I really think all religions should be outlawed. they all, mainstream or small sects, come down to abuse and control of women and children in the end and it should just be stopped before it starts.

Thalia, london,

It's all very well to talk about indoctrination and brainwashing but what's needed is a way of de-brainwashing these people. How many therapists/psychologists/psychiatrists will it take to normalise them - if indeed it's possible at all?

leila, manchester, uk

We seem to have reached a point where we all have to address the problem of who, exactly, makes the law.
Religions like to think that they know "the law of God" and can apply it, hence justifying "martyrdom operations" and "preparing a woman for marriage to an elder of the Holy Church"
We, in democratic countries, like to think of the "separation of Church and state" and call the same things "murderous acts of terrorism" and "grooming an underage girl for sexual abuse"
We can't have it both ways, and we appear to be headed towards increasing confrontation over this.
Personally, I'm a democratic atheist.

Alan, Greenwich, NY/USA

Mormonism as a whole has never been regarded as part of mainstream Christianity due to major differences of belief and many Christians regard it as a cult. In its early days it was known for some of the abuses we see in this account. However as with many deviant religious groups, when it is successful there comes a desire for respectability in the eyes of the world and the main group will modify and abandon some of the more extreme practices. The problem is there will always be the extremists that claim to be the "true" followers of the original Prophet. Thats what we have here. This is a break away group but you will probably find them nearer to the original thing than others. The main Latter Day saints are very large in the USA and for the most part respectable citizens.

David, S London,

Ha! Do we really believe this LDS is religion? I personally don't. In any religious and atheist groups, there are wonderful and crazy people, and in each group there may be only a few who are worse. For these, links with religions or political views become more an excuse than anything else.
Our brain has the ability to brainwash itself either way: whether it ends up being good or bad, believing or not: the methods and "evidence" supporting each view are the same. If it was not like this, we would all think the same about God.
Religious people or not, it is not bad to see the Last Days of these inSanes... (hopefully)

Chicco, Oxford,

I agree with Alan. The fiction of religion cannot be sustained without brainwashing.

Spike, Joburg, South Africa

So now what happens to those kids? History of government's care of children suggests that now the real horrors will begin. There will be abuse from foster parents, prostitution, drugs and suicide to the degree that it would have been much better to leave them all alone.
That seems to be the way it works.

Andrew Horning, Freedom, Indiana

You cannot take the worst from the religious world and compare it to the best of the secular world and remain objective. And if you really want to compare, the people killed by secular governments and societies is much, much higher than those killed in the name of religion (the worst segment of the religious world).

My religion feeds the hungry (100% goes to the recepient, nothing for adminstrative costs). They donate tens of millions of dollars every year helping those in need of disaster relief. They have programs in place for people in wheelchairs, educating third world residents, and so on and so on. We don't really blow our horns too much because we believe it defeats the purpose. Quiet service rendered is true service indeed. Those who serve for recognition already have their reward.

When you hear of extremists like the ones in this story, who are clearly outside of the religious mainstream, DO NOT equate that as meaning that all religions brainwash their people.

Don Layton, Bend, Oregon / USA

Sorry, but it's just one more instance of religious mania eliminating common sense and rational thinking. In other words - it's brainwashing.
This may vary in degree, but it's true of all religions.
(At least in this case they didn't disappear into a cave to await the end of the world.)

alan, germany,

And those who are saying these aren't Mormons are right. I'm tired of journalists getting it wrong. This isn't a sect or a splinter group from what people usually call Mormons, which is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Too call this a Mormon sect or a splinter group would be like saying Bapists are a Catholic splinter group, or that Lutherans are a Catholic sect. It's a totally different church, people.

Austin, Round Rock, Texas

I'm currently living on Baker Street, San Angelo, West Texas and Fort Concho, where the 417 children plus various mothers from the FLDS "Yearn For Zion" sect are being protected, is at the end of this street.

I'm a British author (Sarah Holland, you can find me on wikipedia) and I can SEE these women and children with my own eyes everytime I drive or cycle past the fort. I'm appalled at some of the comments I read above from my countrymen back home in England. The women and children at the Fort are absolutely terrified of what's happening to them. They've been brainwashed on an horrific scale, trained to believe sexual abuse of minors is God's dearest wish and that if an elderly man wants to have full sexual intercourse with lots of different 12 year old girls in his care this is a cause for joyous celebration.

