What a disgrace of a country that we now live in, that we would have such overbearing sympathy for theives and murderers...please can we now look after the people who work hard for the benefit of this country and not the scroungers and lay abouts...I would have done exactly the same as the shopkeeper and will do in the future..

paul, wadebridge, cornwall

Piers Verber writes “The law is very simple you can ONLY use such force as is REASONABLE in the circumstances”, and argues that, by kicking the criminal after he was knocked down, the shopkeeper went too far. This is correct as far as it goes. However, the real issue is that in today’s climate what is ‘unreasonable’? Having knocked the youth down what assurance did the shopkeeper have that he would not get up again – perhaps having drawn a knife? This youth had already attacked the shopkeeper. He was not passively surrendering. In these circumstances I think the shopkeeper was totally justified in knocking him down and trying to make sure he did not get up again. To use a boxing analogy, in a situation like this you are not trying to win on points you are going for a knockout. Based on the facts I have read so far if I had been on a jury hearing this case I would not have found the shopkeeper guilty of any degree of assault.

Kevin, Kent,

I would like to thank my direct patrilineal ancestor who had the good sense to sign up as an indentured servant in order to travel to Virginia in 1674. Whereas, here in the United States, all but two of our fifty states have laws allowing properly licensed citizens to carry concealed handguns for defense of themselves and others, in the UK law-abiding people are disarmed and prosecuted if they attempt to defend themselves or their family or their property. Since when did self-defense or defense of one's property become criminalized?

So, I thank you, Great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandfather Daniel for emigrating to the "Colonies" all those years ago, where, as yet, we still have the right to defend our selves, our families, and our property without being second-guessed as to what force was appropriate by people who weren't under attack.

Elm Creek Smith

Elm Creek Smith, Owasso, Oklahoma, USA

Mr Verber, what hope do we have against the terrorists if that is your attitude.

The shopkeeper should have been given a verbal reprimand (with the officer's tongue in his cheek) and nothing more.

(Although I live in the US I am British and lived there for 38 of my 39 years)

eddie, davis, Cal,USA

The right of self defence has to be strengthened. Criminals should be assumed by society to have volunatarily surrendered the privileges or 'rights' we extend to them. Giving the thieves a fixed penalty - ie, minor slap across the wrist to be paid for by the next heist - is just encouraging crime. Punishing the shopkeeper spo severely is a nonsense. if he overreacted in the heat of the moment then who wouldn't? he should at worst have got a caution and no criminal record.

We give up our right to violence to the state , in exchange the state guarantees our safety. No one expects it to be perfect but currently the middle classes are reviled by the state and criminals are 'understood'. The state is breaking its half of the bargain and increasingly will be seen more like an alien occupier to be resisted.

Neil Murphy, cromer,

"The law is very simple you can ONLY use such force as is REASONABLE in the circumstances."
True, but what the vast majority of people find reasonable is not what our current laws find reasonable and there's the rub. In the given circumstances the overwhelming majority of us do not find it unreasonable for the shopkeeper to continue his assault upon the thief beyond pure self-defence & hotbloodedness. There is a retributive element which is a natural human impulse under such circumstances and goes beyond "the heat of the moment". The man in the street understands this but the magistrate doesn't. This is because both policing and judicial administration and execution, from the magisterial level and above, have been poisoned over the last 30 years by socialist thinking and values, values which have no correspondence with natural justice or common law principles.
The law may be very simple but is not just simply by reason of it being the law.

Steve, Sheffield,

For all of you good English people that want to stand up for protection of yourselves, i would love to have you come live in the USA.We are not perfect by no means in our justice system, but we try hard by having more right to carry in most states.Those states that have right to carry do two things,one is it lets others know that i am an honest person,( like the policeman that pulled me over for speeding, and was nice enough to not give me a ticket,and he seemed to relax after i showed him my drivers license and CCP, its required in this state) and keeps bad people guessing if im carrying.You English need to take back your goverment and put sanity back in

Brian Pacio, kalamazoo, USA,Michigan

You Brits went from the center of the civilized world to a house run by the kooks in just a few decades.

