Dr Hawley,

With the limited space allowed here, it is necessary to present simplified arguements. If you re-read my entry, you will realise you have misrepresented me. Everyone here has discussed inputs to the University system, only I have discussed outputs and the need to collect data.

Dr Terry Johnson, Maidstone, Kent

Dr Hawtrey,

Unless the current process is already perfect, it is possible to raise the output of a university without lowering standards by improving selection. This can be achieved by measuring the output and applying feedback to the selection process.

Dr Terry Johnson, Maidstone, Kent

I'm a state comprehensive educated student now at Oxford and I don't believe there is bias. The reason 59% of students are state school is because ~ 59% applicants are state school. Getting state school students to apply is the problem - which both unis are devoting time and money to address.

Josh, Hants,

Andy from London, higher education should not be a right for anyone unless they can meet the set standard. Lowering that to admit more "disadvantaged" students to create some socialist utopia does everyone a disservice, especially the less-able but so-admitted students. Pass the exam = admission.

Sarah, Ottawa, Canada

I kind of guess similar debates were raging 60 odd years ago when the number of women in higher education was disproportionate to the population.

Maisie , Sutton Coldfield, UK

They may not "be an engine for promoting social justice" but for centuries in the UK they have been an engine for compounding social injustice.

Peter, Wellington, New Zealand

But IPPR research shows that, of those students getting three A grades at A Level, only 64% are from state education. Take those who get three A grades with two in academic subjects and you're looking at about 63%.

Charlotte, Cambridge,

She hasn't 'condemned' having more state school students - she's said that the core purpose of Cambridge isn't social engineering, and that the university can and does strive to get the brightest students whatever their background. Both of which are true, obvious and rather uncontroversial really.

Emma (Cambridge student), Cambridge,

Well said, Alison Richard.

Contrast Mr Johnson of Maidstone - increasing the number of firsts can be done with a stroke of the pen, but it will not improve the standard of anyone's education.

Dr Ralph Hawtrey, Cambridge,

A university can only select the students with potential from those that actually apply.

Alan, Norhampton, UK

I went to a State school but I totally agree with Ms Richard's comments. Uni should be about academic merit rather than based on the postcode you live in or school you came from. Work hard if you want to get into university instead of relying on poverty and get rid of this chip on your shoulders!

Charlotte T, London, UK

I’m from a poor background. I received amazing bursaries throughout my time at Cam+additional support to ensure I wasn’t at a disadvantage. Being state educated is irrelevant if you can demonstrate your ability. Dictating a quota will lead to students being admitted that are unable to cope!

Emma B.A (Hons) Cantab , York,

I agree Alison Richard completely, I don't think state school students are subjected to bias during the application process, my tutor said that he doesn't read what school people are from before interviewing them, positive discrimination could harm the University as well as more deserving students.

May, Oxford,

Alison Richard is absolutely correct in her views - it would do our country no good at all to admit below-par students to our best universities. If someone has not motivated themselves to get the results they need, whatever their background, and doesn't have the guts to apply, they don't deserve it

Zoe, London,

There is a correlation between wealth and intelligence; there is also a correlation between you and your parent's intelligence.

Ergo, at the top end of a fair system (Cambridge admits only 0.5% of the population) you would expect a private school bias

(I'm a state-school Cambridge graduate)

Ed, Cambridge,

The only way to settle this for both sides is to give Unis the choice of either being state funded for state pupils only or they can leave the system and find their own funds. If her comments are accurately reported then she is wrong, she does have a social responsiblity, we all have.

alan, warks, UK

As an academic, I find Professor Richard's position timely and essential. It has become clear that the claim to 'social justice' actually hides an unwarranted sense of entitlement to academic degrees without a sense of obligation to work hard for them.

Bogdan Costea, Lancaster,

Cambridge is actively suppressing social justice. It is no wonder discrimination still exists with people like this in charge. It is time the government took much stronger action against these elitist institutions, the vested interests of those who run them and their biased admissions procedures.

