Tony Halpin
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Roots of Georgia-Russia conflict | Putin sends US message
As a Russian jet bombed fields around his village, Djimali Avago, a Georgian farmer, asked me: “Why won’t America and Nato help us? If they won’t help us now, why did we help them in Iraq?”
A similar sense of betrayal coursed through the conversations of many Georgians here yesterday as their troops retreated under shellfire and the Russian Army pressed forward to take full control of South Ossetia.
Smoke rose as Russian artillery fire exploded less than half a mile from the bridge marking South Ossetia’s border with Georgia. A group of Georgian soldiers hastily abandoned their lorry after its wheels were shot out and ran across the border.
Georgian troops looked disheartened as they regrouped around tank lines about 2km from the border. Many said that they had been fighting in Tskhinvali, the capital of South Ossetia, until the early hours when they were suddenly ordered to withdraw from the breakaway region.
“They told us to come out – I don’t know why – but some of our guys are still out there in the fields,” one soldier told The Times. “I want to go back. If we lose South Ossetia now, it won’t be for ever because we will never surrender our land.”
President Saakashvili of Georgia has ordered a complete ceasefire and offered talks to the Russians. Despite this, the sound of gunfire and shelling could be clearly heard along the border zone last night.
Terrified civilians have fled in their thousands, convinced that Russia will not stop at the border but sweep into Georgia. Some fear that the Kremlin is intent on establishing a buffer zone to guard South Ossetia against future incursions.
Gori, normally a bustling city of 50,000 people, is largely deserted after Russian airstrikes at the weekend. Scores of people were abandoning their homes and loading possessions into vehicles or carrying what they could on foot. “There is a lot of panic. Many people have left and I am thinking of joining them. My bags are already packed,” Georgi, a 56-year-old resident of Tirdznisi, said. “We are afraid that the Russians will come here and kill us. People would not go if we had a strong army but they don’t believe in our army any more.”
Iago Jokhadze abandoned his village of Ergneti, close to Tskhinvali, after it was bombed by Russian jets yesterday. Fighting back tears, he said: “I have left everything, I don’t even have another shirt. If the Russians stay, then I can never return. We’re afraid of what the Russians can do.”
Miriyan Gogolashvili, of Tkviav, said: “The Russians will be here tomorrow. They want to show us and the world how powerful they are. Tomorrow it will be Ukraine and nobody in the West is doing anything to stop them. Why were our soldiers in Kosovo and Iraq if we don’t get any help from the West now?” he asked.
The Georgian Government is recalling its 2,000 troops serving in Iraq to confront the threat at home. Many Georgians will be reluctant to send them back after this war ends. Their despair was in sharp contrast to the confidence on the other side. At a base near the border, Russian peacekeepers appeared sure they would soon be joined by comrades from the regular army. “We are operating normally; nobody has disturbed us at all,” said one.
In Tbilisi, the Georgian capital, refugees from the fighting told how Russian helicopters bombed homes in Tshkinvali and neighbouring villages. Some spent days in basements before emerging to discover that their communities had been obliterated. Mzia Sabashvili, who hid for three days, said: “I know that lots of my neighbours are dead. I have no idea who is left.”
The Russians paid little heed to those in their way. A vehicle carrying observers from the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe was shot at by a sniper near Tskhinvali. The bullet cracked the toughened glass of the passenger window, where a British officer had been sitting.
In Gori, where a statue of Stalin, the city’s most famous son, still stands in the main square, relatives scoured lists of the wounded put up outside the main hospital. More than 120 people were admitted yesterday in addition to the 456 treated since fighting erupted on Friday. The chief surgeon said that three civilians, including a pregnant woman, had died of their injuries.
Scores of soldiers milled around on the road outside. One said that they had all been in Tskhinvali but were now preparing to pull out of Gori. “The situation was very bad there but we were ready to stay. Russia is the enemy of the world,” he said.
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After reading russian supporters comments and those against the russian incursion into Georgia I would offer this.
First of all bombing civilian apartments is cowardly and criminal! Secondly the world must not forget who is supplying Iran with the nuclear technology. Russia has only just begun!!
Larry Koen, Yuba City, USA
If say After world war II we got into a war with china and we had whatever was left over to protect us and Britian and France said no after we helped them.We should have stepped in and destroyed the Greatest enemy of democrasy right then and there but we didn't so a billion$ is a good amend for now.
Nick Atherton, Victoria, Texas,
When is this country going to stop with all the hand outs!!!!!It's
making me sick to think of how much of our money the US gives to foriegn aid. How about fixing our own countries problems first! Those countries don't appreciate it anyway. China has our manufacturing jobs, let them help!!!!!
Neal, Tonawanda, United States
Now Bush is taking a billion dollars out of our tax money to give to Georgia? What are we going to get out of this? The alliance of a teeny country against the monster russia? Thanks, but no thanks. I can think of a hundred domestic things that we should spend a billion dollars on instead.
Brenda, Canton MA, USA
Yes of course they protected their own civilians! Nooooo!!!!!! Because these were Georgian citizen but the aggressor Russia gave them Russian Passports and now they want to protect their civillians????? Why didn't they protect their civilians in Tchechenia or during the school ocuupation in Beslan??
Vato, Tbilisi, Georgia
Let Europe defend Europe. Why is it always "America and NATO," meaning "only the USA"? Maybe Europeans should learn to speak Russian because 'chickens are coming home to roost.'
Jill , Cleveland, GA, USA
This shows that the US is not the only country interested in controlling the worlds oil supply
matt, nurmbar, kenya
Everyone Is Against Russia,Look At The Facts Bush Has Soured The World Lets Stop Slagging Each Other Off.
Bush Is Bad For The World Russia Only Defended The People There,The Cowboy In Georgia Got His Fingers Burnt.
Alas There Are Further Dangers To Come,Its Oil Again.
Thomas, Surbiton, uk
One thing which is very funny is the propaganda right now.
RT (Russia Today) and BBC are just as bad. Main stream media is simply not worth listening too.
Russians go out and protest, Yanks do the same. The weapons of today are far too powerful for the children (our so called leaders) to play. Escalation will happen.
Mick, London, UK
Ossetia (North and South) never was a part of Georgia. Ossetia was a part of the USSR.Till 1991.Since 1992 Ossetia consists in crisis with Georgia.Only presence of the Russian peacemakers (contract from1992) provided the world last decades.It is impossible to consider crisis without background.
Irene, Gorky, Russia
US has involved Georgia in war from Ossetias. Now Georgia involves US in war with Russia!
Irene, Gorky, Russia
tickyul, I'm really grateful for the US-intervention during ww2 (without which I would maybe not live in a free democracy today).
But the babysitter-line is not true. Many of your governments have lied to you, their people and souvereign, about what they do in the world. And it is not babysitting.
rob, stuttgart, germany
This is what happens when a democratic society tries to shove democracy down the throat of countries that do not want that life style. So just like the Beetles song...Let It Be.
RickshawRick, Oklahoma City, OK, USA
Bryan, Des Moines, well, if we talk about parallels, then we can compare Georgia-Ossetia witn UK-USA. USA are breakaway province of UK. Would you like if UK will bomb your territory, kill your citizens? Of course not. And why your defend Georgia, which did that?
Oleg, Novosibirsk, Russia
Sorry the US shouldn't get involved over a corrupt war. Georgia shouldn't of made the jump so quickly on the South Ossetia people. Again Russia is not at fault here. They are just trying to put order in place to protect its people.
Branden, Logan, US
The US should defend Georgia from Russia. Russia is trying to go back to it's glory days of being the biggest bully on the European continent. What country are the Russians going to invade next? Long live Georgia!! Boycott everything Russian!!
Donna, Fort Collins, USA
the media is "forgetting" the fact that russian forces entered the ossetia after georgian heavy shelling of civil districts of Tskhinvali which is stopped only after russian tanks pushed them off the positions around the city. Georgian army killed 2000 civilians in less then 24 hours, and its a fact
Vindy, Moscow, Russia
I can't believe people think Russia is the aggressor. The President of Georgia is a criminal. I really hope Russia takes Georgia now, instead of just the one area. West needs to take a breath and stay out of Russia's business. They are getting better and the west is plummeting to socialism.
John Miklyaev, Salem, Oregon, US
Sorry guys,you are on your own on this one.The USA has been the worlds babysitter since the end of ww2 and what has it gotten us except hatred!
tickyul, san diego, USA
Russia - is not a terrorist! The presidend of Georgia has killed russian people in South Osetia! We do not want a war! We want a peace to our people!
Alexander, Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Its Funny that US kills for democracy...When my Brothers in Georgia are dead for democracy...Is my peoples democracy not worth saving? R u just going to watch us be slaves to russian rulls? How long? How many more?
Stay Stong my Georgian Brothers! Heart of Lions.
Besiki Kazaishvili, Torrance, US
Russia withdraw your troops out of the undisputed areas of Georgia and DON'T advance any further. America will not stand by while Russia moves beyond the disputed area towards the capital of Georgia, and then finally taking full control of the government. Unlike the E.U. we aren't SPINELESS! GO USA!
Rodney, Florida, USA
Article above is a total lie. Georgians have killed more than 1500 osetians, more than 30 000 went to Russia as a refugees, including old men and little children. The capital city of Osetia is destroyed by georgians. Why dont you speak about that?
Ayrat, Ufa, Russia
Russia is just giving the West a bloody nose. Let's consider NATO lucky. By the way remember that radar station in Poland. -what will happen to it if those dummies find out about this.
