Whitefoot you need to look at Rothmans or whatever its called these days, try the double in 98 and 02. I have been an Arsenal fan since 54 and always admired ManU until Fergie took over. There never was any trouble between the 2 clubs until he took over, he has been a great manager but is the world champion sore loser. He is also extremely wily - he obviously had the pitch flooded to stop Arsenal's slick short passing game and sent his team out to put pressure on them straightaway. I hate to say this as I loath Moan Utd, but they played extremely well and could easily have scored 7 or 8 - it was up to us to respond which we did not do! As for showboating I'm all for it BUT don't complain if you get kicked for it! In the good old days players like Norman Hunter and the great Dave Mackay would have broken your legs if you tried it with them. Finally how come so many Londoners and Southerners support MU,just trophy hunters! There are enough teams to support down south,be true to them.

Brian Wildey, Fleurance, France

Of course, it's totally acceptable when Thierry Henry does his "look this way and pass the other" moves when 7-0 up against Middlesbrough.

If Arsenal didn't want to be the subject of a "mickey" take, maybe they shouldn't allow themselves to take a 4 goal scudding!

Ian Thomson, Houston, Texas, USA

If you watch the game again, you'll notice that the crowd were cheering every pass.
First, Van der Sar did a cheeky kickup then smacked it, causing the crowd to cheer
Then the left back kept the ball in play by back heeling it causing the crowd to cheer yet again.
This was then topped off by Nani doing his showboat piece. Fair play, if he keeps possession then I fail to see the problem. He was just giving the crowd what they wanted to see, the third in a succession of 'fancy' moves.

And I'm not even a Utd. supporter!

Jamie, Halifax, West Yorkshire

Well Done Manu. Love it when you play well. Sad that you lose at M. City but that is life. Ars. is good time I just hope they do not do better than Man Utd.

Ray Ray, Coventr, England

I think the BBC should ask for it's money back .
It seems to me that Arsenal wasn't deep down interesting in wining this game. They even left there best forward on the bench,
to emphasis this, for most of the game. There is talk of teams playing more games, but if they short change their own fans and the public - then what we need is less games.

A Walton, Leicester, England

Stephen from bristol, you could have fooled me about the fact that you are "not a supporter of Arsenal or Manchester United." All your criticsm is all one sided. Go on MAN UNITED

Sir A. Ferguson, Manchester,

So Nani was being disrespectful to Arsenal? Not half as disrespectful as Arsenal were to United, the supporters and the game of football by not even trying. I assumed at half-time that Arsenal , having received a rollocking, would come out with all guns blazing, but I couldn't believe the way they ambled out on to the pitch, clearly not caring about the match.
Nani's "showboating" or whatever you want to call it was a moment of great significance in the psychological battle between the 2 teams. Time will tell if Arsenal have the bottle to respond to their humiliation.

Dougy, Belfast,

Steven of Bristol

Do you actually watch much football? Over the last few years Fergie has always spoken on Sky/ITV with surprising frankness on the (few) occasions that United lose. He's even honest enough to accept a draw.
As for the grey shirts affair, you clearly DON'T remember it! Can I remind you he changed them at half-time and they've never been used since. Just how exactly is that an excuse????

Anyway, why spend so much time and effort trying to find something to whinge about when (at last) we're seeing a great season of football. If you were a true fan you'd simply enjoy it!

Duckman (proudly born in Manchester, now in London 'taking their women and jobs')

Duckman, Twickenham,

Hey Alun your club is one of the richest in the world as well. If they're not choosing to spend on depth, there's nothing to praise in that.

amy, seattle, usa

"flaunting football’s unwritten code of conduct" - Sorry??? What unwritten code? Entertaining the paying public? Right. First things first - let's get rid of that code. Must have been made by clodhopping players who can;t do it. Then let's make it compulsory. I bet youtube has been inundated by people wanting to watch that again.
Also, I don't remember anyone complaining when Rooney did that to the Turks in his first game for England.... we all gigled in enjoyment: as I did when I watched Nani doing it.

Paul Murray, Liverpool,

I saw cantona do that ball juggling thing and he was applauded for it. Should we be telling them not to please a crowd who are paying already extortionate fees to watch these games? i disagree with the view expressed by another commentor on wenger though i think he's a great manager who has made the premier league much more interesting as have fergie and the special one (morinho)

simon lomax, warrington, uk

The point about this game is that it shows how little Arsenal have in terms of quality reserves. When fit their first eleven is a match for anyone but the reserve defenders / Bendtner are poor. All this talk of the big four ignores the fact that Wenger is doing this on the (relative) cheap, whereas Chelsea can afford reserve players like Sheva and United can spend big after winning the title. Good luck to them but we Gooners are making it hard for ourselves.

