I (try) and run my micro electronic repair business through royal mail, but it's nigh on impossible, I cant use couriers due to ridiculous surcharges and there far worse than RM for damaging stuff (Think they use a cannon to get packages over the Minch).
In my experience its not just Xmas its all year round, Fridays Saturdays and Mondays I hear the door go but no knock and low and behold a "we tried to deliver your parcel ticket" I'm only sat at the bench 20 feet from the front door, the geeza is back in his van and gone by the time you get out there.
If I'm expecting a Special or recorded delivery I haven't time to wait by the door for hours (As our mail can appear any time between midday and 7pm) if its important and its on one of the above days.

Bang out of order... especially when your customer has paid 20 quid to special delivery his camera or whatever...

Jay, stornoway, UK

I think the Royal mail are a joke.

I had some Christmas cards posted to me with the correct address on etc and they got lost.
These cards were of very personal value to me and it looks like I will never see them.
Royal Mails way of dealing with it is to compensate me with a book of stamps. I don't want stamps I want my post!!!
Every single person I have spoken to has had post lost at some point or another and a lot of people just don't complain so i think the problems is worse than the stats show.
I bet Adam Crozier has never had any post fail to reach him!
When I read about people who are fighting abroad for this country and not receiving parcels it sickens me.

Darren, Northampton, Northamptonshire

Will The Times follow up this story and prove that their claims were correct? If so I will believe them. Or will we not hear another word? If so then it looks to me like a cheap, scaremongering storyline used again for a cheap shot at The Royal Mail. Why not mention all the other couriers who are struggling to deliver items? Is it because the headline wouldn't be so dramatic?

Steve, Newcastle Upon Tyne,

Bought an item on ebay on the 15th Dec, it was dispatched on the 16th Dec, been down to the local sorting office before and after Christmas, still no sign of the parcel on the 28th Dec. Sorry Simon but I believe the story. The Times story not yours.

Mal, Sheffield, uk

The main reason that a lot of cards do not arrive is that the correct address is not put on the cards in the first place

kojak, essex, essex

The whole premise on which this story is based is ludicrous. 'About 1.2m letters and parcels are already ESTIMATED to have been lost in the Christmas post'. Whose estimate ? Scare-mongering about items that are not actually lost is a total non-story. I have a story for the Times Online's editors: An estimated 33% of lazy journalists will invent a statistic on a quiet news day just to fill column-inches in a newspaper. Can my figure be independently corroberated or challenged ? No !

Simon, Welwyn Garden City,

I am a soldier in the Falkland Islands and i am still waiting for 3 parcels from the 7/12/07 that my mum sent. Some other soldiers are still waiting for their parcels from November and start of December. I got one card and parcel but still waiting on the other 3. Mum is chasing it up in UK.

Smith, Chelmsford, Essex

RE: Steve Field.

Steve, doing what you've been paid to do is not good service, it's the minimum requirement.

J. Wilkes, Gloucester,

There is obviously a lot of mixed views here. However I agree with all the Posties that have put on coments. It is true that packages are poorly wrapped sometimes and in this case we do our best to tape or put them in new bags. We also deliver cards to the correct house even when they have the wrong number or wrong street on them and get no thanks. The number of large packages and smaller items but in large anounts has doubled and also because we have to start later 06:15 instead of 04:30 which has caused problems. My wife and I who are posties have for the last three weeks been working from 05:15 (paid to start 1 hr earlier) till 5pm or later to make sure that all the parcels we had were delivered. This was not for 5 days but for two weeks 7 days. Yes thats Sunday as well. Its not much fun delivering when its dark but we got parcels delivered. We care about our customers and did none this extra work because we wanted extra pay as overtime.

I hope Brackley appreciated this.

Paul, Brackley,

reg from york - I think that the implication is that the postman doesn't even bring the parcel out on his rounds, just carrying a "unable to deliver" card that he posts instead (presumably having filled it out in the nice warm sorting office), rather than that he carries parcels with him for his whole round instead of delivering them.

