since the whole world dont understand chinese nation,so we chinese must united together,not for the governmnet but for our parents,relatives,friends,and THE CHINESE NATION.We must have enough courage to face whatever happened and will happen.What we want is just live ourselves and peace,but we dont fear any threats from any other body and any other country

jim, qingdao, china

"IOC member Kevan Gosper, who is vice chairman of the coordination commission for the Beijing Games, suggested this week that the public relations nightmare that has followed the Olympic flame may make 2008 the last year for a global torch relay."

The protests are ruining the Olympic. Please stop using the game to achieve political purposes.

Kong, Guangzhou , PR China

Yes, the IOC should scrap everything internationally related to the 2008 meet. Run the Chinese torch and run everything else only for China too. Give'm all the golds! The world already knows, it doesn't matter.

Atartoo, Beijing, China

Why should a minority stop the torch process? The fact is that China rightly or wrongly controls Tibet. One could say the same for the USA controling Iraq and Russia in Belarus.

Hamad Lone, London, England

If the torch is the property of the IOC, why isn't there a more visible IOC presence to secure it during the relays? At the moment, the relay has turned into a highly volatile "the chinese against the rest of the world" marathon. This should be changed as i think people would feel a lot less chagrin and start acting as graceful hosts if it was clearly an IOC relay of the torch.

stephen, china, china

I don’t understand. A riot in Tibet was put down with the help of the military no doubt. A riot that have gone violent and innocent people killed, shops were looted and burned down. Would not any government would have done the same. Look at the past riots in US and France, as well as UK. Isn’t their security forces were called in to quell the unrest?? So where is the outcry and outburst of brutality, or military crackdown??? Demonstrations? Sure why not? If this is more successful to put across the message but turning it into violence outbursts??? Tibet issue is more complex than what a lot of people here think. Rather than do any good, the protesters have killed the magic moment of the Olympic movement, especially to the kids around the world - is like Mickey mouse or Disney world were found framed of drug trafficking and child molest. Why the press in China only recently show the protests??? They just don’t want to create a Chinese nationalistic movement against others.

PS Kong, Singapore, Singapore

I' m very sad when I see country like china trying to change olympic spirit. They critics other country (france and great britain), because they have desecrated olympic torch. BUT china dishonour olympism created by pierre de coubertin, freedom is condemned by chinese government and for finish I can say that IOC (CIO) has been perveted by money, forgetting the olympic ideal

cyril, pont saint esprit, france

The Chinese people are rightly proud for their achievements. Human rights or not, they have emerged as a great nation and will be such and the West better get used to it.

Will, Millburn, NJ USA

Crawford, you are being arrogant here if you didn't realize it. Do not challenge the integrity of the posters here.

All the anti-Chinese demonstrations can serve nothing but to strength Chinese nationalistic mentality. Not to mention the contreversial legitimacy of hijacking Olympics as a platform to get through messages of specific groups, it is naive to make sweeping statements about a coutnry and its people.

Again, I believe Chinese people are NOT stupid. They don't need salvation from us. Neither do Tibetan people. Do some research over its history before arriving at a judgment. Know what you are talking about. I got a deja-vu here. Cold war is coming back...

Ronny, Blackburn, England

All eyes are on San Fran's police and protesters. Is America still free?

Remember: if this was happening in China, police would gun the protesters down, or at least drag them in for "re-education" (ie: torture).

And as for this statement: '“Using the torch this way is almost a crime," Ms Lindberg said. "This is the property of the IOC, it is not a Chinese torch.”

What on Earth did the IOC THINK China was going to do? It's a totalitarian state! Propaganda is their lifeblood.

Shaun Smith, Toronto, Canada

I'd sure like to buy the Mayor of Paris a Bottle of 1787 Chateau Lafite. I would serious mortgage my home to have the honor of shaking this gentleman's hand.

This kind of character and courage is scarcely seen in government anymore, let alone in any of our leaders whether governmental or capitalistic. No one seems to have any stones as they say.

If perhaps the Governor of California, for instance, actually lived out the roles he played in his films I would have guessed that we would have seen something marvelous in San Francisco. Instead we hear..."Things of this nature..." ugh!

I say, let's dare to take up Bertrand Delanoë's example of bravery and at least try to do something within the caliber of courage and state to the Chinese government that they are but hosts of an event which belongs to the world and should return what they have stolen to those people and to a leader who has ever sued for peace, the Dalai Lama.

Andrew Kelvin, Vancouver, Washington

The IOC brought this international chaos upon themselves. They say that politics and sport do not go together yet they used 100% politics to give China the games. They speak out of both sides of their mouth. They put politics into the selection process and now they don't want politics involved in the process. The proper thing would have been for the IOC to have some backbone and respond to China's years of ignoring and defying human rights by saying NO! There are scores of other countries better suited to hosting the games than China. IOC, you created this mess -- you fix it.