Alun, London,

Well I'm glad Arsene Wenger feels humiliated about the drubbing his team got at the hands of Man Utd. Both managers seem to think they can put out any old team for the FA Cup these days. Both are guilty as each other, it's just that Fergie's lot had a bit more about them this time. So, Arsene, just think if you don't take things seriously, you could fall flat on your face.

Big Bri, Preston, Lancashire

what about pires and henry's attempt at penalty showboating a few years back? was that not showboating because the messed it up? winger wenger again...

djm, uk,

matt, united did not walk out on the cup for an overseas jolly. they had their arms twisted by the authorities - they wanted to defend their cup. but the cup certainly isn't as important as the league or europe and you could tell that by fergie resting our entire first choice midfield, as well as tevez.

and mike... the best technical football team in the country is united. don't confuse the media's permanent arsenal love-in with fans who actually watch the game. never forget that united were playing the beautiful game long before boring, boring arsenal discovered it (about the time they lost their class).

jem, london, uk

What is amazing is that Arsene is still at the Gooners.......what has he exactly won in his reign there, why does his chairman not want somebody with hunger in his belly! come on Arsene
how difficult can it be, you kick a ball into a net, then you spend millions on players who are meant to kick that ball for you
you don't need a doctorate for that do you.................. maybe you need to run off to Spain AND ENDURE SOME REAL PRESSURE!!

WHITEFOOT, London, uk

wenger should be humiliated by the petulant and disgracefully violent response of a team that barely showed up. forget the fact that it was only wayward finishing that kept the score in single figures, arsenal could have had three or four players sent off. if the ref saw gallas kicking nani, he should have sent him off; if he didn't, it's not too late.

jem, london, uk

I am not a supporter of Arsenal or Manchester United, but it is sadly predicatable that the vast majority of the pro-United comments here are posted from all corners of the country - indeed, anywhere from Manchester - whereas the vast majority of the pro-Arseanl comments come from London. This just confirms what most football fans know - most Manchester United 'supporters' are glory-hunters who do not go near their local teams.

Also, whatever one thinks of Arsenal and their manager, there can be no possible dispute that Ferguson is the worst loser in football. When his team lose, he ALWAYS blames it on someone or something else (usually the referee, but we all remember the 'wrong-coloured' shirts affair of some years ago).

Stephen, Bristol,

Who pays Wenger's salary? It is indirectly the fans who pay ridiculous sums of money for what is all too often drab, conservative, antiseptic football.

When you have earned the right to your salary by playing football in the manner Nani demonstrated at the weekend, lighting up the pitch, scoring once and creating two against a supposedly 'top' side like Arsenal, you should be allowed to express yourself on the pitch.

Nani's bit of self-indulgence on Saturday was more memorable than the entire 90 minutes plus extra time and penalties of the FA cup final between the sides two years ago.

When a team bothers to ensure that, with 80 minutes gone, they are not on the wrong side of a 4-0 kicking by their fiercest rivals, then they can hope to expect some 'respect' from their opponents.

This is symptomatic of the 'respect' culture endemic in our society, where few deserve it but many demand it.

Alan T, Oxford, UK

Mmm, Bob Smith, "a showboating reserve in a meaningless competition"? Of course, yoou're right on the spot to understand how real football fans feel about the F.A. Cup, aren't you? Down there in Sunny Australia! Or are you just bitter Arsenal fan who can't take defeat, like Wenger. What is it this time - the pitch/ physical opponents/they wanted it more/the Cup isn't important/they didn't let us play? I still remeber Arsenal's hero Tony Adams after United's withdrawal in 2000 claiming United should never be allowed to compete in it again for disrespecting the Cup! How times change.

Al., Durham, United Kingdom.