Sarah, Manchester,

Perhaps you should investigate Parcelforce, also. A Lego Xmas order, dispatched in Europe on 12th December, which arrived in the UK on 14th December, has been 'lost' by Parcelforce.Whilst Lego's Tracking Team have been unfailing polite and courteous to my calls, and in their pursuit of the parcels, the opposite is true of Parcelforce.Their central call system is automated, unless, in desperation you pick the 'Open a Business account' option when you get through to someone.He will then twice put you back on the automated system, before , on your 3rd call, putting you through to head office, where a woman with no customer service skills will be very rude to you and repeat the mantra 'We cant find a parcel without a tracking number'. When you point out Parcelforce 'lost' the consignment before the parcels got given tracking numbers, she just endlessly repeats'You need a tracking number'.At this point you wonder how many different ways you can tell her they lost the parcels prenumbering.

Judy, Reading, UK

I ordered and received all my on line goods. I ordered early so that there would not be a problem. I think what has happened here has taught most people a lesson. If ordering on line (which is going to be more and more popular with workers) they reall must give plenty of time for delivery. if everyone is ordering all at once and expecting deliveries. There are bound to be problems. There is only so much ANY business can take. They cannot blame it all on the postal services!!

Helen, Glasgow, Scotland

Stephen Harris - While I accept that not everyone addresses items correctly or legibly, there is still a massive problem within the RM.

I've had parcels go missing from online retailers, not in the post but after the've been returned to the Sorting Office when I wasn't in. The fact that the stories regarding no attempt to even TRY delivering parcels come up the length and breadth of the country show that this is not just an isolated problem either.

My wife ordered items for Christmas 3 weeks ago from a retailer we know and have used before - these boxes have stickers with the address clearly typed on them - it's not poor addressing that's caused that to not be delivered yet!

While people still need to be educated on how to address things properly, work NEEDS to be done to address the problems within the RM too. I've now taken to having anything of value sent by courier instead - sad state of affairs but I can't trust the RM with these things any more.

Trevor Hannant, Edinburgh,

Guaranteed Next Day (Working) Delivery, items posted on Thursday still not received.

Thank you Royal Mail, hope my Complaints/Refund form reaches me quicker than my parcels.

I use DHL on a daily basis for all my business items, they always arrive next day and a signature obtained.

If other companies can do it with less resources, why can't Royal Mail?

Jim Reid, Bedford, UK

This is all so familiar. Here in the States we've had the same treatment for years. Yes, it's much easier to drop off a "you were out" card than to actually deliver a package, especially one that has to be signed for. Here we have a different mail carrier each day in December, and they're not trusted with "accountables" (items that have to be signed for) so the cards are made out in the office, sometimes in advance. (Imagine receiving a "you-were-out" card dated the 21st on the 19th or 20th. I've had that happen.) The items rarely leave the postal installation except when, as Murphy's Law dictates, one shows up to collect it, at which time it's out somewhere else....

We also get mail delivery Monday-Wednesday-Friday the other eleven months of the year. despite the allegation that we have six-day delivery.

Heather, Brooklyn, USA

I have worked for Royal Mail for over 35yrs. I am presently a delivery office manager in the North East serving just on 25000 addresses from my office.
I asked one of my employees who was on undeliveralble mail duty this week, to make a note of how many items he was processing. This is just one days woth of items badly or wrongly addressed.
Xmas cards over 950
business mail 140
parcels 47
recorded packets 103
These items were returned to sender or sent to our returned letters branch. But of course the reciprient will class all these as missing or stolen mail.
The men and woman in my office are working around the clock to deliver Xmas post as are countless others around the country.
This morning I had a lady complaining to me of her 20 minute wait to collect her 12 parcels from the callers office. When i asked her why she had so many "while you were out cards" she told me she didnt want to pick them up yet so her kids couldnt find them. A storage facility we aint !!

Stephen Harris, Newcastle,

I do most of my non-grocery shopping online now and find that the Royal Mail is actually the most reliable delivery service here in West London. The budget (so called professional) couriers used by many online shops now are absolute jokes by comparison. Its now got so bad that I boycott, in particular, any retailer that uses Citylink due to their inability to attempt delivery while I'm actually in (while according to their tracker system they attempted delivery and left cards at my address in a parallel universe).