Bill C, Denver, USA

Dave J, you assume that war is the only answer. That's really sad.

These Olympics folk that are upset at the protests because "the torch is IOC property not Chinese" forget that it was the IOC that approved China as the location of the games. I would advise these IOC peeps that perhaps it is their choice that brings this burden to them.

Jimmy, Los Angeles,

The scenes that you have seen in London and Paris are definitely Violence-involving. I would not call much of the these as Civilized Behaviors nor Peaceful Demonstrations, which some western media named what happened in Tibet.

So far the roles that western media has played in this ever-inflamed politicalized international event, has simply ruined the "impartial images" of the western media in Chinese people's minds. It does not help at all in terms of accepting the western world's common value of the human rights for Chinese people.

In old Chinese sayings: "you don't force the horse to drink when it does not want to." "Good things happen in their own way rather than by any outside forces!"

The losers, are those masterminds of the Strategists!
The losers, are those western people who'd like to spread their common values!
The losers, are those Chinese who'd love to be integrated with outside world!
The losers, are those people who'd love to live in Harmoney and Peace!

Ken Xie, London, The UK

Little error in that article. They cancelled the Taipei part of the relay quite awhile ago. Probably a good move in retrospect.

Lime, Edmonton,

"Time is required for the wealth to permeate down to the bulk of its 1.3 billion people. Democracy would only hinder the process. Indeed, it could be argued that democracy can only operate properly where the average wealth is above a certain threshold. " Dwight Vandryver, Scholar Green, Cheshire, UK

I am a Chinese doctoral student. I eat KFC. I drink Coca Cola. I watch 'American Beauty' and European Championship Cup. I use google. I read Times Online and CNN news......

BUT I agree with Dwight Vandryver. He understand China deeply and surprised me so much. At present, Chinese people(include Tibetan) just need only two things, time and peace. Welcome to China, see and think it all youself.

Linger, ChongQing, China

France didn't protect the sacred flame," said the Global Times, a popular tabloid. --- Since when is ANYTHING associated with the Olympics sacred? The Olympic Games are nothing more than a huge money maker for the Members of the IOC. The only thing they do is let you use the circle design and then make the lives of the people in the host city miserable for a couple of years and cuase their taxes to go up as the city pays for the 'improvements' required. I was in Atlanta during the ramp up to and during the 96 games. What a nightmare! Keep the games - who cares!

Rick Price, McDonough, GA/USA

I find it interesting to note, that Rocky, who proudly claims his Chinese background, is in the time wasting "Western" city of Toronto.
I would seriously like to know why those that enjoy berating the West, find it so important to study in the West...Is it to know your enemy?

Mike, Madiaon, USA, AL

Some of the arrogant and ill informed views coming from contributors in China are fine for internal consumption but do not hold up to any scrutiny in the West.
Go back to your books and check your facts about recent history 1: Tibet, was invaded by the Chinese in 1949
2: Quebec held a referendum twice once in 1980 and again in 1992 each time the people of Quebec voted against separation from Canada 3: Japanese atrocities were also visited on thousands of British soldiers who were captured during the 2nd world war and perished in work camps 4: Iraq, the USA and it's Allies intend to leave Iraq. Not so the Chinese in Tibet. Chinese people are regularly jailed for complaining about having their land stolen from them by speculators and corrupt Govt. officials in order to build sub le Corbusier souless concrete blocks of apartments admired in the '30s today resembling an outdated form of architecture abandoned since the 1970s. Please come back with some more cogent and logical discourse

Crawford , london,

I find it interesting that every comment on this thread so far coming from within China all reflect the same position of unanimous support for the Chinese government and a denunciation of all protesters.

3 of the 10 or so comments so far from China feature some variation of the phrase "The Chinese people are all on the side of the Chinese Government against any hostility towards the Beijing Olympics."

This wouldn't be a mere recitation of an official slogan of the Chinese government, would it?

I find it nothing short of amazing that a country of 1.3 billion people have all independently arrived at the same conclusions regarding the official policy of their government.

Pat, Santa Cruz, CA

I apologize. It was probably not two posts above me that made the comment to which I was replying to.

Andrew, West Orange, NJ

I must say that the comments from contributors such as Justin, Sheyang China, Corinne, Berlin and someone is the dubious location of Dublin, China! seems to bear the hand of Chinese Govt apparatchiks.
One thing you need to learn..we are too politically sophisticated in the West to be fooled by your heavy handed mind control and party propaganda......Could these contributors be the Chinese men in blue seen on our streets in London and Paris?????

Crawford , london,

I find it deeply gratifying to see the Chinese government publicly criticised. The insular regime controls information at home and suppresses dissent. Many do not even know about Tiennaman Square.

As for these Chinese posters, you all sound like government propagandists. Perhaps you are ...

