Frankly I'm glad the British are pulling out. Britain has fought courageously and is pragmatic about its prospects, and I hope that British soldiers all get home safely. Anyone in the US who thinks that it's just going to take a "surge" to create political breathing room and bring peace to Iraq is guilty of magical thinking. The US will have to pull out someday too, and if the Iraqis can't stop fighting each other now they never will. Maybe Southern Iraq will become more peaceful, as the militias are forced to govern rather than fight. And if it becomes more violent, I don't think it will be accurate to blame the coalition any more.

Mike, Pittsburgh,

I was in Basra (2005). The British forces were content to patrol in their soft-caps and no armor, pretending that they had the situation well in hand. All the while, the Shia militias were biding their time, amassing arms and manpower (with help from the Iranians). British police trainers advised the local police whose ranks were overrun with Mahdi Army and Badr Brigade members. I know of one incident where the British Army failed to follow-up on a solid information regarding a huge weapons cache. They claimed that arms interdiction was not their primary mission?! (To be fair, the US would not make any inquiry either, saying that they weren't going to "mess around" in the British AOR.)

I truly appreciate the service of the British troops in Iraq, and still consider them our closest ally. But the decisions made by the British political and military leadership were a recipe for a slow-motion disaster. They shouldn't have committed troops unless they planned to see it through!

Jack M., Fairfax, Virginia, USA

Don't worry everyone, if the worst comes to the worst Brown will blame it all on Blair.

its going to be quite interesting to see just how he does it, I mean he cannt actually SAY, "its all Blairs fault" ... but without doubt that will be the impression he will skillfully try to create.

Also he has studiously not changed the defence secretary to in extremis he can always sack him.

I presume our American cousins have by now been able to translate Browns carefully crafted words in the recent Bush summit to read, " I dislike the Republican party, i had nothing to do with Iraq, i have no sympathy for our Army/ Armed forces - they waste loads of money, which could be better spent propping up the Labour vote, or the people of iraq and i plan to run out on you at the earliest opportunity"

Trevor Holcroft, Oxford, UK

Sir,
We jumped into join a war without a real purpose for us.
The US based Likudniks are still piping the existential tune of a jingoistic, paranoid armed ghetto. Will we fall for it again?
The brave men and women of the British Armed Forces are not meant to be sandbags for other countries. Let the US dole out weapons to their favoured allies & let them fight their own battles.

SC, London, United Kingdom

The only way to defeat the west is to drive a wedge between the english speaking peoples. Together we have never been defeated, when we fight alone and dont stand united we allow lesser nations to control the outcome. Iran took your sailors as propodanda to lessen the British will to fight. Our own leftists cry defeat every day so that they can assume power. Lord how I miss the days of Reagan and Thatcher. For 50 years the US, Canada and the U.K. stood side by side in Germany facing down the greatest threat in world history. An earlier poster asked if Americans are "grateful". I will say that I have served with British soldiers and always felt that we were brothers fighting for the same cause. I spent time in Greenland training with the Canadian Air Force at Thule and felt the same way. In the end we will realize that we must stand together or we will fall seperately. History teaches that we are connected by Democracy, language and common beliefs. If we allow that to fail us we fall.

Don, Kirkuk,

Our problem in Southern Iraq is not that we can't establish democracy. It is that the democratic choice of most Iraqis there is a Shiite dictatorship on the lines of Iran. That's the trouble with democracy: you can ask people to vote but you can't tell them who to vote for.

We British have not failed in Basra. It is just that what the Basrans want and what we (and the Americans) would prefer are not the same thing. The most likely outcome of this war will be the partitioning of Iraq. Basra will become a protectorate of Iran, Northern Iraq (if it is not invaded by Turkey) will become 'the Republic of Kurdistan' and the central area will become a rump state: a sort of Middle Eastern Serbia without the rest of former Yugoslavia.

This will be Bush's legacy and it is absurd for America's generals to blame it on the British. In the end you cannot tell the tide to go back. You either retreat or you get your feet wet.

Adrian Gilbert, Tonbridge, England

Why are Americans waiting on the sidelines with what seems baited breath hoping almost that the Brits will suffer an ignominious defeat. Will it make you feel better about your own war effort, if so we ought to remember we are allies and should support one another through the worst troubles. Remember this, the USA have to plan their withdrawal yet. Would you thank us for gloating over a potentially perceived failure by the USA?

Mike, Derby, UK

Lions lead by morons. Plus ça change........