Criminalize self defense?? You all should be ashamed of yourself for letting your government get so kooky. All of Gods animals have the right of self defense. That is why they have sharp hoof, tooth, and claw. Why deny yourself the most basic of human rights, self defense?

Better get house in order before they criminalize your right to complain or challenge the justice system.

Jim, USA, Ca

It seems the police , magistrates and cps are just here to ruin innocent peoples lives . I want my country back ! Positive action needs to be taken against these people who have allowed this injustice to happen .

Benzo, Nr Chelmsford,

For James in the UK, from an American. You are correct, the shopkeeper could have been shot by the thugs, but judging from the current gun crime rate in the UK, that is already a greater possibility than all but the most dangerous of US cities, like Washington, D.C. (where all guns are illegal). However, in most of the US, you at least have the choice to be armed. You don't have to be, you don't have to resist, but at least you are a free man who has the right to the means of self defense. As Jeff Cooper says, when a man picks up a rifle he becomes a citizen. As one of my British friends reminded me, "We are subjects, not citizens." Perhaps it is time for you all to decide that civilization needs to be defended, whether from Muslim thugs, the local thugs, or thugs like Hitler. Arm yourselves, take back your country, and stand up for the good.

Scott, Dallas, Texas, USA

A law that says you cannot defend yourself but have to leave it with the police, whilst at the same time the police does nothing, is not only a bad law, it is an obscenity. This "judge" has brought the law into disrespect, he should be prosecuted.

Ed Zuiderwijk, Cambridge, UK

I voted BNP and if everyone did, this nonsense wouldn't happen. We have to get rid of the left-liberalist PC idiocy causing this cancer in our society. The police and magistrates should know that their Common Purpose inspired actions are recorded for a future date.

Nick Chance, worcester, england

Once again - a man stands up against this demented society, only to be punished by it. There is another article today about the lack of respect the middle class has for the law...I wonder why.

What is wrong with this country? Who's idea was it to punish a man who stands up for himself? I can only assume it's part of the plan to emasculate society.

Daniel, London,

I can't say i am surprised. Fair play to the shopkeeper, he should have given the lad a proper good kicking, that may have made him think twice next time he went into someones business and pinched something.

Let's face it the police are bound in tape, there are no cells left.
Simple solution just put more prisoners in each cell!

Geordie, Raleigh, USA

let 'em try that in Texas!!!!

Jerry Frendo, Wanaque,

You voted them in to power. As far as this present lot is concerned theving, robery and assualt is a fair distribution of wealth!

Roy Bevington., Birmingham., England

So the shoplifters outnumbered the shop staff, stole from them,assaulted them and get a fixed penalty.

The Shop owner in agony from a kick in the especially tender groin area hits and kicks out and he gets charged with assault.

Its Madness.

I'm surprised the Police didn't ticket him for speeding and tow his car away because they thought in error it might be uninsured. Just to make sure the real middle class law breaker suffered.

Watch out, watch out theres a mad justice system about.

Alex, Slough,

They say crime does not pay yet we are constantly bombarded with the innocent members of society getting crimminal records because they have been forced to protect themselves. Where is the justice in this country before long the law abiding citizens will be in prison and the lawless outside where is this so called justice the government has been promising us over the last ten years. We should take a leaf out of the american prison systemand make it a place that nobody would want to go back in once time served.

Bernie, March, UK

So Piers Verber thinks he went too far and deserved prosecution because the law msut be impartial. Was the law being impartial by not charging the youths with assault when it seems they struck first?

Kenneth Hutchison, Tauranga, New Zealand

An absolute disgrace that brings shame on our legal system. If you choose to operate outside of the law then how can it be acceptable to later turnaround and ask for its protection ?

