Yet an another aspect of an ethnic minorities lifestyle being scrutinised and about to be criminalised. Leave them to it. If the practice does not die out then the practice will wipe them out. In the meantime the recessive disorders will be make an interesting study of human genetics and evolution.

Yasmin Laher, Blackburn, U.K.

Heres who you can't marry (from Islamic point of view)

In Quran it has been told:::

Allah Prohibited to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, daughters, sisters; father’s sisters, mother’s sisters; brother’s daughters, sister’s daughters; foster-mothers (who breast-fed you), foster-sisters (who breast-fed from the same woman as you); your wives’ mothers; your step-daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives with whom you have consummated marriage, no prohibition if ye have not consummated; (those who have been) wives of your sons proceeding from your loins; and two sisters in wedlock at one and the same time, except for what is past; for Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

Abdullah, Karachi, Pakistan

The KEY problem is, the choice in marrying a cousin or not. Emotional and social pressures inflicted by parents within these communities, leave little choice for many young people to articulate their own views. I am sure if young Muslims were able to follow their own choices in adult life, there would be very few individuals who would opt for cousin marriages. I think the debate should be around CHOICE & giving access to freedom of expression for second/third generation Muslims, which is often suppressed by first generation Pakistani communities. I am sorry if this offends but it is reality, I have seen it, been brought up around it and I am personally fed up with the situation. Yes cousin marriages is a culturally sensitive issue, as is the emotional blackmail & social expectations surrounding arranged marriages, that are often set in stone.

Tamjid Mujtaba, London, UK

Yet another reason for the Islamophobes and racists to bash on Muslims in their complete ignorance. Let us be clear, there is no religious recommendation in Islam to marry first cousins whatsoever. There exist no religious texts which advocate the practice. It's not something imams sermonise about.

It's merely permitted in Islam, not recommended but not forbidden. Marrying a first cousin isn't dangerous until it becomes a regular practice where new genes haven't been introduced after multiple generations of consanguineous marriage.

So please, for heaven's sake, keep the religion out of it -- it's utterly irrelevant except for those Islamophobes and racists who will jump on anything to further their agenda of hate. This is a cultural practice in particular Pakistani communities. The solution lies in educating people in those communities about potential birth defects, and religious leaders can help with that.

Ed, London,

If we are going to ban 1st cousin marriages because of a likellyhood of disability do we also ban people with the genetics for other disabilities, (just as likely to manifest in their children as with 1st cousins) from marrying and having children. Do we live in a society that wants only perfection 'gatica' springs to mind. My grandperents were 1st cousins they had two highly inteligent 'normal' children who have had children of thier own, all 'normal' inteligent people.They in turn also having children who are 'normal' highly inteligent. Even if any of us had a disability do we not have a place in society. In the eyes of many of the people here the lives of my family are not worth the risk to society....THANKS

hilary, bradwell,

What's wrong with inbreeding. It's worked for the royals

Michael, tORONTO,

Inbreeding is, as it clearly states in the article, a cultural thing NOT an islamic thing. Nor is it wriiten in the quran along with 'thou must commit benefit fraud and blow up on every corner'
So please take your islamaphobic comments elsewhere and atleast attempt to read the article before making a comment.
I agree that measures should be taken to prevent first cousin mariages to help those poor children.
This tradition is popular among the elders as and will probably die out with them in the next few generations.
I am a pakistani muslim but astonishingly my parents weren't related .
"If Muslims don't want to live under the laws of the UK then they can leave......................." bob, muenchen
And where in the article did it say they didn't?
intrestingly the article also didnt mention the word 'jihad' but it was continously mentioned.
i'd be suprised if you even knew what the term meant.

Shamina Akhtar, Derby,

I'm just wondering when a muslim "civil rights" group will demand that the minister be fired for his "insensitive" comments. Have the "disaffected youth" start to riot over these remarks yet?

Kramo, Cleveland, Ohio

Hey Kurt Schultz -- Why not apply your rational, secularist mind to a careful review of this article. As Mr. Woolas (the govt. minister whose remarks sparked the article) notes, first cousin marriage in this instance is "...a cultural thing rather than a religious thing." (Note to Mikey: Last time I checked, Cain and Abel weren't Christians -- and in their case also, marriage of relatives was a cultural or practical matter rather than a religious one.) And while I denounce wife-beating categorically, to be really fair, one has to admit that plenty of non-religious men also beat their wives. So be honest: Religion per se is not the problem.

Mary Clifford, Brooklyn Park, USA/Minnesota

Can I just point out to all those from the US that in the UK the word Asian is used to describe people from the Indian subcontinent as opposed to the continent of Asia. I do agree however that they need to be prevented from going back home to marry cousins and then returning to Britain as it creates a huge burden on society.

Sean, Bolton,

"Hey, Christians - Who did Cain & Abel marry again?

Mikey, Bromley, Kent"

Mike, it may or may not have happened that way depending on what religion you believe (if any), but the reality is Muslims are marrying their relatives in droves and having defective children that will cost British society billions in the long term. Christians are not.

If your point is that all Christians are inbred going back to Cain and Abel, I can't disagree with you there. But if you're trying to deflect instead of addressing the REAL problem (i.e. Muslims are inbreeding and Christians are not) it's only going to get worse on your tax burden, not mine.

JohnnyT, Nashua , NH USA

"Hey, Christians - Who did Cain & Abel marry again?

Mikey, Bromley, Kent"

Precisely. The problem might not be apparent in the first generation, but it weill show up eventually. ;)

MdeVol, Peoria, Illinois

Religion makes people do stupid things. Religion says you can blow yourself up, marry your cousin or beat your wife. Hmmm which religion am I talking about?? All religions are kooky to be fair and we should abandon them. Get rational people . Time for the "New Enlightenment" ( thank you Christopher Hitchens). Reason and rationality folks...live it ,learn it , love it...

Kurt schultz, ST Louis, USA/missouri

Another reason for marrying first cousins is to ensure the the girl has genuine care for the parents in-law, but the practise does need to stop, it just cannot work in today's society.

A.j, Tokyo, Japan

Hey, Christians - Who did Cain & Abel marry again?

Mikey, Bromley, Kent

Charles Darwin married his mother's borother's daughter, and you people put him on your money.

Jon, Charlotte, North Carolina

May I have my say?

1.) If 3% of a population produces 1/3of birth defects, back of the envelope calculations say that they have defects at 12 times the rate of the general population. ( Rounded calculation: 4% produces 1/3, 96% produces 2/3, 96% is 24 times 4%, but produces twice as much, so production rate is 1/12th that of the minority.)

2.) Cousin mariages have their risks, but also their rewards: Consider the Darwin-Galton-Huxley Clan and its first cousin mariages resulting in: a.) Charles Darwin (Origin of the Species), b.) Francis Galton (Physacist, Galton's (ultrasonic) whistle), c. ) Aldous Huxley ("Brave New World" & "Brave New World Revisited" etc.), d.) Julian Huxley. But in re-inforcing the family genius they paid a price in birth defects and genetic diseases, the least of which was gout.

John H Nix, Sartell, Minnesota, USA,

"To top it off, asian people know better than to marry within the same family gene pool. Ask any Chinese, Korean, or Japanese person, and they'll tell you that this is strictly forbidden." -- Robert Hawaii, Honolulu, Hawaii

Sir, have you had the chance to read an article on here (timesonline) about the year of the 'rat'? Please read it.