Steve, London,

I've never had anything go missing and I order and send loads of items per year. It really does surprise me when people continuously moan about the postal service. The only delays in mail i have is when companies or individuals send their mail 10 days after ordering it - without even informing you! No one criticizes them though! It seems being a postman is a thankless task.

bob, kettering,

Please don't blame the posties. Leighton and Crozier are the ones that have cut the jobs, less jobs equals more work for the posties and not enough time to do it in. As for those form lefts, if a postie has 20 recorded deliveries he is never going to complete his round before his finish time, as it take around 3 minutes to knock the door, wait for the customer,get no answer and then fill out a form. Seems silly but that is an extra hour on a round.

Rich, Dudley, West Mids

Having been in the postal business for 25 years, I have never see a Christmas like this one. Our amended dutys were not displayed until the 5th of December. These proved inoperable within 48 hours. And RM management have been creating thie fudge since August!

Result total chaos.

As for overtime only the few who broke the picket lines have been allowed to book extended deliveries. Everyone else has to return to the delivery office at the end of their duty time or finish for free.

billy blows, cambridge, uk

Royal Mail, due to the cut-backs in the service, vast amount of staff being given early retirement last year and Royal Mails,sole vision of trying to get the job done as cheap as possible, have not the equipment or staff in place to process the vast amount of packets that have been purchased by the public on the internet. Mail centre's have been flooded with Polish and Eastern European casuals who are not interested inorting peoples mails???

Tony, Luton,

Yes RJB1 1968! The Chinese are probably respectful towards each other. But animal cruelty in China knows no bounds. Bears kept in cages, for up to 20 years while their bile is drawn off, suffering agnonising pain each day for 'medicine' which has no scientific benefit to humans whatsoever. Put your own house in order before criticizing us Brits.
Yes John (shrewsbury) the public outcry will begin after it is too late and they find themselves collecting ALL their mail from a central point.
And to anyone who hasn't received their mail this Christmas, before complaining, ask the sender whether it was addressed accurately and postcoded. Illiteracy is on the increase in the UK. Not only are items poorly addressed, but many are illegible. Attempting to decipher addresses is time consuming. Time which could be spent on sorting other mail. It is quite astounding the number of people who send what are probably expensive presents through the post yet the forwarding address is illegible.

sophie smith, london, uk

I have become concerned that our post is being stolen. A mobile phone bought from ebay on 30th November and posted from Bamford, Derbyshire on 8th December never arrived. In addition to this a pair of glasses frames posted from Surrey on or around 16th December again didn't arrive. I found out yesterday that a mobile phone I had sold on ebay and posted recorded delivery on the 12th of December to 12 Heptonstall walk, Gorton,
Manchester, has also not arrived at the buyers address. Earlier than this two birthday cards posted in Manchester for my six year old daughter on 1st November didn't arrive either.
This has been happening since the beginning of November. Numerous Christmas cards have not arrived either. Since an item I posted at the Colney Hatch Lane post office didn't arrive at its destination and items posted to me haven't arrived I feel sure that the problem lies with a local postal sorting office. This is too many things being lost in the post over an 8 week period.

Diane, London, London

Absolutely ridiculous. The Royal Mail is a charity dedicated to the lazy and incompetent people who work there. A recent job acceptance letter took 5 days to arrive – we’re obviously towards the end of a round, and the postal workers just can’t be bothered to deliver here. I’m 100% behind sacking the lot of them and opening the market to competition.

David Spooner, London,

Sophie Smith is absolutely correct.This will be a regular occurrence especially after April 2008 when through the new pay deal even more cuts will occur.
The last strike was not about pay but the so called "modernisation" plan that Royal Mail wanted to push through.
This has resulted in the deterioration of the service.
The CWU warned the public but they ignored the warnings.Potentially 40,000 jobs are to be cut making the service even worse than it is now.
Not only is it Leighton and Croziers fault it's the Government's as welll for forcing the pay deal on the workers.
Also interestingly enough Leighton has just had his contract renewed for another year till March 2009 plus a bonus payment of £180,000 on top of his salary of £200,000.What do the public think about that? will you now support the workers?Too late I think.

john, shrewsbury, uk

Sorry to say this, but as an person from another country living in the UK, Brits seems to have a job good enough philosophy. If the job is done, it's good enough.