John D., Los Angeles,

WQhen are the chinese thugs running beside the torch going to be charged with a public order offence ?
Why do I have to read about how wonderful china is from a ludicrous group of apologists who can't understand that the tibetans don't want the murderous chinese communists to destroy their way of life ?
For the Chinese in the US and U K who keep telling us its so wonderful there - Why don't you just go back there if its so good - how come your in our Countries telling us how wonderful your politicians are? Don't you people remember Tianman Square. At least Gordon Brown hasn't killed anyone in Trafalgar Square - Yet!

Richard, Kiev, Ukraine

To stop the Olympics, any part of it, would be a total insult and disaster.

China is at 1.3 billion people. Even if 13 million people are dissidents, that is still 1% of China's populace. Everyone is saying China needs to clean its act up? What about USA's 17 million people below poverty level, 1 out of 100 adults a current jail cellmate, over 1 million US Citizens dying each year from murder, driving while intoxicated, etc etc.

People should not throw stones for fear of it hitting their own glass house. The situation going on with Tibet is centuries old. The mentality of the Chinese is beyond socialism/communism. They are honor bound people with a rich history going on now in its 5th millienium. Is it tragic that loss of life occur. Of course. Are there despots in China? Of course.

But should we punish the international community, the atheletes that have poured blood,sweat,tears over this event? No. It would be wrong on so many levels and facets.

Erik M, Virginia Beach, USA

Why is it alright to fight and hurt people that is fighting and hurting other people!! It doesn't make since to me! Both groups are wrong in the way that this being handled. It's wrong what China is doing but is this way to solve the problem any better? this is suppose to help countries get along not start a 3 rd world war. Come on people grow up!!

Marge Allen, worland, wy. usa

Liberals are always stirring up problems. If Tibet doesn't want Chinese rule then they should commence war with China. We should stay out of other countries business (hint: Iraq).

Dave J, Evansville, IN, US

China was given the Olympics because it was politically correct. Now we are all reaping what the liberal mindset has sown. Chinese thugs are doing their dirty work in London. Big surprise...does anyone remember the tanks rolling over unarmed civilians in Tiananmen Square? Rewarding evil has never worked and never will.

davenjan, Cottonwood, CA USA

I have decided to stop eating Chinese takeaway in protest at the continued abuse of human rights in China. Last year, 732 were imprisoned for voicing their opinions in China. Countless of others are being 're-educated'.

The support of the Chinese for their government as witnessed on this site either suggests that the government is getting party members to post comments or the complete lack of access regular Chinese citizens have to trust worthy news sources.

Tim O'Toole, LOndon,

The Chinese see their living standards DOUBLE every 6 or 7 years, for the entire last 30 years. Where else on earth was there a government as concerned about the welfare of her people? The riots in Tibet are unfortunate, but as in any responsible society, violent unrest has to be put down. No radical minority can have their say through violence. China did make a huge mistake by funding the monasteries all these years, and allowing male children as young as 4 or 5 to "join" as "monks" - we now have seen how it did not work with Madrassas, and we now have seen how it did not work with Geluk sect of teachings, as demonstrated by the looting, burning and killings in Tibet. The same regulations prohibiting minors from joining Madrassas on a live in basis should be extended to all religions. Going to Sunday school with your parents is one thing. Subjecting unformed young minds to fundamentalist religious indoctrination of any kind would be child abuse.

Tongluren, Hong Kong, China

"And I don't think anyone denies that aboriginals in many countries were treated poorly, but the difference with Tibet is that it's happening NOW. Chinese officials have the opportunity to show that they can learn from history."

You are right, we should have blasted Tibet back to the Stone ages and plundered its natural resource because of suspected WMDs...oh wait.

Every Government of China had held Tibet to be part of its borders since the 13th century. This including the Imperial China (in 6-7 forms), Nationalist Government and now communist government, Tibet had been part of China for nearly six times Calforina and Hawaii had been part of U.S.

China will not be splintered again into the age of warlords again.

Mike, Boston , MA.

I do agree Mr. Zhen's view. I come from Bejing and am working in Europe for years. I do love my country. those peole who were trying to make trouble for the Olympic will not be welcome to any Chinese people including Tibet.

what they are doing is to break the peace and put black spot on our country's face.

Maybe they dont realize it any way.

Tony, Dublin, China

China should invite the Dalai Lama to speak at the opening ceremony of the Olympic Games in Beijing.

Les, Los Angeles, USA,

"we are all on the side of the Chinese Government"

"You're all individuals!"

"I'm not!"

Please read the Times and the BBC and whatever else you can get your hands on (since you've obviously read what your government has to say already), and then decide for yourself.