Kingfish, chevy chase, USA
Don't believe The Georgian president!! Georgia attacked first!!! The Georgian army has destroyed Tskhinvali and 10 villages in the first day of war. The Russian army protects the peace population S.Ossetia.Nobody has delivered the humanitarian help Immediately except for Russia.
Olga, Ekaterinburg, Russia
The US doesn't want to enter a conflict with Russia, for a tiny country which doesn't have the strategic imporance worth a possible nuclear exchange. This is something the nationalist Americans in their impotent rage won't be able to figure out. Blame the liberals when you are too powerless to act.
Aby, London, England
I wonder how many "experts" share their opinion here living thousands miles away of Russia and Georgia. What do you know about the Kavkaz regoin? Osetia and Abkhazia never lived as one country with Georgia. And never will be! Russia just stopped a massacre, a genocide of those little nations.
Ayrat, Ufa, Russia
2000 civilians were killed in South Ossetia. Who kill them? Russians? No! Georgians! They destroy Tshinvalli! Thousands of peoples became refugees. Think about it. Russia has not interest in Georgia. Georgia is not necessery for Rusia. No oil, no gaz. Russia wants only protect peoples.
Boris, Moscow, Russia
why some people are saying that russia started all and the victim is georgia? here in my country the news said that georgia has attacked sout ossetia and killed 2000 people then russia had to defent its citizens and force georgia to stop. Now when I read this dont says anything about that!
jacqueline, baja california, mexico
US should not get involved in this conflict. No reason to start WWIII. Why does it always have to be The "ALMIGHTY" US to back countries out of their problems? I say as an American we sit and watched this on the sidelines.
Donnie, Dallas, United States
If America truly is the world's only "superpower," then we have an obligation to be involved in events like this. You can't use that label to justify Iraq and then shirk the duty of defending a democratic, pro-western ally.
Jason Mumma, Milwaukee, USA
people saying georgia in nato is the same as nukes in cuba are insane. nato is basically just a promise of defense, wheras nukes are nukes.
this has happened to eastern europe twice in the past 70 years-are we going to allow a third time or is history just something that happend in the past?
Will, grimsby, UK
Politicians speak ! Army's respond ! People Die !! Why should Russia and the US fight each other? I like the Russian people, but it isn't the Russian people making the decisions, just as in America, no one asks me. This will not end well !
Paul Booher, Charlotte, NC, USA
Why would western powers join Georgia against Russia? Its obvious this would be a bad political move, no?
Paul, Auckland, New Zealand
I don't think anyone can say "why are Great Britain, France, and Germany being so meek and silently standing by asking "what is America going to do about this?"". European Nato is as concerned as anyone that Russia is seizing territory by force.
John Cox, Auckland, New Zealand
To you people saying Georgia was stupid to enter South Ossetia, you don't realize that they did that as retaliation for Russia bombing them. Of course Russia claimed they bombed themselves for a reason to invade.
Samson, Tenn,
The U.S. encouraging Georgia into NATO is on the same level as Russia sending nukes to Cuba. The Georgians need to pull their heads in and realise that they would be speaking
German if Russia were not the dominant power in the region.
andrew, newcastle, stralia
I am an American and I am sick at heart over the fact that once again Russia is going to be permitted to steal the freedom of another Nation while the world stands by. God forgive us ! If we don't help them, no one in Eastern Europe will ever trust us again. And who can blame them.
Paul Booher, Charlotte, NC, USA
Also, South Ossetia was part of Georgia and wanted to break from them. Russia helped them do that for their own gain.
That would be like Texas wanting to be their own country, and Mexico helping them achieve that for their gain.
Samson, Tenn,
Funny how everything comes down to being the fault of the U.S., How is this conflict any different than Iraq invading Kuwait, or Iraq's leader killing thousands of his own people? And because the UN (worthless) NEVER took action against Iraq the US finally did. Why not EU and UN take this conflict?
Anne, San Francisco, USA
Pedro from Viseu (Portugal) sounds extremely reasonable.
Andi, Moscow,
Everyone is criticizing the US - fine, they helped bait Georgia into this mess.
But where is Europe in all this? Why are Great Britain, France, and Germany being so meek and silently standing by asking "what is America going to do about this?"
Europe needs to stand up and protest!
Anthony Cliff, Arles, France
The US Military is airlifting Georgian troops from Iraq as they were recalled to their homeland. Russia is flexing, to be sure.
Humble opinion; NATO and EU influence, and possible nuclear weaponary placement. New oil pipeline to China and reported decreases in oil to Europe? Who is MANIPULATING?
Cindy, Tennessee, USA
Bush is leaving in a few months, and he's a lame duck president. Why can't other countries besides the US take a lead on this? Reason: They usually want all the dirty work handled by the US. Then it's easier to blame the US no matter what happens! Damn if we do and damn if we don't!
Arlene, LA, USA
Didn't dubya win his ticket on the isolationist platform? Withdraw all military to the mainland, or summink.
There's nothing to do on this one though, just let it run it's course.
Putin comes across as a decent sort of chap. Much maligned and misunderstood. I'd buy him a beer.
king , chamonix,
Russians writing on here know very well that Russia's proxy soldiers in South Ossetia provoked the Georgian Army as a pretext for a long planned annexation of South Ossetia and Abkhazia.
Tim, Leeds, England
This was such a stupid, stupid move on Georgia's part. How could they think they could attack an ally of Russia and not get disemboweled?
Even if they are our allies, we should only get involved in so far as immediately ending violence and making sure the displaced populace is clothed and safe.
Alexander Montie, Madison, USA
This is ridiculous. Lives are being lost in Georgia! For what ? A chess game between minnows Georgia and almighty Russia with the self-conscious West wondering what to do? How can we citizens of the world allow this to happen? We are all made of flesh and blood! NO MORE VIOLENCE!
Pedro, Viseu, Portugal
For the mother Russia!
Anyways, Its obvious now that US media is not so unbiased after all. They report what ever suits their government views. Hopefully it is an eye opener for us citizens.
DON"T BELIEVE ANYONE including your president. People lives don't worth anything in this world! Opinions are!
Philip, NY, usa
That was US who made out of third word Soviet state superpower by giving to Stalin genocide regime trillions of dollars of free aid by countless convoys in the 1940s. And moreover by giving to its lovely 'uncle Joe" Stalin whole Central Europe and renamed it "Eastern". So it is Uncle Sam bloody duty to stop their lovely Uncle Joe successors. murderous campaigns around the world.
Krystof, Warszawa, Poland
Europe needs to step up for this. A country such as Germany has much more... reputation they can wager in helping Georgia. Russia is basically baiting the United States, but if someone else opposes them, they're just going to sound silly in their indignation.
Matt Voelckers, Juneau,
An ally of ours has been attacked. One of our friends is being bullied by a big neighbor. Are we just supposed to stand around and do nothing? What if they attacked Finland, Japan... who does russia have to attack for us to care enough to do something?
david B, San Francisco,
Global oil and growth in the medium term is heavily dependent on the 'stans (Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, etc.) The outlet to the west for these countries is essentially through the BTC pipeline across Georgia. Georgia falls, 'stans fall under Russian influence.
Steven Kopits, Princeton, New Jersey, USA
Russia has no interest in Georgia apart from Oil domination and showing how powerful it is. Russia has only one interest and thats itself, on many occasions it has threatened the west and will continue too if it doesnt get its own way. Russia is a real threat to world peace. Dont forget Cyber war.
Richard, Bristol, England
More moves on 'The Grand Chessboard' are achieving the aims of those who attempt to control all of the earth's resources - in this case the pathways of oil and heroin. Putin is an opportunist, as is Bush, they will both fail in the end. They will only succeed in making the planet uninhabitable.
Luis Vazquez, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA
It is wonderful to see such a global forum with so much input from different countries and perspectives. Many of us live in glass houses and shouldn't be throwing stones. Would be better to promote peace than to throw emotions behind nationalistic and political agendas.
David, Kentfield, USA
"Great powers don't commit suicide for their allies."
That's the kind of position Georgia forced us into. We're not interested in a World War over a conflict they started, that's why they're out in the cold.
Troy, Danville, USA
Russia most probably did prepare to what has happened. But it appears to be a smart move now, and not something to blame it for. It Georgians would not attack South Ossetia, there would be no reason for Moscow to fire back. Saakashvili wanted US to get involved from the beginning - that's the worst.
Max, New York, USA
Is Cuba next in line for Russian invasion? Putin expressed interest in renewing Russia-Cuban relationships. After annexing Georgia and the oil pipeline, he will go after oil off Florida shoreline. When will congress wake up to OUR oil reserves? After Putin grabs Cuba?
Lastochka, Fremont, USA
I hope the US and other powers don't rush in and make it worse. As long as everyone is open to talk, there is always hope for peace. I'm sick of having to pray for my friends every time they are shipped overseas.
The US can't get involved in every world conflict. People hate us enough as it is.
Naswipp, Boston, USA
This should not be focused on U.S. and Russia. Georgia pushed the envelop. Georgia supplies oil and gas to Western Europe. Western Europe should admit their need for energy and provide the tactical response. The U.S. gains nothing. China, Russia, and U.S. have to solve everyone's (Europe) problems.
spirro, Hong Kong, China
I find it amzing to hear all the people here saying "Why doesn't the US help. The US needs to support the people of Georgia." Yet, most of you people are the same ones who condemned Bush for sending troops to Iraq. Either we're in or we're out and that means everywhere!