Eating rodents however is not forbidden?

jayil, london, uk

All of the anti-Islamic bias shown here makes me really glad that I have quit Islam and no longer consider myself a Muslim.

Z. Hemini, Kingston,

What a great debate, a room full of elephants?. I love the multitude of people contributing to this article though.. I do not care what they say, in the end, everyone is behaving like irrational fanatics.

Please , don't believe so strongly in what you say, take a step back and look at yourselves - humanity -

john, london, uk

Somebody mentioned Charles Darwin. Come to think of it, Darwin (of all people) was married to his first cousin! Albert Einstein's second marriage was to his first cousin. Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt were second cousins, I believe. This practice isn't limited to Muslim communties.

Alan, Roanoke, USA/Virginia

"You fight ignorance with wisdom and intelligence, not more ignorance".

Wasted words on the deaf.

David Thijm, Stourbridge, UK

What's with this concept that Pakistani people are asian? I hear this all the time, and they have no genetic relation to asian people. To top it off, asian people know better than to marry within the same family gene pool. Ask any Chinese, Korean, or Japanese person, and they'll tell you that this is strictly forbidden.

Robert Hawaii, Honolulu, Hawaii

Look at the map showing the rates of consanguinous marriages

http://www.consang.net/index.php/Global_prevalence

and you'll note a common denominator for those societies with high rates: polygamy. In polygamous societies, there is a chronic shortage of marriageable women, and as a result, families tend to promise their daughters to those in their extended family.

Noah, San Jose,

The ArchBishop is being outrageous. He is speaking as though he lives in a Utopia where everything would be all right if we just didn't have any conflicts or differences of opinion. The reality is that if the undesirable elements of a particular culture are not subject to the law developed over hundreds of years of experience, then the end result will be lawlessness and chaos.
Do we want the UK and USA to become like tribal African countries? Keep up this line of thinking and it will happen!

anthony bolin, Dallas, TEXAS

The continual inbreeding over generations is a fact amongst most Muslim groups. Often couples are more genetically related than brothers /sisters or father/ daughter.
The IN marriage customs is followed by Muslims all over the world.May be not a rule but it might as well be because they follow the examples of revered people in the Koran.
The silence regarding the consequences of these customs is not just in the West.
Outsiders fear the anger of the Muslims if any comments are made and Muslims are helpless because of hypnotic brainwashing. Public Islam present face-saving excuses ,minimising problems, blaming a minority of uneducated Muslims or Islamophobia.
Just for information: another PC term used as a coverup to protect Muslims is the word ‘Asian’. Asians of other faiths marry OUT and do not allow 1st/2nd cousin marriage. Sikhs in particular check back 4 generations [originally it was 7].
Abraham married his 1/2 sister Sarah.Does it mean Muslims have to ?

ps, london, uk

The comments here are the REAL story.

Ive read everything from 'muslims should go home' to 'some cultures cannot work with judeo-christian culture'.

I think there is a duty for people who are less blinded by prejudice to educate and help others in OUR community - that applies to the ignorant practice of marrying relatives AND the ignorant practice of criticising a whole religion/culture/people as one.
If your mind can manage it, please realise that taking the actions of one, or some as representative of all, is impossible.
Would we talk of all Christians being paedophiles because some catholic priests commits evil acts? Of course not.

OUR community. Im British, born to Indian parents. Yet i still see myself as part of a British community. We talk of people 'segregating themselves', but surely people can see from these comments how prejudice is pushing people apart?

you fight fire with water, not more fire.

you fight ignorance with wisdom and intelligence, not more ignorance.

Gurpreet B, Birmingham, UK

1.36%. When you factor out all the cultural factors that lead to prenatal or early death, you are left with an increase in post-natal morbidity (greater chance of death) of 1.36% in a second degree consanguinous (first cousins marrying) marriage.
(consang.net)

In the U.S. 50 years ago, almost all states out lawed such unions. Today, in only 16 states are they absolutely illegal, and a few of those allow them to non-childbearing couples.

Most of the concentrated occurrence of genetic birth defects are the result of historically small reproductive populations, without reference to the degree of consanguinity. Small Pops=Little Genetic Diversity and quick genetic amplification for the good and the bad.

The good minister was actually blaming a cultural phenomenon on a genetic one. Missed the mark, I'm afraid. First cousin marriages are not the culprit, limiting the size of the reproductive population, for whatever reason, is.

HistoryBuff, Richmond, VA USA

Just another day in multicultural Britain.

Andy Gill, London, UK

I don't think first cousins marrying makes much difference in the first instance, but over several generations it must surely shrink and infect the gene pool.

Is anyone actually choosing these marriages? Or are they arranged?

If so, they are borderline illegal.

Richard Haggis, Oxford, UK

As I understand it, one cousin marriage does not increase the risk that much, but when it occurs again and again through the generations, the odds start to pile up. Stanley Kurtz has written quite a bit about this CULTURAL phenomenon that is found in certain parts of the Muslim world (and a few other places).

If it was not for the fact that your government has to pay for their healthcare I would say "have at it" but since you will all be paying, I think that there has to be something done. Or use it to recruit muslims to be radical libertarians and abolish the NHS.

I know that Tay Sachs and other problems are common in Eastern European Jews - not really from present day close marriages, but from a long history of isolation and lack of genetic diversity. Now that we know how DNA works, they are offered Genetic counselling before marriage.

Mike, New York, NY

If you didn't know, it wasn't too long ago that this was a European practice, also.

Trish, Southern California, USA

I was intimately involved in the Arabic community for many years, primarily with Christian Arabs. The Christian Arabs also practiced arranged first-cousin marriages. Although there are many aspects of Islamic thought and practices that I find odious, I suspect that the practice of marrying first cousins is based on culture although undoubtedly reinforced by the Islamic aspects of the culture.

The negative affects of first cousin inbreeding do not significantly manifest themselves until the third generation. It is probable that the preponderance of the manifest defects are due to a culmination of events attributable to successive generations of such incest.

Insofar as Americans expressing their anguish at what we view as prarallel deterioration of both countries predicated on an attempt to accommodate alien elements in such numbers that instead of the native culture transforming the aliens, the alien culture gains predominance and replaces the indigenous culture. What do we value?

Johnson, USA,

Again poverty is being confused with the idea that some cultures are backward. The problem identified by the Minister is certainly a valid one, but it is exasperating that yet again it has been linked to religion and culture rather than education and economics. One difference being, for example, that in this country, sexual health education is readily available to the majority.

Ann Cryer hit the nail on the head when she said that this practice persists to keep wealth in families. The role of immigration policy cannot be ignored. If immigration and emmigration were acknowledged to be necessary for prosperity, it would become clear that the inheritance referred to is a British passport. Naturally families wish to pass this on to their nearest and dearest.

I Whittaker, London,

good, ,let them go on

Juan, New York, New York

So that's what the problems has been with these people all these years!

Harry, NYC, USA

It is simple logic that breeding of any close relatives produces a far greater likelihood of recessive genes appearing in the offspring.
Many genetic diseases are passed along without showing up in the body as they are recessive, and only show when paired with another (recessive) gene of their kind. The more closely you are related to someone, the greater the likelihood of them carrying the same recessive genes as you. Therefore, the greater the likelihood of those genes appearing as the disease.
This isn't prejudice, it's just how nature operates. Nature doesn't pick sides, or get emotive about these things, it simply does its thing.
Culture can change. It changes all the time. This is clearly becoming a massive problem, and quite horrific for these children, so how is is inhumane or in any way unfair to suggest a change in this culture? Or to question whether other cultures should bear the costs of it's traditions? Women and children do tend to come out worst under Islam.