As always the law in this country is set you to protect the criminals and prosecute the innocent hard-working citizen.

D RIVER, Tokyo, Japan

Since Mr. Smyth has been issued a valid criminal record, he will from now on be able to do whatever he likes. The Police needs all curageous individals like Mr. Smyth to step foreward and to merge with the criminal mass. Standing up against crime is a criminal act indeed. In the end, there will be just the Police and just the criminals. The verdict means that you're not supposed to do anything that might bring a crime to a halt - or to help anybody, including your very self. Just imagine: Only the Police may help you - even when the police aint around.

Georges, Zurich, Switzerland

Are you freaking kidding me,

These thugs beat this man, and he's not allowed to defend himself?

WOW, i am glad i live in the US.

Those Thugs would be in a body bag here.

John, Cedar, USA

If the story is accurate, as reported:
The Police should be prosecuted for bringing such a stupid case.
The magistrate should be disbarred and prevented from practicing again.
If the magistrate is ‘merely implementing the law as it stands' those that made the laws should be fined for incompetence.

No doubt, some idiot will come out to defend the decision as 'we cannot have the public taking the law into their own hands - or where would we be'.
I abhor violence, but if someone blatantly infringes the rights of others, I believe that they have forfeited their own rights and deserve everything they get. The thugs got off lightly.

I. McGlone, Brechin, UK

Should I ever turn to a life of crime, I will immigrate to the UK - it is a much safer working environment for criminals than the US.

Randy, Charlotte, NC, USA

Congratulations to the police , the CPS and the magistrates; you have now given free reign and encoragement to shoplifters, and other offenders, that they can initiate violence, with the victim to fear both the asssaulter and the police.

The shop-keeper's actions were fully justified as self-defence, unless he had training and experience in dealing with violence; once reacting to an assault he is not in any 'normal' frame of mind unless he has had such training.

Derek Phibes, London,

I despair of this country

roman, Preston, UK

This case is madness. A shopkeeper chases someone who has stolen from him. He catches up but the thief attacks him. However he manages to defend himself and, gaining the upper hand, administers something of a beating to the criminal. As a result the shopkeeper is punished! There is nothing in the report to say that the shopkeeper went way over the top. I accept that there would come a stage when defending yourself becomes excessive. However we hear so many cases these days of law abiding citizens trying to intervene with criminals and being beaten to death. Facing a risk like that what is excessive? Where the criminals have started to attack then I think anyone is entitled to assume that their life is in danger and respond with the maximum force at their disposal to disable the attacker. If that includes giving the thief a severe beating so be it. If this had gone to trial I doubt that any jury would have convicted the shopkeeper. Why was he prosecuted?

Kevin, Kent,

I bet the shopkeeper never calls the Police again and will probably serve his own brand of punishment on the next guy that tries to steal his property.

Carefull Cle from Oklahoma: Don't forget we have our own screwed up justice system as well. Remember O.J.?

Pete
Phoenix, AZ

Pete, phoenix, az

The law is very simple you can ONLY use such force as is REASONABLE in the circumstances"

Who when retaining/holding a thief who has already kicked you in the groin and is trying to (I presume) "get away" would take time out to analyze the situation and think "Oh now if hit him again, I am probably using unreasonable force?"

If you started doing this (during the heat of the moment) then you would more likely get kicked again in the groin area and the youth would get away without his "fixed penalty"

Derry, Wirral, UK

Very depressing. And the shoplifters will be laughing their hoods off! I saw a guy getting arrested yesterday afternoon for no apparent reason; he'd had a few drinks but was not drunk... I had been chatting to him having a fag outside the pub several minutes earlier. I am glad I returned to my drink and wife indoors or I, too, may have been arrested, immediately lost my job because of it, probably my house and car too!

dodger, perth, scotland

See home office guide lines, available on net. Its a long time since i've read them but I believe it says that you "do not have to wait till the perp hits you"

J.R.S, Carlisle,

To the holier-than-thou Americans: If we went down your road, the shopkeeper would have been shot and killed already. Don't call us, we'll call you thanks very much.