Vicki, Raunds,

Yet again, another 'unbiased' Royal Mail bashing. What about all the other millions of items of mail that were delivered on time. Why can't we have a report that says 'thank you postal workers for working three weeks of 12 hour shifts that fly in the face of EU working practices in order to deliver the millions of parcels and cards.' Why do they not mention that probably half of all 'missing' parcels were incorrectly addressed and badly wrapped so the moment they entered the postal system they were doomed. It should be compulsory to be taken around a sorting office at Christmas so people would realise the vast quantities of mail that have to be sorted. I would like to say a big thank you to all Royal Mail staff who processed & delivered all the mail I sent and received (all correctly wrapped & labelled).

A Foster, Sheffield,

Posties are deliberately making a point by going slow, and refusing overtime at the busiest time of the year. And this is so that they can continue their "Spanish" practices. Wake up posties! The real world is out there, and if you carry on like this there will be no Royal Mail, so you'll have to work harder for less in the real private sector.

Christopher, Salisbury,

The Royal mail is in chaos. Crozier has been in charge for a while now and has obviously failed; time to sack him.

Memo to next Royal Mail Boss - Letters and parcels don't deliver themselves.

Tom Maxwell, Redhill,

I saw the postie across the road in Lincoln yesterday and went to my door to see if he had delivered any to me. Among the letters I found a red card saying that I was not in when the delivery was made etc. I went across the road and presented him with the card. He looked at me both blankly and sheepishly, and gave me a small package. Not a word was spoken!

Kevin, Lincoln, UK

I run a distribution depot for an unrelated business. However the principle is the same.

If we were to class sending a 'while you were out' card to our customers as an OTIF (on time in full) delivery, I can guarantee we would be running at 100% OTIF.

We would also have no customers.

Unless the Royal Mail gets its act together, stops fudging delivery figures and starts delivering mail and parcels properly, there is only one eventuality and that is the Royal Mail being split up and sold off. Perhaps they should divert that vast marketing budget into sorting out its logistical (in)abilities

Greg, Sheffield,

The terminology 'lost post' is a bit rich in my view. Some of it will be lost, but I suspect the vast majority is probably accounted for by more sinister activities.

Tom, Norwich, UK

So the Royal Mail could in effect single handedly deliver a blow to the growth of on-line retailing. I have given up ordering on-line this time because a lot of presents went missing due to non delivery and late items throughout this past year, much of it caused by the postal service (though in some cases the retailers let me down too). I decided not to risk this year and did the majority of my shopping in real shops! At least this way I know I don't have to rely on the Royal Mail to cause me further problems, and I know I have the presents here and wrapped ready for Christmas day!

Max, Manchester, UK

I'm routinely receive "you were out" cards when I'm at home, even though there's a concierge who signs for parcels just a few yards down the street.. It seems to depend on which postie is doing the round. I suspect that some of them write out the cards in advance and just shove it through the door: it's far easier than carrying a parcel...

Bring on privatisation so we can employ professional couriers more easily. Then the lazy posties can go find a job that requires them to actually work.

Ian, London,

The EU decreed that our postal system should be opened up to competition and we are now reaping the "benefits". Private companies have creamed off the lucrative business bulk post, which the Royal Mail have to deliver at a fixed cost. The Royal Mail did need to brought into the 21st century, but will struggle to make a profit AND deliver the service we all expect.

For Postwatch to suggest that if Recorded Delivery can't be improved it should be abolished beggars belief. How long before they suggest stopping deliveries to rural areas as the RM struggle to maintain daily deliveries.