Victor M., Malaga, Spain

its not the time to be leaving, not yet, progress is just being made, it will be so counterproductive and for what end?

thom pain, boston, Mass. USA

i wouldn`t say it is a defeat rather mission accomplished. the time has come for the iraqies to fend for themselves. it would create a civil war but who cares that is what they choose.

auzy, kl,

Oh dear. So you cant win a war by wearing berets and giving out sweeties.

But the liberals told us you could.

They wouldnt have lied would they?

Geoff M, Josselin, France

Blair and Bush did not listen to the middle east experts who warned Iraqis would fight amongst themselves because they thought they knew better. Soldeirs now pay the price.

Steve Byrne, Christchurch, UK

As The Times reported earlier this year - the second most popular baby boys name in the UK is Mohammed. It's predicted to become the most popular name by next year. Will Britain's Armed Forces really be expected to impose "Western-style democracy" on Muslim countries ... when based on the demographics Britain is becoming a Muslim nation ?

Robert, Luton,

The American version of peace keeping involves flying jet aircraft at 30,000 feet and blowing up civilians.

Lee , Wednesbury,

Ho Chi Minh City, formerly Saigon. The old order changes. But not for recalcitrants that continue to use Imperial measurement and colonial place names (example, Burma rather than Myanmar). Come on Telegraph, flash to the new reality. Saigon moment: More like Custer’s last stand.

Andrew Milner, Karuizawa, Nagano

The person who placed Britain in this mess, the ex Labour Prime Minister Blair has merrily run away to seek further lucrative fields to conquer. Noticeably without a care for the suffering inflicted upon the grieving families of men and women who have given their lives unjustly in Iraq. For those troops remaining the eventually retreat seems also highly perilous.

Jack, Newtown, UK

The great lion of Europe must never be chased out the way the Americans were from South Vietnam. England must let the Shiites in the South know that if they are intimidated during their withdrawal from Iraq, the Shiites will pay a price that they never like to think about, . The British soldiers are much more disiphlined then the American ones, and are better fighter at that.
Saigon with not be repeated at Basra, so do not worry too much about the Mahdi army or other gangs roaming Iraq these days all thanks to the White House and the State of Israel which controls the White House.

Will Saigon be repeated again when the American troops retreat from Iraq and in what form or matter, that is the question to be asked.
I have great faith in the British military commanders and their foresight in making sure that the British troops will have an orderly withdrawal from Iraq, that is also in the best interest of Iran, and not the other way around.

vespasianus, Paramus n.j, United States

Whatever the truth on the ground, the Iraqis will want to give the impression that they have kicked the British out of Southern Iraq. This is entirely consistent with claims by Hamas and Hezbollah that they kicked the Israelis out of Gaza and lebanon respectively - even though the Isrealis did a phased, planned withdrawal in both cases. It all has to do with Arab macho posturing and self-delusion than military reality on the ground. The british simply have to leave with dignity and honour at a time and place of their choosing - the Iraqi groups will spin it how they like anyway. Remember - Saddam and the Iraqis were convinced that they won the first Gulf War! If they had been sensible and not deluded themselves, the situation would not have led to the second.

Humphrey Fanning, Marlborough, UK

Get out while you can, to hell with the rest, this place is not worth one more dead. This was all about profit, the blood of our youth, paid the price.

Don in Dallas, Dallas, USA/Texas

now is not the time to leave. we are all just hopefully seeing a sea change. the uks' leaving is ill timed & unneccessary you just had an election you could leave a good amount of troops for a year more then if its not changed , thanks and wish you well, now it seems to push the whole mess over the edge in giving up the whole south. am i missing something about supply routes etc.? we need you now more than ever. America much appreciates fr all your sacrifice, your lost servicepeople and help but we need you to carry on a bit longer!

thom pain, boston, Mass. USA

You've put the problem incorrectly. It's not a question of more experience with counter-insurgency, for British forces do indeed have that. What we see in Iraq is at least two huge forces at work, neither of which is accurately called "insurgencies." One is a large part of the population that wants foreigners out, that is angry at occupation and at humiliation and at America's brutual tactics and inepitude at even getting the water or electricity running. The other represents opposing sides in a potential civil war, the quite likely future break-up of the country into at least three mini-states. There is no center to hold. America's pointless, illegal, and ill-considered invasion has created a Frankenstein monster.

JOHN CHUCKMAN, Toronto, Canada

David of London...thanks mate for your comments. Hopefully the MoD and its leadership will realise that our Forces have been so reduced that we're struggling to commit. British Forces.(tell you what those words send a shiver down my spine) are still the finest in the world . We love to help out our American cousins..makes us proud to do so..Just wonder though whether they are grateful.

kirk, Rotherham, UK

Well, the withdrawal might be ugly and embarrassing but in the end the troops will see again England Green. Just as the Americans actually left Vietnam. Embarrassed but alive and in one piece...