M.R., Stockport,

I think it’s ingenious of the Free Tibet organizers to opportune the international torch relay for sending out their world wide message. I hope it continues. I hope national leaders, from all lands of the free and homes of the brave have the courage to permit and even encourage the flames odyssey through their domains; for if any reason, to heighten awareness, among the complacent and ignorant, the appreciation they should have for the freedoms their governments afford them.

The Olympics originated from closely the same area and era as did the genesis of Western thought. Freedom to openly dissent from political powers was martyred by the great philosopher Socrates.

Chad Hobby, Salt Lake City, Utah

The people of China are with the Chinese Government on the subject of the Beijing Olympics. The people not in China think the Chinese Government complaining about the Olympics makes about as much sense as having George W. Bush recite Hamlet's speech. China is strong, but China is arrogant and bullying, and the rest of the world still outnumbers China 3 to 1.

I hope that they take the Olympic torch and throw it off the Golden Gate into San Francisco Bay.

Gregory Baker, Odenton, Maryland, USA

The objective of the modern Olympics was to enable a nation to prove that ‘its citizens’ are superior to the citizens of other nations – today its purpose is to prove that other nation’s politicians are inferior to their own politicians. We were not very successful at the former and we have no chance with the latter!

Brian Christley, Abergele, UK

My fellow Chinese, Please remember the bottom line:
Only we, Chinese, will be responsible to build Xizang a better place, not these westerners, they don't pay for the subsidy and investments from Chinese government to Xizang, Let's continue what we are doing in Xizang, to improve people's living standard.
As for the Olympic game, we are following it's spirits and defending them, so we have nothing to fear about, westerners are insulting the game not us.
So let's calm down and focus more on our paths, take every little thing we can control seriously, do well in jobs and studyings. let westerners to waste their times, we have more important things to do.

Rocky, Toronto,

Can I just say, this bitter humiliation of the Chinese nation by the West (and kid ourselves not, these demonstrations are not for the benefit of Tibet and anti-just-the-Chinese-government, whoever heard of San Fran loving Tibet - ludicrous! Ridiculous!) I was my hands of it.
I refuse to join in this crazy frenzied demonisation of the Chinese nation. Just as we had no right to make up a reason for invading Iraq (how dumb did world leaders have to be to fall for George W Bush's logic?!) we have no right to stand around, after the opium wars, being all friendly and colluding with the Japanese with pretending nothing happened in the war in China, and so on... and pretend we care about Tibet when most people here just think Tibet is some quaint goat-herding tribe in the mountains.
The whole world must take responsibility for what happens next, after this. I dread to think and I pray China does not go back on its progress after the shambolic display that democracy has put on.

Corinne, Berlin,

cruel and inhuman treatment in Tibet?that is not true.you are all treated.
we are all on the side of the Chinese Government against any hosility towards the Beijing Olympics.

justin, shenyang, China

The cancellation of the welcoming ceremony at the Paris city hall was not Bertrand Delanoë's responsibility. It was done at the request of the Chinese Embassy in Paris after members of the city council floated the Tibetan flag and that of the hancuffed Olympic Rings from the windows of the public building. I imagine they also feared the mayor would mention freedom and human rights in his welcome speech.

Valérie Jouillat, Verzy, France

As a Western person who has done a lot of work in China, I can tell you that many do not understand the Chinese way of thinking. Rather than help the Tibetans, the protests and disruption of the games will have the reverse effect.

In my experience, China has opened up considerably over the last 10 to 15 years. This from positive engagement with the West. While many shout about the low wages, etc., they do not understand that it is ONLY the Western influence of business which has given the people there any hope. It is the countries of the West buying goods from China and thereby giving the people the economic fuel to expand and live better that has increased the openness and hope of society.

Same on Tibet. Rather than opening the Chinese to consider a better situation for Tibet, it will close their mind to it.

Let's keep politics out of the Olympics. We have enough already.

MikeC, Santa Barbara, USA

I am Chinese. I am proud of the fact that China was awarded the 2008 Olympics. I also believe that China should not host future Olympics. Why put up with the hassle of int'l criticisms and distain when China and her people have made so much sacrifices? Politicising the Olympics is akin to inviting guests to one's home for supper only to have the guests complain everything about the host, in front of the host. Why deal with unruly guests?

China is unfairly singled out because of her recent economic success and her perceived threat to Western status quo. China has over 5000 years of history. Do you really think that rowdy behaviors over a glorified cigarette lighter is really going to make an iota of difference? Do be naive.

If bleeding heart liberals/govts want to talk about Tibet, let's also include the failed and unjust war in Iraq, half a century of unjust US-Israeli policies in Palestine, and the blind eye turned to Japanese war atrocities.

Li, Hong Kong,

Tian, most of the people in Canada don't want Quebec to separate from the country, that is true. But most of the people in Quebec didn't want to separate from Canada, either. They voted on it. They had the right.

