Michael Evans, Bucharest
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The former Yugoslav republic of Macedonia walked out the Nato summit in Bucharest today after Greece blocked accession talks because of its name.
“We are here today to announce that we are leaving the summit. We feel necessary to be with our people today,” Antonio Milososki, Foreign Minister, told reporters.
The former Yugoslav republic had been told by Nato that it met the strict criteria laid down for membership, which include civilian control of its armed forces, social reforms and appropriate defence spending.
But the Greeks objected to it using the name Macedonia because it is the same as Alexander the Great's birthplace, the northernmost province of Greece. No compromise could be found to assuage Greece in its determination to veto the country membership of Nato.
Speaking to The Times, Nikola Dimitrov, security adviser to the Macedonian Prime Minister, said: "We are not being punished because we have failed to meet the standards demanded by Nato for membership of the alliance, we are being punished because of who we are and because we're Macedonians."
Mr Dimitrov said the compromise name of Republic of Macedonia (Skopje) had been offered, but Greece would have none of it. "The disappointment is huge," Mr Dimitrov said.
He gave warning that the failure of his country to join the alliance would encourage the radical elements in the Balkans and undermine the stability that had been achieved after years of civil war. "There's no sustainable stabilisation for the Balkans unless Macedonia is a member. We thought we had turned the page, now we're afraid that it will also affect our hopes of joining the European Union," Mr Dimitrov said.
The country joined the United Nations in 1993 under the provisional name Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) pending resolution of its name dispute with Greece.
Mr Dimitrov accused Greece of breaching a bilateral agreement that Athens would not block the country's entry into political and economic organisations if it used the name FYROM.
"We have troops serving with Nato forces in Afghanistan, fighting for freedom, but now our own freedom is being threatened," he said.
"Greece wants us to change our name and our constitution and even our language. They want us to stop using Macedonian as an adjective, it's a hell of a position," he said.
Jaap de Hoop Scheffer, Nato Secretary-General, admitted it was a disappointment for FYROM but said negotiations would continue to try and resolve the dilemma as quickly as possible.
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The Greek propaganda machine prior to the NATO summit in Bucharest paid for a worldwide media campaign trying to âexplainâ its position by asking: What is in a name? Macedonia doesnât have much money for media campaigns but obviously feels strongly about changing its name because the name Macedonia is intrinsically linked to the identity of the Macedonian nation which speaks the Macedonian language. This is why despite decades of pressure from Greece in the form of international lobbying and countless campaigns, Macedonia has stood by its name. The name of our country defines what we Macedonians are and oneâs identity cannot be a matter for negotiations.
The West still retains a romantic view of Greece as the cradle of democracy. Whilst it finds Greece âs insistence on pursuing a nationalist agenda irritating, it seems unable to speak to the fact that Greece âs decision to block Macedonia âs accession to NATO and surely the EU in future is not a viable political option for Greece .
Bonna, London, UK
We (the greeks) want a clear delimitation of what is their and what is ours. Everybody needs to understand that Macedonia today is not a unique entity in cultural and enthic terms (as the people in FYROM think). There is FYROM that wants to call itself like that and there is Greek province macedonia). There are two kinds of macedonians (slav and greek-macedonians).
We want this reality reflected in FYROM's name in order to avoid future misunderstandings and tensions.
We are not saying they should change their name. All we are suggesting is the addition of a term such as "North" or "Upper", or "New" into their name that clearly implies the presence of another macedonia (the greek one).
This would be fare towards both sides and will provide the foundations for a strong and stable relationship between our 2 countries.
I realise however that people may perceive this problem as "stupid", however to both Greece and FYROM this is a serious issue.
Thanos, Greece
Thanos, Athens, Greece
I think Greeks are over-exaggerating here. Tiny Macedonia who tried to evade all evils during the last 17 years and to stay at peace inside and outside has pretensions over a region in Greece called Macedonia! This is the greatest joke of the day! I think the French have every right to kick Great Britain out because their name is derived from a French region, so maybe one day the Britons (nice adjective) will try to conquer it! This is a great absurd... but very similar to what the Greeks are saying. Let the Balkans try to be peaceful after long years of war and bloodshed and disputes and let Macedonia continue to be!