Robin, Hampton, UK

Sunny from Coventry, that is a rather simplistic approach to a complex issue. Surely, the best students are not all in private schools. The resources, class sizes and various other factors are bound to have an impact on the end product. By the way, it is 'if they are not their the brightest'

Nicola Sylvester, Herts,

59% state school pupils - but how many of those are from grammar schools? How many are from Scotland, where all state schools are comprehensive, & the focus on Highers over AH means students are actively discouraged (& not just because of fees) from going South, & particularly to Oxbridge.

Hannah, Ayr, Scotland

Lets not celebrate Labour mediocre education policy.

steve tea, manchester, cheshire

You can be bright without being truly academic. Some Oxbridge students from elite schools fall in that category. They have learning skills, can knuckle down and pass their exams, but when it comes to a career they go into business. The real thinkers in state schools are harder to spot that's all.

Mal, London, UK

Having taught in the state sector for 14 years, many able pupils don't even try to apply for Oxbridge. Schools/parents are unfamiliar with the process, and have never found out how to support these pupils while they apply. Maybe unis should do more to inform, but non-applicants aren't their fault.

Judy, soton,

Well done. The best students come from private schools. Why should they be discriminated against because of the school they go to? If their the brightest, then that should be the most important fact.

Sunny , Coventry,

Absolutely - now we wait with baited breath for Oxford's response !!!!!!!!!!!

ian payne, WALSALL,

This 'pressure' is not new. It is up to universities to decide how they respond to it. The comment “The Government gives me a cheque every year. I have a public duty to do what the Government says.” is VERY worrying. Government has NO track record of dealing effectively with education.

Dr Chilton, Oakham, UK

I would suggest that Universities should be obliged to maximise their output, (for example the proportion of firsts). What are the proportions of state and public school students getting firsts respectively? Would changing the mix improve the output?

Terry Johnson, Maidstone, Kent

As UK Universities are part of the state education system and primarily state funded they have an obligation to promote greater access to elite education for the benefit of society as a whole. A level performance is not an absolute measure of ability in a two tier school system.

Andrew Lee, Storrington,

If you seriously believe that the education received from, say, Eton, is comparable to that of a state school, you are foolish. Ivy US universities are unapologetic about taking students from the best US public and private schools, because they tend to do better in academics and in life.

Rob, London,

It's not Cambridge that should be "promoting social justice" - it's the state education system. If that system provided as good an education as the public schools do (no reason why it can't), then there would be no debate. Cambridge's job is to promote excellence, which it does brilliantly.

Martin, Newmarket, Suffolk

Why aren't they more keen on making sure their is equality between the two sexes at this level? The education system is extremely skewed in favour of girls - why don't we look to even out the numbers - I've heard enough about apparent glass ceilings for women - how about helping young men?????

Simon, York, England

I agree. The primary objective of Cambridge University should be to be the world's foremost research university. The secondary objective should be to be the best possible educational institution for its students. Attempts at social engineering should not distract the university from its core mission

Rahul Nandkishore, Cambridge, Massachusetts, USA

How about scrapping the now inane A levels as the standard by which candidates are assessed.
What about a timed essay on an off the wall topic given to all candidates simultaneously should give a very good idea of who has a brain and who doesn't. Oh and no more entrance based on sporting ability

Judith, New York/London,

Another instance of New Labour policy. This government is determined on all fronts to bring everybody down to the same lowest common denominator and keep us all in massive debt.

Bob Travels, Stevenage,

She's quite right about the role of university as a place for research and then education. I can't envisage what Cambridge is going to be like with vocational degree courses such as Tourism, Graphic Designs etc. with minimal academic merit

Eliot Hunt, London,

e.g.
out of 10,000 students competing for 500 places at the mighty Cam-UN-bridge, we get:
n of private students admitted 205 >>population=700
n of public students admitted 295 >>population=9,300
correct me if wrong
I am sure if the admission process were not biased, statistics would be more logical!

Sam, Sheffield,

As a Parent with 3 students who went on to 4yr colleges,and graduated...It all starts at home..insist on good study habits..and have them at proper age get a 'part time' job...what a difference...Can't do it !!?? Can't ,can't do anything then...Get the Gov'mnt out of your house....

Mr Tim, San Marcos, US of A

Just more hypocrisy from NewLabour.
They beat any corner of education considered elitist (Oxbridge/Grammer/public schools), then send their own kids there.
Meanwhile compressing state education down to the lowest denominator.
And that is very, very low indeed.