Tina Brock, Melbourne, Victoria Australia

Brian, from Seattle, USA - you say "...but about absolutely indisputable genetic science. "

Well, I'm an American who lives in London (Shadwell). I've been here eleven years, can tell you the majority of these people consider your (correct) view "Western".

In other words, they don't and won't believe it. At least not until some "Imman" or higher Shaman tells them this is so.

Ignorant is the operative phrase here. Ignorant and overly religious.

DA, London, England

Don't get to emotional. Just look at the facts. Are the statistics true? If so then look for ways to remedy the problem not get defensive and deflect it. Comparing this to the Jews in Hitler's Germany is crazy. Would you rather be a Muslim in a Western Country or a Christian in Muslim country ? Hmmm. If I were a Muslim in Saudi Arabia or Pakistan and became a Christian I'd be killed. If I were a Christian in England or Italy and became a Muslim it'd be no big deal. What culture is more open?

Arturo, Naples, Italy

I notice the article writer uses the term "asian" when in fact referringo muslim Pakistanis.
Please note that the Indian community increasling objects to this misleading labelling. Hindus and Sikhs have integrated sucessfully in Britain and pose no problems for their host society.

Willi Brix, Flensburg, Germany

Perhaps we should stop characterizing truthful assessments of the problem as "hate" and start to think about the unfortunate children born to these unions.

So, how about a little love instead? This is not about hate toward any ethnic or religious group, but about absolutely indisputable genetic science.

Love for the children demands that such unions be banned and cultural issues have nothing to do with it.

Brian, Seattle, USA

It's simply incorrect to say this is a South Asian or Pakistani/Bangladeshi issue. The consanguinity wiki (consang.net) has the raw data and a nice map. Islam may or may not be the problem but Islam certainly has a problem. And what is Islam doing about it? Looking at the map, the answer is clear, not much.

TMLutas, Munster, IN, USA

Here in Israel this is also a big silent problem. Rahat, the largest Beduin community in the country, has an enormous rate of disabilities among babies and small children due to marriage between first cousins.

A good friend of mine from that town married his first cousin and this is the result: the first child died of multiple defects in the hospital a few months after birth (they didn't even bring him home), the second child appeared normal but now they know he has epilepsy. The thrid child, a daughter had the same defects as the first but suvived. She is severely retarded and can not sit up by herself. The newest baby, about half a year old, has the same defects as her sister and is also severely disabled.

And this is just one family. I understand the cultural and religious sensibilities of my friend but this is so tragic. Muslim leaders need to speak up and address this problem.

Rachel, Negev, Israel

Medical research has shown that the real increased risk of genetic disorders in children from first cousin marriages, compared with non-first cousin marriages, is around 2% - and that's in families where there are known genetic disorders such as Tay Sachs.

Even if the Pakistani population really has an increased rate of genetic problems in live births compared with the non-Pakistani population, there are many possible reasons for this, including for one - lower access to prenatal diagnosis, and/or lower uptake of termination of pregnancy for genetic disorders.

What the Minister is doing thus far is taking a view which is factually, medically incorrect, and combining it with a position on which many people can be stirred to feelings of moral outrage, in order to try to attack an immigrant section of the population.

I think we could have a better society if we thoughtfully applied reason and truth to our problems, no matter what our country of origin or cultural beliefs.

Susan Marshall, Los Angeles, US

I am responding to a statement made in one of the beginning comments, I have been a Mormon all of my (long) life and have never seen a first-cousin marriage--nor second cousin for that matter. The comment about Mormon inbreeding may be true of some apostate groups, but it is not true of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormons).

Loryienne, Meridian, Idaho

It is not just muslim but the Korean poulation in eastern USA near D.C. I know of too many families who force their children who now speak perfect english and they do this to them.

Really sick no matter what the race is.

Brian, Germantown, USA/MD

Could someone with real scientific facts please clear this up? My understanding was that 1st cousins marrying had higher probability of defects, but that it was a small difference. Like if you normally had 1% chance it raised it to 2%. Thats a far cry from saying defects were likely. Please someone post actual known numbers instead of handwavings.

adamrussell, sierra vista, arizona

As far as Americans needing to fix their own problems before making xenophobic or islamophobic statements, I can think of at least one problem we've solved.

Cousin marriages. Fixed that problem a long time ago.

Except for Jerry Lee Lewis.

I'm given to understand that cousin marriages were initially frowned upon here because we wanted a NATION of Americans, not a conglomeration of tribes and ironclad, unbreakable family clans.

We succeeded.

A. Carrier, Middletown, USA/Ohio

why do commentators always refer "Asians" and the "Asian Community" in these types of articles when they are plainly about a small section - namely muslims, and in this case Pakistani Muslims. It really irritates me as a non-muslim, non-Pakistani Asian.

sonny, london,

Just read [Because They hate]

By Brigitte Gabriel

It says it all

Henry Houser, NYC, USA

"Minister warns of ‘inbred’ Muslims", this title sums up whats wrong with todays media. A highly loaded misrepresentation of a story designed to whip up islamaphobia. We are talking about cultural practices not religious beliefs yet I somehow think the writers of this article are fully aware of this.

ALI, Manchester, UK

I think this is almost like what happenned to the jews in Hitler`s germany. Muslims and islam are vilified and demonised everyday in the media. Muslims and islam are blamed for all the problems that this country may be facing. Muslims, prepare for concentration camps in Europe.
Bilal, UK.

Bilal, london, uk

So much xenophobia and islamophobia

Imran Y, UK

imran Y, london,

Another reason why arranged marraige is wrong!

mike, northampton, uk

Thank goodness someone has had the good sense to say this.

I work in special education and special schools in many inner city areas are full to the brim with Muslim children who have only ended up with special needs becacau their parents swam a little to close to each other in the Gene pool.

Matin Benson, London,

First cousin marriage is also related to a wider problem in Islam, which is the abuse if women. If a woman is married to her father's brother, this gives the woman some prtection against abuse by her in-laws. An unrelated woman that comes from a family without means, or who had no brtohers is very exposed to abuse.

John Schuh, Lake Dallas, USA/Texas

To Raymond of New Castle:

Regarding the supposed alarmism about communism. How is it that you never noticed that the Soviet Union remained an armed state from its beginnings until its demise owing to its inability to maintain that state because it feared the West? Many millions went to prison, many millions more suffered deprivation because of Stalin's paranoid fear of capitalism.

John Schuh, Lake Dallas, USA/Texas

It must be stopped, simply due to the children being born with defects. There is conclusive genetic evidence that inbreeding produces these defective children.
It doesn't matter what ethnic group is doing this, fact of the matter is they aren't doing themselves any favours in the long run. They are corrupting their genetic gene pool, the defects become more likely with each successive inbred generation. All it will achieve is marry themselves into extinction. That is a self defeating practice on a purely genetic level, regardless of any ethical concerns.

A further argument - considering this country provides comprehensive healthcare, the burden of providing a lifetime of care, is a burden on other citizens and taxpayers. It is not conducive for the State as a whole to bear these responsibilities when there are many more pressing issues at hand. We can't afford it, and shouldn't be bad to, especially since the practice helps no one.

Wilhelm, Slough, Great Britain

all true. very true.