It's going to be very ugly and more than deadly embarrassing for the chaps who won't be able to extricate from Iraq: ie the iraqis who worked for the coalition (whatever their motives) or didn't fight it.

And make no mistake: they will be handed to the "victors" by the withdrawing powers, simply as a token and a deal. Why? Because any future Iraqi government will have to prove his legitimacy. Such legitimacy shall need the suppression of necessary traitors.

Every colonial war ended the same way. And Iraq is but an "ugly and embarrassing" colonial adventure.

Ronnie, PARIS, FRANCE

British troop withdrawal will give yet another clear message to the Islamists that the west cannot fight a sustained war against a growing global terrorist threat. The jihadists will see this as a another victory over the infidel crusaders ... and the west will continue down the path of apologetic, strategy-less acquiescence.

When will the west realize that a cohesive policy against the Islamist ideology is the only long-term solution to this problem.

Mark Chad, St. John's, Newfoundland, Canada

I'm sorry, but if losing "10 to 15 men" is considered a major military defeat, then perhaps you ought to simply disband your military altogether... But then again, you couldn't even perform so-called peace-keeping operations in your own backyard in Bosnia, now could you?...

Paul Kelley, Columbia, SC, USA

Whatever laudable objectives were in mind in the invasion of Iraq, they were lost in the first few months.
The present "elected" government is totally powerless and it is self evident that although vast numbers of Iraqis voted for the first time in reasonably independent elections they voted on sectarian lines, and since then far to many have supported the sectarian militias
There is absolutely no prospect of a stable government being established any time in the foreseeable future. The presence of our troops is only serving to provide a ready target for all and sundry. Bring them home now,

K Wells, Bognor Regis, , UK

I can do no more than thoroughly agree with Kirk of Rotherham.
Gutless politicians screw up and then force an under resourced Army to try to cover their blushes.
Withdraw now, before another British soldier is killed trying to right the wrongs perpetrated by ignorant politicians (on BOTH sides of the political spectrum).
(presently from Antalya)

David Michael, London, UK

Mike Wilkes of Brisbane. Surely you have grasped the fact the 'Middle East' (apart from Israel) doesn't understand democracy (imperfect as it is) as we do. Maybe one day.......but not in our lifetimes matey. Get a grip man, the West is protecting its oil interests- Iran is next, note the biggest fleet in history gathering in the Gulf as we speak. Invent something to replace oil and all the problems will all disappear overnight but you will have to fight Shell and Exxon et el first.

Victor M., Malaga, Spain

How will New Labour and New Gordon Brown spin this defeat into a magnificent victory?

Phillip, Burnley, Lancashire

If the point of the criminal invasion and brutal occupation was to "put the Iraqis back in control" then it could have been achieved without doing anything. If the point was to put the US puppet "Iraqi" regime in control then it has failed.

Richard Cheeseman, Wellington, New Zealand

Well done Mr Blair. Well done Labour. You must all be very proud of yourselves.

David Masu, Zürich,

This retreat or withdrawal is the most pragmatic option available. The Iranians have won their trophy, Basra, as well as the entire southern Iraq. Their next step would be to prepare for the future conflict with the Arabs. The British military should not have followed Rumsfeld into the debacle called Iraq. The US military will follow the British out of Iraq. The only regret is the wasted British and American lives. Let the Arabs and the Persians now have their fight.

Niwa Sofola, Atlanta, GA. USA

What rot! Rightly or wrongly the coalition invaded Iraq in order to establish a democratic, prosperous, peaceful and popular society. Every time one of the allied armies leaves before those goals are achieved it is a significant defeat for the democratic cause. If the second biggest allied army (and the self-proclaimed insurgency expert) leaves unsuccessful and under enemy fire, like Elphinstone from Kabul or Westmoreland from Saigon, that will be a calamitous, history making defeat. It will still have repercussions fifty years from now and our grand-children will still be picking up the pieces, no matter what spin the politicians and political generals put on it.

Mike Wilkes, Brisbane, Australia

Quite agree with the last statement..If the Americans cannot control Baghdad with 160,000 troops..what little chance of UK forces controlling Basra with 8,000. Bush is trying to save his embarrasment...UK forces are after saving lives. Why oh why were UK forces allowed to dwindle?....As usual gutless politicians are at fault. Wish we had a Thatcher to lead us into war. All coalition forces should now withdraw. Democracy is alien to the middle east. Once we have left a power vaccuum will be created and one man..another Saddam..will take over. Then peace will once again reign through a strong fist. It's all they know.

kirk, Rotherham, UK