James, London, UK

"zero tolerance is surely the answer...

not against the victims BUT against the yobbos who want to bully and intimidate the hard working members of our society"

Would those be the ones robbing and assaulting decent people or the ones in Commons and the Home Office?

Ken, Westford,

The Tony Martin case triggered my emigration in 2003. We don't have that nonsense here in Japan. Criminals are vermin, and an endangered species. That said, had a very minor break in last week. With one hour our local police officer was out, quickly followed by four more, including one to dust for prints. There’s so little crime they need the practice. Eat your hearts out Brits.

Andrew Milner, Yokohama, Kanagawa

If the police won't support and defend the public, the public should not support the police.

Arthur, Melbourne, Australia

This is one of the crazist acticals I"ve read from your country. I just can't believe that that judge has put the store owner on trail...That is the stupist thing I've read...That man, and any person who has a store should be able to protect themselves.I vote for what Joe in california wrote, the man should have been given an award for standing up to someone who is a danger to him. Come on Judge, think about if these kids would have really hurt him, then would have called it a tragedy? This is unjust...Please Judge think about what you are doing...

Ram, Tulsa OK, USA

This really beggars belief - who appoints the magistrates?
Who are the CPS serving?
Why have the Police being politicised?

Bring back C.P. and use it on live TV instead of Big Brother.
Make terrorisim an offense of Treason and deal with those who support it or commit it.

I've had it. I'm off abroad and taking my family with me.

Tom, Stokesley,

And the police say they are losing the support of the public, is it any wonder.
Pressurised by jumped up legal wan't-a-be's fresh out of law school and politically correct social turnips, into getting any conviction at the cheapest cost in both time and money. a more morally corrupt and socially depraved group one would be hard pushed to find, lawyers, I would call them scum of the earth, but even scum, in this age of recycling, I'm sure has a use somewhere.
What a waste of our money and the legal systems time.

Ian, Ramsgate, UK

I thought I had read some nutty stuff about how the British legal system handled crime--but this one takes the cake. I can't believe ordinary British citizens approve of this--but your political system seems to be such that you can't make serious changes in your government. And the poltically correct crazies seem to be running the show.

I was a police officer here in the United States for 20 years--and I can guarantee you that the store owner would never have been charged here. And the thugs who stole would have faced a whole raft of charges.

I am shaking my head in disbelief.

Terry L. Walker, Ladson, S.C. / USA

As an ex-pat living in the "Wild West" I could not believe my eyes when I read this article. I envisioned a crusty old justice handing down the sentence as "Judge Bullingham" might have done in an episode of "Rumpole of The Bailey".
I am approaching retirement and actually considered the possibility of returning home - after 2 visits in the last 3 years, I think I will stick it out here with Wild Bill Hickok and Jesse James - at least they fought fair!
Mr. Smyth should have called upon Rumpole or Perry Mason to do his bidding - at least he would have gone down knowing that all that could have been done, was done. From the sounds of it he might as well have been represented by The Marx Brothers for all the good his defence did.
Almost every aspect of English life has changed dramatically in the 30 years that I have been gone and the Winds of Change have not been good to the olde country. And now a new chapter begins. Good Luck. I am going to watch the sun set over the Pacific.

Ian, PMC, Ca. USA.

Absolute lunacy where being a criminal provides you with better protection than being a victim who protects yourself and your property. It is a shameful state for society to reach this stage.

The term outlaw seems old-fashioned however it does remind me that people in breach of the law used to and should lose the protection of the law of the land.

Patrick Taylor, Bristol, uk

Wow, a law that protects the criminals! Right - off I go to shoplift then

John, Chippenham,

I must say, the logic of your law enforcement agencies escapes me. First, no self-respecting american policeman would've issued the ticket and most prosecutors would not have pursued the matter.