Jeff R, Las Vegas, USA
The British should allow themselves to be sucked into yet another manipulated war. We should do everything to urge both sides to stop hostilities and come to a peaceful agreement.
It is bad enough us being involved in other manipulated wars that are nothing to do with us.
Alan Heaton, Frankfurt, Germany
The Harvard International Review has this to say of Saakashvili:
"In short, Georgias pro-Western and anti-Russian course compelled the West to turn a blind eye to the post-revolution governments failings and excesses a fact which did not go unnoticed by the Saakashvili administration."
Darren P., Greenhithe, Kent, U.K
Georgie Porgie is reading another children's book a la 9/11...apparently Dick Cheney's phone cannot get Georgie on the line as he's busy waving his flag at the Communist Olympics ceremonies...next thing we know he'll be in AF1 wandering and waiting for further instructions...deer in the headlights!
Richard Walega, Boston, USA
The U.S. has no business getting involved in this. It is none of our business. We are not the policemen of the world and need to stop sticking our noses in other sovereign nations' affairs. This used to be what all Americans knew, but have been brainwashed with all the media propaganda.
Dana, Tulsa, USA
Georgians sent their army into S.Ossetia to crush voices for independence, supported Kosovo's independence & shot down Russian plane.
Why is it wrong if Russia sends their army to defend the S.Ossetians 70% of whom have Russian passport ?
Man's aspiration for more influence = more misery.
Anmol, Noida, India
Please West, keep cool... There is no reason to start WWIII because crazy grand-childrens of Lenin (Putin) or Stalin (Saakashvili) are playing together.
Michel , Aix en Provence, France
As a Chinese, we insist we do not interfere other county's internal fairs. Georgian may have decent reason to keep its sovereignty; and Russion may be also right to keep peace. But it is simply an insult to us to start a war just before Beijing's Olympics. I will not forget Geogia's great Offer.
Atony, Shanghai, China
Unfortunetly, citizens of USA and some European countries prove, that they are the victims of "brain cleaning" policy, which their government has been conducting. They make their conclusions only from the information local mass media feed them. Instead of asking themselves: WHO REALLY NEEDS THIS WAR
ELENA, Moscow, Russia
The question is " if US and EU have any moral right to blame Russia keeping in memory what they have done in Irak and Serbia ???"
Arkadi, Ropsha, Russia
Is Bush going to be in the footsteps of Churchill or Chamberlain?
Help Georgia, or turn our backs to it? What is the word of the US worth if we let Georgia fail? First Georgia, and then where? Estonia? Ukraine? NOW is the time for ACTION, not foot dragging!
Wayne Price, Moscow, Idaho, 83843
To Harry:
It is NOT our business to "help" anyone who asks for help. That is nuts! If you are so anxious for war, YOU are free to go over there and get involved. But, it's not your right, to risk our soldier's lives and our treasure, to satisfy your desire for warmongering.
Dana, Tulsa, USA
Something is wrong in the world. Everybody lies about the conflict: world's media, Georgians, Russians. There is a lot of lie ewerywhere. I'd like to ask what will they do when the truth is revealed? To lie again?
They should stop the war and begin negotiations now before it is not too late.
Elena, Moscow, Russia
south ossetia / chechnya - anyone see a horrible hypocrisy here? Russia says chechnya has no right to declare independence and uses overwhelming force to get its way and in South Ossetia it says she has a right to independence and will use overwhelming force to grab some land. Uhoh -we're in trouble
Steve V, Stoke-on-Trent,
I am impressed with the Russian reporting even as the city of Tshkinvali is still being shelled/bombed by Georgia they can count 2,000 dead people. Reading these posts it is clear that the free press in Russia has been preparing the ground for this invasion. Georgia was suckered into action.
Terry, Watford, England
it's just an evil play for politics. I hate war, but I realize, that it's the only way for Russia now. I want it ends as soon as possible, but we'll not let anyone to consider our country (Russia) to be a slave in the armes of US.
Anton Taranikov, Guangzhou, China
Georgia's actions have probably ensured that neither it nor any other prospective former Soviet states will be admitted to NATO for the foreseeable future. The last thing NATO needs is to be bogged down in tangled separatist quarrels with Russia.
Kate, Southampton, UK
South Ossetia is within Geogria but this nation has a right for self-determination and in 90s Georgia deprived ossetians of this right not accepting results of their referendum not to be a part of Georgia and attacked them.. Now Russia is defending ossetians again, from nationalist Saakashvili & USA
tanya, Moscow, Russia
I now understand how Germany in 1938 was allowed to start taking country by country without any resistance from the major world powers.It is a shameful and pitifull situation when Georgia commits 2000 of there troops to our war in Irag and all the Nato countries and the U.S abandon them.
Richard NEIL, CLOVISA, USA
Georgia gained independence from the former USSR, now S Ossetia should be allowed independence from Georgia. Georgian military should not have bombarded the city to begin with, you reap what you sow. If Ossetia is returned to Georgia, then Kosovo should be returned to Serbia. Simple as that.
Neil, Newcastle Upon Tyne, England
Georgia is not the aggressor. Russia provoked this Ossetia-Georgia conflict only to justify military aggression to Georgia. And reasons are simple - oil and sea! Georgia is a way from Black sea to western europe. Georgia is also a non-russian oil "bridge" from East to West.
Darius Hartmann, Krakow, Poland
Remember the economic collapse of the USSR. They had to give up all of the Countries they controlled with their Communist Dictatorship.
Now OIL allows them to rearm and have a world voice.
$900 Billion Dollars from the U.S. for oil allow them all to speak loudly. Our Dems have stopped us.
John Petrick, Jasper, United States
Kim from Upland, Calif:
Georgia supported the U.S. in Iraq. The country is feeling betrayed by U.S. failing to help an ally.
Hugo Estrada, Washington DC, USA
Georgia is not the aggressor. Russia provoked this Ossetia-Georgia conflict only to justify military aggression to Georgia. And reasons are simple - oil and sea! Georgia is a way from Black sea to western europe. Georgia is also a non-russian oil "bridge" from East to West.
Darius Hartmann, Krakow, Poland
All readers;
The US backed Georgia is caught in the election game of US;
The republicans set up a puppet in Georgia to facilitate a risky act
to test the Russian will. It failed, same forces tried to bring to power another stooge in Armenia Levon Ter-Petrossian, It also failed. It is time to learn.
Thomas, Toronto, Canada
If I'm not mistaken Georgia is NOT a member of NATO yet.
Ariel, Somewhere, USA
I will reiterate some comments made here. GEORGIA is the aggressor. South Ossetia has long desired to be independent of Georgia, and Russia is defending this desire, and their own peacekeepers (at least 10 Russian peacekeeping soldiers were killed during Georgian attacks).
Tyler, Tulsa, United States
This is part of a much bigger plan-depopulation, if you please. As elitist Bush watches the Olympics, people in Georgia die. Wonder how many Georgia souls need to expire to further the New World Oder (whoops, Order).
Lyn, Monticello, USA
Where the heck is the UN or Geroge W. (I thought it was his mission to take out tyrants)? Probably still cashing in on the gas prices.
Nick, Knoxville, USA
This is the problem with our (the US) failed policies...we went into Iraq, looking for any support we could find (because well established countries knew better), we took what we could get. Now the Georgians feel rightly like we are beholden to them, inappropriately involving us in this mess.
Jay, Chicago, United States
I was just curious. How do all you Canadians posting here feel about letting Quebec leave Canada to be its own country? Probably a bit like the Georgians feel about South Ossetia being independent.
Michael, Birmingham,
To John from Houston,
Actually, America believes in the sanctity of human life. That's why President Lincoln saw fit to declare war on a section of the Union that was interested in preserving slavery. In doing so he actually stood up for and furthered Independence and Liberty (regardless of color).
Aron, Michigan, USA
I think it's ironic how the people who are always criticizing the US, be it Americans or foreigners, for getting involved in international affairs and policing the world are the same people who are now complaining that the US should be getting involved in Georgia and/or Africa...
Adam, Dallas, USA
Well since that fancy pipeline hat passes through Georgia feeds Europe, why doesn't the EU grow some balls and help Georgia? I as an American am tired of running to put out fires in Europe's backyard, time for you all to handle this one. GROW SOME BALLS Europe and quit cowtowing to the Rssians
Paco, Artesia, United States
Russia is NO enemy! Sure there not...
Seems they are their to protect and damn what Georgia says even though the Russians use the same excuse when 'Defending Their' land in Chechnya. Hmm Now thats double standards. We should help those who helped us and just what would happen if Georgia was in NATO
Garry, london, UK
If you attack another country, and then get your teeth kicked in, don't go asking for help....learn from your mistakes, and don't pick on more powerful countries.
If Georgia were winning, I suspect we may help the Russians as they were not the aggressor....If this were unprovoked, we may help out
bill, illinois, usa
Seems like a lot of people have inside knowledge of what is happening in Georgia and what various world leaders are thinking about the situation. As for the people from Canada and other nations think the US should do something, maybe they should ask their governments to come out of hiding and act.
Stewart, Houston, USA
There is obviously a lot of factors at play here, you can't expect immediate reaction on either side. To say that Russia doesn't have the right to help Ossetia is like saying you can't hold down somebody that punched someone else in the street. See what Russia does after that area has calmed down.
Jamie, Ottawa, Canada
Why Kosovo and Osetia and other places that wanted to be independent are different? Is it because Kosovo independence was supported by west powers? Stupid politicians!