Ros, Surrey,

its not just the post office that doesnt deliver, the private delvery firms are just as bad, altough we work from a house on two occasions lately we found that we were "not in" and tha t a card (never actually found) had been left and that we could pick up our parcel in Plymouth (60 miles away). We even saw the van pull up outside, reverse and then drive away, no actual attempt was made to deliver. On the second occasion only a very irate phone call 30 minutes after the tracking showed we were out got the mail delivered.
Our postman has had his round extended in the latest management review and now seldom arrives before dark, he tells me he is unable to finish most days and has had to split the round up so that cutomers at the ends only get post on alternate days.

Derek Gray, Truro,

What happened to the practise of employing casual staff for the Christmas rush?
I'm sure a lot of students would welcome a chance to earn some extra money - or have the unions got the Post Office hamstrung as usual?

GJB, Slough, Berkshire

Most of the times when a card is left for collection of item at the depot, the postman do not bring the item with him.
He decides before he leaves on his delivery wether to take it
or not, It's the supervisors not doing there job, by making sure the item is taken out.

G. Persad, London, England

I have had, three times now, instances where Royal Mail did not even bother with a "you were out" card but just left the Recorded Mail at the local sorting office and expected me to recognise something was missing. Fortunately, because I was expecting deliveries I was then able to use my well-developed powers of "ESP" and figure out the items might just be at the local sorting office. My local sorting office's public counter is only open till 10:00 on a Saturday, even on the Saturday before Christmas for heaven’s sake. What sort of service is this? Something pretty major has to change or this business will just disappear. Posties beware, you will have nobody else to blame when the jobs go west!

Howard, Liverpool, UK

The post service needs improving to cope with the boom in online shopping. This year I have had the "you where out" card posted through even though I was in the house. I have had parcels posted where the other party promises the item has been posted but I havent even had a card through claiming I was out and then when I have phoned the depot the parcel is sitting there. I get parcels left on the step in the middle of the city!!! Letters routinely go missing, the service is becoming a disaster. I now get all my parcels sent to my mothers address as her postman is reliable where as mine is not. I think like all things these days the service is run to make maximum profit for minimum service and we are caught in the middle.

CG, Liverpool, UK

I have bought all my christmas gift online this year from a varierty of online shops- all arrived safe and sound , all within good time. It seems you only ever hear about is the poor service and not the good. Thought a bit of balance needed here...

Steve Field, Bourne, UK

Crozier did not excel at the Football Association. Why should the Post office be different? Unrealistic targets are the bain of modern life. Ask the Chairperson of the Police Federation.

SA, uk, uk

One of the jobs of good management is to motivate and enthuse staff, and part of this is keeping in line the stroppy and lazy ones who ruin everything, and discipline them if they do not come up to scratch. Given the attitude I see at our post office, I am not surprised when mail is being treated like trash - the whole place is a demoralised mess. The answer I am afraid lies not in the worker bees but in the people at the top - it's up to them to inspire and motivate and if they are tenth rate. so will the whole organisation be. It's a pity that this is not recognised by Government,it would save such a lot of money and anger and resentment to just get in somebody good to turn the post office around.

ja, London,

I have also had cards placed through the letter box saying that I was not at home to accept a parcel yet there was on all occasions someone in the house. These cards are typed with my particulars. I wonder if the postman also carries a typewriter on his / her rounds to complete these forms !

J OHN, DUNDEE, scotland

Christmas isn't the only time the Royal Mail has failed. I have been trying to track down a package that was sent to me in September but still hasn't turned up... just one of many instances when this "system" has failed me. This is both shameful and embarasing! Has anyone ever considered a complete overhaul of this ridiculous and inefficient system?

Kim, Edinburgh,

Over the last ten years, and millions of wasted taxpayers money, the ( so called ) Royal mail, is no longer Royal.
It has dissolved into a pit of pathetic management, or mismanagement I should say, it seems the post person ( political correctness) decides who gets the mail delivered now, as I to am STILL waiting for mail that should have been with me 10 days ago. Ten years ago this would never have happened. What a mess!!!! The whole thing is rotten, and it starts at the core. Get rid of the the lot, and bring in a service that does what it says on the tin, because I can not see this getting better! They held the country to ransom, more companies use mail for online delivery's, I now think twice about ordering anything now because I DONT TRUST THEM ANYMORE.