Paul, Kingston Vale,

Islam is to blame for everything. As usual! Inter-cousin marriages are PERMITTED in Islam but not encouraged. This is what people have to understand. Yes I agree first-cousin marriages are common among the Pakistani community but the educated ones always weigh pros and cons before proceeding. So the solution lies in educating these communities and I am sure generation by generation they are becoming more educated. Perhaps we need to take a survey on the generation raised in this country and see how rife the problem is. I am sure it would be less than the generation who migrated here.

Abdul, London, England

As someone who was brought up in Bradford and now lives in Oldham, I had heard about this from several doctors/nurses.

I think many people are confusing islam with Pakistani/Baglasdeshi practices. Few muslim cultures support 1st cousin marriages, but rural pakistan/bangladesh are different.

The challange for the british state is this. Given that we have a free at the point of use healthcare system, should we allow people to undertake practices that we know are likely to increase the healthcare burden to the state. Put bluntly do you want your tax dollars treating a Pakistani child who was born to 1st cousins? in the same way do you want your tax dollars being spent on treating the cancer of lifelong smoker? Most people argue yes, but that the state has the right to limit the hamful activity. As such 1st cousin marriages should be banned.

Some will argue that this is an intrusion into people's lives. It is but if others pay for the consequences doesn't the state have the right

Andrew Booth, OLDHAM, ENGLAND

"I think there many wider social problems here is the holier than thou West."

Would you like to explain further?

I'd be happy to expose your obscurantist and defensive denial Mr Mahmood, but you will have to post something substantive instead of the mudlinging that Muslims use, whenever they are criticised.

Let's debate - but to any such invitation, Muslims like you are either silent or react with distracting violent "offence".

Muslim in-breeding is a fact. That is the topic of discussion here.

Joe, Manchester,

Tom, Newcastle. I agree far too many comments by Americans. After telling us for years communism is a threat to western civilisation (therfore justifying wars nobody wanted around the world ) they now tell us Islam is the biggest threat and doing the same. This particular article is on inbreeding a practise found in many European originated societies in the USA (like the Amish or Mormins). I suggest you sort this out before worrying about what is happening 4000 miles away. And also it cracks me up every time Americans complain about immigration. If you haven't noticed all of you are products of mass immigration.

raymond, Liverpool,

In some US states, first cousin marriage is illegal. It's not a problem. The law is never enforced, but it makes people take it a lot more seriously that the practice is a bad idea.

Arranged marriage is not necessarily forced marriage. I had an Indian co-worker who was in an arranged marriage. It was her choice to have her parents arrange it. She rejected their first pick because she didn't like him.

There was social pressure, but no force. She didn't love him, but was happy with her life. She could have divorced him any time she wanted, because they lived here in the US. Her family would disown her, but as I said--social pressure, but no force.

I think arranged marriage is a bad thing, but people have the right to choose to have their parents fix them up on a long blind date if they want. :-) If the "happy" couple are consenting adults, it's none of my business.

Julie Cochrane, Atlanta, Georgia, US

It was and is suicidally insane for the UK to allow in significant, let alone transformative, numbers of immigrants who are not descendants of ethnic natives of the British Isles.

As a whole, any benefits they and their progeny have provided have been more than outweighed by the overwhelming costs in public safety and order, overcrowding and environmental pressures, burdens on the public treasury, and countless ways in which Britain has been forced to become less British and more alien and in which and the texture, flavour, and feel of daily life have been harmed or even ruined.

Leo, Maryland, USA

The issue is about inbreeding in the Pakisatani community, it has nothing to do with Islam. What needs to be done is simple, we need to educate the community to address the problem.

Islam discourages first cousin marriages and has done so for the last 1400 or so years. Please stop linking Islam and Pakistan the two have nothing in common.

Mohammed Raziq, Birmingam, ENGLAN

In reply to MR T:
"Also arranged marriages do work, Two out of ten Muslim marriages end in divorce. Five out of ten English marriages end in divorce. The facts ..."
This comment is completely irrelevant. The MP's comments about first cousin marriages highlight the increased likelihood of the children having genetic defects, which is why the practice should be discouraged. He implies that is unfair to place potential children under such a greater risk. The fact that Muslim marriages end in divorce less, provided that the couple are both consensual in that, is a good thing, but that is missing the point. And furthermore, your displaying your own ignorance about Islam, since many Muslim marriages in Britain are not arranged; the problem is strictly with first-cousin arranged marriages and whether this was a problem confined to one religion or not should not make a difference.

Oli Baggaley, Oxford,

There are many here in the US who think that we have a very similary problem. Those who think so are generally on the Left of the political divide, so I wouldn't give much credence to their view. However, these folks think that country music is evidence of such inbreeding in the US.

Gregory Indelicato, New York City, New York, USA

It is understandable the resentment of some people about Americans making comments on this thread. However, when it comes to unrestrained immigration and Islamic terrorism, Americans and Brits are in the same boat here. Maybe it’s not a bad idea for English speaking people of a common heritage to work together a little.

ken harkins, easley, usa/sc

I am fully sympathetic to the genetic dangers of in-breeding but, have you SEEN my first cousin? She's hot, dude!

Olden Atwoody, Strokin, Ontario, Canada

Right on, Tom from Newcastle!!

Imran, LONDON,

"This is just another example of how Islam is incompatible with western democratic nations and civilization". -- Charles Mosser, Philadelphia, USA

This is just another example of an ignorant comment made by an American. Sir, it is clearly stated in above article that it is NOT related to Islam and is purely a traditional thing. I wish people would read before they comment.

jayil, london, uk

When will the world realise that religion perpetuates ancient lies and marrying your cousin depends on how fit they are.

Noel Challenor, Shawbury,

To all those who did not read the article.

This is not a Religious BUT a cultural problem.

Here, i've quoted the part which people may have missed:

"That's a cultural thing rather than a religious thing.."

jayil, london, uk

Lol...the Muslims played a "valiant" (godfearing?) role in defeating us communists (red menace) in Afghanistan in the 1980's. Now they're getting their come uppance from their capitalist chums. Ho ho, quite amusing actually!

Karl, Auckland, New Zealand

Fine okay, minister point made. Lets address it, along side HIV infection in gay people, millions of children who will never know who or where their father(s) is. You only have to watch the day time talk shows to see ample evidence.

I think there many wider social problems here is the holier than thou West. You would think not given the responses from the Times readers.

Shaffiq Mahmood, Halifax, West Yorkshire

just another burden on this countrys nhs service no wonder it can not cope when this inbreeding goes on pity the poor children

john
windsor

john grime, windsor, u.k

Even in Canada, in the not too distant past, we have had problem with small isolated communities in the more remote areas. Marriages between close relatives have led to many physical and mental problems and for this reason public health campaigns were undertaken to educate the population and discourage people from marriage with relatives. Because someone has had the courage to talk about the elephant in the room and bear the immediate knee jerk calls of racism, they should be applauded. This 'cultural' practice should be actively discouraged, period. Oh and by the way the communities in Canada where inbreeding occurred were Christian so what! and if you're Muslim you should feel the same way about this issue.

