in(my country) due to hate stares and comments. I'd rather the money be spent on a sensible cause such as Africa or to combat the imminent & realistic changes which is harming us due to climate change. Thank you Andrews generation for giving my generation presents such as global disasters and oh yeah-Hatred

ANISA, LONDON, UK

There is one and only one reason for this investagation by the times, and that is to STOP Blairs £1m funding to boost Islamic studies at UK universities. Native British people are to smart and will not buy into this propaganda. In ALL the mosques where i have visited, we were clearly told to respect and obey British laws/people.

Mohammed, London, UK

Interesting ..... are we fighting the terrorism war in the wrong country?

Time we woke up and started complaining but then that would be racist wouldn't it?

I'm looking forward to Sunday when the local BNP are reading the sermon at the local church, but then he might get arrested might he?

JD, London,

All peace loving Muslims should focus their efforts to convince the true image of Islam to the those who have hijacked their religion, telling non-muslims that Islam is a peaceful religion is pointless, because it doesn't matter what we think, we are not threatening anybody, non muslims are not the problem here, the terrorist are.

Aa far as cynical distractions like American action in Iraq under the spurious cover of concern for Iraqis, where was this when Saddam was tormenting and killing his people, where is it for Darfur, where is it for Iran? I think Muslims should have a dialogue within themselves where the root of the problem lies rather than coming on forums and talking about peaceful religion.

Ronald, Hendon, UK

When will our government wake up to the damage that these arrogant supremacists and hate-mongers are doing?

Many ordinary people are heartily sick of Islamofascism, and cannot undertsand the spineless attitude of the establishment.

Thank you for printing this article. Now how about a sustained journalistic campaign to pressure our leaders to take action?

Andy Gill, London,

Let's face it, our policy-makers have singularly failed to recognise their part in the discipline problems in our schools, and the social problems centred around increasing sections of our younger people. Does anybody really think they're capable of placing aside their politically correct notions of society and integration, to actually recognise the level of threat posed by self-styled islamic fundamentalists undermining our security, usually whilst scrounging large amounts in benefits and free housing from those they purport to despise so much.

These hypocrits and terrorist sympathisers are not representative of the majority of decent, peace-loving muslims, and should be treated like the cowardly, criminal hypocrites they are. Look how long abu hamsa was allowed to spit out his poison and hatred, whilst scrounging benefits and feeding like a leech off those he said he despised. The whole point of making mistakes is that we learn by them. When will our government learn..and act

Will Richards, droitwich,

I think Inga from London has made a very extreme statement i have only 1 thing to say to all this is we are not all the same and should not be painted with the same brush.

Ahmed, Leicester, UK

RIyadh ul Who? Really, Times Journalist looking under shells for dirt.

Rob, London,

Riyadh ul Haq has delivered 100's of lectures over the past decade and are openly available for all to buy and listen. I would recommend all readers to buy as many as you can and make your own judgements rather than relying on a few selected phrases from a few selected lectures gathered for a certain agenda. What has been portrayed in this investigation is that Mr ul Haq preaches a message of non violence, but is not afraid to speak up against oppression in all its forms.

Idris, London,

To: William James-Smith, LONDON,

Sir you are categorically insane. The US is a country that that is ruled by the first democratically established constitution. It is the interpretation of that constitution by the people of the US that presently protects the lives and safety of Islamic terriorists and abettors that are being detained and the almost absolute liberty and property of the many atheists that detest evangelical Christians.

As for the UK, the world owes the situation in the Middle East to Winston Churchill and other lawfully elected and appointed UK government officials from the 1850's through the 1940's. Thank you very much.

Riley Still, Atlanta, GA, USA

Time to round up the radilcal Muslims and send them on a one-way trip to Afghanistan with a mid-flight dropoff of about 27,000 ft. sans parachute.

Jesus, Britain won't let its own citizens to carry weapons to protect themselves on their own streets but will tolerate radical Islamofascists preaching the killing Westerners in right there under their very noses. It's time to scrap the constiutional monarchy and re-establish a true monarchy. At least a king with some testosterone could protect the tiny island nation of Britain - it's own ciizens appear pretty worthless and confused in that regard.

Scott, Durham, NC, USA

The Achilles heel of "Democracy" is demographics.

Biblically speaking, It's the clay mixed with iron.

DRS, Omaha, NE, USA

<BLOCKQUOTE>but dont you agree that if people accepted other peoples differences then the world would be a much more peaceful place?</BLOCKUOTE>

I'd much rather have equal rights and justice, not the peace of dhimmi-hood

stevek, miami, usa

May I suggest to Ben from London that he read a great deal more about Islam, and, in praticular, source texts like the Qur'an and the Hadith collections, or modern writings from ther various radical groups. There is much that Islam teaches that is praiseworthy, but there is a great deal that needs to be confronted. Islam is the only religion to command violence against non-believers, the only religion to say that it is a duty to hate unbelievers, and so on. Since the 19th century, reformist Muslims have looked for ways round this, or the teachings on women, or the laws on adultery, homosexuality and other 'criminality'. But they have met with little overall success. People like the Deobandis, the Tablighat-i Islami, the Wahhabis, the Muslim Brotherhood, and Salafis in general have retained considerable influence and are expanding it. Meanwhile, Western governments shrug their shoulders and do their level best never to offend any of these radicals. Not even in the name of human rights.

Dr. Denis MacEoin, Newcastle upon Tyne, UK

No surprise. It's standard Islamist practise under the doctrine of at-Taqqiyah to misled infidels- read the sayings of Islamist preachers in their original languages to their own congregations and the vast gulf with their pacific statements in English will immediately appear.

Islamists are wolves in sheep's clothing.

All radical Islamists, not just overt jihadis, even senior clerics in respected Goverment appointed positions share these tendencies. They are after all simply following their examplar diligently, who's detailed biography from Muslim sources is an enlightenment in methods of torture, the frequent assassination of poet critics and the slaughter of civilians.

charles soper, London, UK

It is well know that this country is 'liberal' and welcoming of best of other nationalities and faiths, thus enriching the country for the benefit of all.
Any people who fall below what is held to be decent, law abiding behaviour, all fall under the same heading - wherever they come from and whatever their faith. This problem is no different from any other, in that this sort of extremist behaviour with it's attendent horrors, and possible consequences is completely unlawful. And therefore should be treated as such, by the law of the land. And if the laws don't already exist to ensure the safety of all citizens in the face of such criminals, then it should be updated. That's what governments and the police, law and judicial systems are there for.

TB, London, UK

But what to do with the growing minority of homegrown jihadists?

Alot of the comments above suggests deportation of extremists but I don't think that is the answer. Why? Because radial islam is a disease, a VIRUS. These radicals are sick people. You cant cure a virus by sending the sick abroad because that person will damage that country by infecting other people. And since we live in a globalised world ,eventually that virus will comeback and hurt you in one or another way. Another problem is that most countries are reluctant on letting in these radicals since they have enough problems of their own.

Since this extremist problem is more or less common in the whole of the EU, we should build a "un-radicalisation facility" in a remote, sparsely populated area in Europe. Not a prison but a guarded townlike community where these radicals are isolated from rest of the society. Here they can live normal lifes but have to be educated and enlightend to go back to the real world

Mikael, Stockholm, Sweden

Actually, the Islamist was written by a man of no faith who changed his real name to Ed Hussain,due to him finding his first muslim name offensive. He probably would change his skin colour if he could as well. He is again a stupid person who did find the radical method interesting. As the radical form was created by society rejects anyway(just like the people who walk into schools and shoot kids in USA-rejected by the majority). Ed Hussain is like the other attention seeking, greedy muslims and UK press, which have decided to put panic in the peoples minds to take advantage of the current climate(and make a quick buck). So lets not bring Mr Tom into the discussion, it would be embarassing relating him to muslims who have more sense than to join extremes. He went from one extreme to another, from people hating to self hating.

ADAM, LONDON, UK

How does this tie in with the Governments enouragement and sponsorship of faith schools?

Liz, Colchester,

Farrukh:
So again, I welcome dialogue with our government to help, empower the everyday Muslim with the knowledge that is required to counter the points of view put forward by such people.

How are you going to do that?
The question has to be raised, "Did Muhammad endorse jihadism?". And if the answer is yes, how can you ever counter the views of the hardliners?

In my opinion, Muhammad endorsed jihad in the later stages of his life. You only have to read Surah 9, Bukhari & Muslim, the Sira and what various luminaries of the 4schools of Islamic jurisprudence say. Then you have the example the Caliphs : Abu Bakr, Uthman, Umar & Ali did following Muhammads death. Egypt, Jerusalem, Syria will all conquered in 637AD-641AD. So what have you got going for you that your views are right? If Umar presents the 3-options formula that Infidels should accept Islam otherwise pay the Jizya Tax otherwise be killed - why shouldnt British Muslims endorse that?

Shawn, London, England

when will the government wake up we british no longer want these none working british hateing murdering, what else can one say, lots im sure. the immans and there followers should be sent back to were they came from if they hate BRITAIN as much as they preach.

MR ANGRY , preston,

It's pretty simple to me. In the United States you have Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religion. EXCEPT there is not 'Freedom of Speech nor Freedom of Religion to promote a Crime.

Margaret, North Carolina, USA

Dear readers, the ’Haq’ you’re on about, stands for truth, now to put things in perspective this absurd idea that Shaykh Riyad Ul Haq is preaching extremism is far from the truth, but rather tolerance, dignity and a code of behaviour which is enlightening society.

Today we are all facing unprecedented influences and encroachment in our lives, not to mention the degradation of communities and human values. I would sincerely advise all readers to listen to his talks or to attend his seminars before conceiving premature conclusions.

A. Islam, Birmingham, England

"Wake up Stupid people your childrens future is at risk. Ban this evil cult and deport all muslims from the west!" --Inga Svendson, London, UK

I was born here, therefore i am a British Muslim. I will take your advice and kick my self out of this country. Thank you sir!

British Muslim, Londonistan, United Islamic Kingdom

Actually, the Islamist was written by a man of no faith who changed his real name to Ed Hussain,due to him finding his first muslim name offensive. He probably would change his skin colour if he could as well. He is again a stupid person who did find the radical method interesting. As the radical form was created by society rejects anyway(just like the people who walk into schools and shoot kids in USA-rejected by the majority). Ed Hussain is like the other attention seeking, greedy muslims and UK press, which have decided to put panic in the peoples minds to take advantage of the current climate(and make a quick buck). So lets not bring Mr Tom into the discussion, it would be embarassing relating him to muslims who have more sense than to join extremes. He went from one extreme to another, from people hating to self hating.

ADAM, LONDON, UK

STEVEN GASH

Is the march against Islam still on then, 11th september ?

The last I heard on the radio it had been banned, so I take it DEMOCRACY won. Good news.

Islam is corrupt.

Maggie Millington, Brittany , France

As a muslim I would like to say that Islam has not said to hate jews and christians and what not, I have lived in the UK for 4 years when I was a student first two years I was not wearing hijab the other two I was, and I lived in peace and I have met a lot of people jewish , christian , even athiests.

All of them are still my friends, hate will not solve everything, nither will blood shed, if those extreamists go adn read the Quran again they will see that it is a religion of peace and not hate. I hope from Allah that all the religions and faihs of the world would stand united against war and violence of all kind

Najoud, Kuwait city, State of Kuwait

The Times will not publish what I want to say so much for freedom of speech. The comments by some individuals clearly demonstrate the knowledge of the subject matter. Why do you always resort to deportation of imams. It is clear the media need a hate figure and they are targetting a man who in my opinion has the right to say whatever he chooses. When the Klu Klux Klan or BNP speak at their weekly meetings I don't see The Times reporting on issues....Why do people always talk about taking away civil liberties....I think Mr Haq drives a nice car and is a nice man I have heard his speeches and boy does he rock...now print this...I am a theologists who believes one mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist.

Torbaf Smith, Birmingham,

British Ppakistani Muslims have gone astray and destroyed the good name of Islam. Without proper leadership and guidance, they have been taken in by extremist sects. Without the true guidance of an Imam, Sunnis and Shia sects have lost the true meaning of religion. The Muslim Council is shambolic and should not lead Muslims. The British Government has let these ameteurs represent the face of Islam in Britain. They are not being proper leaders, like Muftis. They are politicians who have used the position for their own ends. Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) would be trully appalled at the way his teachings have been twisted by Deobandis and Wahhabis. He spoke about the Al khitab (People of the Book) Jewish, Christians and Muslims being of one Abrahamic tradition. He spoke of the fact that there had been 999 messengers before him including Buddha, the Hindu mystics, etc. He respected all religions - He saw them as one. Rid Britain of the people who destroy the Muslim Religion

Sureya, Cardiff, UK

Has no one also thought that- hey wait a minute the mosques have been around for years and years, and no attacks have occured previously. The attacks have only been started over the last few years and is not due to sudden brainwashing- give the youth abit more credit, what do you think we are? The older generation such as yourselves,that believe everything which is shown and read to you?

But hey? you know what it does coincide with the so called war on terror, which is wasting my taxes year after year, for a cause I don't give a toss about(again another stupid preliminary, power hungry cause) and the only thing it has given me is a feeling of insecurity in the country i was born in(my country) due to hate stares and comments. I'd rather the money be spent on a sensible cause such as Africa or to combat the imminent & realistic changes which is harming us due to climate change. Thank you Andrews generation for giving my generation presents such as global disasters and oh yeah-Hatred

ANISA, LONDON,

Under this left wing government we have had a decade of appeasement. Appeasement of a mass of migrants who detest Western values, burn our flag, burn effigies of Westerners and who regularly issue 'fatwas' against anyone to whom they take a dislike. At the same time they are takers of all of the benefits which accrue to British citizens and they are very quick to shriek 'racist' or 'islamophobia' if anyone dares to query their attitude to non-muslims.
The history books will look back on the attempted islamisation of this country in the latter part of the twentieth century with astonishment. Let's hope for a happy ending, free of these extremists.

Rick, London, England

What we see in Iraq today, could be British Cities in 7-10 years time.

Islamic extremism will increase because they see this as the only way to peace. These extremists want Islam to be the only religion in the world and they will acheive this with the gun and the bomb, If we let them. In Britain we are a live and let live society that has been badly taken advantage of due to our mutli-culturist attitudes.

We must stamp out the extremists that are giving peace loving and sensible hard-working British Muslims a bad name. The powers that be, have stamped out extremist groups like Combat 18 and infiltrated the BNP etc. It is time we stamped out this type of religious extremism before we have to drive about in Armoured cars when shopping or the school Run!

Osiris, Leeds, Yorkshire

Mr Norfolk's information given on the Deobandi group is incorrect:

The Deobandi group originate from the Indian sub continent and are an off-shoot of the traditional Sunni Hanafi school of thought, they are in themselves more traditional than their opposite group, the Barelwis.

The Deobandis are not a centralised institution, this man is not going to be the "Spiritual leader of Deobandis in the UK" because simply, they do not have a spiritual leader. Most of the Mosques in the UK are independent of each other, and Riyadh ul Haq's opinions are not, and should not, be taken as the same as the majority of the Mosque's in this country, or for that matter to be seen to represent the view of the majority of the views that the Deobandi group hold.

I fail to see how the Deobandis can be termed a "hardline Islamic sect" based on the sermons of one person. The Deobandis are on the majority a moderate group, and one person's views should not be taken to represent the majority.

Mohammed Khan, London, UK

its about time we all woke up to the fact that you cant go around the world murdering and massacring innocent people in the name of democracy and not have a backlash..the simple solution is to stop the genocide of muslims and the rape of their resources and then we can all live happily ever after

tom, derby,

'Nu Labour' will do nothing to aleinate the moslem community for fear of losing their vote so nothing will be done about this threat to our country until it is too late.

David, Worthing, UK

Well done to the Times for finally giving this news the light of day! As per usual the existing political parties are too scared of being politically incorrect to take any effective action.

Europe has a solution to such problems and you don't have to go back too far to find it. It's just a question of how bad do things have to get before Political Correctness finally gets abandoned along with its apologists at the BBC.