Yuri, New York, USA
Russia is completely right-----Georgia is the aggressor-----and needs a slap on the wrist-----as much as I admire Putin and Medvedev I wish they did not allow the bombing of civilian homes------we in the West have been rubbing Russia's nose after the Soviet Union collapse-----pandering to Georgian
Pat, SWANSEA, UK
Why is everyone anti-American until they want us to help them fight their wars?
Kim Righetti, Upland, Calif. USA
Hello, dear readers..
Please do not forget who started this war... :( who said their troops to attack South Assetia... Russian troops will not kill Georgian citizens! And they will no go forward behind South Assetia borders!!
I do not like war and not happy with Russia have to fight against anybody!
Andrew Svintsov, Nizghny Novgorod, Russian Federation
Remember Suez? U.S. would not even help Britain when we needed help. If Georgia had as much oil as Iraq, the U.S. would have troops there.
Ralph, Atlanta, U.S.
Jesus! With people like Michael from Bournemouth in our midst the West doesnt need to look as far as Russia for its enemies.
Pete, Newbury,
"The Devil Went Down To Georgia"
New York, Jamaica, USA
If the US had been supportive of this, it would only make sense that Georgia would have had the weapons to deal with Russia's response. This is a fight Russia wanted and waited for Georgia to "provoke" them. The real agenda will soon be apparent if Russia presses further into Georgia.
Tim, MN, USA
Some people told that Russia wants to remove the Georgian president. Maybe it is truth. In 1945 Russia (in Soviet Union) removed one leader of Germany who was chosen democratic. And all world was thankful. And I will be proud of my country if it will safe the world from one more bloody dictator.
Dmitry, Novosibirsk, Russia
Sorry, but in America we don't believe in Independence. When the south voted to leave the Union, Lincoln killed them and burned their cities. We send our armies to "Preserve Unions" - not for self determination. So Georgia should just be re-annexed as part of the soviet Union.
John, Houston, usa
if you want the americans to help.better discover oil in georgia soon.
mike, toronto, canada
Aggression should never be rewarded. We should take a lesson from before WWII when Hitler began taking pieces of neighboring countries. Appeasement brought the us WWII.
This is exactly the way Hitler started.
Phil, Falls Church, Virginia, USA
Russia has been and will always be a backward country, its large geographic space shapes its culture, just like ours (surrounded by the sea) shapes ours. Its is always looking to shore up its boarders and keep all the competing populations under control.
Russia should worry about its demographics!
Sean Morris, Sheffield, UK
I think the USA and other Western countries, need to start a new plan, stay out of other people's business.
I understand what the Georgians are saying, and know they need help....I don't know the solution to this problem, but think the USA should bring all soldiers back home & stay here.
Barbara, Ky, USA
I don't believe the rebirth of Sov.union makes sense nowadays.Nobody can ever know what all these wars are about.The world has some worse problems as (re)-unifying of some micro-mini-states.Instead of searching or making come issues like this,the authorities should think of sustainable mutual growth
Liuba, Stuttgart, Germany
War with Georgia? Not ridiculously. Army of Georgia - 20 000. Our army - 1 000 000. How many hours will last war? Iraq has grasped Kuwait in some hours. And at Hussein the soldier was less.
Alek., Saratov, Russia
<<<I think the US should prepare to destroy the Russian war machine. Using laser defense and hypersonic tech will make it easy.
Jeff M, Salt Lake City, USA>>>
Yeah, and what about those hyperspace warp drives and them fantastic flux compensators?
Jeff, you scare the s*** out of me...
Sven, Germany, Europe
Putin is determined to rebuild the Soviet Union. This is the beginning. Unfortunately, the U.S. has stretched their forces too thin to be much of a deterrent. Former Soviet states need to beware. Putin is an egomaniac and Georgia is just the beginning.
Bryan, Oklahoma, U.S.
I see whats going on here. The USA gave the go ahead for the invasion of South Ossetia to gain control over the energy lines running through Ossetia and tried to bury it under the Olympic Games. Then Russia came along and decided it could do the same as the US in the guise of protecting Ossetia.
Curtis Anderson, Gloucester, UK
Well, you know what -- if the US could bomb Serbia for 78 days for 100 killed Albanians, Russia has all the right to bomb Georgia for killing 2000 Ossetians.
Pete, Cambridge, USA
Simply put, the Russian forces want the president of Georgia out of power, as they said this morning to Condi. As for why Georgia went into the area, they went to arrest people that were causing unrest in the rest of the country. Russian envoys should have stopped this instead of ignore it so long.
Jerod, Manama, Bahrain
Don't you remember what happened in Kosovo? There the reason for NATO bombings was 100 killed Albanians. Now Georgians killed 2000 (!) Ossetians. Is it not enough for you? You should thank Russians for stopping them
Dave, Cambridge, USA
Russia is NO enemy of the world!!! South Ossetia is devastated, 2000 of civilians (Tshinvalli) are killed as a result of Georgia's cruel assault, many are still hiding in basements of their damaged houses, over 30000 of citizens had to flee. Russia has just come to rescue.
Zarina, Vladikavkaz, Russia
A lot of US citizens commenting here have a very cavalier attitude to war and seem keen to 'help out their buddies' from Georgia, as if it were a game of baseball.
anne price, coventry, UK
it is a policy of the west to use and refuse its own allies, apply double standards and more importantly, to abuse its own people in the interests of business and profit. It is why the West will and must collapse.
Michael, Bournmouth ,
Russia's actions are shameful. The comments of the Russians in this tread, show that the real goal of Russia is to remove the Georgian president and appoint a stooge of the Kremlin.
Russia is an anti-democratic and militarily aggressive. I'm glad we're helping the US with its anti-missile shield.
PaulT, Prague,
Why USA won't help you?
Well, to quote Kissinger:
"Great powers don't commit suicide for their allies."
SD, Split, Croatia
Jeff M, Salt Lake City, USA,
and I think the US is leaving Russia no choice but to unleash a nuclear holocaust on the world right now before the missile defence is deployed if you people plan to kill us all off anyway like you did the Indians why should we wait?
Igor, Smolensk, Russia
South Osetia has NEVER been a part of Georgia !
It was given to Georgia by Stallin (who was georgian btw) but has never been accepting georgian authorities
alsi, Helsinki, Finland
This conflict was inevitable from the moment that the West ran roughshod over Russia and pushed Kosovan independence through the UN process. Russia offered explicit warnings of consequences. The only surprise is that Georgia foolishly jumped the gun and has cost herself much international sympathy.
Phil, Tallinn,
Americans supported Afganistan at 80th - now they have Ben Laden, 11 september etc.
Today they are grow up Saakashvili. I'm sure he is new dictator! Much more dengerous then Sadam Husein. More then 2000 people killed in one day by georgian forces. Is it normal?
Evgeny, Saint-Petersburg,
The west is tired of war
and now theres the Iran threat that we might have to neutralize
If Russia wants to
Georgia will burn
and I don't think we'll stop them
not with force anyway
Kodie, Victoria , Canada
This has just begun and battle lines have not been fully drawn. I'm amazed at the arm chair generals who have so much to say. Demand a U.S. response when we don't have a full picture of intent yet?
Want to help? Book a flight to Georgia and sign up
John Campbell, Bakersfield, CA, U.S.A.
I am reading the blog of one of my friends in Tskhinvali. He is posting in LiveJournal via his mobile. Something strange is going on: Georgians say they withdraw but continue shooting. Tskhinvali is still under Georgian artillery fire. Russian tanks entered the city only yesterday evening.
Alla, Royston, UK
may i insert comment here though i'm a filipino i'm deeply affected by the slaughters and devastations cause by this war. why is it hard to give other with peace while all of us want to sleep soundly at night? i ask people to respect each other's sovereignty.. south osetia is within georgia.
jpbarroga, sorsogon,
People are dieing in thousands, and nobody cares. Of course we-Russians and every sesible man want him to leave, because how can narrow-minded, selfish man run a whole country!!?? Fools are the most unpredictable and dangerous human beings, you never know what he is going to do next.....
Helen, Krasnodar, Russia
Times didn't say anything about the 2,000 Ossetian civilians and Russian peacekeepers, who were killed by the Georgian army, which started the conflict by its bombings of the South Ossetian towns on 08/08/08, Friday morning, when the whole world was preparing for the Olympic games.
Max, Moscow, Russia
TimesOnLine, show us photos of hundreds of Ossetians murdered by Saakashvili and the bomb holes in places where their houses used to be. Do you want to be considered his accomplice in his heinous war crimes?
Akomeko, Moscow,
Amazing! Why you really "do not notice" that Saakashvili suited a genocide to ossetic people?
Gregory, Helsinki, Finland
Vladimir Putin has revealed himself a cold and brutal dictator, his new president is a talking head. Good thing Bush is pushing the missile shield in Europe. I think the US should prepare to destroy the Russian war machine. Using laser defense and hypersonic tech will make it easy.
Jeff M, Salt Lake City, USA
Also; I oppose Obama's election because of his social policies. But for those under an 'Obambi' illusion: Join, on the sidelines, the following parties: the Clintons; every other Democrat in the race; and Alice Palmer and her colleagues in Chicago that were all 'removed' from the ballot in 1996.
TJ, Lansing, USA
I'm sure the Bush Administration in the United States promised more support for this invasion. The leaders of Georgia would not be in their right minds if they thought this could be pulled off by themselves.