David F, London, Canada

I am a Pakistani-Canadian and product of marriage between (double?) first cousins. That is my parents' mothers are sisters and my parents' fathers were brothers and both grand couples were first cousins themselves. The British government has taken a very important step in the right direction. Not only should this information be presented to those within the British community but also back in Pakistan. I myself suffer from facial nerve paralysis that prevents me from having symmetrical facial expressions, other than that theres nothing wrong with me. But I am strongly against cousin marriages. It has nothing to do with religion. It's all about social security for those who practice cousin marriages i.e. if I give my daughter's hand to my brother's son, I can be confident in the fact that she'll be treated well and be secure because she remains within the family.

For those interested an article by Dr. Anita Zaidi of Agha Khan Uni http://www.chowk.com/articles/4165

Hasnain Nazeer, Canada,

Who cares if 1st cousin marriage was accepted in the past. It is 2008, genetic studies proves it is dangerous. It is such a stupid argument to bring up past examples as if it makes it OK by today's standards. Any culture that chooses 1st cousin marriage in 2008 should be educated and confronted about the dangers. Is 1st cousin marriage legal in the UK?

David, Damascus, USA, MD

Most comments by Americans here are xenophobic and islamophobic in nature.I think they should try to solve their own problems in the States first.I don`t think they have a very good idea of the British way of life.Britain at one point ruled maybe 2/3 of the world, so it is not surprising that you have minorities from all over.Muslims have been in this country for ages and generally there have not been any serious problems.I am a muslim and I LOVE the UK!! YES extremism is a problem and i`m sure over a few years it will be sorted out. God bless the Queen!!

Imran Y. London.

Imran Musa, lusaka, zambia

This is just another example of how Islam is incompatible with western democratic nations and civilization.

Charles Mosser, Philadelphia, USA

I would liked to of seen how many people would of commentated if the word ISLAM OR MUSLIM was not used. Also arranged marriages do work, Two out of ten Muslim marriages end in divorce. Five out of ten English marriages end in divorce. The facts ...

MR T, south east london, england

Marraige to first and second cousins is very common in rural and remote Scottish communities and in the British upper classes. Perhaps our ministers would like to comment on this as well.

Sam, Glasgow,

I take pity on the poor children.

Franz, Berlin, Germany

i suppose the logical next step is to consider what role inbreeding might have not only on physical disability, but also mental disability. somehow i suspect that debate would be even less pretty...

Chris Wood, Manchester,

I saw a documentary a few years ago about pakistan and the reason why they have a over and above instance of birth defects in their country. Yes, that's right, it is because of in-breeding.

Can you imagine if, iin this country's culture, it was desirable, acceptable and sometimes the only alternative to marry your first cousin?

How would the country look after all of these children, who would need long term care and medication? In pakistan, they get around it by not offering any sort of social safety net, if you cannot work, you cannot feed your family and they die - simple.

In this country, we are (depending on your view) either a soft touch or a good and just society. But surely, if we know what the cause is, then it is in our society's interests (which means everybody's interest!) to educate and try to stop the problem.

kim, london,

Just the other day I read that all blue-eyed people can be shown to have a common ancestor, even though that was
10 000 years ago. . So it's not as if inbreeding is, or was, unknown in the West. Also, in many cultures first-cousin marriages are thought of as incestuous - one of the deepest taboos - but not in all. The Catholics need a dispensation from the Pope for it (usually given when the girl is already pregnant). The Lutheran church (in which I was raised)regards first-cousin marriage as incestuous, but not second-cousin marriage. All this, like the Bible and the Q'ran, was set out before there was any firm knowledge of genetics or reliable birth control. We all need to have that, though, whatever faith we are, and make our own choices.
If we go back far enough, we're ALL related ...

Julia Iskandar, London, England

It is apparant from reading above comments many people still think within the terms of 'us' and 'them'. This disgusts me. This is clearly not a debate about first cousin marriage, but another chance for the great white race do crow on about how much more 'civilised' they are.
Living in the west midlands, i hear this racism towards the muslim population all the time.
After the 2nd world war immigration to this country was encouraged, and essential, to get the country back on its feet. I believe that had the british been more welcoming, and indeed thankful, to all nationalities that travelled here, people would not have needed to segregate themselves in the way they have.

becky, west midlands, uk

Unfortunately this issue is but one of a whole heard of elephants in the room.

Sarah Davies, London, UK

Queen Victoria and Prince Albert were first cousins and that receding chin that so marks the Windsors is a common feature associated with in-breeding. Thank god for Diana, Sophie and (ahem) Fergie for introducing normal genes into the young Royal generation.

Jonesy; King George was not actually 'mad', he suffered from Porphyria.

wendy, Maury, France

I don't recall marrying your cousin being a central tenet of Islamic thought. I think you're confusing practices of the peasants of rural Pakistan with what is outlined in the Quran. Please take more care to make those distinctions!

Tameem, Vancouver, Canada/BC

Old rural Welsh proverb - Incest is OK so long as you keep it in the family !

Dr. Jimmy, Nottingham, England

Who cares if ancient Saxons "were immigrants" or if the (small, rich) British nobility was inbred? What do these silly debating points that have to do anything? Consanguinous marriages in the large, poor, unassimilated population of middle eastern immigrants are a real and present problem that deserves attention. Many such marriages are forced, many involve underaged girls, and many include beatings and other ill-treatment as a matter of cultural tradition and principle. As if all that weren't bad enough, now it turns out that consanguinous marriages are, predictably, causing a spike in birth defects. Yes, Islam truly is the gift that keeps on giving.

Diana Blackwell, Berkeley, CA, USA

for god's sake, it isnt as thought the royal family are marrying cousins anymore! and with people banging on about "replacing the word muslim with the royal family," have they considered the royal family are a distinctly small population compared to the number of children born with defects in the muslim society? it isnt about royals or muslims, it is about the children being with defects which, admit it or not, come from inbred marriages

melissa, reading,

Islam is too different from Western civilisation for complete integration to be possible. However many people in the UK do have a rather strange notion of who they themselves are. To Tom from Newcastle I would say that there is very little DNA evidence to give credence to the notion of being Anglo Saxon. Dane and Briton seems to be what most people are in these islands. Don't forget that the Saxons were also immigrants. Aggressive ones at that and without a hint of Christianity about them.

peter, dublin, ireland

Hasn't the marrying of cousins been happening within the British upper-classes since time immoral?

Alex, Guildford, UK

Isn't it time we stopped pussy footing around for fear of upsetting minorities? We are actually being cruel to ignore a practice that is bringing so many handicapped children into the world. Given the amount of birth defects caused by first cousin marriages there is an obvious case for this practice to be made illegal.

There is also the cost to be NHS to be considered. Many doctors are willing to withhold treatment from patients who they consider are responsible for their own ill health, ie smokers and obese people. They haven't shown too much concern about the sensitivities of those they are targeting. People who marry first cousins are just as responsible for their own actions. I'm not advocating withholding treatment from their children but this is a health issue that can be dealt with without too much difficulty. What is more important, keeping money in the family or the well being of children?

Lin, London, UK

The joys of political correctness and open-borders. Uncontrolled immigration continues to bring even more "benefits" to, soon to be extinct, western civilization.

Franc, Palm Beach, USA/Florida

Marrying cousins was illegal in England until Henry VIII. Maybe it should be made illegal again

william Haines, northwood,

USA has also had similar problems in isolated communities such as Appalachia and also the descendents of the original white settlers in Hawaii...

Francis Strazzulla, Dove Canyon, CA/USA

For pity's sake this practice needs to be confronted. The one thing you wish for in a child is that they are healthy and can be happy. My god even an atheist like me can see it. Why can't they ?