Nicholas, Clayton, CA, USA

I have read all five of this man’s speeches. Two questions may be asked of his extremism. First, is it theologically based – does the Quran actually order Muslims to avoid, harm or exterminate non-Muslims? Second, are Muslims being victimized around the world because of their faith?

To the first question, we would be hard-pressed to find many Muslim imams who interpret the Quran to mean that it is a Muslim’s religious duty to avoid, harm or kill non-believers simply because they are non-believers.

To the second question, ul-Haq argues that Muslims are deliberately victimized all over the world, and have a duty to defend themselves. But Muslims are not oppressed in countries like Indonesia, Malaysia, Morocco, Turkey. In the Balkans, Serbs fought Croatians just as readily as they did Muslims: the war was about territory. Similarly, in Chechnya, the Russians wish to maintain as much of their former Soviet territory as possible. In countries like Egypt and Pakistan, it is Mu

Richard, London,

That article is a farce on so many levels.

We've had Shaikh Riyadh ul Haq deliver talks at our University nevermind anywhere else!

Being a resident of Leicester myself and also being very familiar with some of the clerics mentioned above it's a shame that the media has to throw things so out of context.

Look what happend with Chan 4 Dispatches "Under Cover Mosque" - The reporter is now under investigation by the Police for misconstruding the truth by editing video clips and so forth.

How long before the same happens to Andrew Norfolk.

Articles fulls of false accusations and misconceptions such as this one are one of the root causes of "Islamaphobia" and end up causing trouble.

Those responsible should be arrested and held accountable.

Someone, Leicester,

hey, what happens when we get over the muslims??? perhaps the black kids can start shooting their schoolmates, or maybe the eastern europeans can be free to rape & murder us... this country has had the michael ripped out of it too long... keep britain british

p davies, Derby, england

Z. Khan: "Islam means Peace and submission."

More accurately, Islam means peace THROUGH submission. That is, if you want peace you have to submit to islam, i.e. become a dhimmi & subject to Islamic law. This in accordance with the dictates of Mohammad, who instructed his followers to summon the conquered peoples to three choices: Conversion to Islam, submission as dhimmis (and payment of the Jizyah); or jihad. Offensive action is REQUIRED by Q9:5 in order to establish the supremacy of Islam.
Once Islam reaches a sufficent concentration, it WILL establish its own government and laws. If those laws aren't accepted by the larger society (as in a two -tiered system), they will be applied extra-judicially until the muslim portion of the state can gain its autonomy, generally though violence, intimidation & Warfare.

Remember Dispatches Channel 4, Undercover mosque? " . . . . You MUST live as a state within a state until you take over . . ."

Omar, Plains,

Several commenters have spoken of the true meaning of the Q'uran and Islam. Neither Islam nor the Q'uran can be understood without knowledge of the doctrine of abrogation and consequently of the life of Mohammed and the chronologic sequence of the Q'uran.

The message changed as the life of Mohammed progressed. Without understanding these changes and the doctrine of abrogation, which holds that later verses overrule earlier, one cannot understand Islam.

Fred, Birmingham, AL, USA

some people will do any thing to make sure that muslims are neaver at peace. beacuse muslims follow islam which means pease with all .and some muslims have become tool of hidden agganda .good and bad can be found in west east north south.no one is perfact but allah the creater of all.let us debate what is right and wrong .islam forbids intrest in any form of lending.this is why those who countrol all the money lending on interst. hate islam.they use all tools to give muslim s bad name inclouding some so called muslim s by saying doing things which has nothing to do with islam. let us fase it all of us are slaves of money lenders on intrest. does anyone knows how to be free? yes islam does.read quran it is for all mankind.

mr shabir hussain, skipton bd23 1ss, england uk

My view is that these fundamental muslims-the so called jehadis are basicaly twisted and cannot listen to reason like ordinary citizens.They get led by their clerics like cattle and sheep and are responsible for branding islam as a terrorist enterprise.So much so that all types of muslims are today suspect

India has a large muslim population which by and large is OK barring a few known pockets and wants to be part of the mainstream-want jobs,build buisnesses and send their children to good schools etc.
One of the reasons for this is that in India there is a very low threshold for other communities tolerating their antics.They have learnt the hard way that bad behaviour like bombing people and places,threatening other communities and generally spreading hatred can have immedeate repercussions like a rap on the knuckles

The british are too civilised for these ruffians.Maybe they can learn some lessons from India

AKSKrishna, London, UK

Face facts, they are doing what they like in the UK, the goverment is funded by them ( second biggest donator to labour after unions) as read in the Times, and don't give a damn what the public think on so called multiculturalism. if i look where i grew up, its gone from one street to the whole town becoming like a muslim enclave, i not racist, but this is wrong, we were a democracy, Islam isn't, so how can the two ideologies live side by side?.....stock up with rations because we will just end up like yugoslavia was fifteen years ago......

Tell me im wrong, because the evidense and history are all on my side nomatter what the politicaly correct left wing tell the media and public.

Great Britain is sadly dieing.

Shanre, Clitheroe, lancs

"music is a way in which Jews spread “the Satanic web” to corrupt young Muslims"

It would be funny if it wasn't so dangerously serious.

We need to ask ourselves if encouraging such an openly malignant religion in our midst is really such a good idea...

Alan, Edinburgh,

It would be more appropriate to describe Deobandis as puritanical and ultra-conservative than "hardline" or "radical". Riyadh ul Haq's anti-Westernism needs to be understood in the context of a general anti-worldism, where Jihad is conceived primarily as a fight against occupying non-Muslim colonial forces in Muslim lands. I would guess his most widely read book is actually on salah (Muslim prayer). He and his supporters pose no threat to national security and no Deobandi Imam "controls" any British mosque - mosques are run by committees who invariably limit what Imams are permitted to say in their khutbah. Moreover, Barelwi groups such as Minhaj ul-Qur'an are far more successful at recruiting Britian's demographically young Muslim population.

Yunus Yakoub Islam, Huddersfield, UK

Its people like Mr Ul Haq who give my religon the wrong image. They call themselves muslims but forget the basic teaching of tolerance.

Mr Ul Haq refers to 'Their Big Macs and Cokes'. Had people like yourself been focusing on success then perhaps the muslim world would have been more economically successful. We are very quick at critisising the so called western world but should learn from their strengths.

Also I dont think it is rocket science to get a simple message and that is to mind your own business. Every muslim according to you is branded a fundamentalist. This is because of representatives of the religion like yourself who have no concept of respect and tolerance and unfortunately majority of us get branded as a 'fundamentalist' because of a minority of narrow minded people like yourself.

I am a muslim and proud to be one but when people like you give my religion such an image, it hurts and upsets me.

Sort yourself out!

Amer Siddiqui, London, UK

Where is the police report? I'd think you had a responsibility to show the report. Until it is made available to the public, this article's factuality is up in the air. So I say to the author: Fetch the facts and show them otherwise this is questionably just a Muslim-hate peace drawing support for conflict. Am I wrong? Should I just believe that "a reporter saw a police report"?

Richie Vanderlubbe, Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Why have we seen our country filled with people of other faiths when the majority of ourselves are no longer religious.

Surely after shrugging off our own religious yoke we are horrified to see another religion wishing to impose itself upon us too.

And here we have yet more evidence pointing to a simple fact that Immans are actively preaching discontent in mosques around the country. More concerning though is they actually have an audiance who listens to them. Surely any sensible person would not allow their children near such a place. The fact that they do is rather worrying.

But lastly why are they still able to do this after years of it been reported in the media. Why if we can no longer say boo to a gohst are these people allowed to continue in this fashion.

Tough action is needed not someone in slippers who will creep around the issue instead of tackling it head on.

ibbo, leeds, Yorkshire

Nick Griffin was persecuted for telling the truth about islam being a vicious, wicked faith. Just to prove the point look these two up on the web
Al-taqiyya
Mufa'khathat.
Now tell me these are the kind of people you want to let into your lives. Everyone has the right to follow their own religion, but let them do it in their homeland and not here, where it goes against everything we believe in.

craig pond, stoke-on-trent,

I live in an area of London with a large Muslim population - people who live in our country but are overtly hostile to it and to the British people. From my own experience, I find it impossible to believe that "only a small minority" of Muslims are extremists. The truth is that many Muslims are extremists, and a solid majority would be content to see Britain become a majority Muslim country. In the circumstances, tolerance is not merely a foolish but fatal.

Stu G, London,

He only wants to ban art, music, and television so today’s young muslims don’t have their own minds. Islam is turning into a dictatorship religion which needs updating for modern free living. If they don't agree with that then I suggest they go to a country that practices the old ways of suppression.

How can he possibly get away with saying such things in this country. I am getting sick of our tolerant view on these so called radical people. Why don’t we become more radical and deport them?

John, Hartlepool, North East

"In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.” "

The above comments and ul Haq's utterances and actions are atrocious! It is well known that many Muslims start wearing the most extremist hats of jihad and terrorism eventually! It is only matter of time.

However, see the spins moderate Muslims and their fellow travelers will give to these actions!

What is happening is a wake up call to the US, UK, Europe and other secular democracies. There should be no mercies to subversions from within and promoters of violence! Why these people are not prosecuted for preaching racial hatreds and promoting violence?

It is better to deport as many shady characters back to, from where they have come, by changing obsolete laws where required. Also, please limit immigrations of unwanted and those who are going to be a liability!
Regards,

Krishna R. Kumar, Udupi, India

Perhaps these people here would care to tell us what they think the government should do. They can hardly lock him up for expressing a dislike of chess and football.

Colin, Cheshire, United Kingdom

Most Muslims are not fanatics but if only 2% of UK Muslims are fanatical enough to drive a car into an airport doorway we have 40,000 of them in the UK. (2% of the UK's 2 million Muslims is 40,000)

Islam is a political organisation as well, most Islamic actions can be described as political not simply religious. Will we ever get an explanation as to how it came about that we allowed so many Muslims into the UK?

Christopher J. , London, UK

How bout deport him?

gary britnell, London,

Liberalism is suicide.

By allowing and excepting nearly everything, the UK (as well as many other Western European nations) has allowed a clear and present 5th Column danger to grow in it's midst. In fact, the UK is so Politically Correct, it is actually FUNDING the educational grants and advancement of those that seek the replacment of the current government with an Islamic one.

Liberals, you should be proud!

DRS, Omaha, NE, USA

This should reinforce the fact that Hindus should not be clubbed as Asians. Now I guess the time has come when Any person from Indian subcontinent should be identified with his or her religion . This is because Islamist Preachers also are waging a verbal war on Hindus.
Why should Hindus be classified with these people as Asians , is it just because they come from the same continent?

sarang, basildon, essex

I am not at all suprised to read such an article, it is what I have been saying will happen in the UK for a very long time. Successive Governments in the UK have failed to control immigration to such an extent now that the British Isles is now in such a terrible mess that there are no possitive figures on the number of immigrants there are in the country, legal or otherwise. My wife and I have now voted with our feet and left the UK for pastures new where immigration is strictly controlled (yes, we are now immigrants) and where we have been made most welcome. Our cost of living has been at least halved and we can walk the streets safely, leave our property unattended and yes, even the health service here is cheaper than the NHS. I served my Queen and Country in two uniforms for over 35 years, but for what for? You can keep the UK, we shall never return.

The Expats 13, Vrysoulles, Cyprus

I cannot believe that our government is just standing by and letting these people spread their poison! They say that the black flag of Islam will fly over Downing Street.

Fact - Hitler tried it and was defeated!
Fact - there are only about 3 million muslims in Britain and of them only about a few percent have radical views, most like the rest of us just want to enjoy "life , liberty and the pursuit of happiness"
Fact - there are 57 million non muslims and quite simply "our gang is biger than your gang"
Fact - at some point the normally very tolerant British people (including non radical muslims) will have had enough of these people and tell them to go to back toe the Middle East where quite frankly they belong
Fact - one day we will invent alternative technologies that do not require oil at which point we will not need their oil and we can leave them to their medieval way of life
Fact - if only Cameron had the guts to say it as it is he would have a landslide!!

Andy D, Liverpool, Great Britain

50% of mosques? Is that the smallest 50%? Unless you weight the mosque by the size of its congregation these numbers are pretty worthless. For all I know from this report this could be less than 5% of Muslim's who go to mosques, and an even smaller number who are being radicalized.

Come look in Harlem, New York (where I live) there are churches on every block. Any statistics on churches in New York City might say the the majority are black evangelical - but perhaps not when you look at congregation size.

Nic Fulton, New York City, USA

Shut down any mosque where hatred is encouraged and/or preached and immediately deport the preachers if they are not British citizens.

If they are British citizens, remove access to their pulpits to ensure they have nowhere to spread their doctrine of hatred and slap them with stiff jail sentences if they continue to do so.

This is a malignant cancer that must be excised.

Bill Foonman, Jacksonville, USA

what happened in Serbia will happen in Britian, but the Muslims wont make the same mistake twice they will make sure they win before starting it - Britain is finished ! It will be a muslim state in 10 years

Paul, bury, Lancashire

John Coy, London, you really are completely deluded. Jihad is for all time - as long as there is Islam there is Jihad. There is only one set of Islamic legal and cultural values. These do not and cannot change - Mohammed was the seal of the prophets and his example is for all time, innovation in religious or social practice is kufr.
If you want to ask about Islamic values start here:
http://ex-muslim.org.uk/

James, Dublin 12, Ireland

What I don't understand is if they loathe western values and have such distaste for the British and Americans, why don't they pack up and go to Iran/Saudia Arabia/Pakistan, etc.

The reason they don't, is because they would not have the freedom and "standard of living" they have in the West.

francis, chicago, USA/Illinois

Poor multiculturalist Britain!
How sensitive (you think) you are!
One thing is sure; this year in my country - while you will be troubled by your senseless politically correctness - we wont be ashamed to say HAPPY CHRISTMAS!
You lost your identity:...from now on you are simply a milkshake of NOTHING!

REQUIEM AETERNAM DONA BRITANNIAE

Alberto, VENEZIA,

Living here in the USA & a Radical Mosque nearby , I only see more events unfolding ( Portland,OR) & in the USA. Regrettably,Muslims have freedom of religion here in the USA but non Muslims do not in any Middle Eastern Country esp. Saudia Arbia. ( One can not even have a Bible in Saudia). We should disallow any Religious group who promotes Hatred & Death to Non -Believers should have any Church Benefit denied them. Regrettably, that will not stop the spewing of a Hatred toward people who are not like me.

Mitch Stanley, Portland, Oregon

"Many had their studies funded by local education authority grants". Sorry, but you've got to laugh - Britain's fast becoming a joke.

Jonathan, Auckland,

"whosoever killeth a human being it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind." (5:33)

Care to share the verse that comes directly after that?

Or would that be too honest for a "moderate" muslim who is completely set on lying so that sharia law can replace british law?

MM, Andover, UK

This is for "Richard of London." Oh yeah, it's all the religious people who are the problem. Mr. ul Haq and his followers are no different than any other people of religious faith. And, the answer to all this is... ...education! Well, all right then. Boy, that sure worked out real well against the last army of fanatics.

It's amazing to me that someone can stand on ground desecrated by Heinkel and Dornier bombs, V-1s and V-2s and utter such nonsense.

"One ought never to turn one's back on a threatened danger and try to run away from it. If you do that, you will double the danger. But if you meet it promptly and without flinching, you will reduce the danger by half."

Mike, Irvine, CA, USA

This is all stupid i am a muslim my self i have never heard of these sects or people. i am british muslim and proud one too i will fight for this country. these stories are making us muslims sound like animals we are people that respect others they are those who give us real bad name. These muslims bombers are just like the South korean who attacked the college in USA and killed 30 students brianless and mentally disturbed

peries, oxford, England

Great Britain is suffering from the left leaning politicians like America. Lets hope they can do whats right and light our darkest hour. Become a beacon for the world and deal with these islamist monsters in the most brutal way possible. Deport them to France. :)

patrick , birmingham, USA

Enough is enough. Why can we not eject these types from our shores. Preferably from Beachy Head.

Alex, Scarborough, Great Britain

I have noted various comments on the Q'uran and Islam and whether it means or teaches this or that.