Based on what I'm hearing, Georgia was sacrificed like a lamb to the lion.
Jimmy, St. Paul, USA
Why dont you think about womens,childrens and old peole killed in Tshinvali by Geogians?There 2000 dead,a lot of people now runin to Russia to take a help and many people,what cant go anywhere,cose of their illness.Is Georgian actions are normar?that you'll did if in Osetia were YOUR relatives?
Alena, Voronezh, Russia
Yes, Georgia has helped in the illegal war in Iraq so perhaps now it is getting a taste of it's own medicine? The West keeps prodding Russia by encircling it with missiles and its troops and then cries foul when Russia reacts. Why dont we let the Russians put missiles in Cuba?
connor, Windlesham, Surrey
If the Iraqis had had the sense to flee their villages there would hardly be any civilian casualties and the war would've been over years ago.
Simple, Fresno, USA
To Patrick Handy, Livermore, USA
All that you wiil attain is that Iraqui rebels will get some modern weapon and you will need some extra coffins. Russia not a country with which it is possible to joke in this way.
Valery, Krasnoyarsk (Siberia), Russia
The fact is that Goergia invaded firstly, just at the time when Olympic Games began!! Goergia insulted all the people of the world who love peace, it should be given a lesson!
Tomtree, Lahsa, China
The Georgians, and everyone else, should learn once and for all that the West, and particularly, though not exclusively, the English, do not have alliances, they have interests. It is not in the interests of the West to intervene, so they will not do so.
Terry Dell, Weybridge, UK
How can you be so blind and do not see that this war is a Saakashvili provokation needed to blame Russia and to show how "defenseless" Georgia is in order to become a member of NATO.
Listen to georgians who say that Saakashvili attacked Ossetia not to subjective journalists!!
Irene, Jõhvi, Estonia
This is the main story .. rusia a powerfull state and a powerful army and georgia , a small state and a small army , this is a story with a only one end for a small contry like georgia , they will lose more and more , day after day , if they will continue to fight .
Gabriel, Bucharest, Romania
feel great symphathy for suffering people from both side and pray all this absurd over
hate polititians and their cruel games
olga, Moscow, Russia
Georgia attempted to reoccupy South Ossetia. Good for them. Russia intervened on the Ossetians behalf. Bad on them. Now the Georgians expect us to nuke Moscow? Crazy...
Larry, Manchester,NH,, USA
what a pity, when few politicians make decisions for all nation, and when their acts destroy peaceful life!!!
danna, Chernivtsi, Ukraine
@ Rob, NY. Georgia had every right to reclaim its territory in South Ossetia. Do you think Washington would simply allow one of its states to declare independence? Russia is invading another country here, not Georgia. The US and EU are cowards for not intervening by force!
Max, Macau, Macau SAR
Russia please stop watching State run television tune into a independant news you will see whats happening.
You country men are Murdering Women and children.
Hope you feel proud the little bear roars lets see you take on the US! No because you know you would lose.
Simon, Bristol, UK
It amazes me how ignorant a majority of posters here are. Georgia is an independent nation (recognized globally). South Ossetia is part of their country and only DECLARED indpendence (not recognized globally). It's a civil war plain and simple. Russia had no business getting involved.
Brian, Detroit, US
Hey, Putin -
After you finish off those rascal Georgians maybe you can take on another powerful foe worthy of your army: Starbucks. You could claim that you had no choice but to roll out the tanks in order to save Russian nationals from the danger of foreign instigated coffee.
Richard Rivera, San diego, USA
Hungary 1956, Prague 1968.................... - need I say more !!!!!!
ian payne, walsall,
Living in Russia I've seen much propaganda in my life. But what Western media are doing now exceeds everything with its cynicism and falsehood. Stop backing Saakashvili. He's a war criminal, just like Karadzic.
Akomeko, Moscow,
america and europe will do nothing in this war , they will have just a diplomatic oposition to rusian action , but just that . The rusia has the gas , a key element in this ecuation , they need the rusian " yes " in another urgent problem , the iranian case .
Gabriel, Bucharest, Romania
Georgia shouldn't have entered S.O. with troops, the US shouldn't have entered Kosovo with troops. Russia is defending its citizens and the independence of S.Ossetia.
The USA has no jurisdiction in Georgia or in Kosovo.
Independence should also be gained for Abkazia as per the 1992 referendum.
Eddie Allen, Durham, England
If Russians want this war why they did not began it? Why Georgians began to to shoot at Ossetian towns?
Peter, Novosibirsk, NS, Russian Federation
As many people as many minds.
The only is true-war can lead to many innocent deads. But the human life is the only worth thing on this earth.
Ivan, Rostov-on-Don, Russia
Why the author is silent about more that 2,000 of South Ossetia civilian people killed? Or the georgians are the only poor peple we should take pity on?
Why dont you write that the georgians bombed heavily Tschinvali?Unbelievable, such an unfair approach!
Nataly, Vilnius, Lithuania
The USA have pushed Georgia in war, here even there is nothing to discuss
Alexandr, Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Russian aggression should be stoped!
Don't even beleive Russian media, they don't have freedom of speech and it's all filtered by Kremlin. This whole deal was staged by Kremlin and all civilians from South Osetia were evaculated before military actions started, then show have began!
irina, Kiev, Ukraine
As you may so speak? Similars the west information agency report only that they want? But this wrong! The West does not get reliable information! All quite not since you speak! The Russian pacifier more than 10 years support the world in zone of the conflict.
max, Samara, Russia
People! You deceive! Come here to Moscow you will see all as is, and it is better in Osetiyu
Laba, Moscow, Russia
is sad that normal people ( civils and soldiers ) it will suffer in this wars ( georgia , irak , kosovo ..and so on .. )
Gabriel, Bucharest, Romania
GWB should have prevented his Georgian friend from doing that.
City of Tshinvali is now a hell and nobody cares. Illusion of democracy in Georgia (with suppressing opposition and independent media) is priced multiply higher than lives of Ossetians.
Andrei, Novosibirsk, Russia
People of the world! You deceive! World mass media conduct propagation of a false information. Russia DID NOT ATTACK Georgia! 07.08.2008 at 22:00 Georgia has attacked South Ossetia. At 3:30 08.08.2008 tanks of the Georgian armies have entered into city Tskhinvali.
Alexandr, Kazan, Russia
Consider the consequence of the United States sending troops to fight against Russian soldiers. I can assure you that the fighting will not stop but in fact become much more intense and widespread. The best solution is a diplomatic one, if one can't be found we are all in trouble, not just Georga.
Jonathon Houston, COLORADO SPRINGS, United States
Did you seriously expect any other reaction from Russia after their peacekeepers suffered a loss of 12 killed, more wounded? Not counting locals killed during the first night of the assault. Only if Georgia was to gain control over most South Osetia before Moscow reacted. Ugly for both now
Andrei, Houston, US/Russia
People! Stop and think! When will you stop being poorminded! Georgia invaded Osetia and killed and is still killing people there! more than 2000 people are killed there and you are still blaming Russia?! I am really sorry for the western people 'cause you're full of cinicism. You're not democracies!
Alex, Moscow, Russia
It's hard to say who is the aggressor in this conflict because of the conflicting media reports. One question that needs to be addressed is would all of this be happening if Putin wasn't in power ? He's been trying to revive the old regime since he came to power ... that's obvious to anyone
AJ, Ohio, USA
Georgia attacked South Ossetia on the night before the Olympic Games started! Russia have to defent its citizens and force Georgia to stop ethnic cleaning and genocide. It's a war against Russia supported by USA and I wonder why the european countries support USA again and its bloody politics!
tanya, Moscow, Russia
what a pity, when few politicians make desicions for all nation
danna, Chernivtsi, Ukraine
Over here in Moscow, the news were that the Georgians started shelling Tskinvali killing nearly 1,000 civilians. Of course, I do find it hard to believe (killing a thousand people is no easy fit unless you are using nukes), but as far as I am concerned Georgia has started the war. Stop them first
Sergey, Moscow, Russia
If France and Germany had allowed Georgia and Ukraine into NATO, all NATO would be involved in this conflict.
You all have to thank Germany and France for every world is saying "It was Georgia who started the war" instead of "It was NATO who stared the war"
Askar, Kazan, Russia
People! Wake up! What are you talking about? Russia began the war? Russia is destroying the georgian people?
Russia doesn't need this war. If it is, so why Tshkinvali lays in ruins and osetins are diying?
Maybe the USA doesn't want to help Georgia, 'cause knows the truth?
Vera, Nvkz, Russia
To Lou, Tbilisi, Georgia
Tell it to my great grandfather who was killed by your congener Stalin.
Valery, Krasnoyarsk (Siberia), Russia
Idiots all. If France and Germany had allowed Georgia and Ukraine into NATO, this would not have happened. Putin would not have attacked. However, who knows truly what is happening there? Our news says one thing, there news says another.
Steven Jones, Louisville, USA
I'm an american and have been trading news stories with a good friend in Moscow during this whole thing. Frankly, Georgia had no business launching an offensive against Ossetia in the first place. Russia has over-reacted though, because they are trying to destabilize the Georgian government.
Rob, NY, USA
Actually who wants to go to war with a country with nukes and the credit crunch.I feel sorry for the inocent women and children
Patrick Nairobi
patrick, Nairobi, Kenya
I love all the foolish armchair soldier conservatives so ready to send someone else's kids to war with Russia.