If they had, I assure you the local community would've been up in arms until it was dropped.

Mark, Calcasieu Parish, Louisiana

Garbage like this is one of the reasons I left UK 20 yrs ago and came to the USA. My store has been robbed once at gun point and a second felon tried to rob me at knife point. The judicious application of 5 .357 Magnums delivered by one of Colonel Colt's fine revolvers soon put an end to the second fellow's miserable life. The point is, over here you can defend yourself as long as you stay within the rules.

Steve Heathcote, Scottsdale, Arizona USA

zero tolerance is surely the answer...

not against the victims BUT against the yobbos who want to bully and intimidate the hard working members of our society

Smita, Harrow, UK

Who said the law's an Ass?

BertyBrit, London,

prestcott was never prosecuted for assault after hitting back after a benign assualt of an egg rather than a kick in the groin
one law for the powerful another for joe public

terry kates, lincoln,

The rights of thieves should come second to the right of a shopkeeper to defend himself and his property. No wonder petty crime is rampant in the U.K. Also, the legal system in England seems to encourage guilty pleas, fearing a full trial would result in a greater penalty. This is hardly justice.

Roy Murray, Toronto, Canada

Makes so much sense. Criminals run rampant while the victims are fined and jailed. What happened to the world we once had?

joy, lodi, NJ

It's no wonder that other countries see GB as a joke. The only people who seem to do well in GB are crooks. I can't wait to get out.

Hugh, london,

A truly depressing story. I have thought for a long time that the main aim of the UK police is not to 'protect and serve', but to CONTROL society. Any hint of people taking action themselves or vigilantism the police and magistrates step on it very hard to the applause of the horrible left-wing, as in this example.

Ultimately, unless this country starts moving in the opposite direction, the people will need to protect themselves in their own way...

Paul, Plymouth, Devon

There is a principle in psychology called 'operant conditioning' - you select a behaviour and then reinforce it, either by reward or punishment. In this way you can teach pigeons to play ping-pong and rats to solve mazes.

You can also teach criminals to flout the law and citizens to fear upholding it, as the legal system is currently doing. So now we pay taxes to undermine our own safety and security. Odd.

Revd John Richardson, Elsenham, UK

The law is very simple you can ONLY use such force as is REASONABLE in the circumstances. Even the defence lawyer says "In the heat of the moment he kicked him once or twice. Initially he was acting in self defence. Frustration at the situation took over". That says it all..the shopkeeper went TOO FAR and the law has to remain impartial. We cant have a situation where we say "oh yes well they were up to no good so the shopkeeper should have a free reign to go crazy...let him stamp on thier heads they deserve it". The laws are there to protect EVERYBODY even those being subjected to an unlawful assault because they have done wrong. Two wrongs dont make a right!

Piers Verber, Wiltshire, UK

What if the lout he attacked had drawn a knife or gun in 'sel-defence' - would the lout be justified in "taking the law into his own hands"? Let's hope the thieves are punished by the court adequately and the shopkeeper wins his appeal against sentence.

Mike Watson, Malmesbury, UK

The Police in this case should be ashamed, No wonder they are losing all respect,

Shaun Maudsley, St.Helens, England

This obvious injustice is doubtless motivated by our increasingly useless police's desire to be able to tick another "crime solved" box and is why the public regards the police and judiciary with growing contempt and distrust. Any chance Gordan will fix this and give us what we pay our taxes for? Maybe the government could introduce a law against criminal stupidity. The magistrate, prosecutor and police involved here would all be caught bang to rights on this and it would be a fair cop.

Robert, Cambridge,

What was this magistrate thinking of? (if he even was).
Every time I read of cases like this I despair of the justice system in this country. Perhaps we all should go around stealing from shops and then when anyone tries to stop us we scream assault and get away with it! It would certainly help my economy!