And claims such as present Macedonians have nothing to do with Alexander the Great are ridiculous as well. Macedonians of today are a mixture of Slavs who came in the 7th century AD and the indigenous Macedonians. Alexander the Great was not allowed to take part in the Olympics because he was a Barbarian - a word that the Greeks applied to everything foreign!
Mary, Birmingham, UK
There s Macedonia city in Ohio USA ! There are many Athens cities around the world ! Greece never raised a name issue because none of them claimed territorial rights.People of FYROM have every right to call themselves Macedonians but they have to recognise that Greek people called themselves that way 2000 years ago.There would be no problem if we define ourselves as Greek and Slavs Macedonians and declare respect to each others sovereignty.Too bad 30 years ago we considered our selves brothers!
Konstantinos, Athens,
Dear Brett, Salt Lake City, USA, what is STUPID is the the Americans that have about 300 years history as the "USA", arte trying to teach the world, HISTORY! You are like the people in FYROM. They have not got an identity and they trying to steal the greek one. Just like the Americans that they have no HISTORy and they trying to create some! PLEASE! YALE should at LEAST REVOKE Mr G W BUsh's HISTORY degree! In any case they always at least confirmed that he was an "average" student (they really meant bad student)
Alexandros, London, UK
No Elena, it is obvious what YOU are trying to do. You are stealing their history, you are stealing the name of their region and in a few years you will claim the province of Northern Greece, the original Macedonia. Your horrible actions, to insult the greek flag in such a manner, tells it all.
The Greeks are very right and I think we should all consider how we would feel if we were in their place, before judging them.
Carolina, Firenze,
"Macedonian" is a greek word meening "higlander".
Claiming the macedonian one is different to the greek language challenges common sense.
"Phil-ip" is as greek as "Phil-anthropy", "Phil-o-sophy", "Phil-alethes".
Borders over the centuries change. However, usurping the national culture of one country to fabricate a new national identity is not how an ally is supposed to act.
Efthymis, Athens,
"Macedonian" is a greek word meaning "highlander".
Claiming the macedonian one being different to the greek language challenges common sense.
For example, the word Phil-ip is as greek as the words "Phil-o-sophy", "Phil-alethes", "Phil-anthropy", "Phil-o-logy".
Borders change over the centuries; history should not, in favor of world's prosperity. Usurping the culture of a country to fabricate a new national identity is not how an ally is supposed to act.
Efthymis, Athens,
It was a sad day yesterday, not just for Macedonia and the Macedonian People but for Democracy , freedom of expretion,
Human right's. And it was a happy day for Genocid , Racism and Greece with it's (19 century politic,s example 98% pure Greeks ,2% muslim's and no other minority).
Macedonia and Macedonian I am, for that is my Human right
and it is the 21st. Century.
Alexander, London, UK
The FYROM is a slavic state, that speaks a slavic language and has a slavic culture, they have nothing whatsoever to do with ancient Macedonia and thus they should not be able to imply through their name that they do. They wish to steal Greek land and lay claim to the national Greek cultural heritage. Why should we allow this to happen to the country that gave birth to Western civilization and culture? I am mad about it and I'm not even Greek!
J Roberts, Manchester, UK
I think Greece should not push so hard for name change on the part of the republic of Macedonia. This problem is not special for Greece, if it is a problem. We understand that countries are not divided on single-nation and single-geographical name criteria. There are examples for this like the Republic of Azerbaijan with 8 million population while a very big region in Iran exactly neighbouring the Republic of Azerbaijan (historically they were one) has the same historical name but with a population more than 30 million Azeries. Of course, Iran did not like the name of Azerbaijan at first and they tried names like Aran which is the name of a small place in Azerbaijan. Iran did not push as hard as Greece, maybe they knew they couldn't do much.
ebrahim khodadoost, Ardebil , Iran
We are not related to the northern Greeks who produced leaders like Philip and Alexander the Great. We are a Slav people and our language is closely related to Bulgarian. (FYROM's Ambassador to Canada, Gyordan Veselinov in an interview with the Ottawa Citizen, 24 February 1999)
We are Slavs who came to this area in the sixth century... we are not descendants of the ancient Macedonians. (FYROM'S President Mr. Kiro Gligorov, Foreign Information Service Daily Report, Eastern Europe, February 26, 1992, p. 35.)