Not one of them could have pointed out Georgia, much less South Ossetia on a map a week ago. Not one could tell you the ethnic tensions that led Ossetia to break away. Quit expanding NATO
Collin, Eau Claire, USA
If the United States doesn't do anything now, it's no big deal. South Ossetia wants to be part of Russia so let Russia invade and take over. No real loss to Georgia no matter what they say. If and when Russia goes into Georgia proper is when we should take action in their defense.
Robert, Harlingen, Texas
We should at the very least provide the Georgian military the means to level the playing field against Russian superiority in military air power. The Russians will ride roughshod over the Georgian military unil Russian air power is held in check. We should not appease the Russian Bear.
Patrick Handy, Livermore, USA
Do not betray the people of Georgia!!! There is a long history of Russia taking over the country of Georgia. This is not the first time! Do not believe the propaganda machine of the Russian government!
Chaya, Bat Yam, Israel
What is wrong with this picture? Everyone is saying save poor Georgia. But Georgia is the country who first invaded neighboring Ossetia, an internationally recognized independent state. Now they want the US, land of the free, to support their failed invasion? We're too busy taking over Iraq.
Bob, Baton Rouge, US
Georgia has a better chance of getting help from the US than they would if Clinton were still in power...or, God forbid, Obama! Also, don't under estimate Russia's neighbor's hatred for them. 300,000 Fins defeated 3 million Russians in less than 190
days in the winter of 1939 when Russia invaded.
Maurice Brule, Wilmnigton, Ma, USA
To tyrone`, Rawalpindi, Pakistan
The only prospective american ally is Russia. Georgia is the american pawn which made serious mistake when they attempted to conquer S Osetia.
Valery, Krasnoyarsk (Siberia), Russia
So, Russia invades, with "ethnic" excuses. America is blamed by BAFA's (Blame America First Always) for doing nothing,because of Kosovo blah blah when RUSSIA has invaded. 1 question. When are the BAFA's to march in streets against Russia? Hypocrits. Pull out of NATO let Russia have Europe. HAppy?
Deuce, HUdson, Fl. , USA
US got their oil in Iraq for now...they're not gonna go and fight another war. Let's just face it. When US needed to play its games they did it without asking anyone. Just invaded and conquered with some lame excuses.Why Russia can't act, especially when someone has become too cocky to strike first?
D, Toronto, Canada
No one help China to fight the Tibet separatists, why so many people here can blame Russia? when you are bit by a rat, what will you do? bite back proportionate and conscionable? No, you just kick the rat to death!
Fisher, Ningbo , P.R.China
Putin, the former KGB boss and hand behind the new "puppet" Russian presidency is a sly, smart, crooked leader who has never liked the West moving in on those former Soviet blocs..playing his hand as US troops are spread around the globe and the Olympics are being held. Democratic Russia...please!
Charles Gibson, Austin, TX, USA
Why you Georgeans to took out the stupid president Saakashvili? Its he is playing fire by georgean nation! Why Georgia should govern wit Osetia, it is osetia and there are living Osetia& Russians. It is stupid enough to attack place, what is not Georgian territory in fact.
Davaa, Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
A number of people keep saying that Georgia attacked first. What did they attack? They went into an area that is part of Georgia. They did that in order to stop rebel forces aggression against Georgia. The so-called 'peace keeping forces' are Russians!! That is ridiculous!
Chaya, Bat Yam, Israel
Khamzaty, Russia is not a superpower. Their army is a joke compared to the U.S. Outdated, ill-equipped and ill-trained. The fact is Georgia had no right to attack South ossetia. Russia HAS over-reacted and is trying to intimidate them but the U.S. did not approve of Georgia's actions.
Rob, NY, USA
@ Joe - the 'Georgian support' of the US in Iraq was nothing more than the US buying a 'supporter' to make its illegal invasion of Iraq appear as if it had popular support.
That the US won't help Georgia is no suprise - look at what they did to their 80's ally Iraq.
Bard, vancouver, canada.
mr tutto, LA, "I guess Georgia hasn't learned yet that you don't pick a fight that you can't win..... ON YOUR OWN"
interesting point of view. maybe we should all take this piece of sound advice and pull out of afghanistan and iraq as the US can clearly handle all this ON YOUR OWN.
JW, brisbane,
Tell you one thing. Putin just won the election for McCain by his over-reaction in Georgia. Who's gonna vote for Obama now when the red bear has returned and we have shades of the red menace back? Not I.
Rob, NY, USA
I love europe's double standard.. HELP US!! Why Should we?
Dave, Dallas, TX, USA
Unless I missed it' I haven't read or heard a word of condemnation of Russia or offer to help Georgia from the French popinjay masquerading as a President of Europe. A strong EU my foot!
John, Kouvola, Finland
It's amazing to me that we are withdrawing and downsizing our Armed Forces here in Europe, at a time where we are obviously witnessing! with the Invasion of Georgia, the resurgence of the OLD SOVIET UNION! and just last week! Putin was talking about basing long range attack bombers in Cuba.
John, Mainz, Germany
The author of this article made it clear that he blames the US. Russia is in Europe. Europe formed the EU to handle European problems. The US can not go everywhere and die for every country. The EU has a responsibility to police itself. Darned if you do, darned if you don't. Never trust the press.
Patrick, Killinghall, UK
Come on, guys in the US and the UK. Where is your favourite 'free media'???
Your newspapers are trying to create a WW3 by the means of propaganda and make US fight Russia. The whole world knows it would be a disaster - but for some reason you listen to them and don't even see that Georgia's lying.
Elena, Moscow, Russia
South Ossetia was independent of Georgia since the 1990s. Two monitored referendums were held in which they wanted no part of Georgia. Georgia was the aggressor attacking when the world was distracted by the Olympics, hoping that Russia would do nothing. .
w., ottawa, Canada
Time for freedom loving peoples of the world to unite to the Georgian cause. Russia is trying to reform the old Sovit Union. If they are not stopped in Gori the rest of the CSI is at stake. Putin is nothing more but a communist with a Wall Street white wash. This US citizen will do what is needed.
Eugene Boyanton, Picayune, USA
To all our US friends here - Georgia is on the Russian border, it not the state with Atlanta in it! The US has been pushing towards this conflict with its adventurist foreign policy, knowing there is no real way it can help without risking a major (nuclear) war. Very stupid.
Mark, Munich,
It's Georgia on the day of Opening of the Olimpic Games started bombarding South Osetia! Not Russia!
Why you, the European journalists, do not work in South Osetia! Why do not you show the Osetian women and children!
Annie, Ekaterinburg, Russia
Well dont look for America to do anything. If there is one thing we have learned from the Euros its that such rash action is considered cowboy diplomacy. First we have to talk about it for years on end and then bribe everyone on the UN security coucil to do the right thing including Russia.
Roadside Couch, Dallas, Texas, USA
I agree with those that say 'it was Georgia that kicked the hornet's nest' - what did they expect?
Ted Martin, Amarillo, USA
Cowboy in Chief doesn't have the balls to help out Georgia. Good old USA just used and discarded another ally.
Harvey Dent, Gotham, USA
it's a war between russia and usa...georgia is just the place of the war
sorry for my english...
Andrey, Hofgeismar,Kassel, GERMANY
The author of the article is entirely focused on tens of killed civilians and hundrends of refugees in Georgia. He prefers to forget about thousands of killed civilians and tens of thousands of refugees in South Osetia.
The brain washing machine works - US and UK mass medias are one-sided
Konstantin, Validivostok, Russia
Be in no doubt. The South Ossetian situation was carefully orchestrated by the Russians to bait Georgia into taking action. When they took the bait, the Russians were ready to act. This is about Russia taking control of the port ot Potian Baku/Tbilisi/Ceyhan pipeline so they control energy export
Paul, Scottsdale AZ, USA
God I wish there were no more leftists in the world. Whereever there are leftists and socialists there are always misery and aggression and the ones living freely and peacefully in democratic states ALWAYS condone aggression when it's done by one of their own kind.
tarane, denver, Colorado, USA
Well, just wanted to say something to Noelio that South Ossettia is a breakaway province of Georgia, HOWEVER, you can't compare that to the Iraq-Kuwait thing, becaus Kuwait never was a breakaway province or anything like that to Iraq. Learn your parallels.
Bryan, Des Moines, IA, USA
Rulers of Russia are shameless bandits. Their country is literally dying and they keep playing Great Power games. Next we'll see a puppet government to be installed in Georgia by Russian panzer and our handwringing. Remember Kabul in 1979? Everything forgotten and nothing learned, by all sides.
Felix, Mountain View, USA, CA
South Ossetia voted for its independence. Georgia attacked and butchered them on August 7th. Imagine Canada attacking Quebec for voting for independence. A huge mistake attacking the Russian bear by Saakashvilli. Now he's crying like a little girl every day on CNN.
Eric, New Rochelee, USA
I just heard over the News that the White House in response to the invasion of Georgia by the Russians President George W Bush has called on the US Army's 82 airborne to garrison Atlanta, GA.
Thank GOD he is still our President!!
Renegade GOP, Concord, USA
Gah. Read some stuff about the region before telling your opinion. South Ossetia is independent from Georgia since 1992.
What happened is that GEORGIA started to INVADE South Ossetia. Russia just defended them. Refugees are fleeing to Russia, not Georgia. Plus, USA gave Georgia the equipement.
Floirt, Avignonet, France
So it's America's fault. Amazing. Didn't Georgia attack first? Or am I not getting something here...?