Taylor, Solihull,

When I was a young woman three weeks work on the Christmas Post as a casual was a common thing for students to do to earn some money. Now instead of taking on extra staff for the Christmas peak staff numbers are cut and demoralised.
Deliveries and collections were made on Sundays and right up to 5pm on Christmas Eve. Sunday collections went in October. Second deliveries went ages ago. Now the only delivery is somewhat later than the "second post" used to be. My post arrives at about 2.30pm and I don't think our street gets a delivery every day either. If I were running a business a delivery so late would make it hard to function so I can see why DX is so popular.
And Reg, what they do is scribble the cards in advance, no details on the card and leave the parcel in the depot. Then pop through the letter box or they are penalised for missing their targets. Likewise, even parcels requiring a signature are left on the doorstep without a knock, this happened to me yesterday.

cam, uk,

I wonder what sort of bonuses Leighton and Crozier can expect to pick up for this weakening of the Royal Mail? They have been very successful in preparing it for privatisation - the writing has been on the wall for a long time.

Bill Q, Derby,

Reg, York.
No, the postman doesn't even bring the parcel on his round. Mine left one of those cards when I was in, and I caught him before he had left my drive. The parcel was still at the depot, but I had a card saying 'sorry you were out when we tried to deliver'. The postman's attitude could best be described as truculent.

P Robbins, Cornwall,

Reg, they don't take the parcels out in the first place.
I ran out the door with my, 'you were out' card and challenged the postman-who was still outside the door- with it.
This does happen.

Ian (Brit) , Paris, France

logistically royal mail have cocked it up this christmas.they have totally underestimated the staffing levels at mail centres,this is due to employing temps who cannot learn the job in a short time ,or just cannot read or write english.in our delivery office we have had missorts(item of mail sent out incorrectly)from all over the place and in huge amounts.whether these connect to the right place before christmas i would say is doubtful.
where do you point the finger too blame, it has to go to the very top.profit is being put before service.alot of posties are concerned about managements attitude to customer service,who are getting a very bad deal at the moment.

mike read, odcombe, somerset

Reg, it is easier; they don't have to carry them on the rest of the round as they don't take them out with them in the first place having written out the cards in the warmth of the office

Hughie, Essex,

I left home in Manchester on Thursday morning (20th). A Christmas card that my dad had sent ten days earlier had still not arrived. He has now told me it contained a cheque and he is worried it has been lost or stolen. A card sent by my sister also hadn't arrived.

In fact I had received a total of four Christmas cards by the time I left. Down from about 20 last year. I was also still waiting for a monthly cheque from the USA which usually arrives on 13th. In the week before I left, the only mail I received was a BT phone bill.

Robert, Manchester, UK

I live in China where you would never ever get this type of appalling service - people work 6 days a week and the level of customer service here is extremely high. There is also a far superior level of respect here for other human beings - far more so than in the UK where you all seem to be fighting the person next to you. Enjoy your christmas in the damp rain!

RJB1968, Hong Kong,

"deliberately failing to deliver parcels to save time" - so the postie would rather stand on a cold doorstep, write out a card, carry the parcel on his back for the rest of the round then do the paperwork when he gets back to the office rather than deliver it ?

reg, york,

I too have experienced problems collecting parcels from the Bolton depot, the attitude of the staff suck after taking a day off and waiting 4 hours in the cold to only get turned away 5.30 on the dot.

Even if you try to get it redelivered online / using the automated telephone system, they still don’t deliver your parcel. I have given up and simply re-purchased locally.

Chris, Bolton,

What did the public expect?. The Unions warned that job losses would lead to a deterioration in the postal service, but Leighton and Crozier have pushed ahead with 'modernisation', cutting the time Posties have to complete their round, and employing fewer and fewer employees to sort the mail, whilst they earn in excess of a million pound salary year on year. And before readers call for privatisation and competition in the postal service, the confidential records of 25 million people were recently 'lost' by the competition!

sophie smith, london, uk