Bill Glanvill, Horsham, Sussex

Here in Oklahoma the kids would go to Juvenile Court and the shopkeeper would have been viewed as a hero. Not sure about you Brits.

Cle Cox, Lawton, OK

Cle Cox, Lawton, US, Oklahoma

The more I read about your laws (a good # of years already, rather as a hobby...), the worse I feel for you people. Your government has gone INSANE.

Robert Scott Wilson, Pinellas Park, Florida, United States

Arghhhhhhhh!!! What is the matter with this Country?

Peter, Brixham, Devon

Unbelievable.
What about 'Have-a-go Hero' headlines if he'd been shot dead?

Gwilym Rhys-Jones, costa del sol, spain

He must have used a discount lawyer,as if the story is accurate,this mans conviction is a disgrace to reality.The thieves mst be laughing at us all.

Keith R. Pirelli, Rio De Janeiro, Brazil

Our laws seem to be made in order that we commit suicide.

S. Daiger , fredericksburg, , va.

Places where property crimes are not prosecuted seriously are going to degenerate into young thug havens. I suggest flying your family to Mexico and wading into Texas to live. The US is better at protecting property, and Texas is better than most states at allowing innocent people to defend themselves in their homes and businesses.

Joe Schmoe, palo alto, california, us

Well, we have our problems here across the pond with the political correctness run amok, but you Brits are now sinking under the weight of your own idiocy...I doubt that there are now enough of you left with any common sense to be able to take your once-great country back from the barbarians and lunatics.

I am sooooo glad my ancestors had the will to leave when they did!

Tim, Memphis, TN

It is not my fault this happened, I voted UKIP. If you didn't it is your fault !

David Holland, London, UK

He should have been given a medal and an award of £250 (to be paid by the parents of the thugs). Unless the police are willing to station someone in every shop, then shopkeepers must be allowed to defend themselves.

joe, San Francisco, CA, USA

If I, a law abiding 54 year old, whose father was a Met police officer for over 30 years, no longer has any respect for the police or the judiciary because of instances like this, then it is no wonder that the criminal element in society are causing mayhem and laughing at our inability to reign them in

Martin Atkinson, Watford, England

If ever there was a case of the lunatics running the asylum...

Bartman, London,

No wonder that the population have such a low regard for the Police and the Injustice system.

Nigel Wheatcroft, Wimbledon, Uk

Sad to say but I'm not surprided by this decision - shoplifters have the freedom to do whatever they want in this country - why the powers at be believe that thieving from a shop is different to thieving from a house I don't understand. Theft is theft and maybe if the police started to take this crime seriously it may have a positive knock on effect further down the line. I suspect shoplifting is seen as a way to finance drugs by many, but still the police don't care.

What's this poor chap supposed to do when these thieves turn up in his shop again - they will, and they'll laugh at him - and they'll steal. This country is in a poor state

Peacock, London,

I can see I did the right thing emigrating from the UK when I did.

Rodney, Richmond Hill, Canada

You go right way, guys. By the way, why are knives still not prosecuted in England? Its are so dangerous things!

Ilya, Khimki, Russia

In 2003 I was attacked on my property by 6 youths who were having a pizza and beer evening on my lawn at 2 am in the morning. I conmmited the heinous crime of asking them to leave. One of the youths suffered an injury I caused in self defence. I myself was admitted to hospital with a suspected broken jaw and cheekbone, I was also beaten across my back with a length of steel.
Because I defended myself on the street outside my house ,and not on my property, I was arrested twice and threatened with charges of assault.
The local police stood to gain from multiple convictions and gain lots of "crime solved" points.
It is time to take the country back from the politically correct, apologists and have a system of law based on natural justice.
If the shopkeepr would like to send me his address I will gladly pay his fine, in fact double it, so the next time he sees the toe rag pass his shop he can give him another dig. I will gladly pay my train fare down there and join in. Bast***s

jono, Newcastle,

"Self defense is justly called the primary law of nature, so it is not, neither can it be in fact, taken away by the laws of society." - Sir William Blackstone