And I don't think anyone denies that aboriginals in many countries were treated poorly, but the difference with Tibet is that it's happening NOW. Chinese officials have the opportunity to show that they can learn from history.

John, Toronto, Canada

The west may have spoken loudly and brashly on the torch. But at least the protesters weren't shot or run over by tanks. Who is China to tell us about 'moral authority'?

Roger , Kearney, Nebraska United States

western media only focus on what the Chinese polices may do to tibentians but the videoes they gave are all shoted from india and nepel. there is no evidience that chinese police fiercely beat doen the tibitian. and also they did never talk about what tibitian did to han ethnic. the tibitian murdered and burnt han ethni cruelly. i believe there are no countries in the world can torlerate the caos and murders on their soil.
shouldn't we comment and obvious things from its both sides?!

Zheng, London,

I find it ironic that so many Chinese nationalists are urging me to make up my own mind when the CCP has a stranglehold over the information they have access to. When people don't know about one of the most important episodes of the last 50 years (Tiananmen Square) that happened in their back yard.

Indeed, the US and other western nations have done awful things; for that I am ashamed and outraged. That does not give China the right to do the same.

AJ, Charlotte, North Carolina, US

China can't get out of this by saying a lot of countries have done bad things in the past.

Guess what ? A lot of countries have done things in the past. However a lot of countries are moving on. There is peace in Northern Ireland, Scotland can vote for its own parliament, Australia has formally apologised for its wrongs towards aboriginees, Maoris hold significant position in New Zealand.

The big difference with China is that in 2008 the abuses are still going on. This is not about being the poor relations. This is about state sponsored murder, forced sterilisations and the like. It is is not just about Tibet. It is about ordinary Chinese thrown in jail for 5 years for organising a petition. It is about Tiananamen Square in 1989 for which no apology has been given. And last but definitely not least let us not forget Mao's 70 million dead. There has been no break with history in the manner of Nazi Germany or indeed Stalin's USSR.

The PRC is still the same !

Luis, London, UK

I am Chinese, I just find some of these comments here are really funny, some of you describe China as a hell, no human rights, no free religious practices, no free media access, no ... and you said people in China are being repressed... Really amused me, because right now I am at home reading Timesonline and downloading BBC radio programmes, and later maybe watching CNN broadcasting, I will sure you I am not being repressed at all :-). Oh, you can practice all kinds of religious you like, I have been given two Bibles to read by friends, we have churches here too besides temples, but I am non-religious because I hated to be preached to do anything.

BTW, I also have been living in Europe for many years, I don't feel China is any worse than you are.

Oh, could you please stop the war? Give us some break, would you?

Zhen, Fujian, China

If even the IOC - which exists as much to fly its own members first-class around the world as much as to promote its deficit-inducing two-week 'public' spectacles - is taking note of the Tibet protesters, China might want to think about doing the same.

As for those who cry sanctimonious about the mystical powers of sporting competitions, surely the right of a people to maintain their culture and attain basic human rights is a more pressing issue than who can run a little faster or throw a ball a little further than someone else.

robert Barron, vancouver, bC, CANADA

I find most protesters these days over Tibet truly hypocritical, ignorant of history, and reeks of double standards. For the Caucasian readers - how many of you truly reflect on your own country's behavior in the not-too-recent past. For the Americans, where are the native aboriginals today (the ones called Red Indians, Redskins, or whatever other names you imposed?) The ones who are left have to live on the worst patches called reservations, living on Bingo games, dignity destroyed, wrecked by alcoholism, substance abuse, broken families. Let's not mince words, it was, still is, human and cultural genocide. And the Australians with their aborigines, the New Zealanders with the Maoris, how about the English with the Scots, with the Irish? Why is Northern Ireland not part of Eire? Why does Spain not give independence to the Basques? Why does most of English Canada oppose Quebec independence? It was not that long ago the French army was still torturing Algerians. It was not that long

tian, beijing, China

Another example shows the strong western media bais. Western media said there were violent protests in London and Paris, whereas they said the protests in Tibet last month were peacful demonstartion even though the protestors in Tibet armed with axes & set fires against shops which burnt inncocents alive to death.

Leung, Hong Kong, China

The IOC should never have given China the Olyimpic games.
As the olympics are symbole of sport and human rights why give them to a country that does anything but.

Chris, Geneva, Switzerland

if it's an olympic torch and not a chinese torch why was it being gaurded by the blue tracksuited chinese heavy mob!

keith, chester,

The torch carried by Phidippides from Marathon to Athens and on to Sparta was to ask the Spartans for help in the war against the Persians thus politicising the torch from the outset. As soon as Gordon Brown stood in front of the Olympic torch from behind closed metal gates the matter became political. The IOC assertion is but a fig leaf to mask self interest at the expense of the Tibetan people.