Time for an election now.

Pat, Coromandel, NZ

She is right in principle. Whether she practices what she preaches is another matter, and one on which I am not qualified to comment.

Oonagh, Hong Kong,

We don't educate our young people, we just teach them to pass exams, so 'straight A students' contain a mixture of intellectually ordinary and very able students. Cambridge's role is to identify and nurture the ablest. Qualifications are a guide not a determinant. Of course Richard's correct.

Jacques, London, UK

True, with all its status and glory, the state of the economy and material progress at our human expense I guess it only matters in the narrow margins of society....

Pete, Point England,

Nulabour will not be happy until we are all regressed to knuckle dragging morons. They loath experience, brilliance and independence (all things they sadly lack).

Roger, Surrey.,

Thank goodness. How absolutely spot on she is. Courageous and accurate, well done Professor Richard

Paul, Saigon,

No she is correct. After all, the university tradition has been that they are engines for social injustice.

Bill, Perth, Australia

I was a Fulbright Scholar at Cambridge. Some of the public school students I met at Cambridge were not that bright -- but they had the right accent.

Zoe Oakleaf, Ph.D., Little Rock, AR, USA

If Government wants a nationwide regression to the mean in which all people are intellectually "average", it is going about it the right way. No more Darwins, Hawkings, Miltons, Watts, Cooks, Newtons, Pitts, et al. The brain drain would REALLY become a flood. A Great Britain without greats.

Bob Evans, Anaheim, California

I agree with the article totally

If you get good enough grades you get in that should be the only issue for entrance

If the government is concerned about an uneven social education playing field then it should get it's own house in order and stop victimising the middle classes and universities

Guy, London, UK

@ "This is abject nonsense..."

With such arrogant dogmatism and sweeping generalisation you would not last 5 minutes in an Oxbridge tutorial!

Oxford/Cambridge have made efforts to attract applicants from less "privileged" backgrounds but in the end selection must be on academic merit alone.

Richard W, Bogota, Colombia

Sam, Jonty - blame the state school system for not producing good enough candidates, not Cambridge (or Oxford) for not taking them. Forcing them to take underqualified applicants just lowers the standards for all.

And yes i was at Cambridge, and yes I was privately educated.

Giles, Singapore, Singapore

Professor Richard seems to be of the 'Ivory Tower' persuasion, apparently not wishing her institution to be involved in industry, skills, or society at large. To seek to provide an outstanding education without application is a moribund view of the role of Cambridge University. Pity.

R Eagleson, UlaanBaatar, Mongolia

I went to a state school but got into Cambridge through the back door as a graduate student. A straight 'A' friend from my school applied and didn't even get an interview. As a grad, I tutored many from the 'elite schools'. Known as the cream as they were rich and thick. So, nothing has changed

Bert, Auckland, New Zealand

One (vice-chancellor) said: “The Government gives me a cheque every year. I have a public duty to do what the Government says.”

What an absolutely pathetic thing to say. This is what gives great universities a bad name. Oh, and good on you, Professor Richard - you hit the nail right on the head.

Mike Armstrong, Macau,

About time!

Jo Morris, london, uk

yes they are - Alison probably doesn't appreciate this given her extended tenure at Yale...

david, cardiff, uk

The statement from the vice chancellor shows how the class system so ruthlessly perpetuated by the so called "elite institutions" has damaged our ability to compete and how deeply embedded that ethos is. Education (at all tiers of society!) is a right not a privilege, to be awarded based on postcode

Andy, London, UK

Sam, does that mean you favour admitting less-gifted students ahead of better students? That's what would be necessary to raise the percentage of state school students admitted.

Scot Danner, Dubai, UAE

This is abject nonsense. The snobbish culture of Cambridge University, particularly its colleges, prevents it from being a truly academically elite national University as many able students would not even think about applying there. Richards is an example of the complacent nature of the place.

Jonty Williams, Northampton,

"promoting social mobility is not our core mission","our core mission is to provide an outstanding education"
I do not really see any contradiction between providing outstanding education while trying your best to promote social 'mobility' whatever!
59% admission out of 93% of population isn't right

Sam, Sheffield,