John Baker, Birmingham, USA

"Self defense is justly called the primary law of nature, so it is not, neither can it be in fact, taken away by the laws of society." - Sir William Blackstone

John Baker, Birmingham, USA

Absolutely disgusting, Mr Smyth should not have been charged in anyway for tackling these yobs. Criminals should have no recourse whatsoever when tackled in the course of committing a criminal act. It is no wonder that we have teenagers killing each other, when they know that if caught they are going to be treated with kid-gloves. The action of the police, cps and magistrates in this case shows the judicial system is totally out of touch with the public opinion.

Les, Southport, England

He pleaded guilty in Truro Magistrates’ Court, bad move. Anyone who been to a Magistrates Court know how useless the Magistrates are, quoting laws but not showing discretion when required, like in this case.

The unfortunate side effect is that this man now has a criminal record and restricted in his movements.

Rob, West Mids ,

Angy Haslam, chairman of Truro Magistrates’ Court and prosecutor Julian Herbert have now joined the ever growing list of those responsible for the destruction of civil society in Britain.

Russell M, Stirling, Scotland

Here in Texas the shopkeeper would receive a medal for heroism and the crooks would go to jail. Defending your property was .... was in England ... part of commom law. Where is England going when the good guys get punished. Ruin awaits

Kent Herrick, Texas USA,

Over to you, Gordon.

Norman Paterson, Anstruther, Fife

A government who refuses to allow its 'subjects' to defend themselves against hooligans and thieves is a government who has lost its moral authority to govern.

Robert Gaskin, Foothill Ranch, U.S.A California

Amigos, I have a feeling these bad laws will have to change. The current system is ludicrous. I recommend that every shopkeeper in the country close up shop for a week in passive-agressive protest.

A few MPs ought to face a noose over this, really, simply for the sake of criminal justice.

Dee Wolfe, Salt Lake City, Utah U.S.A.

Since Mr Smyth has been named why shouldn't the Sunday Times name and shame the police officers involved.

David Gwilliam, Leicester, England

It's clear that retail is dead.

If you shoplift and are caught you receive a fixed penalty notice (but not jail and no record). So providing you are not caught to often the FPN could just be considered as a cost of doing business.

Why were the shoplifters not prosecuted for assault? Is Shoplifiting now a recognised professsion and assault is just part of that?

Is a shopkeeper now supposed to open the door and be friendly to shoplifters?

When someone steals from a shop they are stealing from the profit margin of that shop. It is not a victimless crime. It is theft.

Mike Hinsley, Bristol, UK

It's not lunatics it's lawyers! They cannot make it in their profession so they become MPs so they can run our lives for us.
What is it about this country? Why is everything done to apease the worst elements? I LIKE the Texan way - you break into my house or garden, I can shoot you. Here if I swore at a housebreaker I would probably be arrested. In a report in this paper a man got 15 months for KILLING his baby. Muslims put bombs in the underground, we have to walk round on tiptoes so we do not upset them. When do we get rid of lawyers ruling us, especially foreign ones, and get our country, and common sense, back?

Peggy W, Blyth, England

Absolutely Outrageous, those lads deserved what they got, and what is the nation going to do about this crazy manipulation of the law in favour of scum?? Nothing, because we are miserable weak little blancemanges, covering our own backs, already beaten into submission by 700 new laws, overfearful of authority. Why can't we show more solidarity, like the French? Why can't we trust natural justice?

Sarah, Wellington,

In the United States, Mr. Smyth would be entitled to a jury of his peers, and no jury would convict him. Indeed, Americans would laud him as a hero. With jurisprudence of this sort, how can dear old England avoid slipping into anarchy?

Jim Bacon
Richmond, Virginia, USA

Jim Bacon, Richmond, VA, USA