Crawford Austin, london,

good, scrap it, it was rubbish anyway.

james guthrie, melbourne,

If you care about human rights it's very plain that the Olympics in China must be boycotted. Also, the money saved buying China imports is money that's being used to help fund the Chineese army and police who are the arm of injustice in China. There's a direct link between US trade policy, the American consumer and human rights violations in China, Tibet and Myanmar (Burma).

Ken Wells, Spokane, WA

I will not be watching the Olympic games out of Bejing. I will be protesting, I will not support the sponsors of the games i.e. the advertisers on tv at the games, I will be telling them that I will not buy their products.

tim, Meriden,, US

Really doubt the government-in-exile has so much money to pay for the "protesters".

Charlie, Milton Keynes,

I don't know about scrap the Olympics but they need to be looked at in the context of the way that sport has evolved and changed since Berlin. They do not represent wide participation sports (Pentathlon and Handball?) and have become a circus with little to be proud of. It is time for a complete review of their position and relevance, particularly the gravy train that the IOC has become.

Ken Wood, FLEET, HAMPSHIRE, UK

We Chinese people are all on the side of the Chinese Government against any hosility towards the Beijing Olympics.

justin, shenyang, China

Anyone who knows the inner-workings of international sport will appreciate the extent to which greed and self-interest motivates most of the stakeholders. From the committee members riding the gravy-train, to the corporate-sponsors seizing athletic achievement, to the host-nation politicians furthering their agendas, it beggars belief that the Olympic organisers claim any moral high-ground. That the Torch is now an emblem of the chasm between the real winners and losers, can only be good.

Simon, Hertfordshire, Herts

The Chinese people are wonderful!!! It is only the one-party communist chinese government who is 100% at fault for the hostility the world feels for them, they are the ones to blame for the good people of a united world for protesting the terrible human rights violations against their own people and those of Tibet. It is a sad attempt at a spin job the chinese govenment is trying to weave in implying the rest if the world is somehow wrong to expose them.
The IOC should not mock the world for showing it's heart felt feelings, as these actions demonstate the world believes in the same things the Olympics respesent, Freedom, Love, Respect, but instead of basking in the glow of this exposure, the IOC is now spinning it's shame for a bad decison to host the Olympics in Bejing.

Allan, Toronto, Canada

China has a very poor Human Rights record. As in India, Christians in China also face lot of problems. Just giving Bibles to the people attending the Olympics can never be the solution. There is no freedom of speech and religion in China. So the difficulties and torture the Tibetans are enduring can be imagined. This is the right time for them to protest. World has to support them in this cause for a free and democratic nation.

Joby, Bangalore, India

Reading the comments of some readers from Beijing and Shanghai, obviously Chinese, it seems that some Chinese are quite supportive of their governments policies and oblivious to the fact that they are being repressed.

jan, kent, uk

@Yorke: Do you think people have the power to stand in the UN? Well no! And one of the only time we see people opinions is during these public events.

Barkilphedro, Butry, France

The torch relay must end. Allowing the Chinese to parade the torch through Tibet would be an obscenity that flies in the face of everything the Olympic movement is supposed to stand for. Can't the IOC see that the Olympics are being used as a proaganda tool to legitimise a muderous repressive regime.

IOC stop this torch relay farce now before you and your movement lose all credibility. Either that or watch the Olympics die.

John, Birmingham,

Billy,

So your saying those athletes that celebrate poor human rights should attend?

think you need to read up more on this and concentrate on your own issues like murdering whales and telling the world its for research, YEAH RIGHT.

Steve Wood, london, uk

Tibet is not a liberal issue! I consider myself to be conservative and am outraged to see the cultural genocide of a very special and unique place called Tibet. Perhaps this is one issue that liberals and conservatives can agree on and work together for a free Tibet. Tibet is no more a part of China than Quebec is a part of the United States! Just because you border a country doesn't mean you can take it over and annex it because they have something that you want. By the way, even though I am conservative, I think Bush has been the most disastrous president in my lifetime!

John Young, Richmond, Virginia, USA

San Fransisco? Of all places. What do think is going to happen in San Fransisco? They protest everything from God to the Boy Scouts out on the Left Coast.

Steve, dalton, ga

If any of the torch bearers had the conviction to stand up to the Chinese, they'd wait for the opportunity in San Fran and throw the torch as far into the bay as possible.

Mike, orlando,

Jiang Yu, the Foreign Ministry spokeswoman: "If someone takes this as opportunity to threaten China, this is totally wrong, and anyone who uses the Olympics for political means will only tarnish their own image."

And the Chinese would NEVER use the Olympics for political means....

Jim, Costa Mesa, CA

Boycott China!! Boycott the Chinese Olympics!! Free Tibet!! Long Live the Dalai Llama!!

Li, San Francisco,

The IOC brought politics into sport by awarding the Games to the country with the worst human rights record.