To Westerners I would like to say that if you do not understand the doctrine of "abrogation" and the historical and chronological sequence of the Q'uran and the life of Mohammed you understand ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about Islam as held and practiced by the vast majority of muslims and the Q'uran as they believe in it.

Mohammed's message changed as his life went forward - later Suras are said to abrogate the earlier and this is dealt with within the Q'uran. Whether one believes this was because of the will of "Allah" or the circumstances of his life is a decision each must make, but to be ignorant of these changes is to be IGNORANT of, and almost certainly wrong about, Islam and the Q'uran.

Again, if you do not understand the doctrine of "abrogation" you know nothing of Islam or the Q'uran. Space does not allow further comment, but if you want to know you can find it on the 'net.

Fred, Birmingham,

I know the speaker personally and everything has been taken out of context and is a blatant distortion of the truth.This is yet another example of fearing that which you do know about. having been to numerous lectures given by speaker, i would like to share one which i learnt , "allways ascertain the truth"

Abid Hussain , Bradford, uk

I know the speaker personally and everything has been taken out of context and is a blatant distortion of the truth.This is yet another example of fearing that which you do know about. having been to numerous lectures given by speaker, i would like to share one which i learnt , "allways ascertain the truth"

Abid Hussain , Bradford, uk

I think this article esp since it relates to muslims as per usual is unbalanced.

Firstly, in what context were these statements made ?
I am sure you can find more direct and unambiguous statements from zionist jews, christians, secularists, etc but would you publish any of them and would you say that they represented the views of the mainstream majority within that faith ? I doubt it.

Balanced broad based reporting would be too much to ask. Extreme views from followers of non-muslim faiths can be found widely on the internet and 'fringe' magazines, but would you report them as mainstream and demonise those people as well ?

What is the purpose of this article? Is this a process to 'reform' Islam, or as a political tool to label all muslims as terrorists who do not deserve human rights as the Europeans did to the Jewish people not so long ago-the parallels between what is happenning to the Muslims now from the west is similar to what the Europeans did to the Jewish people.

GA, Bolton,

I know the speaker personally and everything has been taken out of context and is a blatant distortion of the truth.This is yet another example of fearing that which you do know about. having been to numerous lectures given by speaker, i would like to share one which i learnt , "allways ascertain the truth"

Abid Hussain , Bradford, uk

I agree broadly with Paul Williams, and would go even further in opposing the commonly held view indoctrinated by radio phone in presenters and such like that everyone born in the UK and Eurrope etc, ie outside of their Islamic countries of origin, are automatically entitled to remain in their western non-Islamic countries of birth.

L. Gee, London, UK

If muslims don't appreciate or understand Western values....well then, they should depart from the West.....this is what happens when a society welcomes, with wide open arms and borders, a huge influx of a culture totally dissimilar to your own....I fear Britain/Europe is irreparably damaged, and will be subsumed just by sheer fecundity.

H. Buckle, Teaneck, NJ

please send them home.

John Thomas, london,

As a non-Muslim who has married a Muslim (who has since converted from Islam), I would note that defenders of Mr. ul Haq should consider the fact that Islam does not embrace religious freedom in the sense of freedom of conscience.

I have learned at length that it freedom of religious conscience is punishable by death in virtually all forms of Islam.

George, Durban, South Africa

This is way worse than I even thought. You people have got to WAKE UP! There is NO reasoning with this kind of hatred, no co-existing with it. No amount of "education" can peel back this kind of vitriol which has been boiling for 14 centuries. Clearly, any "imam" that preaches this kind of sedition should be deported or imprisoned, and his mosque should be shut down. That is just for starters. England, they are bringing a civil war to you, and you and your leadership sit and "tolerate." Act now, and you might save your freedom.

Wilson Chamberlain, New York, USA,

Anyone who has read even the most basic translation of the Koran should accept that Muslims can never integrate with non-muslims (Infidels).
All those professing or accepting fundamentalist views should be offered free passage to an Islamic state before they are corrupted further, provided they give up British citizenship and the right to return here.
One wonders why they came.

John, Caernarfon,

I am so saddened to see this once great nation slowly being bled to death by radical muslims. The UK needs to WAKE UP and expel those imams such as al Huc who spread such hateful ideologies. I simply cannot fathom how or why the UK government sits idly by and watches! Whats there to fear? Deport these clowns NOW! The cowardice of the British government is allowing the UK to become the Pakistan of the west: a headquarters for Islamic extremists that will be used as a starting point for terrorist attacks against Europe and the US.

Hailee Mohawee, Cleveland, USA/Ohio

About islam, please read hundred of articles on the site of Ali Sina (Faithfreedom.org) and listen apostates like Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Wafa Sultan, Ibn Warraq and many others.

AGG, Evreux, France

Shaykh Riyadul Haqs speeches have totally been taken out of context. Forget about what you have read in the newspaper and do your own research, listen to his speeches, read up on Islam, try and understand the Quran and you will see for yourself that it is not a religion that preaches hate or violence but love and peace. The media try again and again to put Islam in the worse possible light so as a muslim woman i have become used to people thinking i am opressed and denied freedom, but that is not the reality. Its not about killing people and terrorism and it definately doesnt say that you cannot be friends with non-muslims - my best friends are Catholic!
Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world...find out why!

zainab, UK,

Well, Nostradamus predicted third world war -Christians against Muslims (or the other way around?). I looks (SADLY I may add) that we are heading in that way. I just wonder why Britain has not got so many problems with other immigrant groups (Poles etc.). Isn't it because they are Christians and have got similar lifestyle to the majority of British people?

Daria, sheffield,

Being tolerant doesn't mean that you have to tolerate everything.
To create a tolerant society, the intolerants must be censored and punished.
As someone said above, german society was tolerant with Hitler when he was nobody. This tolerance paved the way to madness and genocide.

Just my two cents...

Luis Gonzalez, Buenos Aires, Argentina

Shamefully, England has been given away to people like this; surrendered without a fight. Initially, it might have been hoped that like earlier immigrants Muslims would assimilate. Afterall, whether someone was a Catholic or a Jew had nothing to do with their sense of being English (it is England that has been lost). But, in the name of mulitculturalism, to allow the English to become merely one among many competing 'communities' - no longer a national people in their national home - was a supine betrayal. Muslims and others feel no need to do more than obey the law, while retaining all the characteristics and alien identities of their place of origin. They have no interest in being English and will never be other than colonists. It is very difficult not be enraged at what the established political parties have encouraged to happen to our country. What arrogance to attack the BNP when they raise a lonely voice of protest while allowing those that hate us to say what they will.

david Lovibond, devizes, england

The deobandi, along with all other made up groups under the umbrella of Islam, are not the true preachers of the islamic message. They, along with all other groups such as Jamaat e Tabligh, Brelwies, Sufis ect have failed to discharge the correct teachings of our beloved prophet, peace and blessings be upon him and all of God's prophets.
If you want your neighbour to become muslim, you are not going to invite him by showing hatred towards him! Islam does not preach hatred, rather these misguided preachers do.
Why don't the mainsteam media ever report about the teachings of true islam, as taught by the Salafis. We are not a made up group and don't teach hatered of any person or country? Is it because it doesn't make for a good anti Islamic story?

Abdullah, London, UK

This article signals a steering change in the UK. In the Times yet! Issues that cannot be named cannot be dealt with. The mask is now off.

Were I a Muslim I'd be noting how Europeans have treated troublesome groups in the past once a belief crystalized.

The effete can also be savage when provoked. Look at the Swiss. Time to return to dar al-Islam guys. The dar al-Harb is about to get too hot for you.

Mason Jahr, Sacramento, CA, USA

“We are in a very dangerous position here. We live amongst the kuffar, we work with them, we associate with them, we mix with them and we begin to pick up their habits.”
Nobody is forcing you to live amongst the Kuffarr, Pl leave Kuffar & move to a place where you are OK.
Hypocrites.

jose, Toronto, Canada

To Tony Pearson of London, I was going to write a very long comment until I read yours. I simply cannot put it better myself! Bravo!

Hailee Mohawee, Cleveland, USA/Ohio

To correct M Jones of Staffordshire- wherever there are communities there is trouble. They all seek their own independence and tribalism is creeping in. Be it the english/scottish divide or be it the Muslims and the Christians.

I always laugh when I hear "kick them out" as if they were never our problem in the first place. Homegrown issues here, we don't deport to Australia anymore. Without that luxury perhaps we should look for a more constructive approach.

Michael Laughton, Cheshire, United Kingdom

Ask an average muslim on whether this is a problem within his or her community.

You will get your answer.

bd, US,

The time has come for a wholesale review of what is required of a British citizen as to loyalty to the state and nation.
This sort of teacher and planner, plotter in reality, has no loyalty at all, is a revolutionary. But because of the label of religion, all this is considered a multi cultural blessing of diversity.
No loyalty to UK state, nation and values, no citizenship, no right to remain here.
That is wholly reasonable. A half intelligent conservative party would be advocating a powerful commission on what citizenship requires, how the 'rights' industry is promoting intolerant religious fascism, and how to ensure deportation is made a prima facie duty of government without the judiciary acting as a virus against the nation's well being.

Fati, Haggerston, UK

Z Khan,

Thank you for those two examples of Islam being a religion of peace. Now let me give you two examples that say otherwise:

9/11 and 7/7.

Would you like more?

Ron, Phoenix, Arizona

It is high time the 'West' - not least Christians - took note that the Fatherhood of God ("Our Father in Heaven") is a major tenet of Judeo-Christianity, whereas to suggest that the Allah of the Koran is a father would be blasphemous to the Moslem; ergo, the Allah of the Koran is not the same as the God of the Bible. Moreover, 'Allahu-akbar' does not mean 'God is great'; what it most definitely stands for is that Allah is greater!

DC, Chertsey/Addlestone,

Mr Khaled Ahmed is right when he says 'You can't run multiculturalism like this, because that's a way of destroying yourself'. Liberalism, not Islamism, is the greatest threat to Britain today. It 'tolerates' our most implacable enemies and proactively funds their subversion of Britain with local education authority grants!. This, as Mr Ahmed says, is truly 'mind-boggling'.

Replace suicidal Anglo-American liberal ideology with democratism, the rule of the democratic majority. Once this is accomplished we will be in a position to deal with Islamism as a secondary threat.

First, we must deal with liberalism - and liberalist extremism.

Terry, London, UK

Such venom from your mouth, William James-Smith from London. Do you truly hate the U.S. government so intently that it forces you to become an apologist for radical muslims whose goal is nothing less that the overthrow of your government? I predict there will come a time when your ever-growing Muslim population begins to foment so much terror within your own borders that you may regret the harsh, condemning criticism you pour forth on your not-so-distant cousins across the sea.

Our goals and values are not very different. Our survival will depend on our cooperation. It is coming Mr. James-Smith.

J. Primrose, Sacramento, California

Britain is an islamic Country under sharia law. And that is good so.

Achmed, London,

Most religions at some time in their evolution were intolerant & extreme and put to death non believers. As an example centuries ago we saw it with the Inquisition where the Vatican ruled over most of Europe and took the stance if you're not with us you're against us. Catholicism was reined in thanks to Henry VIII and over time it became a tolerant non extreme religion accepted in all democratic countries along with other religions. Islam unfortunately is still set in the middle ages and controlled by the extremists who adopt the same line as the Spanish inquisition. New Labour with its laissez-faire policies has actually fueled this extremism in Britain by discriminating against non Muslims in so many areas that the Muslim minority now believe their's is the right path for Britain. Only when these hard liners are stomped on by western democracies will Islam become a tolerant religion alongside all the others. Failing that, Britain will inexorably become a Muslim state within 10 years.

Mike, Alicante, Spain

I agree with mike gee entirely and I think Britain is foolish in not putting a stop to this right now. It is all well and good to be tolerant but when it damages your own country you have to draw the line. Not only in England are mosques used to spread lies and incite the population but all over the worl. I don't know any other religion which incites people as much as muslims. Do something about it before it is too late

Renate Baramy, Ramat Hasharon, Israel

All the muslims who live in Britain, themselves or through their parents, chose to make their lives in what had never been a "multicultural" society but one that has been Christian for thousands of years and in which individual freedoms were and are sacrosanct. That freedom has always been constrained by concern for others in that society - the Rule of Law, long established and here to stay.

Whether or not they understood the Britain that they were coming to, that is what it was and will be. They chose to come, They MUST live within that society as it has always been - or think again.

The world has many states that more closely match the criteria of the hard Islamist. If they do not like Britain as it is they must seek a life elsewhere. They have no right to demand that Britain changes to meet their minority and non-British demands.

Peter Kirwan, Montpeyroux 34, France

We are told repeatedly by Muslims, politicians and do-gooders that Islam is the religion of peace, and that the vast majority of Muslims want to live in peace. The fact is that presently the fanatics rule Islam. It is the fanatics who commit terrorist suicide bombings, who systematically slaughter Christian or western orientated societies and are gradually taking over entire continents in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who bomb, behead, murder, or honour kill, who take over mosque after mosque. And it is the fanatics who encourage the stoning and hanging of adulteresses and rape victims and insist women wear burkas. Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence and who will become our enemy if they don't speak up, as they will awake one day and find that the fanatics own them. As for us, the peaceful and silent majority who watch it all unfold; we must actively resist the fanatics who threaten our way of life, beginning with fanatical and vile preachers of hate

Ida Letugo, London, uk

Riyadh ul Haq:

“We are in a very dangerous position here. We live amongst the kuffar, we work with them, we associate with them, we mix with them and we begin to pick up their habits.”

Welcome to Integrated Britain of the 21st Century!!!

Liz, Bordeaux, France

Robert of Manchester wrote:

"Another nail in the coffin for our wonderous multicultural utopia. When will the Government speak up?"

The government will speak up if, and when, the people rise up.

On another note, I can't help but notice the anti-Christian sentiment of so many who have posted messages. Christians aren't bombing subways, trains, buses, buildings, and crowds of innocent people. Christianity and the Judeo-Christian tradition, combined with the respect for law and freedom that comes from our Greco-Roman heritage, are what made Europe great and gave it dignity. Toss that aside and you are lost, deservedly.

Ross, Wyoming, USA

frankly as muslims we are suffering from extremism but we have great scholars who can solve this problem why do not britain ask for preachers fom al azhar and famous islamic universites to preach in mosques the prophet pbuh told us about those bigots those people existed in the islamic history like al khawarej but we have to face them with real islam and by dialogue especially those muslims there knowledge in the arabic language is not sufficient to understand quoran and sunna

ahmed amir, cairo , egypt

Sebastian23 said, "Where in the Quran does it say that blood should be said in the pathway of Allah?" Tell me that non of these surahs in the Quran promote violence to spread Islam: 9:5, 8:60, 9:14, 8:12,17, 5:51, 9:73, 9:29, 48:29, 4:74, 2:190-191, 9:38, 9:41, 3:85, 2:193, 3:157, 9:29.

Dan Richardson, Oxford, UK

inga stevenson has got to be the most stupidest person online pertsonally i blame the education sytem for his lack of intelligence. shaykh riyadh ul haq has got to be one of the most inspirational scholars we have in the west today . taking a few comment from a few lectures from thousands he has given and with clever editing making him out to be some sort of loony reaps of despearation from the times ( not suprising thier sales being down ) so lets attack the muskims that will up our sales . come on tims you use to have quality now you scoring below the daily sport

anin, birmingham,

we can't really blame the majority of moderate (ie - true) moslems for not turfing these evil people out of their communities when the authorities seem to be taking the same laissez-faire approach. meanwhile, the disenfranchised are radicalised, as always.

we should be far harder on political islam.

as for the religion itself, it's no better or worse than any other, I suppose. and has no need to be more beligerent. "you shall have your religion and I shall have my religion" - moslem readers may recognise the quote. however, as far as the state is concerned, only arguments of common sense should be listened to and any religious extremism which threatens the state should be approached with zero toleration.

where the state demands certain standards of behaviour and these cross moslem sentiments, then they, like everyone else, can like it or lump it.

jem, london, uk

Islam should indeed be tolerant of Judaism and Christianity, given that those religions are the roots of its beliefs. Or did its adherents forget that we were there first, and indeed stated it all in a way that still manages to be more relevant to the modern world?