Mark, Canfield,
Ossetia DECLARED independence in the 90's.
GEORGIA:Ossetia = IRAQ:Kuwait -Same thing.
Georgia INVADED and killed multitudes of civilians. There is a LOON at the helm of Georgia. Russia is right to do for the Ossetians as USA did for Kuwaitis!!!
Stop allowing yourselves to be BRAINWASHED people!
Noelio, Essex, UK
I don't think America is getting the whole picture. We here in the United States do not understand why Georgia needed to take Ossetia. Also, I think that people in Georgia do not understand that there is a long standing detente between Russia and the U.S. to preclude nuclear conflict.
Jeff Dunham, Yacolt, WA
This will be George Bush lasting legacy. How did he see good when he looked into Putin's soul. Russia is back. Shame on us if we do not help Georgia.
John, Omaha, USA
Looks like Hungary, 1956 revisited. Whaddya wanna bet we'll do nothing? This is what happens when the aggressors perceive our weakness.
Don Kennedy, Phoenix, USA
This is a distortion, the only genocide committed was by a Georgian dictator Saakashvilli who attempted to exterminate South Ossetians, but was stopped by Russia; this is Neo-Con attempt to take over the strategic region using a puppet dictator Saaksahvilli thru the provocation of Russian peacekeers
Alex Kudryavtsev, Toronto, Canada
The russian people are being ripped off by putin and his cronies who are stealing their oil and gas wealth . At least the commie leaders didn`t steal from their people . Their military is pathetic , old weak and useless the Russian bear is a joke if they want a row with the US and Uk let it happen !
tim, newark , uk
First off this is predictable when the wall came down the west had plenty of oppurtunity to warm relationships with Russia, think about Bosnia,Kosovo, Nato inching ever closer to a country that had alway been suspicous of foriegn powers. Now apparently Russia has been revamping their military
RichardK, League City, TX, USA
My understanding is that South Ossetia is majority Russian ethnicity and they voted to separate from Georgia. Isn't Russia playing the same role that the U.S. played in protecting the Kurds against Saddam?
Scott , Somerset,MA, USA
Just wait for another rool of Russian bear in his nest.
Well: 516 tanks gave Gitler 8 days in Osetia.
Dmitry, Moscow,
Europeans criticize the US for meddling in other's affairs, but when attacked suddenly the US is the only country available to help. Once again, Europe will stand by and do nothing, except of course, criticize the US.
Nestor, Niantic, CT, USA
As a member of NATO I hope thatthe Alliance stands up to this agression. Deploy NATO as Peacekeepers in Gerogia as the Russians have done. Russia is playing a dangerous game. Russia has not recovered from its' intial collapse yet and is NO match for the collective might of NATO.
Sam Carew, London, England
It's not as easy as some may think. Most of us in America would like to help, but diplomatic relations would fall on deaf ears. We can't go about this militarily, because our troops are in the Middle East and fighting two wars is crazy at the moment. And, above all, we just don't have the money.
Nathan, Fort Worth, United States
Western Countries affirm they want to be partners with Russia but would you treat your partner like this:
* Support anti-Russian governments bordering Russia?
* Establishing military bases in anti-Russian Countries near Russia?
* Never blaming Georgia for STARTING the war or attacking civilians?
William Escutya, Guadalajara, Mexico
The US cannot help. It is past the limits of its power and it has no credible leadership. Bush and the US care as much about Georgians as they do Iraqis.
Jefferson, Monticello, US
The West should come to Georgia's aid immediately. Given that most of Europe is impotent, this essentially means that the US and UK should enter the arena and rescue this fledgling liberal democracy from autocratic, expansionist Russia. GEORGIA NEEDS AND DESERVES OUR SUPPORT
Emmett, Greenwich,
Unfortunately, all I have to go on is what I read in the news. And, the "mainstream" news here in the USA is no longer trustworthy. For now, I think I have to agree with Russia. Ultimately, my prayers are for those who suffer, on both sides. The soldiers and the civillians. God bless.
Todd W., Cleveland, USA
America would help right away..
But every time we do you other countries condemn us and tell us how bad we are.
We can stand up to Russia.. but when the actual big shooting between the US and Russia starts.. it will be the USA that all of you blame the war on. We wish we could help.. hands r tied.
Cale, NewYork, USA
Blaise, in Burkina Faso, you make a very strange comment. What Russia is doing to Georgia is shameful? How about what US/NATO did for 78 days and nights non-stop bombing of Serbia, its civilians and infrastructure, with all types of weapons of mass destruction. Where were you when that happened?
Liz, Edmonton, Canada
George Bush and NATO are USELESS! This needs to STOP!
BTW, It is not the American People, but their CORRUPT Government. Come November, hopefully the Republicans will be oust and the World will be a better place....my prayers are with the People of Georgia and Russia...peace....
Penny, Ottawa, Canada
Russia need to be opposed. Georgia's president acted foolishly but imagining that Russia is acting out of a desire to support self-determination is idiocy of the highest order. Where is this zeal when it comes to Chechnya?
Russia isn't afraid to play the realpolitik game. Are we?
John Swaine, Malta, Malta
We won't intervene in this one and its a shame. The Georgians have helped us tremendously in Iraq and we owe them. They were wrong to invade South Ossetia but we need to help prevent Russia from taking back a republic. The US will help in some way just as we help everywhere when an ally needs us.
Bryan, Lexington, USA
It is sad that we are going to sit allow the Georgians to be integrated back into Russia back into a future USSR. We should be sending every ship to Georgia and pulling some people out of Iraq to keep Georgia it's own country. Otherwise Georgia will soon be a city-state of Russia shortly.
George Scott, San Diego, USA
We should and want to do something, and we are disguested in how our President is just sitting next to Putin at the Olympics acting like friends. Do something Bush!!!
David, Tucson, USA
This is about oil and the control and flow of it. You can't blame the US or the UN rushing to aid Georgia with troop aid. They are trying diplomatically, but of course this will be fruitless. Would we rather have WWIII start up over this fight for control of oil. This is all very sad.
WT, Sunnyvale, US
City Tshkinvali (the capital of South Osetia) now is completely destroyed by 3-day bombarding of Georgian forces (and 8 villages too)! They use heavy artillery, tanks, and rockets!
Over 2000 civilians are dead (many of tham are Russian citizens).
President Saakashvili is WAR CRIMINAL!
Ilia, Moscow, Russia
Georgians shouldn't have shot the Russians soldiers and shelled the city in first place. What were they thinking.
No doubt US must have approved of the plan, now they should send career and support Georgia. Is this how you treat your allies? Is this how USA will treat Pakistan in future?
Shame.
tyrone`, Rawalpindi, Pakistan
Let us remember it all started by Georgia. We should stop seen Russian as an agressor, Georgia should know what their playing with. The so called West should stop giving Georgia false hope that they will stand by them.
alfred, London,
ill sign up right now to go in there if the russians dont stop, america will not just stand by if they keep this up. We will help our friends who fight beside us.
Joe, Charlotte, North carolina, USA
It was legitimate for Georgia to try to stop the region from leaving but they did so at their own risk knowing Russia considered many people there to be part of their ethnicity.
This business of abandonment is ludicrous, they helped in Iraq because we train and supply their entire army!
Joseph, Washington, D.C. , USA
Shell I trust Geogians after reading this
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/10/georgia.russia5
Sergei, London, UK
The Russians know that the U.S.A. will do nothing but talk. This is Russia's backyard. The U.S.A. has no business there, and isn't the world's policeman. What's amazing is that Condi Rice, the U.S. Secretary of State, is supposed to be an expert on US-Russian relations, but clearly is not!
Henry K., New York City, NY, USA
No, Russia is not a joke.But the US and West are rapidly showing themselves to be jokes of the highest order. This sort of thing has happened to Georgia before -- and it was sucked up by Russia/Soviet Union both times. It's time for the outside world to take immediate action. Not talk about it. Act.
Lou, Tbilisi, Georgia
The US will sit back on this one due to oil, risk of war with a country that has nukes, and our over-stretched military. We will look bad after this. Having the USA as a friend means nothing apparently. Sorry Georgia, you're on your own. Bush will support you with words only.
Dan Cooper, Baltimore, USA
The issue is that a region broke away from Georgia, it is a free and independent state. I believe that any region has the right, no obligation, to establish its own government that it sees fit. Georgia is like the British Empire attempting to recapture the US after we won our independence. I'm w/Rus
Cody, Denver, USA
i agree.....the usa is truly responsible. my country tries to overstep its boubds all the time. poor georgia..they were fools to trust bush and the good ol USA!!!!!!!!!
bart, philly, usa
the USA is actually significantly more powerful than Russia. Russia has but a shadow of the power the USSR . the Russian bear is still a force to be reckoned with & the USA doesnt want to face it. fighting a war in Russia's backyard is a bad idea in anycase , if only someone had told Georgia that
Hedd Wyn John, Penybont, Wales
Sadly, I agree that my country will ignore the murderous brutality of Putin and allow the people of Georgia to be slaughtered by the Russians. This does not bode well for any of the free peopls of Europe. Bush knows he has no ability to respond so he'll smile and make nice with Putin at the Games.
BLC, North Attleboro, USA
The UN will be unable to do anything becuase the Russians will veto any direct military or economic action against them. Shoud the US or NATO take military action, it will quicky turn into a major war with the potential to turn into a nuclear nightmare.
Austin, Houston, USA
Hey, guys.
I'm trying to figure out, who's telling lies right now.