China has (and will) exploited the Olympics for pollitical (and commercial) gain.

The torch has little to do with sport. It is a marketing' event'.

Steve, Cambridge,

how dare they?
shame on these protesters!
I am very sorry for media distortion in western world about Tibet issue,pls find truth by you own eyes.
China is still a developing country with many unsolved problems,but Tibet is definitely a part of China !
China does have many human right issues and still try to find better ways to deal with it,but that's the protesters who are humilating so called human rights!
One world, one dream!

colleen, zhoushan, china

when you all talk about the Human Rights Record of China, do you really know China? don't discuss anything before you understand it and rush to make a judgement!

jessie, shanghai,

Fairtrade Olympics anyone?

Andrew, Newcastle upon Tyne,

I totally agree with Shekhar Malode's comment...

prashanth K., Sangli,

Please, scrap the Olympics altogether. (I couldn't care less about Tibet)

Alan, Edinburgh,

I must debate a previous comment. To say "China is not a perfect place" and to add "the majority of Chinese people are really enjoying the benefits of the reform policy taken by the Government", constructs a false picture. If we can only question those that are perfect then we are not allowed to question anyone. Plus, just cause others do something, is it therefore justified? And, even if the majority of Chinese are benefiting(which I doubt), that doesn't justify the imprisonment, oppression, and even killing of minorities such as the Tibetans.

Ron, Los Angeles, USA

The only violence I see from images after images is the police and 'flame attendents'

Also, these protest would not have been seen if the events were not presented as a chinese propaganda tour. It should have been presented as an international community celebration minus the red flags and chinese thugs.

Dee Breen, London, UK

If China had a halfway decent human rights record, it is clear there would be no issue. The onus is on them to clean their ship. Well done to those who are exposing China's hypocrisy to the world. This should only be the first step: boycotts of the games should be the next step by those who are willing to "put their money where their mouths are", with respect to human rights.

Teper Blundell, Randburg, South Africa

For IOC members to claim they are "sad" or "disappointed" is to make a mockery of world opinion. One aim of the Olympics has always been to unite peoples from around the world. The Chinese attack on Tibet is flouting a key aspect of the Olympic spirit. The IOC could relatively easily rearrange the whole circus to take place in e.g. Greece and not let Chinese athletes take part. Perhaps the Chinese Government would then begin to see that it is not almighty.

Alan Halls, Solingen, Germany

Perhaps the IOC should substitute Harare and Dafur as alternative places that the torch may visit.

Chris, Ashford, Middx, UK

They gave the Olympics to a Communist Dictatorship and they are surprised that their victims around the aorld are taking this opportunity to protest.

What a breathtaking failure of judgment.

One has to ask again, "why?". Why reward bad behavior? Did anyone really expect the Chinese to suddenly become respectful of Human Rights? Of course not. So then what was on the mind of the IOC?

Ed in CT, Woodbury, CT

It is truly disappointing that because of a few countries who allow violent protestors to habit that the IOC is considering of scrapping a more than 70-year old tradition.

People ought to be able to differentiate sports from politics. Shame on the protestors who put the Torch Bearers' safety at risk!!!

Mike, Sydney, Australia

Today it is impossible to disconnect sport and politics. Sport spirit is based on human rights first. The big first mistake was to allow China as organizer, (not its people at large : the information chinese people receive is ALSO under boycott...) to allow its repressive and freedom communist killers to take advantage of Olympics. All freemen will boycott these games. We should have exerted boycott against 1936 games, and don't allow Hitler to show the 'German Power ' at this time, same we should not allow to allow China to show it. Don't wait until too late. BOYCOTT ! All of us boycott also "Made in China" products. (China is stealing your jobs also)...

Xima, Marseille, France

I suppose nothing is ultimatly beyond politics. The olympic organisers talk of ideals, and yet embrace the obcene commercialism of their movement; and lets face it, it is obcene! think of what we could all do with that money in real terms Mr Livingstone included, glad I am not a London tax payer!.
The IOC are responsible for their own actions I fear, oh, and lets atually free Tibet while were at it.

Alan Noorkoiv, Coventry, Warwickshire

To cancell the torch relay would be a humiliation to the 1.3 billion Chinese people. It is simply not fair.
It is true that China is not a perfect place, as nowhere in the world is really perfect. However, the majority of Chinese people are really enjoying the benefits of the reform policy taken by the Government since 1978.
There is no doubt that China will become better and better. To harrass the torch relay will not help China foward in any sense. I would say that the majority Chinese people are on the side of the Chinese Government against any hosility towards the Beijing Olympics.

Fu, Beijing, China

It is all politics. There is an undercurrent of hostile comment with respect to China as if Darfur were somehow *their* fault, Burma were somehow *their* fault, &c. Not that the former colonial power, let alone the local populace, bears any responsibility.