As others have commented, if these hardcore Deobandi people are so affronted by daily contact with Christians and particularly us evil Jews, the solution to dealing with our malign influence is obvious. Clue - it doesn't involve living in Britain.

David, Manchester, UK

PS to my last email: ... and if anyone believes in a God, clever and powerful and supreme enough to have created the Planet, the Sun, The Universe and all Creation, don't they think that this God is clever enough to 'punish' people, if He wants to? Or don't they trust him? For anyone to take it upon themselves to think that they have the God given right to cause harm to another person (or anything else come to that) , is not only stupid, it's them, in their ignorance, making themselves out to be a God.... and that's not called the 'Almighty' it's called 'a mighty EGO!' And they thereby go against the very thing that gave them life in the first place.

Tarni, London, UK

I, as I'm sure many others in this country do, believe in the importance of freedom of speech and the right to practice religion, especially in a country so vocal to the world stage. However when this hard won 'freedom' is abused as it is so obviously being in this case, shouldn't the government have measures in place to act against that abuse? It amazes me that, as a culture, we have strived for years to build this multicultural and tolerant society, but it is the good that has come from us attaining our goal that is allowing instances like this to take place un-challenged.

Gary, Notts,

I think every person should make an effort and study the Religion Islam and the sect of Deobandiism for themselves before making any remarks that can incite hatred. I do not agree with people blind following and inciting hatred towards any religion, be it Hinduism, Christianity, Judaism or Islam. The media has a bad habit of cutting and pasting certain comments and quotes which can cause hatred towards a certain group or movement. We all have heard about the investigation against the despatches program, which quite clearly had made these errors regarding mosques and Imams. So clearly its upto every person to gain knowledge about a certain group or movement instead of blind following and hurling extreme remarks about banning the hijab etc...

abdullah, London, England

People like this give a bad name to Islam and Muslims generally - we are all not like this.

Asif Khan, London, UK

If all people, native of immigrant, had to vow allegiance to Great Briton the country they live and work in. perhaps they would think twice before breaking that vow, and would not then commit offences against this friendly state and her people. Maybe they should think back to recent history, where another great nation, wrongly turned against a religious sect, and millions then died in concentration camps. We do not wish this to happen in the UK. But the Muslim religious leaders should take heed. The majority population is getting fed up to the teeth with the sounds coming from the mosques.

Gordon E STEWART, Dinan, France

HALF of them?

In a sane country,this revelation would be headline news on national television and there would be demands for government to take action.

Don't hold your breath.

sandy, ayrshire,

The Muslims came to India over a thousand years ago, and despite the all pervading inclusive nature of Hindu society, they remained apart. I see a new demand for a state of Muslimstan arising here in the next century. What the fundamentals are really dooing is just following the holy book. " Paki" hating racism, the class system of the British society, the media campaign against the Muslims and brown foreigners are partly to blame. The decaying inner city values, the loss of self-confidence among the British, the glorification of the blacks on the media,ignoring the white working class, has something to do with the current malaise. Come back , Enoch.

Victory Smith, Birmingham, U.K

Why don't the government detain all of them and deport them out of the country and strip them out of their British citizenship and live in peace. If the government doesn't do it, then it needs them to exist for one good reason or the other. It also means that the govt wants an enmy. Mentioning verses of the holy quran and taking about kelling infidels means that a war with Islam is intended and not peace.

Rami, Cairo,

It would appear that Richard is an atheist Fundamentalist, believing that a non-belief in G-d is the right path, and only his way is right. How is this not different from religious fundamentalists? Religious fundamentalists fail to recognise the good in that which they don't understand, and it seems Richard is doing the same here.

Lisa, London,

A spokesman for the Department for Communities said: “We have a detailed strategy to ensure imams properly represent and connect with mainstream moderate opinion and promote shared values like tolerance and respect for the rule of law."

Ah, the good old "detailed strategy". Labour are very good at those, because Labour are very good at vacuous jargon and pious intentions. And if at first they don't succeed, they create another "detailed strategy".

Paul T, Leicester,

Yeh you don't like Saudia Arabia. But BAE on the other hand beg to differ. Oh yeh, that's right BAE has got £20 BILLION deal with Saudis). It's not anybody else, it's the leaders who are making decisions here. And these are mere tactics to control our minds. You hate Saudis, well think again. These same people gave you cheaper oil than coke. From Gap to M&S are exploiting people in third world countries to make millions of dollars. Million were killed in Indonesia in 1960's just so people here in West can wear trendy jeans. And it's happening again. In Iraq, and it's right in front of your eyes. But you are not bothered. Why should you? Someone said "Dont come here, go back". I guess u dont need permission or visa attack millions in Iraq.They didn't even ask you "come visit us". Well British rule gave nothing to India, or Africa except killing millions. Now they are wearing a crown of civilised society. Just saying "I'm sorry doesn't take all that away."

Nameless, watever,

Yet again the main stream media is spinning its web of lies and deceit against Islam. Islam is a very tolerant religion and one which has historically protected other religious groups i.e. the jews when they have been persecuted. It is no wonder that the general population get a distorted view of Islam which is mainly due to inaccurate and down right decietful reporting by the Western Media. One can comment on the lies and deciept which took the British and Americans to War in Iraq but that is old news. The Muslims are entitled just like any other citizen of the world to protect their lives,property and their right to practice their religion and if that means that they have to take up arms against those who are killing them and their children, raping their women in the name of liberation then what is wrong with that. I think it is about time that the Muslim nations of the world got together under one banner of Islam with one military to protect their citizens from harm of any kind.

Tariq Rehman, Bradford , England

Wake up the sleeping lion of Islam he says? It was not that long ago that Europe's soil rang with the sound of Nazi SS Jack boots. We must be careful lest the lion that is wakened is the european backlash to this behaviour. The fire of islam is unmistakeable, and burns bright across the world: Darfur, Chad, Mali, Pakistan, Iran, Afghanistan, Iraq. Anywhere where there is death, conflict, and misery, you will find islam laughing back at you.

Shane, Guildford, England

As a muslim I go to the mosque and see people who love peace. As a muslim I am disgusted by reports such as this in the media which attempts to portray muslims as people who have something against this country. I respect this country and the people of this country. It's time we all work together for peace not just in this country but in the whole world.

ismail hussein, london, se15 1ha

Call a Spade a Spade, people!

The UK's Muslim community is fast being overrun by Islamists, who cry "Islamipobia" when anyone says anything critical about it. Many Muslims, as this article reflects, are disenchanted with the government and resent UK, even though they were born here and reap its benefits.

Nowadays, Muslim clerics daily and openly call for Jihad, even on our own soil. Non-religious Muslims are being harassed and attacked in the UK. Honor killings fill the news. Gays and Jews do not go into Muslim neighborhoods. Terror groups are praised and their propaganda distributed widely.

Expect more attacks. And in a hundred years or so, expect an uprising. We know what happens when religious Muslims become a strong minority - just look at Thailand.

Andrew, London, UK

"it is not suggested that all British Muslims who worship at Deobandi mosques subscribe to the isolationist message preached by Mr ul Haq" - so if I choose to attend BNP rallies, you suggest I might not be a racist? What fatuous nonsense is this? Perhaps those Muslims who hopefully disagree with the Deobandi message vetoed their mosques, I might have more faith in the idea that extremist views are in the minority. However your figures seem to indicate otherwise. This is not good news for all liberal minded people - and suggests the government is at least privately worried whilst trying to placate us publically.

Suki, Lostock,

Hate preachers should be deported, end of story. If anyone does not like their adopted country they should return to where they came from.

Ireland, England, Scotland and Wales have been christian countries for centuries. Islam extremists aren't going to change that. Come on - would YOU let them go that far? The British public will step in and Gordon will be forced to stand up to these people. We must be sympathetic to them - they probably have been brainwashed into believing that all non-believers should be executed etc etc.

How I wish everyone was an atheist - no more idiotic disputes over gaining the eternal glory of a supernatural being. But for all the adult viewers, you probably don't need a 16 year old to tell you that.

Lisa, near Glasgow, Scotland

SUFI claims Islam means 'Peace'... please do your homework - the literal translation is 'Submission'.... which is what it seams Islam wants the world to do.

When the average Muslim starts to complain about the extremists instead of those who complain about the extremists THEN Muslims might be taken seriously...

Mark, Brisbane, Australia

Farrukh//

I think that is a good idea that you shouldn't give up on. Try to engage some influential moderate organization and you'll have better chances of succeding. But an educational program is enough, you moderates need to organize yourselves and establish a new moderate movement that is strong enough to counter the radicalisation of muslims in the UK. This organization would generate the positive publicity you moderates never get and would be proof that its only a minority that are extremist.

Mikael, Stockholm, Sweden

Lucky for Britain, the majority of mosques have peaceful Imams preaching peaceful messages to their peaceful followers - despite the best efforts of misguided radicals such as Mr Ul Haq

Muqbool, London,

The Moslems in Britain are the most ungrateful people ever. You British take them in, feed, clothe and educate them, and they and their spawn turn on you and your children and rend the innocent in their malice and self-righteous anger. They have no feeling of gratitude, only entitlement, and they don't even behave like good guests do, but they steal from their hosts, burn your houses and assault your children. They should be thrown out, if for nothing more, than an appalling lack of good manners.

Lee, Virginia, USA

As a loyal Brit, living abroad, I am heartsick at what I read in the newsapers regarding Immigration and the negative impact its had on our Country.

Why was it necessary to open our doors to the flotsam of society?. Why are people who still live by 12th centuary standards, who cannot or will not conform to the value system of the host Country be allowed to stay.

Every British person I meet, who is still living in the U.K. is of the same mind frame. So how is this ridiculous notion of Multicultralism, allowed to continue. We as Brits, have a proud heritage without thinking that we should have to change our culture to suit the so called new arrivals. I say enough is enough.

I think the Tower is where traitors were placed many years ago. I think its time that the so called Politictians, responsible for causing the havoc and destruction to the British way of life should be introduced to the location.

Maggie, come back all is forgiven and where are you Winne? HELP!.

Andrea, New York, USA.

This is a brave piece of journalism, especially in a period when the government seems determined to extinguish all criticism of Islam in the public media. The sort of comments made by ul Haq would not be tolerated from any other quarter.

It appears to reaffirm that hardline teaching is increasing in many British mosques, whether Wahhabi or Deobandi in origin, and this teaching is stirring up sectarianism and bigotry. It confirms what was revealed in the Undercover Mosque documentary, that even so-called mainstream and orthodox mosques now are filled with preaching that stirs up hatred and encourages violence from a new generation of angry young men.

The government needs to change tack fast, and repudiate the MCB which is dominated by individuals who think in this way, in favour of marginalised groups such as the British Muslims for Secular Democracy movement. In the meantime, hopes rest with courageous investigative journalists who will not be bullied into silence.

Matt N, Oxford , UK

Ever since the Peace of Westphalia governments have been obliged to tamp down their own rabble rousers who advocate crossing borders and fighting without the government's ok. To this day, the FBI keeps investigating the cubans in Florida to ensure that Fidel Castro does not have a bunch of his co-nationals try to launch a revolution from the US. When such understandings break down, danger comes to us all. A good childhood friend of mine lived in a house that had been shot up by an Iranian hit squad. The neighbors were rather frightened by the affair.

When an imam advocates shedding blood overseas, he is striking at the peace and security of his neighbors indirectly, in violation of centuries old norms, and endangering them from the cross-fire when the return blows inevitably come. The government has an obligation to shut him down before the peace is endangered. The government of the UK is not doing its job

TM Lutas, Munster, IN USA

Social misfits, what else can you say about them.
You live in a country, on your own volition and them say the state or system or other cultures are wrong.
Get a life, pack your bags and go to a better place (or utopia of your belief) and leave us lesser mortals here in Britain.
Why can't the government act against these minorities amongst the minorities? Why do the state take knee jerk action to put up a show only when a disaster strikes?
We have a small fraction of population who just refuse to integrate with the rest of the country and a bunch of impotent politicians bereft of any courage to act simply on the basis of political correctness. Political correctness for what?

K Prasad, Ayr,

Ask yourself who benefits from terrorism.
Certainly not the Iraqis/Afghanis or the Palestinians.
The only beneficiaries are the benighted Despots of the Middle East who, in their hatred of encroaching Democracy, (ensuring end to their autocratic regimes) are willing to spend their last dollar and sacrifice the last "Palestinian/Iraqi/Afghani Freedom Fighter" to ensure their ability to, forever, exploit, disfranchise and intimidate their citizens.
'Tis time to have the deprived multitudes of the Despotic Moslem Autocracies cast of the yolk of their enslavers and march with the Democratic Countries of the world towards the attainment of Democracy and the freedoms it guarantees.
They have nothing to lose but their shackles.

B. Beyamenu, Toronto, Canada

The information source of the above article is from the Brelvi sect of the Muslim community, which originates from the sub-continent. There is intense hatred between the Deobandi sect (mentioned in the article ) and the Brelvi sect. A fact which is shown that neither sect celebrates Eid on the same day. Western writers should be aware of this when researching and gathering their facts and not be caught out by hidden community agendas, just like Bush and Blair were fed mis-information by the Shia community in Iraq to get rid of the Sunnis.
Nevertheless, there is a lot of truth in the article.
Our leaders get away with it because their public are mostly illiterate and believe in anything they say without question. The Muslim community from the subcontinent have no forums to questions our leaders or hold them to account without fear of retribution therefore all these negative actions and beliefs are perpetuated. Dont expect Govt to do anything (they need the votes)until is too late.

ismail, bolton, UK

Actually, the Islamist was written by a man of no faith who changed his real name to Ed Hussain,due to him finding his first muslim name offensive. He probably would change his skin colour if he could as well. He is again a stupid person who did find the radical method interesting. As the radical form was created by society rejects anyway(just like the people who walk into schools and shoot kids in USA-rejected by the majority). Ed Hussain is like the other attention seeking, greedy muslims and UK press, which have decided to put panic in the peoples minds to take advantage of the current climate(and make a quick buck). So lets not bring Mr Tom into the discussion, it would be embarassing relating him to muslims who have more sense than to join extremes. He went from one extreme to another, from people hating to self hating.

ADAM, LONDON, UK

Yet another sign that Britain and its way of life are slowly being detroyed with the complicity of its own people. As with Europe generally, this spreading sourge will lead to bloody civil war as Europeans become desperate to preserve their societies. The infiltration of radical islam throughout every part of the UK is so complete that it leaves few options other than to fight it directly. Unfortunately, I question whether the British people (or the Scottish or Irish) have enough sense of self-preservation or cutural strength remaining to wage such a fight. One of the great tragedies of human history is now unfolding and my heart breaks because of it.

John Haskell, Pleasant Hill, California

Wow .........from reading this article and reading these comments looks like there are nutters all over the place and on every side. Help...

antoine, Warsaw, Poland

they should be kicked out simple.

The gov should cast them back from where they came from.

They make Good muslims like me look bad infront of of my Countryman( British)

Take it from a muslim they are bad news period.

they teach what they want young muslims to hate there friends make them feel no accepted.

londoner, london, GREAT Britain

Im a muslim proud to be a muslim deobandi is not a sect at all what is with all this propaganda deobandi is a school a madressah in India where people go to become scholars teachers, the school of deoband promotes peace they disagree with terrorism and killing of innocent helpless people its class to see the times stirring up trouble on the anniversary of 9/11 its a shame really ppl really milking it and causing hate between peaceful muslims and those of other faiths, not good at all, peace and love to all all from a muslim who doesnt listen to music who has a beard who's wife wears a hijaab and who has many christians, jewish and hindu friends

Mohammed, U.K,

"If the comments attributed to him are true - it seems the media have found another "bogeyman" to "tarr us" all with ad create fear"

Yeah, except many muslims are posting here to defend him.
We don't need to create "propaganda" against muslims, they do it for us.

MM, Andover, UK

Its time to take our country back !