We do not claim to be descendants of Alexander the Great. We are Slavs and we speak a Slav language. (FYROM'S Ambassador in Washington, Mrs. Ljubica Acevshka, 22 January 1999)
We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians. That's who we are! We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his Macedonia. Our ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century A.D. (Kiro Gligorov - Toronto Star - 15/03/1992)
Digenis Akritas, Ludwigshafen, Germany
I see some do not understand this problem. It is more than just nomenclature. It is in fact a ultra nationalist movement from Skopje which has made allegations to reuniting with their "homeland", which in the case is a large part of northern Greece! This northern part of Greece called Macedonia has been Hellenic since pre-history. FYROM speaks about destabilizing the region when Greece vetoes their addition into NATO and EU. Is it not a destabilizing force when a neighbor country aspires to a large part of your territory? How would we as Americans feel if the Quebec and Canada wish to re annex old territorial claims in New England. Would we not wish for the Canadians to stop such rhetoric before engaging in future agreements and treaties. That is what the Greeks wish for. FYROM's abandonment of territorial claims to the Greek province of Macedonia. Only then can the region remain stable.
g, ny,
Yes, shame on Greece for messing with a smaller, weaker neighbor. I mean an equivalent to this would be something like the USA messing with a small, helpless neighbor like Cuba. Wait a minuteâ¦.
Chris, London,
This is the 21st Century!
This is all exceedingly childish behaviour on the part of the Greeks.
In a similar vein I dont see why we cant refer to the FTROG (Former Turkish Republic of Greece) or similarly FBROG (Former Byzantine Republic of Greece) how about FRROG (Former Roman Republic of Greece)
Being a conquered country by so many other countries kind of makes it all rather moot.
Simple question. Are parts of the Country of Macedonia, lands that were once part of the old Macedonian Kingdom?
Seeing how Phillip of Macedon founded many cities in the country, the answer is Yes!
The ethnicity of the current residents of that area are immaterial because of the mass migrations of people in the whole of Eastern Europe really jumbles them all up.
Glaston, Yeovil,
While one can say âtiny Macedonia poses no threat whatsoever to Greece,â the authorities in the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, or Fyrom, portray Greek Macedonia as âoccupiedâ territory, refusing to remove such claims from textbooks, speeches, articles, documents and maps of âGreater Macedonia,â which includes parts of northern Greece.
Such irredentism and hostile propaganda are more befitting to 19th-century policies than 21st-century NATO membership.
One hundred fifteen members of the United States House of Representatives co-sponsored H.R. 356, asking Fyrom to âstop hostile activities and propaganda against Greece.â Senators Robert Menendez, Barack Obama and Olympia Snowe introduced a similar resolution in the Senate.
Nikolaos Seiji Morihashi, Osaka, Japan
This is all very nice, but don't you think that Greece's views should be given a fair chance of being heard as well?
The dispute with FYROM is not just about the name; it's about a name that carries territorial claims with it. Unless these calims are repudiated by FYROM through a change of name, there is little sense in making an "ally" who is threatening your borders. How would US feel if Mexico, for instance, decided to call itself Republic of Texas and alluded that the State of Texas should be "liberated" ?
There are always two sides to a quarrel and I think your readers should be better served if all views were presented equally.
George Liakopoulos, Athens, Greece (Hellas)
This is quite possibly the stupidest dispute to ever block a country's accession to NATO, and it is ENTIRELY the Greeks' problem.
I mean, come on, do they seriously think that since Macedonia is using "Macedonia" as a name, that means that want the Greek province Macedonia?
Brett, Salt Lake City, USA
I think that the Greek position is ridiculous. It's just the name of a country. I mean there are parts of America called "New England" and "New York" and nobody complains, and parts of France called "Brittany". Just get over it and stop whinging!
rach, reading,
Greece does not want you to change your language, because speaking in a serbo-bulgarian slavic dialect is the most solid proof that you are not Macedonians; Everybody knows that the ancient Macedonians spoke the Greek language.
You people are Slavs who came in this region of the Balkans during 7th ce. A.D. Trying to steal a part of the Greek history will lead you nowhere.
Nicholas, Athens, Greece
There shouldn't be any negotiations after this because they broke the agreement it is obvious what they are trying to do
Elena, MACEDONIA,