Fred Fargenheimer, phoenix, arizona usa

The problem is not just with rural Pakistanis, it is evident in Afghanistan, the ME and Africa. Inbreeding is endemic to tribal muslim cultures the world over. Sad but true and the western world needs to realize that 'those' people are not anything like us and don't want to be like us. They want our wealth though, and have no problems taking it from us.

Dean, Copperas Cove, Tx

It's actually quite indicative of how different the muslim community is from the rest of the British population. We do not separate them from ourselves, they do that all by themselves by creating this subculture where practices such as inbreeding are acceptable.

And to Dishan in London: 'I think at this rate, we Muslims better leave the country.' YES, if you can't make the effort to integrate into OUR laws and culture then maybe you should.

Louise, London,

This is a worry, and one of many problems facing Britain today. I think it is great that people from other countries come here and live amongst the anglo-saxons but we do need to intergrate them better into our culture. Make them feel British instead of Parkistani or Polish etc. living in Britain.
Also why are there so many comments from Americans on here, I think you have your own problems to worry about when it comes to race. Sort out your own problems before you come mouth off about our, "open door immigration policy."

Tom, Newcastle Upon Tyne, England

In the Midlands official figures quote two thirds of resources provided for the blind, deaf and profoundly disabled, are going to the children of Pakistani moslems. This leaves less than a third of the budget for the majority indigenous population. Likewise heart and pulmonary disease will result in working life only to age 55 for those of south asian origin. This means 25 or more years of State support will be necessary for these individuals. Add to this the no longer published Govt. figures on crime which demonstrates that immigrants and ethnic minorities commit more crime, particularly violent crime, plus the HUGE social and housing costs and I begin to wonder how Govt can keep repeating the mantra that these de-stabilising levels of immigration can possibly be of benefit to OUR community. By the by, community means shared ancestry, values, institutions and interests. This should really frighten us as the islamist bombers too come from 'communities' where many share their values too

A. Bandoned, London, ENGLAND

Another minister jumping on the bandwagon and getting his 15 minutes of fame. Immigrants and minorities tend to stick together and marry within their own "safe" domains. The answer surely is to educate them, rather than chastising them for cultural practices.

Hamad Lone, London, England

I walked into my newsagents today and looked down at the row of Sunday papers on display. Nearly all of them had some kind of story about Muslims on the front cover. I would hate to be a Muslim in this country these days, attacking them has come to be seen as socially acceptable.

YES, I'm sure inbreeding is a problem among some communities but why does this story have to come into the news in the same week that everyone's kicking up a stink about sharia law?

Claire, London, England

We have a classic case of the blind leading the blind ..here.

Mohammed, London, UK

You can just see it now, the introduction of forced intergration. These Labour politicians don't know how to leave anything alone. If Asian communities have sufficient problems they will find a way of solving them. This comment is probably driven by the cost to the NHS of supporting these children with disabilities. With Labour, there is always another agenda.

judy, Liverpool, England

Arranged marriages are forced marriages. Is it not illegal for anyone to be forced to do something against their will, even if the forcing is done by their family?

Enforce the law and put the forcers in jail or fine them severely. It might end the practice.

Jon Maynard, Lansing MI, USA

What about the children born to a life of suffering and pain, often shortlived. It is a disgrace and something that those within the medical profession should try to discourage. Political correctness stifles them into accepting inbreeding and its consequences. And its not a one off first cousin marriage but generations of inbreeding that leads to a high number of genetic defects. As a nurse and midwife I have seen many congenital abnormalities, some minor but many life limiting and I am saddened for the lives that these children have to live (or endure). If we know that a particular aspect of culture leads to pain and suffering we should do our utmost to prevent it. Never mind sensibilites, think about the suffering for both child and family.

anne, Bradford, West Yorks

Inbreeding has been prevalent in Britain for centuries and way has been led by the Royal Family who have been marrying their cousins for centuries. Has anyone not seen the movie, The Madness of King George? The madness was as a result of in-breeding.

Jonesy, London,

The Western world has been force-fed this assimilation far too long. If our so called "leaders" will not lead, it is time to vote them out! It is our "destiny" to right this wrong. There are evil forces trying to destroy our very heritage.

Kansasgirl, Kansas City, USA

This is a truly amazing conversation. Talk about 'cultural differences' ! I'd say the amazing part is that the marrying of cousins is not illegal in the UK. You would have thought that after all of the 'inbreeding' and blue blood diseases that afflicted past royal/aristocratic reproductions, you would have learned a lesson, but alas...

In the US, we have a term for this. It is called 'Arkansas hillbilly'. And by the way, this stuff is illegal in the US, which is why they have blood tests and somewhere it is buried in the law that people must be 5 generations removed.

F. Hoffman, US Citizen, Birmingham, UK

bye bye Uk you had a good 2000 year run...but you're done for ...boo hoo (How do you stop a nation from commiting suicide??)

g, NY, USA

Marrying cousins is not some pre-historic cultural customs adopted through ignorance and Greed, it identifies values in not just the individual but there family also. It’s a custom that has long been adopted not just by Muslims but all religions and monarchies.

|But to deny this birth defect problem does not exist would be most un-true. In relation to the vast majority this simply is not the case , Sciencetifically it is proven that over a considerable period of time intermarrying can have some negative effects on children, but were talking centuries here and to that simply does not happen, due to wars, Migrations etc etc.

Finally on aspect of religion both Christianity and Judaism do not allow or condone their members to marry a Muslim, were as in Islam one is permitted to marry Christian and Jews. This may not ring true to what you see in the local mosques and hear the mad mullahs preach but it is fact.

WM, London,

Lets replace the word muslim with the words Royal Family ,
and then we can have a discusion about indreebing and marrying cousins without it just getting responses from every muslim hating British National party rascist nutter in the country.

john, Buenos Aires, Argentina

another one for the Darwin awards?

tim blair, Peterborough, UK

On the other hand, where's the problem? You have women going to a clinic to have themselves emplanted with a stranger's semen, have that bady as your own and never take into conciderationt that said child could marry a half sister or brother from the same male donor and not even know it.
Just the other week we saw a brother and sister, parted at birth, ended up marring each other and not even knowing it. Now what do they do?
I see the same problem with inbreeding here too....why aren't your so-called experts doing or saying something about that?
We have become a Godless Country here in the U.S. too, and now we are paying a very high price for our turning away from what was once a family unit. Both mother and father living together as a married couple and raising their childred with ONE name. We have forgotten that a name still means something, it identifies who you are and who you are related to...has the little light come on yet????

Dutchman, seguin, Texas

Its ridiculous in this day and age for such practices to still be legal and happening in this country. People arranging these marriages should be imprisoned for child abuse.

Jake, Glasgow,

Tay Sachs; is a tragic disease but almost unheard of these days because the Jewish authorities advocate pre marriage screening for the disease. Even the deeply religious advocate testing and do not arrange Matches where there is a genetic risk.

Miriam, London,

Key word there: "Medieval"

Phil Davy, Eltham,

This defect is also prevalent among Arabs in Israel and a great deal of time and energy is spent by the Israeli governement dealing with the problem.

Dr. Irene Lancaster, Haifa, Israel

Britain lets the muslims do whatever they want. If the muslims want to do itwith their relatives, let them do it.

Derek, Bellevue, USA

"We are coming to enjoy the fruits of centuries of this practice. The only relationships allowed are those that are forced. Ali, bridgeville, usa, del"

Do you mean the high birth rate of muslims now enables you to at last challenge western culture on it's own territory?