Paul, bury, Lancashire

I think some of the ignorant few who think they know a little about the Quran really need to stop manipulating verses. There are many verses quoting love, compassion and tolerance in the Quran.

And as for voilance being explicitly encouraged. one can quote many verses ont he bible and the old testament where violence is explicitly quoted, thus giving rise to the relentless, merciless rape and killings by the crusaders.

Lets us not get carried away with extracted partial information and twisting the meaning. This can be used to incriminate an innocent faith. Be it Bhuddism, Hinduism, Chritianity or Judaism.

And as for the Sheikhs statement on 'shedding blood'. Is the killing the only way to shed blood? Is blood not shed by the oppressed and victimised.

Umar Bin Khattab, London, UK

Umar bin Khattab, London,

How can people say that he is a radical. i listen to great many number of his talks and has never preached hatred. go to alkawthar akadamy (may have spelt it wrong sorry if i did)you will find no hate to the west. just because the iman does not like ceartain things does not mean he is racist.

inga, islam would not have been able to spread from the edged of china to the far reaches of spain with in century of the start of islam if it was done by the "sword" the isalmic army was very small in number compared to the military mights of the time .
by the way the first jews were alowed into jerulsam without persucution was under the 2nd caliph umar. yeah a religion on a warpath.
it was not the muslims who killed civillians in the crusades

ridwan basith, Luton,

Muslims in the UK have got to get their own house in order! I cannot see who else can do this with any credibility! I am sure most of them are disgusted with the behaviour of the minority, but the silent majority need to do something about it!

Chris, Karlovy Vary, Czech Republic

The only thing I can say is that the majority of British Muslims are likely feeling what I am feeling, and that is nothing but sadness.

People have come here to look for better lives and give their children better opportunities, only to have a part of their lives turn against another part of their lives, or their children's lives.

How can there be anything but sadness for the British Muslims when the British half of their identity is being threatened by the Muslim half? How can they feel anything but sadness when the religion of their place of origin has ideals of destroying their British-born children's way of life?

I would like to hope that if Allah could see all this now, He would feel nothing but sadness, too.

A Irish, London,

It's very sad but unfortunately true.
"you get what you tolerate"
When is britain going to wake up???

Iyiola, Aberdeen, United Kingdom

Remember that these are the views of Andrew Norfolk, he could be anti Islamic as far as we know.
Riyadh ul Haq must have done something right to be preacher of a hardline Islamic sect.
Riyadh ul Haq is a man that’s not afraid to speak about the truth and the on goings of the western culture. A man looking out for his brothers/sisters and the rest of the world. A man giving a reality check to the people of the UK about what is going on behind the naked eye. A normal human being that has his own views/believes is being classed as a cleric.

Safwaan Salloo, Walsall,

I always have a good laugh at the disaster that is modern Britain. You people bought civilisation to the world but now you are frightened and meek little people, waiting for your country to be taken from you. What happened?

David Heidelberg, Sydney, Australia

These are latte-day Nazis. Pure and simple. Only the Nazis would never have thought of going on welfare and opening clubhouses in England from which to plan their takeover while they kee bringing in more and more Nazi brides under the guise of "family reunions"

Funny, ain't it?

Karl Martell, Tours, France

The rantings and ravings of a subversive lunatic are the rantings and ravings of a subversive lunatic - period. Matters not if the book the lunatic holds on high is the Koran, the Bible or the Dead Sea Scrolls, they are still the rantings and ravings of a subversive lunatic and should be treated as such.

The rights granted under a democracy are not a suicide pact. When religious lunatics advocate the overthrow of the very government that justifies their existence, that is not religion it is subversion in the guise of religion and should be viewed as subversion.

Political correctness must have a limit. Shall we discard the peaceful teachings of the cross, the star and the crescent and pick up the call to defend a radical, violent, subversive crescent?

People and the government should view religious subversion advocating violence the same as political subversion advocating violence and act accordingly.

DanO, Mount Vernon, USA

Canada prides itself as a multicultural nation, but with its growing Muslim community things are starting to look a bit scary. Canada is also one of the most 'politically correct' places on earth, so it will be very difficult for the media or government to address an issue like this.
Let's hope that we here can follow the UK's admission that bad things are happening in places of worship.
So, as my grandparents used to sing with enthusiasm: Rule Brittania!
Luke

luke fisher, ottawa, canada

As a non-Deobandi Muslim I believe our leaders and our communities should make an effort to take a more active role in Muslim-majority areas of the UK and to counter the influence spread by this dangerous ideology that doesn't even spare those who are Muslim but don't adhere to their madness.

If the rest of the citizens understand that this is an isolated sect (which has unfortunately gained popularity, mainly because it was active while others were passive) then the Muslims who don't adhere to the Deobandi teachings would feel better knowing that they're not being associated with them.

Akbar H F, Geneva ,

To Sebastian

You ask "Where in the Quran does it say that blood should be said in the pathway of Allah?" have a look at Surah's 4:74;47:4;
61:10-12 and the last ayat of all to be revealed to Muhammad, which is therefore the most authoritative of all, cancelling out all the "nice"previous peaceful and peaceloving revelations.

Here's what Surah 9:5 says:-

"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful."

The online Qur'an browser at http://www.quranbrowser.com can be used to read what the others say.

Barry Holroyd, Leeds, West Yorkshire, England

Well said Tarni. Our tolerance is being abused and our politicians are sleepwalking us into darkness.

A lot of these radical groups are banned in muslim countries, ban them here, now! And ban those hijabs they scare little old ladies and kids.

Tim., East London,

You should set your 'skinheads' loose upon them. Ordinarily I have no respect for such people, but one viper surely deserves another. You should round up every one of these disgusting parasites and boot them at once. Drop them into Iran from aeroplanes.

Krishna, Mumbai, India

converts to islam team... how do you know whether the editor is being selective? you don't know what comments are being posted but not printed.

the general tone of the media is anti-extremist, not anti-moslem. maybe you haven't noticed, but many moslems are disgusted by the hardliners who they feel are perverting their religion.

of course, if you are an intolerant bigot, it's not surprising you feel under siege.

jem, london, uk

When they are preaching these absurdities, do people laugh? The evils of football, music? This is Monty Python isn't it? Why don't people just laugh?

This is what happens when we give respect to these ridiculous notions. They just become more ridiculous and yet we have to keep quiet for fear of offending sensibilities. All religion is based on a herd like bovine stupidity but Islam tends to be the worst offender.

And to be fair, if you believe that your religion is the one true religion how can you then show respect for other religions? It's a logical impossibility. Thus we get the bitterness, rancour and eventual violence we are seeing.

Religion is a cancer in our society. Take away its special privileges, expose it to proper analysis and yes to ridicule for that is what it deserves. Abolish all faith schools.

If people want to believe this rubbish then it should be a private matter like horoscopes or tarot. It's no different so stop treating it as such.

Paul Owen, Birmingham, UL

Sebastian23; have you been living with your head in the arabian sand?
There are many hadiths and koranic verses that talk about the killing of the infedels (that meaning everyone that is not a muslim. Study up on such things and on history before you make such a off the wall comments.
No, not all religions are peaceful or preach peace. And Richard of London , hope you find the truth before it is too late. All things has consequences ...turning from God does too. England is not the nation I use to know as a child; it horrifies me to see what has happened to England and Europe and sadly it is coming our way.

dominique, Pinellas Park, USA

So called 'moderate' Moslems are just a Trojan horse, designed to lull the Brits into thinking there is a nice, tolerant strain of Islam and that if only millions of pounds are thrown in their direction that they will start teaching it. They'll just spread more Sharia law in England which already allows sharia courts. There is NO MODERATE ISLAM according to Turkish Prime Minister, Erdogan, 21 Aug 2007:

"There is no moderate or immoderate Islam. Islam is Islam and that's it". He's right, and there's no reason for any real Brit (or American or European) to 'tolerate' an ideology or its followers which teaches in its 'holy' book the forcible conversion, subjugation or death of anyone who doesn't 'submit' to this totalitarianism. Nor should anyone tolerate evil Sharia Law which is based on three inequalities: inequality between Moslem and non-Moslem, man and woman and free man and slave. (Islam sanctions slavery in its "koran": "possess the necks of your enemies".).

Bookworm, london,

I hope the Princes are watching closely. I have many Islamic friends who slip up in conversations when in groups about their intentions. This includes how the wealthy property people buy strategic houses in town areas to create white flight. They always plead that they need grants for the mosque for community prayers etc, and have prayer rooms in their houses to avoid council tax. They are always trying to teach non Islamic believers about Islam all day long and try to convert non stop. They say the aim is to have an Islamic state in England, meaning no monarchy. They tell me how a 16 year old girl will become a mother in a household of ten muslims in a decade. This includes bringing in a 'Freshie', then the mother-in-law, uncles and aunties and a few children, so do the maths. I have heard them call superiors kuffar many times in the workplace in front of work colleagues. It's too late, in 20 years England will be semi-Islamic. Get your calculators out and you will see the future.

Engslam, Blackburn, England

It seems the solution is pretty obvious: If I, as a white male, were to make equivalent comments about Muslims, Jews, or any ethnic minority, I would find myself in court charged with inciting religious/ethnic hatred and violence.
There's no need to ban mosques, or arrest all Muslims, or any of the other more extreme views that people may suggest; simply treat individuals inciting violence and hatred in exactly the same way that white people would be treated if they were to do the same.
Put all the extremists whether they be white, Islamic, Asian, or whatever in jail where they can learn to get along together.
Meanwhile, the rest of us really _can_ get along together.

Bruce, Ipswich, UK

Isn't it funny how immigrant groups can despise British values and culture, whilst they sponge off tax payers money. They escape persecution from dictatorships to settle here, where they get housing, education, health and social security, then tells us how corrupt and decadent we are.

In their own countries they would be tortured and brutally disposed of for challenging the regime in the slightest way. We are then blamed for their failings, their lack of democracy and social justice. Their lack of backbone, their lack of moral fibre is not our failing. If they have no love for this country, what on earth are they doing here?

Halo, London,

Britons should thank Tony Blair for the gift he has left for all of you. By funding these extremists, Blair and New Labour did a great disservice not just to the UK, but to the vast majority of Muslims who are held hostage by the Mosque network.

Now the UK Home office is funding another Muslim group and sending these guys to Canada to export their nonsense.

Tarek Fatah, Toronto, Canada

This article lacks qualification and balance. This is a poorly written 'us' and 'them' story. In the entire article they only managed to get one balancing quote (by Khaled Ahmed) putting the story into perspective. It waited until paragraphs 7 & 8 to even suggest that this is not necessarily representative of the wider British Islamic community.

This article is devoid of any 'conflict journalism' principles and serves only to compound the problem of anti-Islamic British nationalism.

Mame du Bois, Toowoomba, Australia

first of all whosoever has interpreted the speechs of Mr ul-Haq has cleary NOT I Repeat NOT understood the message and has clearly taken it out of context, therefore his judgement is incorrect.
Secondly I think its blindingly obvious as to why Mr UL-Haq has refused to comment or be interviwed because reporters are known to twist the words, so why would he knowingly fall in to the trap.

Mr Patel, London,

eeeewww u mke me sikk!! u have no shame and no respect for your community for religions nd for yourself!! shame on u makin a joke out of islam.....ders noway a true muslim can be a terrorist it has no connection with islam!! why dont you go take a closer and deeper look into islam and see what it really means.......'ISLAM' litterelly means 'PEACE!!' not WAR!! no-offence to anyone!! =)

Khateeb, Leicester, UK

Islam is utterly incompatible with civilization. Ban Islam from Britain NOW and deport the mindless followers of this cult of death, before our once enlightened and advanced society descends into a new dark age of religious tyranny and oppression.

Edward, Birmingham,

i have heard these men on many occassions and my only solution to this debate is to hold a conference where these men be invited and discuss their views publicly, then we will determine if they are fuelling hatred or not in this country. i'm pretty certain these men will come out innocent and with many admirers. but even if they would do this, i'm also pretty sure many would still doubt them claiming they were hiding their true feelings and only saying 'good things' for the public. some hard core fundementalists they would be then eh?

muhammed, blackburn, UK

Islam is Islam. Muslims should not apologise for it. We are pro-Islam and anti-everything that is not Islam. There are no 'bad' things in Islam. It is all good, from being just to your neigbour all the way to executing the murderer. We should not apologise for Jihad or the Islamic Punishments. They are good and nothing but good. We have a right to believe in it... its' called 'freedom of belief' - Britain just needs to put up with it. Freedom is to tolerate something even though you do not like it. What is the point of having 'Freedom' if we act, believe, and think just like everyone else does? We live in a country that allegedly lets us practice our faith and be free to hold our beliefs. So why not let us believe in ALL of Islam? The fact is the West does not really believe in 'Freedom' its all a BIG LIE. You just want everyone to be 'free' to act like you do!

Abu Musa, Manchester,

Having a mother who originates from the deobandi sect and a father who originates from the Barelwi sect, Having learnt about both sects, none preach violence and the values are very much the same. Henceforth the conclusion I come to as many young muslims that we are simply muslims- followers of peace , not followers of any sect. It is the older generation who have one foot in the grave, that have made the sects, due to power hungry struggles.But most muslims are simply muslims -thats it. As a beautiful women who covers her hair- I would also like to add that I started to wear it because I thought my voice,opinion,strength & personality was more important.Just as Mary, mother of Jesus was not oppressed for wearing the clothes she did, niether are we, so quit the pretence concern,people are just upset that they don't get to ogle at us.As a feminist ,I find many negative aspects of society (anorexia, bulimia, bullying,low self confidence, pride) to be eliminated through wearing the scarf

ANISA, LONDON, UK

Dont blame them , they are just following the Quran 9.5 kill the unbelievers 8.39 wage war till islam rules the planet 4.34 women are inferior , whip them if they speak up even 'out of context' these are terrible verses and even 'moderate' Islam dare not protest amputations, stonings etc. because they are all in the holy book

arun, London,

If the British government doesn't have the kahounas to get rid of these parasites, then the British people themselves should go out into the streets and start making examples of this scum. As one post mentioned earlier, if you don't get rid of these sub-humans now, then it's your children and grandchildren who will suffer, and suffer greatly at the hands of these ungrateful barbarians.

Mike Sipowicz, Sioux City, Iowa , USA

Does it really say in the Quran that music is satanic? (I don't know, I haven't read it). I find it hard to fathom where he gets the opinion that the students at the Royal College of Music are all devil-worshiping Jews. They aren't dressing up and filling music halls with recitals of Manson thats for sure.

Bizarre.

Bob, Aberdeen,

I wonder how long it will take before the Brits and Europeans get mad and scared enough to start blowing up mosques and killing the imams and other suspected or real jihadists. It's pitiful that educated muslim people can belive that idiotic drivel the imams preach. Perhaps mass deportation will be the next best step before a civil war starts? It's almost as if the Imams are trying to provoke attacks on themselves. Paradise must be wonderful, but I bet they've run out of virgins by now. Shiites can't even live with sunnis. All because of the way one worships some ignorant, 7th century pedophile. Shame on those people. Abandon islam and join the Human Family.

Mateo Paris , paris,

Theses kind of sects are forbidden in many Islamic countries since a long time. Many of those leaders refuged, and were protected in Britain since the 70th. To be honest, which is well known and approved in many Arabic and Islamic countries, is that the British goverment is protecting Islamic extremists for political reasons and objectives.

Soufiene, Sheffield, UK

As someone who is a Moslem born and brought up in the UK - I have to say I have never heard of this person (Mr ul Haq) - certainly he is not my "spiritual leader" nor deos he have any "influence" over me. If the comments attributed to him are true - it seems the media have found another "bogeyman" to "tarr us" all with ad create fear - I would caution, that many comments attributed to many so called "Moslem leaders" like Ahmedinajad's so called comments regarding Israel have been deilberately taken out of context and deliberately misrepresented to spread mistrust and hatred for the agenda of a few. I hope this is not happening yet again. Perhaps the Times should offer to interview this guy directly and quote exactly what he is saying.