People here are saying, rightly, that this is like the M. Night Shyamalan film THE VILLAGE, where an entire community do not realize the world outside exist

Sarah Holland, San Angelo, TX 76903, USA

For the love of sliced bread, these people are not part of a "mormon sect". Latter-Day Saints pray to God the Father; these people pray to Adam. To learn more about these peoples leaders checkout this link:
http://www.mormonfundamentalism.com/LCW-Bio.html

pedro, orlando, Florida

That's right. These are not Mormons. Some US reporters get that wrong, but I've noticed that UK reporters seem to get it wrong even more often, it must be the distance...

Michael, San Francisco, California

The land of the Free! The Democratic society. The American Dream.

I think the US government need to condemn and be critical of its own backyard before they invade, imprison and police others in the world.

Yas, London, UK

I agree that any subversive or predatory behaviour should be investigated, but the comments about clothing, food, tv and crayons are prepostorous.

Do they need any that rubbish? They will probably be happier without being bombarded by advertising and images of "pretty" skinny fake blondes.

Jay Tee, Oxford, UK

"They need a dress for a four-year-old. They specified the dress should be long down to the ankles, have long arms, a loose waist, and be a solid colour in a pastel shade. I don’t think there is a place in Texas you can get a dress like that"

Does no-one in Texas own a sewing machine?

This is truly ridiculous, there is no reason that these people should not be given unprocessed food, the means to make their own clothing (or at least to be allowed the clothing left behind at the ranch). After all, we're talking about children who have been brought up in a *basic* and traditional manner, and women who have voluntarily accompanied them - surely their needs are not so complicated!

Brijit, Paris, France

This sect has been tolerated for nearly ninety years and it is well known what has been going on there. There are now reported to be between 10,000 and 40,000 adherents to these beliefs. Quite apart from the horrid abuse of young women and older ones in polygamous marriages, the sect expels young men at a prodigious rate. After all, if Warren Jeffs, Barlow and the other 'elders' are to have many wives, they need to get rid of young men. Boys as young as 13 have been regularly dumped at night in neighbouring communities. I am very glad the Texas state authorities have acted, and that they acted in 1953, but what a disgrace this sect was not stamped out in the 1920s. It has been operating in an identical way ever since then and has bred more and more victims to become the monster it now is.

Tony Volpe, Newcastle upon Tyne, UK

I can only hope that the needs of these people are thoroughly and precisely respected.
Why there is a problem with their clothes is hard to see for they will have their own clothes and should be using them. Forced use of new clothes (even copied in style) will add to their disorientation and distress. Just collect all the kids clothes and let the women with them sort out who's is whose.

We are, as a society, trying to reform the diet of our children away from processed food so children in care should be given healthy unprocessed food as a matter of course. If kids in care are given junk processed food that is wrong.

Nor should TV and other media be a problem. A TV is not an essential part of a healthy life, rather the reverse, going by reports from families who choose not to use them.

Just because certain specific acts are seen as seriously misguided (underage sex) is no reason to condemn other aspects oif their lifestyle. Respect where deserved, please.

Shan Morgain, Newport, Wales UK

Cult religions are the produce of democracy, it is their human rights to be cult members in a "free" country. What do you expect, folks???

A.S., B'ham., UK

Yet another example of Reigious sickness.... further supported by the article about "God in the Whitehouse".

I would suggest that more people should read and understand the Aetheist's view... take a look at the Richard Dawkins article and links.

Robert, London,

These men have created a cult, they are pedophiles who have isolated and indoctrinated women and enslaved young girls for sex. Local, state and Federal agencies continue to delude themselves and enable these cults by allowing these groups to call themselves a church, this is denial of the worst sort.

Freedom of religion should not include religions that espouse slavery, child abandonment (where are the boys) and pedophilia. Someone has to stop these men.

Barbara, Baltimore, MD

These are not Mormons. These are some radical group called Fundamentalists or something.

Gabe, Sanfrancisco, California