So we come to liberty, democracy, religious freedom and human rights in Tibet.

Well, it is true that under the Lamas, the Lamas had the liberty to do much what they wanted; the bulk of the people, however, were slaves. Under the Lamas, democracy was an unknown concept. Under the Lamas, there was, to be sure, religious power, religious privilege, religious wealth, indeed absolute religious rule. But religious freedom? Not a chance. Human rights? Under the Lamas life expectancy was 35 ish, now 65 ish. Explain again what you mean by 'human rights'.

The protests are utter humbug. That having been said, the Olympics, anywhere, including Montreal and Vancouver, were or will be a complete waste.

Cheers,
dba

Brian Allardice, Vancouver, Canada

It's NOT the Chinese Torch?? What about the Chinese bodyguard escorting it everywhere then...
And Mr Rogge was deeply saddened by the protests...and not by the Chinese acts causing the protests?
The IOC do not put forward a good argument for a peaceful torch route. This is exactly what is needed, the Games should not be boycotted, but the extent to which the torch is nicely highlighting the concerns over China are ideal.
And am I right in thinking in the Olympic Charter that the Olympics are designed to promote a fair and just society. Protests over China's Human Rights record is wholly justified.

Damien Turner, Dorchester, England

I would like to agree with Lord Coe, one of the organisers of the London Olympics, who stated that the Chinese protectors of the torch where nothing but paid thugs - when are they going to be charged for assaulting protesters?

Paul Singh, London, UK

shame on these protesters! these people hijack Olympics to fulfil their purpose. if you belive you're legitimate enough, go to the united nations in diplomacy way.

yorke, shanghai,

The reason that the torch relay has become such a longwinded affair is purely down to commercial reasons.

Samsung and Coca Cola the Olympic partners who have, since 2000, had the right to sponsor the torch relay, obviously want the torch to go to as many places as possible.

The Olympics is something of an anomaly in sports marketing, as no commercial branding is allowed to feature at the events themselves, so sponsors don't get the value out of their logos being on TV for hours on end, and therefore need to squeeze value out of other side-events and promotions around the Olympics itself. One of the easiest ways to generate a lot of PR and to build a strong association with the Olympics is through the torch relay. So the IOC will have sold this right for a lot of cash (and will prob have to give that cash back to Samsung if they cancel)

So far Samsung seems to have done a brilliant job of staying out of the controversy.

sam H, Hong Kong,

PR Disaster

How can China turn an Olympian PR disastere into a publicity triumph?

How can China become a loved and respected member of the world community?

How can China shake off its growing image of Evil Empire?

Answer: Free Tibet.

joe, Berwichshire, Scotland

The Olympics should never have been awarded to China with their poor Human Rights record. This has not improved, in fact it has become a lot worst while China have prepared for the Games.

If the govermants of participating countries do not advise their own sportsmen to boycott the games it should be up to the common people to ensure that they do not pass without some protest against the cruel and inhuman treatment that is currently going on in Tibet & China.

I personally will not be watching the Games at all this year - not much of a protest but if everyone felt the same way it would hit them where it hurts most - commercially.

Hilton, Manchester, UUnited Kingdom

Athletes supporting democracy and freedeom should drop out from participating in the china olympics.

Billy, Tokyo, Japan

It's getting to the point that anything big anyone tries to organise or do seems to encourage these protesting types to come out. Soon, no-one will do anything for fear of another violent protest from rent-a mob.
Protest by all means, but don't get so agressive with it.

Mags, Nr Oxford, UK

The way things are shaping up in the path of this Olympic torch, same clouds can gather over Olympics,too!

Shekhar, Pune, Mahrashtra/ India

For the IOC to Say it is not the Chinese Torch but an Olympic Torch contradicts the IOC calling the games the "CHINESE Olympic Games" don't you think.. Either way, it was a huge mistake giving the Chinese the opportunity to host the games in the first place.
Really , Honeslty, Truly, since when did the Chinese have a good Human rights Record anyway, and were the IOC so stupid to think that China would suddenly resolve these Issues by 2008, I think not, and FInally " TIBET IS NOT MADE IN CHINA"

Joe Akram, Sydney, NSW

Saying that it is an IOC torch, not a Chinese torch is a flimsy defence as they gave the Olympics to China. What makes me angry is the fact that they were given the Olympics on the proviso that they improve their human rights records which they have not even attempted to pretend to do. It is China that has made a mockery of the Olympics.

Rob, Singapore,

How about having the torch runs without any Chinese presence at all?

No one to protest against.

clivex, Brussels,

Just scrap the Olympics altogether if this is how badly the IOC are going to manage things!

Matt, Napoli, Italy

Owners of chinese restaurants outside China are far more supportive of their flag than the continental Chinese disappointed by their government.

Chen, Paris, France