Michael Jabir, Leicester , UK

This just gets more and more scary, but anyone in my part of the world with their eyes open realised many years ago that our liberal attitudes were an open invitation to the extremists to get a toe hold in the mosques and, just like the rest of us liberal minded folks, the more tolerant ones in the mosques merely grumbled a bit and hoped the that extremists would go away. The initial failure of the local clerics and their flock, and the subsequent failure of the rest of us, to recognise the danger signs and deal with the rise of local extremists has put us in a position in the north west where attitudes are begining to polarise. This is playing into the hands of the those who would take advantage for their own endds. I have no idea what the solution is - I suspect there is no solution. I fear that the genie is out of the bottle and I for one have no intention of staying around to see the place fall apart - like many others I shall now take my family and get out of this country.

Mike, Lancashire, U.K

As usual the British media has yet again does what it does best - sensationalize and take things out of context. I have listened to many of the above mentioned speakers talks not recall one of them called for hatred against the British people whatever their religion. In fact these speakers have inculcated values such as tolerance and postive participation within many young Muslims across the country - including myself. The British governement and media have a clear agenda to drive a wedge between the more sufi' istic Barelwis and the conservative Deobandis, when the general public have very little idea what and who these movements represent. This attempt to divide and rule Muslims in Britain is already backfiring as Muslims across Britain are learning much more about each other and are coming together inspite of media sensationilizing. The real issue is shameless Western foreign policy - be sincere!

Shabir Aziz, Sheffield, UK

This current situation is the result of a permissive and all too open society.If individuals are not prepared to abide by the law of the land (this does not imply having traditions and faiths subjegated) and preach hatred of other races and creeds then the full weight of the same law should be brought to bear in its fullest manner.

Titus, Bromley,

Fully agree with wilson and wish to echo the sentiment. what i'd like to ask any government minister is to explain to me is why are our troops in Afghanistan fighting the taliban yet the very same government allows the taliban to build it's HQ in our capitol city? Appeasement eventually will lead to war it does not prevent it, The only difference to pre ww2 is the enemy has been allowed in.

sally, Selby, England

"There is only one god but the wise know him by many names" - this is a qoute from a religious text - it certainly is not an Islamic view. But if there is any spiritual truth then surely this is one of them. How can any sane and spiritually matured being proclaim that only his way is the right way. There is only one destination but many paths to reach it. May the almighty forgive these lunatics who espouse hatred for their fellow man, and grant them wisdom that the followers of the other great faiths of the world have acquired over the millenia.

Dave, london, u.k.

This article articulates why I have had so many sleepless nights since NuLabour took office! The future for the Britain we have loved looks bleak indeed.

Wouldn't it be comforting to know that we have leaders with full understanding of this growing problem, and the necessary courage to deal with it - decisively?

Richard Lewis, Swansea, UK

What has happened to the "goverments" first mandated duty to protect its own citizens when it has been the architect and cheerleader of mass immigration with the official figures show that 60% of immigration outside of EU is Muslim.

robert, ashford, kent

Islam has pulled off one of the great propaganda coups of all time. 1. It is a religion of peace. NO. It is a political ideology, akin to totalitairianism and certainly not peaceful. 2. Islam has verses of tolerance to guide muslims. NO. These have been abrogated by verse 9:5, one of Mohammed's last recitations which overules all previous tolerant verses. 3. All religions are the same. we all want to live in harmony. NO. The aim of Islam is a world under sharia. This has been the aim for over a 1000 years. Nothing has changed, just the opportunity is now here. 4. Muslims are innocent victims of racism. NO. Muslims are not a race. They play the victim card when it suits them or bully or blame others when they can get away with it. This is a war that Islam knows is taking place but the West does not. It is a war between the free world and totalitairianism. The free world is superior to Islam, in economics, technology & creativity so we can win. Certainly, we must not lose.

Tony Pearson, London,

Yes, Islam as a religion is an archaic fairy tale which should remain just that. It has no purpose in the modern world. The relevance of its teachings is like that of pre-industrial science to the current world of sophisticated physics and electronics.

Ali Salahuddin, Bradford, UK

It seems that nothing will shift our politicians to act in our interests so why keep voting for them to keep them in power? It's our fault as much as theirs.

stevgillamos, Romford,

Andrew Norfolk has taken things out of context. This is blatantly another attack on Muslims and to stir up hatred amongst society. The Shaykh he mentions is not a radical or a fundamentalist but his speeches have been taken out of context. He only preaches what Islam is and Islam is about peace, justice and submission. Now, if thats what u call fundamentalism or terrorism then maybe all Muslims are terrorists and fanatics?? People really need to listen to his talks to find out how he really is, instead of reading coomments made by people like andrew.

ARG, Leicester,

a comment made in your paper by a muslim was the lion is waking up, all i can say is the british bulldog has yet to bite! the british tolerance is now being tested to the full, by radical muslims who hate the british and there way of life, WHY DONT THEY LEAVE! or is social security to strong a pull on them?

sharp, preston,

Have I read it right? "the Message of Muhammad (Peace be upon Him) - which is no different from the Message of Jesus" ??? This is madness! Mohammed called for open warfare to convey his cult, and poses as the "most perfect role model" ... of a war-lord, participating in robberies, instigating the murder of those who criticized him, managing slave trade and butchering at cold blood his prisoners (hundreds of them).

For the Muslims and Muslims apologists. Do not waste your time trying to convince the "infidels" that this cult is peaceful. Instead, you should spend your energy to convince the Muslims, exactly those who are "hijacking the religion" that it is peaceful!!!

Wake up!

Calatrava, Vaughan, ON/Canada

These radical muslims will only leave or move on when they have converted Britiain to a MUSLIM COUNTRY!

It's no secret that their agenda is a global imperialist one.

The cheek is that their using our taxpayers money to do it!

David, Wirral, UK

Wilson of London is correct. We have helped many of the Islamics who hate us, by taking them in when they feared problems in their own lands. This is undoubtedly seen as a weakness . Some time ago in a TV debate a politician tried to point out to a mainly Muslim audience (well, that makes it a BBC programme, then) that British soldiers had died for Muslims in Bosnia. The reply from a young veiled Muslim was that it was "years ago" and as a result people had forgotten about it.

Strange that Muslims still remember the crusades from 800 years ago.To be fair that is just about the era in which many Muslim countries still exist.

Graham Voisey, South Devon, England

I find it beautifully ironic that people such as this openly express contempt for Britain and the 'West', yet exploit all the freedoms which this society provides to express those very opinions. They know full well that if they were in most countries in the Middle East, they'd be hanging from the end of a noose.

John F, London,

If someone promotes such hatred then need to judge by where he gets his justification. The problem lies with in the Islamic scriptures. You can justify the violence from Quran so easily. There aabout 150 verse that support violence one or the other.Sura 8:12,13,15-18"Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): ‘I am with you: give firmness to the believers. I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers. Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them." Sura 8:65 (Fight with perseverance because you will win.)
"O Apostle! Rouse the believers to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred. If a hundred, they will vanquish a thousand of the unbelievers, for these are a people without understanding."
Sura 8:67-69 (Keep killing and don't take prisoners until the land is subdued. You shouldn't fight to get material goods, but God forgives your mistake this time.)
"It is not fitting for Apostle that he should have prisoners of war until he had thoroughly subdued the land.

MM noble, Glasgow, uk

I am getting rather worked up by the comments of some of our "foreign friends" from the US and China. Communist China - a nation that supplies wepons to those who are killing our soldiers and which supressess most, if not all basic human freedoms; - and the US - a nation that has complete contempt for the rule of law and whose evangelical hate-preaching nutcases are even more of a concern than nutcase imams (the reason: they have money, power and Bush in their back pockets) have absolutely no right to tell us how we should govern our nation. Yes there are crackpots and they need to be dealt with but at least those crackpots aren't running our country - unlike the US and China.

William James-Smith, LONDON,

If these people hate British and Western Values why don't they go back to the country where they came from since its so much better! It'll be no loss to britain as they contribute nothing.

TB, Luxembourg, Lux

We must wake up to the fact that we, as a species are being faced with a choice, the most profound since we came up with agriculture ten-or-so thousand years ago: do we want religion, or peace? Whether it's radical preachers stirring up hatred, or the Catholic Church seeking legal protection to discriminate against homosexual adoption, the issues come from the same root. When we couldn't jet around the world, when there wasn't large scale, unassimilated immigration, humans with wildly carying ideas rarely came into contact with each other in everyday life. Exceptional circumstances, yes: The Crusades, for instance, or the Ottoman incursions into Europe, but for the large part, we kept seperate and out of trouble. Religion seperates humans by default into believer and non-believer (or whatever phrase is used). If we want true, unbiased and honest tolerance, we will have to sacrifice the comfort of religious certainties. Whether we can do this is the next great challenge in our history.

KJ Keir, Aberdeen, Scotland

KICK THEM OUT! If they are against Britain, they don't deserve to be here.

The government needs to wake up and grow a spine!!

Patriot, London,

Recommended education for kuffars on the realities of Islam today.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/

David Smith, Stourbridge, UK

Wherever there are Muslim communities there is trouble, wanting independant muslim states, this will eventually happen here, this country will be completely different in 50 years time.

M Jones, Staffordshire, UK

its nice to see the times has taken the next step....bringing the deobandies into the extremist fold....who next the sufi's...?? there is nothing radical about 99% of Imams and the british born imams are a blessing for the uk...ppl who are educated and have grown up in the uk. They are those who understand the mindset of the muslim youth and will be the MOST successfull in turning the youth AWAY for REAL extremism that is a cancer for both muslims and and the rest of the world.... Or of course the government would rather have urdu arabic and bengali speaking imams who have no real link to this society, have no understanding of the culture of young muslims growing up here or their aspirations/fears ..but hey at least they are 'on message'...who cares if the youngesters cant or dont wish to listen to ppl who rant and rave about the 'good' in those very countries they have just left !!! How is it secular libralism is incapable of tolerating anything other than itslef.??

jarrar, Birmingham-stan, Uk-stan

You will see Muslims making comments here to try and rubbish this story. Just read the book the "Islamist" from one who knows what Islam is really about. The Qoran certainly says spread Islam by the sword. Anyone who has watched the spread of muslims into the west knows they in their warped minds are spreading Allahs wishes. Its about making the world Islamic.They are taught to lie to the Kaffirs and the stupid Politicions let them get away with Murder in more ways then one. Wake up Stupid people your childrens future is at risk. Ban this evil cult and deport all muslims from the west!

Inga Svendson, London, UK

I am not British but still am rather surprised at how the British authorities have allowed such an extreme form of Islam to take root and flourish in the UK. I cannot understand what prevents the authorities from cancelling the staying permits of the likes of Mr Ul-Haq and sending them off to wherever they came from. Are they scared or do they just consider it too politically incorrect to expel a person who is clearly a threat to law and order in the society? The UK authorities should not allow this political correctness or fear to shoot them in the foot and must act before it is too late.

G.N.Rajan, Rhone-alpes Isere, France

If ul Huq was white, his preaching of this filth would have the left out marching in protest. - and probably bring a prosecution on himself. BNP's Griffin was charged - why is this man not?

Nick, Rotherham, UK

Sebastian23, Have you actualy read the quran? if so go back to the begining and start again, i think you missed most of what it meant....

Shane, Clitheroe, lancs

If they don't like mixing with the Kuffar who corrupt their puritanical ways they should go to an Islamic country.

N.Trivedi, London,

Ban smoking inside and outside Mosques, that should solve all our problems. Brussels and this government will not be happy until they cause another English Civil War at which point they can put foreign troops on our streets to achieve their ultimate goal. A defeated and neutered Britain. Take a close look at the downfall of Yugoslavia and tell me I'm wrong.

Steve P, Leeds, England

I attend Shaykh riyadh ul haqs talks and i cant believing what im reading. All of his comments have been taken out of context and a ANTI-Islamic minded persons context has replaced it. He said only a few months ago "40 neighbours each side of you have a right over you, muslim and non muslims. Imam abu Hanifah's (born 680AD-ish) neighbour was a jew who used to make noise every night, until 1 night the noise stopped, so he enquired and found that he'd been arrested for being too drunk, so Imam Abu Hanifah bailed him out. Does this promote to hate non muslims??It is his interpretation and understanding of islam that deobandis follow. Shaykh Riyadh encourages us not to sleep around., drink alcohol or gamble - look at how many families break up due to them, He only encourages a simple life of peace and contentment, and ive NEVER heard him say anything about us killing anyone. If you choose to believe this anti-islamic article, then goodluck to you.

Arosh Ali, Coventry, UK

The EU must now act as one in removing these Hate Clerics to the lands of their origin, so they can preach to their own kind away from our countries. Freedom of Speech is one thing but this is taking the matter "out of all proportions". If these followers don't like it here GO so we can live the way we want to and have done for a 1000 years without outside interference.

Mike, Burley-in-Wharfedale, West Yorkshire

One of the most frightening articles I have ever read. The more one learns about contemporary Britain, the greater the sense of utter helplessness. I cannot see any hope for society; no potential solutions or strategies. Nothing.

Bryan Stanion, Aghios Nikolaos Crete, Greece

Most Moslems want to live in harmony as well. The more extrreme aspects of any religion are unpalatable, but I have yet to meet any Moslem bogeymen (or women) myself.

Remember 1984?

It suits this government to have dissent among the working peoples of the country. It takes the attention off the real issues...

Pete Balchin, Solicitor , Bristol, UK

The other half of Britain's mosques are of course controlled by the Saudi based wahabbi sect. When is the government going to wake up?

And to think the government plans 125 state-funded Islamic schools... the level of ignorance amongst politicians is tantamount to abdication of duty.

MBC, Edinburgh,

The biggest threat we face today is terrorism and weapons of mass destruction. The definition of terrorism is to create fear - to terrorise and that term applies to contempory democracy. The media have failed to report the high number of WMD's that were found in Iraq belonging to the terrorist regimes. These WMD's were not present in Iraq prior to the invasion and occupation, but were brought into Iraq from western democratic terrorist governments. An example of a WMD is the cluster bomb which is designed to maximise innocent civilian casulty - These terrorist devices have been used by contempory terrorists and have to date killed hundreds of thousands innocent Men, Women and Children. We are committing and supporting acts of state terrorism in the name of democracy and freedom. We must learn to respect the way and life of other nations, rather than invading and occupying them and lead by example.

Shuaib Achhala, London, UNITED KINGDOM

We open our arms to these people, and this is how they repay us? The government needs to wake up and take action now, or it will be our children facing the terrible consequences.

Richard, Surrey, UK

Eh, this is news?

Ellen Morris, Leeds,

A religion should not be judged by the behaviour of some of its nominal followers because there are bad people among every religious group, and making a judgment based on those people is misleading as they may be violating their religion.
A religion should rather be judged by its teaching.

Ben, London,

This artical is truly important, it shows how dangerous the exstremist have become. But the problem is how do you get the imans who preache this dangerous foul propaganda, out of the mosques.

Henrik M Pedersen, Stjordal, Norway

"The problem is the starting-point. if you believe in nonsense like the existence of God," BORING I know lots of people at my local Church of England who don't go round blowing things up or preaching hate about everyone. If these radical-atheists ever stepped back from their incessant bickering about other peoples lives, then they could realise that this is a problem about basic human conflicts and the way we live as a society (and how certain people have problems between that and their own ideas), not religion as a whole. Watchout... theres a Buddhist going to blow up that Synagogue.. NOT

Craig Morely, Halifax, Yorkshire

Farrukh :

Why do you need government assistance to counteract the teachings of these people? If Islam were truly a religion of peace, shouldn't you be able to convince with reference to your own holy books?

Omar, Plains,

Almost half of mosques under control of Islamic sects?

Here's news - every church in this country is under the control of one or other christian sect and they can't agree amongst themselves who's version of their religion is the right one. From the wee frees to the happy clappies. Violence and intolerance? Intolerance of other religions by Christian extremists isn't a history lesson it's current fact. NF, BNP, KKK, the English royal family (remember it's against UK law for one of that bunch to marry outwith their religion). I don;t support or condone what Islamic extremists preach but I do get a tad tired of continued implications that there's is the one religion with nasty types.

deamhain, Port Righ,

I would like to add a PS.
Well done to the Times, for confirming all that was aired by C4 in their recent program.
There was outrage at the time [ & interference from the police ] & now maybe people will see all it contained , as fact.
Not that there could be any doubt of what was said,& shown, but you have taken it further by numbering the Mosques with the hate filled Imams.
Could we have a list printed soon of the guilty ones ?