Daniel K888, Melbourne , Australia

If his Honor is addressing issues based on scientific fact;
Political Correctness has no place in the conversation.
In addition if we are willing to defer major issues affecting society because of a concern that it might hurt someone's feelings; well then we are doomed as a society!

Rick Aztlan , Chicago, USA

About 5 to 10 years ago the Palestinians were complaining that they had a much higher birth defect rate due to the Israelis delibertly poisining them. The Israelis conducted an extensive study and came up with the same thing. Way to much inbreeding. I beleive that ended those complaints!

Mac-101, Hopkinsville, Ky

Under classic natural selection, first cousin marriage would be selected against -- sooner or later the defects due to inbreeding would become fatal prior to reproductive age. I was amazed to learn that here in the US, less than half the states have laws forbidding this incestuous practice. Man, even the thought of it gives me the creeps. Just look at the damage done by so many generations of inbreeding to the ethnic Jews .... just goes to show I guess that Jews and Muslims are -- culturally -- just different shades of gray -- maybe that is why they hate each ofter so much.

MJ, San Diego, USA

As usual no one is looking at the larger view.

The stats on birth defects on cousin marriages is mixed, whatever the experts say: first cousin marriages is statistically less likely to result in problems than 2nd cousin marriage, but more surprisingly the actual rates as a percentage are still quite low in either case. To illustrate: the chance of a birth defect might be doubled (for arguments sake) but if the normal rate is 1% then the cousin marriage rate is still only 2%.

I would be very worried if a society began leglislating against against cousin marriage, which is quite common even among the general UK population (people tend to fall for cousins), on such slender numbers. What of our other rights? Apply a few numbers to them and everyone will be marching to only one drum beat: that of the new mob who call themselves "Experts".

For human life to be worth living risks are unavoidable. And for freedom's sake we must accept suffering and death, even of children.

Greg Lorriman, Leatherhead, UK

Introduce a religious age of consent for children born to Muslim parents.
The majority of children born in the UK are free to think and choose why should they all not be?.

wayne, huntingdon, cambridgeshire

First cousin marriage may exist in other Muslim communities, but is much encouraged in rural Pakistan by liberal UK Immigration laws.

Pakistan marriage often involves a transfer of land from the groom's family to the bride. First cousin marriage allows land to remain within the extended family. An additional but unwritten part of the contract is that the Pakistan resident party obtains entry to the UK and therefore to its employment and welfare possibilities. This is especially valuable to Pakistan born boys who otherwise would have fewer means of entry to Britain.

A change of law to compel UK resident Pakistani (and Bangladeshi) families to arrange for their children to marry other UK resident members of their community, would mitigate the problem. But that of course is not going to happen any time soon.

J Solicar, Manila, Philippines

As part of my work some years ago, I visited a local centre for paediatric respite care in East London, and was clearly told by the Manager that there was a huge rise in infant handicap, almost exclusively amongst the Pakistani community - this was ascribed to poor maternal nutrition and inbreeding.

marion, London, UK

The whole point of the article is to show that the minority will not marry just anybody, they only marry the correct religion, caste etc. This is leading to first cousin marriages. We cannot set a law for every eventuality, we need common sense. I visited Bradford on a regular basis and the local community seemed to accept that the high amount of infant defects was because of marriages witthin communities.

When you make a comment about "In this day and age there are more than enough people to go around so we don't need to be marrying our cousins." think of the bigger picture. The communities will not marry outside their group and children found to want to do his have been known to be punished.

John Salt, Warrington, CHESHIRE

Western Societies underwent a Reformation which resulted in a reduction of the power and excesses of the clerics, in turn it gave us the chance to develop the scientific method.
We cannot expect pre and post reformation cultures and mindsets to coexist happily in these small islands. Our leaders have created this situation they must now rectify it, will we accept a pre industrial future for our children, or will we find leaders who will take us all forward to something better?
Honorable members of the House of Commons stop spinning we see your acceptance of the current situation as weakness.

Dave, chorley, UK

While the marriage of cousins is not forbidden in Islamic law, it is certainly frowned upon in most civilized Muslim society. As distasteful as it sounds, the tradition of interbreeding (close cousin intermarrying) usually harks back to parochial notions of land preservation within families and so on. As is all too often the case, the practice persists even when the underlying origins have long since vanished. Mostly entrenched in Islamic sub-societies that are economically and educationally deprived, the greatest irony of course, is that those who insist on inbreeding, are probably the most likely to reject Darwin and the implications of natural selection. 3% of the population account for 33% of genetic birth defects ? It hardly surprising that "outsiders" are making calls to "save them from themselves".

Rami Samara, London,

In Islamic culture, women have no power , so, a girl who marries a cousin knows she is safer - or at least - knows what to expect, when she marries her cousin. Her mother, too, is happier, knowing that her daughter will be safe in the house of her sister or brother.

I am very sorry to see Britain become an outpost of Islam, it is a great pity to see such a magnificent country led by such as Rowan Williams.

Heather McFarlane, Whitehorse, Yukon, Canada

I am a doctor working in a pathology specialty, and have recently seen a couple of patients born of consanguinous parents (their parents were cousins) with previously undescribed genetic defects. These problems could only be ascribed to the consanguinuity. One patient was from North Africa, the other from the Indian subcontinent.

Rob, South East,

Is this actually true though? Is there verifiable evidence from a non-partisan agency that can verify the much higher rate of birth defects amongst pakistanis?

If this is more than an urban myth then some education needs to be done and first-cousin marriages should be illegalised. I'm surprised they are even legal in the first place. In this day and age there are more than enough people to go around so we don't need to be marrying our cousins.

Anthony, Montreal, Canada

Turth fell victim to political correctness decades ago. All cultures are NOT equal.

Jennifer, Dallas, USA

It is not only the obvious inbreeding that is the 'elephant in the room': sperm and egg donations are potentially a greater problem - and in this case not knowing who is your genetic sibling or first cousin or even son or daughter adds to the danger. I think the politicians and doctors should not be so selective in their worries. Although they are right to highlight the problem as they have, they should not close their eyes to this other aspect of the problem even if this is less acceptable to their 'scientific' personas.

Alice J McCabe, Doncaster,

Most US states forbid marriage to siblings and first cousins. Why? Because inbreeding caused widespread genetic disabilities in the early days of the Republic. The dangers were apparent long before the genetic reasons were understood.

This is a very old story, a mistake that was also made out of ignorance by millions of our own ancestors, no matter who you are. A bit of enforced out-breeding fixes things up for future generations.

It is criminal to allow closely related parents to inflict such illnesses their children. We are no longer so ignorant; there is no excuse.

E Carpenter, New York, USA

The nerve of Mr Woolas, broaching a subject that might injure the feelings of Muslims! Who cares if everything he says is true. Doesn't he know we live in a multicultural world where truth has been properly reformed? Objective reality has been transformed into a political construct.

The long and the short of it is that the social pathologies of Islamic culture must NEVER be critically scrutinized. To do so would be Islamophobic.

Chezwick, Haymarket, USA

Why are there no Muslim countries that have a healthy, literate and productive population that lives with modern technology and laws? THAT is the elephant in the room.