Because it's quite different from what the russian newspapers are telling. Here you never mention, that there's a real genocide in Osetia.
I don't understand, why the western newspapers reveal only facts which suit their position
Art, VL, Russia
The West will not let Russia invade a free democratic country. Should Russia show signs of wanting to totally conquer Georgia then the US and EU will respond and Russia will be shown once again that it cannot suppress liberty and freedom.
Dain, Canberra, Australia
the west (America) will do nothing to help Georgia, as they did nothing to help Hungary , Czechoslovakia and all the other countries and nationalities that the Soviet bear says are theirs !
We were told communism was dead and Putin wasn't in charge anymore :) Communism is alive in well .
sean connor, Calabogie, Canada
Its time to go and help the people of Georgia. They were there for us in Iraq and were still there today. Russia snubbed their noses. We need to go and help those who were with us.
Russia just wants the oil pipleline.
Putin can rot for all I care.
We need to help the people in Georigia.
nikki, las vegas, usa
Russia hasn`t enough territories. Their politics in Caucasus always was "divide and rein". They will let kill and hate Caucasians each other as much as possible, after pseudo "peace-maker" Vania will drink vodka in Tskhinvali. Putin is a real butcher: Tchecheny, Gali,soxumi, Beslan, Nord-ost...
Dave, Toronto, Canada
There are ways to 'help' the Georgian military without being so public in doing so. US Air Force has been flying the Gerogian military personnel from Iraq back to Georgia, that's the public help.
Brian, Gulf Coast, USA
It has plenty to do with Kosovo. By illegally carving up Serbia, the US abolished the international law that prohibited superpowers (ie the US, Russia, and China) from carving up smaller states. The US also invented regime change with its illegal actions in Iraq. There is nothing America can do.
Robert, Whittier, USA
This is a wake up call to all small democracies surrounded by authoritarian governments. You can not depend on the west for your survival. These small democracies must have tough ground units that can fight a guerilla style war inflicting allot of damage. Depend on yourselves.
s, PA, USA
The U.S. already has enough problems dealing with troops deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan. We don't have the resources to commit troops everywhere in the bloody world. Secondly, we had trainers already there training the Georgians how to fight. Why aren't you complaining about Europe not helping?
dan, las vegas, usa
once again more "blame the west" or "usa"rhetoric. russia has always been an aggressor to her neighbors. the usa must help the georgians as a greatful friend.
mike, pittsburgh, usa
The U.S. will do nothing but talk above board. Below board, Russian equipment will start blowing up in unusual ways.
Steve, Sunnyside, Washington, U.S.A.
I'm a United States citizen. I want to say that we and our allies and friends, including our friends in Georgia should stand strong against Russia. This will not be the end of their aggression if we choose to let it go. Of course, this also takes diplomacy and nobody wants another major war.
Jonathan, Tallahassee, United States
The shame is on America. As we won't help. There are many here who would readily go there and give aid. But the American left supports Vladimir Putin and Communism. Its too bad America has faded into socialism. The cost is the world.
Chris, Evergreen , U.S.A.
Putin is answering NATO's advance into Western Europe. He warned us not to place a missile shield on his border, he said that he would act, he is now doing so.
America will do nothing to help Georgia. This calls in to question the very purpose of the NATO alliance. Putin has won a major round.
Joe Hurley, New York, USA
The west and the US will not let Russia completely invade Georgia. This thing is escalating very fast and it is becoming very clear what Russia is trying to do. I really hope this doesnt turn into a full out war and involve more countries but if it continues the way its going then its going to happen.
Richard, Tokyo, Japan
Everybody's lying
Art, VL, Russia
I guess Georgia hasn't learned yet that you don't pick a fight that you can't win..... ON YOUR OWN
mrtutto, Los Angeles, USA
Keep in mind, Georgia attacked first.
Russia's response is disproportionate and unconscionable, but Georgia kicked the hornet's nest.
mike macon, norton shores, michigan, usa
Let it be known the citizens of America, the true patriots, want to go to battle against our old enemy. I despise what Russia is doing to the people of Georgia, and I detest our government's weakness in aiding them. Now its Georgia, tomorrow its the rest of the former USSR. We must put a stop to it.
Micah Thomas, Tallahassee, USA
The U.S. should be ASHAMED if they don't help out the people of Georgia. The U.S. should be delivering humanitarian aid at the very least. But unfortunately for the victims of the Russian aggression, I don't think the U.S. will be sending in military supplies or troops; thanks to the liberals.
Don Michael, Atlanta, U.S.
The world should be stepping up, Europe should lead this time around. Doubt that would ever happen.
Jon, USA,
Let's get that gutless wonder Obama on this! He will make a long speech and solve the whole thing.
tg, long beach,
I am one American that is truelly outraged by this. I am also outraged that our government will not help our allies that have helped us in recent history.
The world should not support Barak Obama and the Demacrats. My country would be more willing to help if the Dems would allow us too.
Chuck, Glendale, Az, USA
Obviously it would be difficult for the US to respond now because they are tied up in Afghanistan and Iraq. Russia knows this and that is why they chose now to flex their muscles. Their army is a joke compared to America's, and it knows this, that is why it strategically attacked when it did.
Andreas, Augsburg, Germany
The Ossetians and Georgians have been through numerous wars; they have never liked each other. The two cannot live together, and there will never be peace. This is the same situation as Kosovo, except the only difference is the fact that Georgia is a U.S. ally, while Serbia was not.
Ben, New York,
Putin finally found someone he could whip!
Dave, Baileys Crossroads, VA, USA
I am of the belief that if any country wants to remain free and asks the United Sttes for help, it is our duty to help them. Unfortunately, the liberals in this country will start their crying again how President Bush took us to war once again. In the meantime, innocent peopl will die.
Harry, galva, U.S.
We obviously haven't learned anything form the past. Agression gets away with it due to weakness on the part of the west..Russia,Iran,china, etc....It is the first shots of WOrld War 3 which is a war that will be fought over natural resources...when 1% of our oil is cut off...with winter coming
hf, ny, usa
Are you kidding me..If America wants WW3 than go ahead and defend Georgia.This is warning for Czechs.This is what is going to happen to if you keep supporting the Americans.I am so happy that the Russians are showing their Power.We need another actor in the world,so the world can have check and ba
Omario, DC, Washington
John McCain is a senile old man..... If it were up to him we would already be fighting Russia. Let me ask you. When we invaded Iraq for a Regime change, Did Russia, North Korea , China or anybody else attack us ? The answer is NO. Are we going to get sucked into another war ?
mrtutto, Los Angeles, USA
Creation of the Kosovo quasi-state showed that everyone with enough tanks and bombs can change international borders.
Pandora's box is open! Scotland and Northern Ireland get ready!
moler, vancouver,
What this situation highlights is what a complete waste of time the United Nations is.It was created for situations just like this,and it is completely useless and impotent
eric, Raleigh,NC, USA
Funny how the Canadians and Europeans come out now and post criticism about the US for not stepping in. Damned if we do, damned if we don't. Why don't you guys ever step up for freedom? If the Georgians need to rely on you guys they might as well prep their graves.
Brett, Oklahoma City, USA
Anything that happens in the world, it is the US' fault. If we move in this situation, we are condemned as an Imperialist Nation-Builder. If we do not move in this situation, we have "abandoned Georgia". What is the role of the UN? What use are they? "The US will never help"? Nonsense!
Joel, Moorhead, MN
The situation in S.Ossetia is no different to that in Kosovo, except the US is supporting the opposite side in the conflict. Georgia's attack on Russian Peacekeepers (by association on Russia itself) was reckless. The use of Heavy inaccurate weapons by Georgia against civilian areas was criminal.
Kevin, Adelaide, AUSTRALIA
Send in the Messiah Obama!!!
I'm sure that he can talk it over with both sides and work out an agreement in a few minutes.
Scott, Pittsburgh, PA, USA
I think Canada, Mexico and Europe should step in and help Georgia. That way, they can be blamed like the US always is when things don't work out. Oh wait, that will be the case either way...
Dan, Redmond , USA
I am embarrassed by our lack of response here in the US. Russia will take this as a permission slip to do it again and again. Do we have anyone in Washington who will stand up for what's right? These people fought beside us in Iraq. Nice payback. To all countries near Russia: You're on your own.
charlie, dundee, united States
ubfortunately, Kosovo is the reason. Russia told the west when we help kosovo seperatist against a russian backed serbia would allow them to practice a similar interventionist strategy. I Hope the US will stand by our ally but I am afraid we will follw 1930 appeasement model.
Louie, Montgomery, USA
Russia is simply demonstrating its true intentions that have always been there under Putin. Control, power and taking back those places they "lost"--it will not stop here. And, the world is basically powerless to do anything.
Ricky, Asheville, United States
the americans will abandoned georgia, they will not sacrifices there lives for them, they know that russia is not in the mode of playing game
lee, victoria , canada
This has nothing to do with Kosovo, they are two different cases. What Russia is doing to Georgia is shameful. I hope the world will react to this and stand up against Russia.
Blaise, Ouagadougou, Burkina Faso
The Georgian president should have been more careful in dealing with Russian, in other words, his overreliance on the West failed him these days. The US will never help, just stupid UN resolutions, while people are dying. Russian is not a joke, huge army and superpower.
Khamzat, Londres, UK
Actually Georgians should thank there western friends for the current situation, if they didn't support Kosovo's independence this would not happen.
Stefan, Nis, Serbia