Maggie Millington, Brittany , France

The whole of Europe is facing up to a slow and creeping Islamisation, and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. We are the prisoners of our own past. Our Governments are too haunted by the spectres of authoritarianism, war and genocide to ever consider biting their thumbs at the PC-lobby; too scared of being labelled reactionary should they move even slightly to the right on basic issues such as Immigration and Assylum.

In Britain, the left has simply been too effective at closing down the public debate. No one is willing to speak their mind for fear of being branded "racist", "islamophobic" etc. , and no politician / mainstream party appears willing to take a risk and champion the genuine and legitimate concerns of the people. The consequence: just watch the BNP vote jump at the next election.

Graham, Leeds, UK

I have been very curious for a while now as to whether or not there's been a study into the ethnic origins of these so called 'radical islamists'. The press tends to label them as Muslims, but their actual nationality plays an important part too I believe. It seems there are a lot more problems caused by Pakistani Muslims in Britain, compared to those of Arab origin.
Perhaps this isn't just about Islam, but Islam being used a vehicle for these people who have come from a generation of immigrants who have other issues.

Mia, London, UK

"...imams who share a similar <bold>radical</bold> agenda."

Norfolk is quite wrong with this descriptor. More accurately, the imams adhere to a variant of Sunni salafism, which is a pure, fundamentalist strain of Islam. There is nothing radical about it. What these imams preach on Fridays is verbatim quotes and literal interpretations of the Qur'an and the ahadith.

Eric Green, Peterborough,

If these guys were Nazis, promoting Nazi views, they'd be outlawed, deported or Imprisoned.

Because they hide behind the guise of religion their opinion is accepted under the laws of "free speech"; all the while they are poisoning minds.

The UK has enjoyed "Free Speech" thanks to our forefathers defeating our ways of life and freedom in WW1 & WW2. Surely these "Islamic" prophets are as dangerous as the followers of Adolph Hitler when It comes to threatening our way of life.

When will we as a nation get our heads out of the sand and confront these haters of peace and free living and treat them with the contempt they deserve? Liberalism will get us nowhere and eventually we'll have a similar civil conflict such as those in Ireland and the former Yugoslavia!

Smell the Coffee, Cumbria,

Kick them out! If they are against Britain they shouldn't be here!

Lea, Holyhead, North Wales,

People who do not understand the delicate balance of a multicultural society should stay out of it. I can hundreds of examples from Prophets (PBUH) when he cared and helped the non muslims living under his jurisdictions in arabian peninusla. Mr. ul-haq has subjectfully choosen to quote only those instances when the word of Jihad and blood shed is used by the Porphet (PBUH) to fight against an aggressor or a cruel ruler.

It is important that the muslim society in GB stop issuance of hatred from the most respectfull position, the Imam.

Mehdi AK, Zurich, Switzerland

Britain has utterly changed. what has happened that no Churchil like figure is emerging and no Bernard Levine to lash the collaborators and appeasers with whip of sarcasm. The present practice of multiculturism will help to make Britain a fearful place for non muslims.

bhubaneswar ghosh, kolkata, wb

Have any of you actually listened to any of his lectures?
Try using your own intellect rather than being fed the viewpoints of people who have know knowledge or concern of the greater good.

A person, London, UK

The level of ignorance about Islam boggles the mind. I cannot believe the dribble that is written, in what is meant to be a 'quality' paper. This is more suited to sensationalist tabloid journalism, written to suit a purpose.

As a Muslim, I dont believe in people being harmed in any way, believe myself to be British, pay my taxes and dont break any laws and believe in contributing to society by charity work. I also follow the doebandi theological teachings. They are NOT incompatible.

In the case of the Dispatches programme about an Imam's sermon, where police said that distortion of the truth through 'heavy editing' had occured, is a case in point. It occurs in all forms of media.

Shabana, London,

having been brought up a Muslim in the UK I was always concerned that the Uk would find itself with a problem such as this. My brother and I back in the 80's discussed which side we would take our religion or our country, we chose our country but asteenagers didn't realise that we could have both. It means a reclaiming of our faith from the misguided and simply evil people that have hijacked it for their own political purposes. I grew up being taught that Jews were my cousins and that they and Christians are 'people of the book' to be respected, that Muslims don't evangelise.
Unfortunately the people that want to use Islam for their political aims and objectives wern't just fellow Muslims. It suited the UK and US govenments to have alot of angry young men baying for war to go fight a proxy war in Afghanistan and in the Balkans, so they supported the hardliners and turned a blind eye to them in the UK Mosques. As a result moderate Muslims have been sidelined and shut up.

J Siddiqui, London,

Farrukh,
Your comments , while commendable , are naive.
You are a Muslim who appears to be denying that, the Qu-ran you read is not the same Qu-ran the Islamists in this article read !
It is exactly the same book & the same Muhammad, the difference is only that they are taking Muhammad literally & you are burying your head in only the good things he said.
There are no ' confused' values here, it's as clear as night follows day, Muhammad promoted Jihad, he made the kuffars enemies,he gave clear instructions on what to do .
None of these have ever been annulled, it's what being a Muslim means ,
It is against Islam to mix with Jews, Christians & all non believers .
A Muslim who does , is not a true follower of Islam, it IS a black & white fact.
Call the troublemakers Deobandis or any name, but it's just a name.
What Islam needs is a new Qu-ran, a new ' testament ' removing the troublesome ' sura's' this & only this, could be the answer to ANY kind of compromise between East & West.

Maggie Millington, Brittany , France

Richard in London , so nobody should belong to a religion for fear of becoming the prey of extremist teachings? What a load of rot! Religions are based on and encourage peace and love, and whilst I dont belong to any relgion myself I am more than accepting of someone who finds their own personal peace and happiness in any relgion they choose.

In fact acceptance and respect of others beliefs is the key. No one is asking you to get on your knees and pray but dont you agree that if people accepted other peoples differences then the world would be a much more peaceful place? If not then you are no better than any religious extremist or preacher of hate.

Rod Munch, Northampton, UK

The biggest threat we face today is terrorism and weapons of mass destruction. The definition of terrorism is to create fear - to terrorise and that term applies to contempory democracy. The media have failed to report the high number of WMD's that were found in Iraq belonging to the terrorist regimes. These WMD's were not present in Iraq prior to the invasion and occupation, but were brought into Iraq from western democratic terrorist governments. An example of a WMD is the cluster bomb which is designed to maximise innocent civilian casulty - These terrorist devices have been used by contempory terrorists and have to date killed hundreds of thousands innocent Men, Women and Children. We are committing and supporting acts of state terrorism in the name of democracy and freedom. We must learn to respect the way and life of other nations, rather than invading and occupying them and lead by example.

Shuaib Achhala, LONDON, UNITED KINGDOM

I quite liked the comment from China that the British were fools for allowing preaching of questionable material. Are you even allowed to view pages like this in China? ;o)

mrak, spegville,

Riyadh al Haq seems not to appreciate that much of the west is also concerned about the 'Coke and Big Mac Culture'. Also many westerners are in awe of the cohesiveness and mutual support apparant in Muslim communities; values the West seem to have lost.

I've never met anyone who wants to subjegate or eleminate Islam or any other religion. I have met many people who will defend, at all costs, the rights of all to democratic freedom and the pursuit their own beliefs.

My experience of meeting and working with Muslims is of a courteous, gentle, friendly and hardworking people. Rather than preach segregation and hatred, surely there is an opportunity for Riyadh al Haq to encourage learning from each others cultures whilst retaining cherished values.

Don Allwright, Altrincham, UK

Read in isolation one would think these thoughts were simply jokes or at worst those of crazy persons. It is however, a very serious situation involving some very dangerous people. I honestly don't believe the British public and the very politicians who represent them fully understand what is going on and what needs to be done.

Barrie Redfern, Krsko, Slovenia

When are people going to WAKE UP and recognise that we have allowed a fox into the chicken coop?? Instead of ignoring this fact, or hoping the gathering storm will go away, the government and judiciary need to take drastic action to root all radical islamic groups and their acolytes out of this country.

Ben, London, UK

Well! It looks like Dan Richardson has mastered the Qur'an. It would be nice if he had mentioned the surahs that spread peace and tolerance. One should focus in understanding the meaning of the surah than to merely quoting individual verses.

R.Ibrahim, London, UK

There are certain sects who give Islam its bad name 'Islam' for one means peace and all you can really do is pray to God to guide these people who are misguiding other vunerable people to the straight path. Ameen

SUFI SB, Keighley,

Thousands of people will be in Brussels on 11th September demonstrating to Stop Islamisation Of Europe.

It starts at 12.00 in Luxembourg Square

Stephen Gash, Carlisle , England

All faiths have the same problem, someone at the top sets the agenda and their interpretation is the one that all believers follow, rather like lemmings .
The Muslim faith is still young and has yet to mature in the way Christianity has.
Its only a few centuries ago that the Catholics rampaged through South America destroying other civilisations in the name of God,
and in the last century were still hunting Aborigines for sport so lets not mount the moral high ground here.
What I don't understand however is why anyone wants to come and live in Britain whilst hating the lifestyle, surly a recipe for mental instability

m wilkinson, Telford, uk

Hello,

I have listened to this Sheikh's talks including the ones from which the article takes excerpts. From the talks I took the message that integration is ok assimilation is not (from a religious point of view). To be part of society in inevitable, though should one lose the right to hold onto values and principles as laid down by religion?

I follow the edicts of my faith but I don't hold non-muslims in contempt. Rather I seek to learn from their better qualities. In numerous talks the Sheikh has mentioned many aspects of British societal behavior that the muslims ought to possess but unfortunately don't.

I believe this article to be an unfair portrait of a true man of religion. Many of the statements to me seem to out of context. Especially when Quranic verses are juxtaposed to Mr Ul Haqs owns words creating a seamless paragraph Mr Ul Haqs own views.

Maz, Solihull, UK

This article is excellent and brings to light another issue which the 'government' ( persuaded by Wahabbis and modernist Muslims) has been keen to persue- the creation of British trained Imams.
This demand to train Imams in Britain is coming from the very same people who are training people like Mr Huq- who are opposed to 'traditional' Islam which is tolerant and inclusive.
Nothing could be more disastrous for us than to stop non-english speaking 'tradional Imams' (who in the main separate religion and politics and have a live and let live attitude)) from coming to Britain and replacing them witha bunch of 'modern' english speaking fanatics trained by government funded institutions by Deobandis and their Wahhabi cohorts.

Mahmood Jamal, London, UK

Islam means 'peace and submission'. Everything about the faith is about inculcating a sense of peace and amicability in both the internal (personal) and external (social) spheres of life. This is emphasised so much so that the Quran states:
"whosoever killeth a human being it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind." (5:33)
This is just one example from countless verses of the Holy Quran that emphasise peace and love on this earth, and likewise the example of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is such as has no parallel in the history of the world. When Mecca fell to Muslims and the Holy Prophet entered the city victorious, all those who had treated him and his followers with cruelty received his free pardon, without asking for it. Thirteen years of persecution were forgiven and forgotten in one single moment.
These are just 2 examples of compassion and peace that Islam sets forth...

Z Khan, London,

A religion should not be judged by the behaviour of some of its nominal followers because there are bad people among every religious group, and making a judgment based on those people is misleading as they may be violating their religion.
A religion should rather be judged by its teaching.

Ben, London,

To Lori, Toronto, Canada.

Duh ! Some of us (British) citizens on the the street have a good idea of what is preached at these places. But, Duh !! wilful negligence by our huggy humanist *government* has allowed it to develope and to continue to flourish. To say that the *nation* is wilfully ignorant is a tad harsh. Let's be clear about who is at fault here. And that is an extremely weak and ineffective Labour *government* obsessed by polls.

RJA, Nottingham, England, UK

I don't see what the problem is.Muslims are sitting down before you and telling you that they intend to kill every last Westerner alive and then they demonstrate their intentions by blowing up parts of the country and still no one seems to believe them.I ,for one,believe them.They appear to be very sincere.It's way past time that Westerners should be listening to what they're saying.Muslims are here among us demonstrating by word and action that they despise our very existence and still we tolerate them.Why?Do we wake up before it's too late on not?

ron, toronto,

You, Britain, are doomed...

Paul, Columbia, SC, USA

Here we go again. Everybody's jumping on the band wagon just because of one article. I am a Muslim and i listen to the speeches of Shaykh Riyadhul Haq and he is one of the very few people who actually speaks out when wrong and injustices are being carried out. These are the type of stories that sell papers and ceate a stir and that is exactly what is happening judging by other people's comments. These are just snippets of his speeches and have been quoted out of context. One needs to listen to the whole speech to grasp what is really being said and why it is being said.

A Yaqoob, Birmingham,

A. Rahim said, "In confronting Mr ul Haq about his misguidance about Islam, he should be reminded how tolerant the Quran teachings is towards other religions, specially Judaism and Christianity. Let him re-read the Quran."

Do you mind listing the surahs where 'tolerance' is explicitly taught? On the other hand, I don't think you or Mr ul Haq will have a problem finding where violence is explicitly encouraged (see surahs 9:5, 8:60, 9:14, 8:12,17, 5:51, 9:73, 9:29, 48:29, 4:74, 2:190-191, 9:38, 9:41, 3:85, 2:193, 3:157, 9:29).

Dan Richardson, Oxford, UK

Do people really believe that Islam is tolerant ?
Mo said "If anyone changes his religion kill him"

We should stop all muslim immigration now.

David, London, UK

Richard, London. Why are you using an extremely troubling report on Islamic extremism to generally attack faith in God? It is not Jews and Christians that are causing the trouble - it is radical Islam. Not all religions are the same and the presence of counterfeit religions does not negate the reality of the genuine! Atheism cannot and never will be able to explain how the vastly complex and beautifully designed universe we live in came into existence. It is you who need to think about the evidence for your beliefs which are based on a theory of macro-evolution which has shown to be totally false even by Darwin's own criterion. If you think people turning from faith in God to atheism is the answer then just take a look at Stalinism and Nazism. The answer is not to attack faith in God and the answer is certainly not atheism! This report from the Times is a real wake-up call and we British need to wake up to and deal with the very real and serious threat of extreme Islam.

Paul, Peterborough, UK

Why oh why do people think that it is OK to come and live in a country, take all they can from it, including the freedoms it has won and built, like the NHS, the Social Security structures, freedom of speech, laws to ensure equal rights to all people, laws to protect the innocent, and much, much more, - and then think it is their God given right to campaign AGAINST the very country that has given them a home? Can anyone explain this because it doesn't make any sense to me at all?? What makes even less sense is why any country would allow it to happen.

Tarni, London, UK

Why should we be surprised? The Islamists want nothing more than to kill or subjugate Christians, Jews, Hindus and even the small minority of Muslims that do not support the violent overthrow of Western Civilisation. These "seminaries" must be shut down and the traitors disposed of with extreme prejudice.

J. Worthington Edwards, III, Kansas City, USA

Deport them - if they hate the west so much, send them to Pakistan or wherever they believe they can live their islamic dream.

Matt, Egham,

I wonder if all the readers have stopped to think that if a Muslim Cleric is preaching the teachings of Islam - whether we agree with them or not what then would a Hindu, Christianity, Jewish etc preacher preach......????

I am not promoting nor do I agree in the killings of innocent people, but Islam is alot more than what the media has protrayed - maybe it is time to stop inciting hatred and building gaps and start to help the readers learn more about the true Islam... or whould that defeat the purpose !!!! God forbid the people would find out that Islam is a peaceful, caring, forgiving, fair and most importantly tolerant religion.

The readers should stop acting like the blind followers and learn more about Islam and judge themselves ....!