John Carter, Los Angeles, USA

Absolutely true.The practice of first cousin marriages is widespread in rural Egypt.
As a primary care physician, working in Upper Egypt , I encountered many cases of congenital defects among the offspring of such marriages.
I do not know the science behind this,but I noticed that the incidence of such defects and deformities was higher,when the father was married to his paternal cousin.
I think it is a cultural thing ,because the inbreeding was as prevalent between Muslims as it was between Christians .Maybe it is a remanent of the Pharonic times ; Ramses II married few of his daughters, and the marriages between brothers and sisters , and fathers and their daughters were not uncommon in the royal families,may be to conserve the royal blood, and keep it in the family....

Sam, dallas, USA

This problem also exists among the Amish in America.

Beth, Alexandria, VA

This problem is not confined to Muslims. The condition known as 'Tay Sachs Disease' is prevalent in the Ashkenazi Jewish communities in the UK. Notably in North London. Tay Sachs is believed to be caused by close family marriages.

Chris Clark, Bath, UK

The solution is to allow British men to date our Pakistani sisters - our love for them will triumph over all race, immigration and genetic problems!

Chie, Tokyo, Japan

People in this country used to joke about the hillbillies marrying their first cousins and their offspring being mentally unsound. It's sure not politically correct to say what this minister is saying, but he's correct. It's why there is a law against marrying first cousins in most of our states. The chances of both cousins inheriting the same recessive gene is too great. Get a biology textbook and read up on the subject. You don't even have to look at people to see the truth. Purebred dogs that are closely related have a greater chance of inheriting genetic defects. People are mammals, and the same thing happens with them. No doubt, though, this poor gentleman will be verbally tarred and feathers for his remarks. The truth is no longer a welcome subject in a politically correct world.

Janet Fuls, Cottonwood, CA USA

Muslims need to live under the laws of the West if they want to live in the West!! Sooner or later they will learn that they will not create their khalifa / caliphate at the expense of those of us who are civilized enough to know better!

Sue, WPB, fl/US

We are coming to enjoy the fruits of centuries of this practice. The only relationships allowed are those that are forced.

Ali, bridgeville, usa, del

I think at this rate, we Muslims better leave the country.

Dishan, London,

It's a pity people like Woolas must jump on the race bandwagon at a time when the media is already very sensitive towards debates around immigration, race and religion.

I'm disappointed that we haven't seen a sensible debate debate about this in the media and the xenophobic comments posted on this website don't make me feel much better either.

Khaled Shivji, London,

If Muslims don't want to live under the laws of the UK then they can leave.......................

bob, muenchen,

The open immigration policy of the UK is a deliberate act to weaken the economy ready for the full implementation of a European state.
They can't just redraw the borders and say 'There, done!' because of the massive economic imbalances within the 'state'.
They're averaging out the European economies and soon we'll have an EU constitution thrown down our throats, along with the Euro, an EU president, alien laws which we'd have no say in... it's a nightmare but nobody seems to see it.

Look what's happening in America right now. Trade agreements and talk of the Amero and North American Union. Deja Vu? Yes!
Europe started with trade agreements and then they started telling us what bananas we could trade or what measuring system.... or go to jail!
Open border at Dover + Open border at Mexico = Two sides of the same coin.
All on the road to a New World Order, to use the words of Bush Sr, Henry Kissinger, Bill Clinton and Gordon Brown.
Something that even 'immigrants' should oppose!

Gary, Grimsby, NE Lincs

Maybe Mr Woolas and his medical experts should take a look at the family trees of some of our ruling elites.
Breeding dear boy, breeding...........

Kalb Qabiyeh, Glenrothes,

The degeneration of the inbred Royal Houses of Europe and Britain should be a lesson to them. The mental health of many aristocrats should be an illustration of what centuries of inbreeding can do.

Wombat, Brisbane , Australia

Some years ago 'inbreeding' on some of Newfoundland's islands resulted in high levels of preventable congenital defects. The problem was solved through forced repatriation of the inhabitants of these smaller islands to Newfoundland proper. It was a controversial, but of course necessary, intervention.

Deon, Edmonton, Canada

The obvious issue IS the policy of uncontrolled immigration. US President Calvin Coolidge was quoted as having said (wisely, I think) that certain cultures and groups do not fit well in a (basically) Judaeo-Christian-derived, liberal democracy. The values of Muslims overall are such that they really should not be admitted to western democracies or be allowed to remain in them any longer. THAT'S the elephant.

Tedd, Tecumseh, USA

The whole Islamic issue is a ticking time bomb for the western world. There are the problems of dealing with the Jihadists, and now the threat to your culture and way of life from within. The chickens have come home to roost rather quickly. The problem extends throughout France as well. You must begin to take action immediately. The problem of assimilation is one we are familiar with in the US. Mexican immigrants, both legal and illegal refuse to assimilate, therefore destroying the culture that drew them here. In this era of political correctness we have lost the will to do the hard tasks. I fear the world will pay the price.

Ross , Rock Island, USA, IL

I've heard anecdotal evidence of the same problem in Sydney's Lebanese community. Hopefully after one or two generations the decendents of these immigrants will have integrated (for want of a better word) into the wider Australian community enough that they will be able to benefit from a wider gene pool.

CF, Sydney, Australia

".....that inbreeding among immigrants is causing ...", Why use the word "immigrant" when this only applies to one particular religious group. And then you wonder why all immigrants get stereotyped.

Rajan, NJ, US

when i worked in sheffield the paediatric clinics had so many new syndromes to deal with they didn't have names for them - this helped to provide work for lots of doctors and nurses.

the pakistani community have brought so much wonderful culture to britain - the least we can do is bring in a few uneducated villagers and look after their disabled kids that they have with their new spouses.
what's the point in having the oil wealth if not to spend it on the nhs and the needy of the world? The UK's oil revenue adds up nicely to the cost of the nhs, and its good for a few more years yet.

iain c, edinburgh, scotland

Woolas identifies a pygmy as an elephant: The prevalence of inward reproduction is the result of local cultures of immigrants. The real elephant is the fact that New Labour has encouraged an open door immigration policy that has permitted such customs to become establsihed in Britain.

By allowing this uncontrolled tide of immigration to wash our shores, Labour has permitted what can only correctly be described as alien laws and customs to become rooted within our culture. The results threatendisaster for our democracy in the absence of a more measured and better described policy.

Forced marriages, subjugation of women and the persecution of homosexuals and ethnic groups (including dominant religions) are high on the list of anti-European practices that are being passed on to immigrant offspring within Britain.

Edwin, Bucharest,

This is disturbing news. To my knowledge this trend has not emerged (yet) in the States or in Canada. This "human" problem should be tackled forthwith, but I don't suppose the families will cooperate willingly.

I remember reading an article about Bradford some 20 years ago by Hanif Kureishi in Granta magazine. If anything, the Asian population there seems to have become even more separate over time. The policy of assimilation into U.K. culture must be pursued. These children are being born with preventable defects. Are the parents even receiving genetic counseling?

This news is quite telling. Rural Pakistanis should be discouraged from continuing the practice of marrying their cousins.

It was bad enough when NY's Rudy Giuliani did it in his first marriage.

Carolyn Bongiorno, Glenham, NY U.S.A.

We need to remember exactly who did this to our Country and hold them to account.

Paul, Rochester, kent, UK

The headline is a bit off: as the MP says, it's about keeping wealth in the family, and not a directly religious practice. Not that the religion is totally blameless: it's what you get when religion inhibits aa society's ability to learn from mistakes and progress.

brian t, Dublin, Ireland