N Khatun, Yorkshire, England

Having quickly browsed the 'infinite justice' transcript, i beg to ask the question, having read it with an open mind, what is exactly wrong with it?

I feel this is an 'Islamaphobic' article, trying to vilify the religion and preachings of Islam once again (the fastest growing religion in the world).

Open your mind, the is no 'clash of civilizations', it's just the media and people in power trying to scaremonger and spread hatred.

To the general public, do not rely on the mass media to paint a picture of Islam, speak to muslims in general, go to your local mosques, and do further research into the true teachings of islam, and dig deeper into the reasons behind certain rulings and actions, only then will you be able to form a balanced opinion of this great religion.

Mo, London, UK

“You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself.”

I agree with Mr. Ahmed's sentiments, except that you can't "run" multiculturalism at all, at least if you wish to survive as a free people. The takeover of mosques by radical elements is a natural exponent of the twisted multiculti experiment.

Tim, Raleigh, NC, USA

Try finding the same sort of perverse violent thinking and teaching from any other major world religion or philosophical movement. With such prevelance. These so called small groups of radicals in the Muslim community continue to pop up and be reported. If it's not the Taleban it's the wahabe or it's the leader of Iran, then it's "rebels" taking a school in Russia, then it's the al sadr people the Shiite radicals, the Sunni radicals, Palestinian radicals, Egyptian radicals, Radical clerics, Radical converts on and on so forth. There are so many Islamic radical groups, sects, movements, individuals et-cetera that I can't even hope to remember all their names other than they all claim the same religion. And every time we are told this is small, a minority, an abberation by those who hijack a religion. Where is the same phenomenon found in ANY other significant religion/philosophy?

Chris, Bellingham, USA

And people wonder why so many Brits are leaving? With the current government and the idiots who run the courts Britain is likely to be an Islamic state by about 2015. Why doesn't the government support the thousands of peace loving, genuine and hard working Muslims instead of protecting the fanatics?

george, Glasgow, UK

The first measure our Gov't should take as a matter of extreme urgency is to cease funding to all religious schools. Schools should educate not indoctrinate. The second measure must be to remove the "charity" status from all religions and their associated cults. This would then allow the Inland Revenue and Customs and Excise to investigate, audit and enforce visibility of funding and spending.

Kevin O'Brien, Ashford, England

It is somewhat counter-intuitive and deeply alarming that second and third generation, Western-born and educated Muslims tend to be more radical than their first-generation parents and grandparents. The reason? Western host-societies do not offer any meaningful rootedness beyond the tepid pap of inclusiveness, multiculturalism, tolerance, etc, etc. Young Muslims in quest of some meaning in their often drab lives duly find Kuran 9:5 -- and it's a heady brew.

Serge Trifkovic, Highland Park, IL, USA

If ul Haq and his ilk are so keen to return to the 7th century, they must eschew all forms of communication other than quill pen and all forms of transport other than foot, horse or sail. Otherwise they will be open to the charges of hypocracy and opportunism.

Paul, London, England

No doubt those on the Left infected with the islamofascist appeasement meme (or the multi-culti meme) will decry this investigation as [sic] racist or that the preachers have been taken out of context (funny how the theocratic fascists are always quoted out of context) or that you are being 'islamophobic' (a nice P/C BS word invented by the Left / Islamist alliance to deflect attention away from the highly regressive and reactionary ideology espoused by the Islamists).

However this should serve as a wake up call to those still asleep, as for our Government they should be honest and state that Islam isn't like the rest of the Sky Pixie delusions, as it is a political ideology bent on imposing itself on us, like it or not.

Accordingly these individuals should be interned as Fifth Columnists. I truly worry that if they don't then we'll see a complete breakdown in Law and Order as extremists (Islamist and anti-Islamist) fight it out in the streets of the UK.

Malcolm Smith, London, UK

The Deobandis have previously been criticised for only focusing on some basic tents of faith and not approaching things holistically. Riyad ul Haqq has been around for a long time; few see him as an authority figure. Now suddenly he's the sensational leader of over 600 mosques. Who said this? The Police...oh, well they've never been wrong (murder of innocent man on tube etc)!! He leads 1 mosque!

Riyad ul haqq is a nobody to most Muslims. It's just become the fashionable thing to do for some readers to read articles like this and suddenly talk about erasing Islam/deportation/end of world etc - most from parts of the country that have not been touched by violence from extremists. A lot of big mouths
If Haqq has done something wrong - punish him, not thousands of others.

Asghar, London, UK

This, he says, taught them that they will “never be accepted” in Britain and has led them to “return to Islam: sisters are wearing hijab . . . the lion is waking up”.

The lion is waking up eh? I think he might find that Brittannia is waking up to the threat and if he tries to force his values on the rest of us then the lion may have to be caged up as there is no way an Islamic state will ever take hold here. Don't take us on.

Nick, Bristol,

Another nail in the coffin for our wonderous multicultural utopia. When will the Government speak up?

Robert, Manchester,

I always thought that the Quran was a book that teaches Love, mutual understanding, order and the importance of education but according to the learned Mr ul Haq it is all about spreading hatred, division and chaos. How could I have been so misguided?

Mauirts, Rotterdam, The Netherlands

I'm only surprised that Ken Livingstone hasn't yet invited him to lecture us on the glories of 'multiculturism', in preparation to erecting a statue of him.

Paul Carlin, Dromore, County Down

This is another clear attempt to divide Muslim community on sectarian lines. I am not Deobandi nor Brelvi, but I do know them both very very well and i love both sects and disagree with both on few issues. Both are human beings. I heard many lectures of those scholars who have massive influence and massive contribution. I can clearly see the ill intention and the unhelpful approach of the author. Extreme views are everywhere and in every faith or ideology. This article has no link to reality. If I pre-framed you as evil person, then I (and everyone can do that) twist whatever you say to present you as evil. Now watch for the next due to this, local papers and media outlet around the country will be re-printing this, some may be contacting local mosques some not. Muslim have to “proof” (again) that they do not do this. We work day and night to build bridges and connect communities and work slowly to reform from within (and it will take time), but articles like this burn everything.

Anas, Southampton,

Unfortunately christians round here decided to "take the mosque" and where I sleep at home I could here a nightly gun battle. This stopped recently the mosque is still there. When I was in hospital recently many came in with knife wounds, garroting, bullet wounds and wounds to the head caused I believe by a cross bow.

That is called war.

Chris, London,

Dear Editor, i carefully observing "your selectiveness".. you are posting only negative comments and not balance it with any counter responses... media is always biased and anti-muslims anyway!!!

Converts to Islam Team, Hampshire,

Well this surely is an indication that Islam is not in step with the "multicultural" agenda that is constantly pushed on us. It seems to me after reading this article that it is intolerant of other people and their beliefs, religious and non religious. I for one do not have a desire to live in an Islamic state. I am sure there are many other people out there that are sick and tired of what this minority are proclaiming.

Lewis , Leith, Edinburgh, Scotland

We need to deport (by force if needed) any and all extremists (and their families) like this so like so like the proverbial bad apple they don't spoil the rest of the fruit.

Adrian, Middle England, England

The writing has been on the wall for some time but the government are illiterate when it comes to Islam!

D Shaw, Derby, England

Bye bye, Britain - it's only what you deserve. Thank you for being an amazing parent to so much of the New World, for giving such a great example to the entire world, but your sleepiness at the wheel is disgraceful. I hope you win this one, god knows - but I worry anxiously that it's too late.

I'm a left-leaning voter, but the head-in-the-sand attitude of the left for so many years now is baffling to me.

Jason Bo Green, Toronto, Canada

So ul Haq's seminary outlaws art, television, music and chess and would do the same for football, evidently. Judging by the picture though, Allah permits car ownership and driving.

Do you think ul Haq ever has the radio on? I've yet to hear him competing on Ken Bruce's mid-morning pop quiz on Radio 2

Heredal, Perth, Scotland

A. Rahim said, "In confronting Mr ul Haq about his misguidance about Islam, he should be reminded how tolerant the Quran teachings is towards other religions, specially Judaism and Christianity. Let him re-read the Quran."

Do you mind listing the surahs where 'tolerance' is explicitly taught in the Quran? On the other hand, I don't think you or Mr ul Haq will have a problem finding where violence is explicitly encouraged (see surahs 9:5, 8:60, 9:14, 8:12,17, 5:51, 9:73, 9:29, 48:29, 4:74, 2:190-191, 9:38, 9:41, 3:85, 2:193, 3:157, 9:29).

Dan Richardson, Oxford, UK

The way we dealt with religious subversives in the 17th century was to send them to internal exile. I see no reason why we cannot do the same with this lot. They can preach to themselves all day long but they can't spread their poison. It worked then why don't we give it a try now.

James VI, Holyrood, Scotland

Richard is absolutely right (excellent book) but it doesnt address this short term problem. If people missuse the freedom of religion as a weapon for the spread of sedition and violence they should be actively contained. I am not advocating any action against any religion specifically but those who use aspects of a religion to formulate hatred against others whether in the UK or abroad. Hiding behind the "respectable" front of any religion whilst preaching hatred and death is just terrorism by another name and should be dealt with as such. As Richard implied this includes all religions including Christianity.

mike gee, bournemouth, uk

If they hate western culture then why don't they just leave?
They obviously don't like the place and they are definitely not wanted.

David, Beijing, China

I subscribe to the view that Islam is the true religion of God, yet it does not require me to reject the fact that there are non-Muslims who care for the poor, the needy and the destitute. Some preachers are more vehement in their articulation of this point, others more structured and less emotive.

As British Muslims we have a number of challenges facing us as we seek to convey the Message of Muhammad (Peace be upon Him) - which is no different from the Message of Jesus (Peace be upon Him) that God exists and He has discharged you with certain responsibilities. In time, god willing, we will fulfil them.

T, London,

And what will the labour government do about it. Nothing. It will only react after more people are killed by these people and then only the minimum action they can get away with.
It is just this sort of approach that let Hitler get away with more and more and ended up with WW2.

Johnny Norfolk, Mileham , Norfolk

This is Max Frisch's play "Biedermann and the Fire-raisers" revisited. We have invited into our house the people who wish to destroy it.

wilson, London, UK

"He heaps scorn on any Muslims who say they are “proud to be British” and argues that friendship with a Jew or a Christian makes “a mockery of Allah’s religion”.

Then, for the purity of his own vision of Islam, surely he must leave Britain as rapidly as he can?

Matt, Shropshire,

They can distance themselves from the kuffar best by leaving the country, say for Afghanistan. In the meantime, the UK authorities should deny them grants.

Terry Dell, Weybridge, UK

Is there anything in this report that we didn't already know?

The only difference being that the Times has actually had the guts to publish it!

Mo, Paradise Cove,

Duh!

Just what do you think goes on in these places? How naive, or rather willfully ignorant can a nation be?

I suspect Great Britain has yet to realize just the full extent of what has happened there.

Lori, Toronto, Canada

Where in the Quran does it say that blood should be said in the pathway of Allah? I think you will find that the essence of all religions is love and unity and this so called "teaching from the Quran" certainly does not meet that standard!

The purpose of religion is to unite the worlds and if muslim relgion is not united itself (demonstrated through all its sects) how is it to achieve this beautiful teaching of unity by Muhammad.

Sebastian23, Newcastle ,

The problem is the starting-point. if you believe in nonsense like the existence of God, whether Muslim, Christian or any other, you lay yourself open to believing more nonsense such as these extremists preach now, and Christian extremists preached just a few hundred years ago. The cure is education. Get people to think about the evidence for their beliefs. It would also help if a few senior politicians who are atheists stood up and said that Islam, Christianity, Judaism and Hinduism are all false.

Richard, London,

In confronting Mr ul Haq about his misguidance about Islam, he should be reminded how tolerant the Quran teachings is towards other religions, specially Judaism and Christianity. Let him re-read the Quran.

I think people like him are paid to create rifts between peoples of different birth origins and beliefs. Unfortunately his types are spreading not only in the UK but around the world, especially in the Gulf Arab countries.

A. Rahim, Manama,

Truly the British are fools!

Not only do they allow dangerously subversive material to be preached openly, but they actually use taxpayers' money to send people to listen to it!

Bill McCann, Suzhou, China

The religion of Multiculturalism has been co-opted my Islamism. The goal of the Islamist is coming closer in the U.K.. and there are no solution in sight.

Malcolm, Darian,

The lion? the lion? Are you kidding me. How about rabid mouse. The only reason millions more innocent Muslims haven't been killed is the great reluctance that Europe has shown in engaging radical islam. The sleeping lion is Europe. Maybe if this knuckle dragging ape had spent more time learning about history and less time chasing a religion that fills the vacuous feelings of inadequacy that he and other aliens self generate then he would engage brain, before mouth. Westerners are fat and lazy and just want to be left alone, give them a reason and they'll turn into the monsters of the past.

Richard, DALLAS, USA

Members of the government , especially ministers, have little or no understanding of Islam whatsoever, except some magical concept of their own that it is a 'religion of peace'.
They are very easily conned by Islamists because they are committed to multiculturalism , which has allowed Islam to grow and prosper - often with government financial help.

Unless we get a hard-line government with ministers who will face the realities of the serious and enduring threat Islam poses to democracy, the future is bleak indeed.

It is not a 'small minority of radical muslims' ( Tony Blair) . It is the embedded beliefs of Islam that will continue to cause trouble.

We need to ban the Burkha and the Hijab and any form of cultural dress which supports seperatism. All muslim faith-based schools and madrassas should be dissolved.

If government continues to allow Islam to propogate its embedded political doctrine, the problems will escalate. Grasp the nettle NOW before it is too late.

Paul Williams, London, England

This is not true religion. Jihad was for those times in history, and these times are different, when we all must live according to the laws of our country. Muslims should not think they can live as if they were in the 7th century when those same legal and cultural conditions no longer exist. The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said "do not be extremists" [in religion] and the Holy Qur`an says "God will judge between them" [over religious differences] so let us not presume to judge, but leave judgement to God. The greatest teaching for every Muslim should be the simple message that: "There is simply NO NEED to preach that one religion is right and others are wrong" - Live and let live and let God be the Judge on who is right and who is wrong in what they do. If Christians or Jews or people of any religion do bad things - this is NOTHING TO DO WITH RELIGION - but if they have gone astray, in time, God willing, they will see the error of their ways and return to goodness.

John Coy, London,

But the spokesman for the Department for Communities did not say how they were going to deal with the problem.

Britain, the country of the FREE has got serious problem around the corner.

Dennis Spence (British Expat), Manila, Philippines

For a long time Muslims such as myself have contacted our government advising them to establish an educational program on Islam to enable the majority of everyday Muslims who do not subscribe to these 'stricter' and often mis representative interpretations of Islam. No response. If the government will not help everyday Muslims who do not actually hold these 'confused' values, how do they expect us to counter this negative influence which neither represents the teaching of Islam, nor the example of Prophet Muhammad? So again, I welcome dialogue with our government to help, empower the everyday Muslim with the knowledge that is required to counter the points of view put forward by such people.

As for deobanids vs barelwivs, one is just as bad as the other; labeling one strict and the other moderate simply reflects a failure to understanding the real issues facing the Muslim community today.

Farrukh, Woking, UK

Given this government's record it will be years before they get round to doing anything; and only after another bomb attack or two.

Peter Day, Doncaster, UK/ Yorkshire

Why don't you Brits just run these guys out of your country. Remember Nevil Chamberlain, he tried to make nice with the Devil and that didn't work out so well for you guys.

Rick, Dallas, Texas

It is clear that contracts need to be signed that agree to abide by rules of tolerance and respect and the rule of British Law. Racism and preaching of violence and hatred should be if they are not already against the law. If the preaching of religious hatred and intolerance is unlawful then tany such preachers Islamic Catholic protestant etc should be arrested and forbidden to practice. If they do not hold permanent residence they should be deported.
You say rtat 'Mahmood Chandia, a Bury graduate who is now a university lecturer, claims in one sermon that music is a way in which Jews spread “the Satanic web” to corrupt young Muslims.'
What kind of University is till employing him??The extremists take advantage of politically correct cultural relativism.
All values are not OK.

Barrie , Perth, Australia