I´m not a supporter of any Premier league club nor do I have a preference for any Premier league club. I just like to see good football , mainly from TV . While I accept my views of most clubs are not definitive I must say I do find Arsenal , its team and manager to be unpleasant . I accept its the nature of managership to take a blinkered view of their own teams shortcomings , refereeing decisions etc , but Wenger ´s behaviour has degraded and cheated a club once regarded in the forefront of order , reputation and integrity . Rather than permit the Club to continue in Wenger´s image it might be better to restore Arsenal to its proper place by consigning Wenger to immediate history .

paul rayner, london, uk

Arsenal showed no desire or presence this game. It was almost as if Wenger didn't want Sir Lex to walk away with the satisfaction of having thrashed a rival who actually made the effort. Now that would be more embarrasing wouldn't it, Arsene? Anyway, as far back as I have been a Gunners fan, they have always had some excuse for their failure. I think they should play the team in pink gunnerware until they show their manhood in the face of a giant red tide. They played like pansies and if they felt like kicking anything, it should have been the ball in the net. I am glad Nani fed a dose of reality to the sore loosers. Well done Manu!

JiggyP, Philadelphia, US

Same old gooners so gracious in defeat. How an earth has the fa cup become a worthless competition. You havent won anything in 3 years, and by no means can call beating ac milan, or winning the league a banker.
It was the same when you lost to spurs. Any true fan loves the trip to wembley. The facts are you got a hiding. And if your cup form continues like this in the big games, you better just prey you dont end up with out a trophy again.

Tom, Manchester,

Again another showing of Arsenal and their bad sportsmanship when they lose.

I would feel embarrassed if I were a Gooner. Always full of excuses...
"United won because they wanted it more, no other reason. Arsenal are reknowned to be the best technical team in the country, few fans of football would argue with that. The sound and deserved thrashing Arsenal received resulted from the arsenal players lask of interest,"

"they wanted it more", "lack of interest" - you LOST - get over it!

This kind of excuse is pathetic!

ChasNDave, Brampton, Cumbria, England

Arsenal didn't care. It was a reflection of the increasing irrelevence of the F.A. Cup. man U were desperate for a win, Arsenal could really do without the distraction. It is worth noting that Man U's decision to withdraw from the competition in 2000 signalled it's demise. Now we are supposed to care? As for Nani, who is he? So far a showboating reserve in a meaningless competition. Wow.

Bob Smith, Melbourne, Australia

I think that wenger and his rogues need to be put in their place. there are no rules that say you cannot do keepie -up etc. If its legal on the pitch what are they complaining about?

The only thing that humiliated Wenger and his players were their players and their choice of play. Thier manner of losing was also undignified after all they had one man red carded when it should have been two. If I had been the ref, I would not have been so lenient with them.

They deserved to lose 6 nil. also, They do not deserve to be league leaders. Roll on next weekend when other teams will know how they can be beaten. Looking forward to ManU taking the league title.

Glasgow bobby

bobby seran, Glasgow, Scotland

" . . . flaunting football’s unwritten code of conduct"

Don't you know the difference between flaunting and flouting, Oliver? The Times used to have literate sub-editors years ago.

John , Hackney,

Arsenal's young players say there the best because there having a good run in the league, but to be the best you gotta beat the best... Sorry Arsenal

Matt, Market Drayton, England

Man U certainly show boated against City last week and Spurs the week before - what geniuses.

bob torrent , London,

Wenger needs to go to specsavers! Every time one of his players lets their club down with some serious foul play, he claims he hasn't seen it. I wish i could get his job, where it didn't matter if i was watching the match. Will he ever come out and say it was bad play? As for the Nani situation, i think it's ridiculous to lambast him. All through out football history we've had "showboaters" Bestie, Maradonna,Gazza and Cruyff. Henry wasn't adverse to it either. It all comes down to class in the end, something that Arsenal need and United have in abundance. Arsene should stand up and be a man for once and admit his team were a poor second on Saturday. Outplayed and out fought in every area.

Look at last week when United lost to City, Giggs came out and stated that City deserved the win as they had been better all round. Form is temporary, class is permanent

Shane P, Edinburgh,

wenger seems to forget the time when Pires and henry tried that ridiculous showboat penalty against MAn City, if that wasnt humiliating nothing is!!! Nani was just demonstrating his skill like Henry did for Arsenal no one complained then!

Imran, woking,

This game showed two things: Man U has the better strength in depth; and any suggestion that Arsenal owns the beautiful game in the UK is just daft. Man U are both highly effective and attractive to watch - especially in this mood.

However, it is not possible to draw conclusions about the relative strengths of either club's first teams. We need to await the outcome of the Premiership title for that - though it will be extremely tight at the top, with two such class acts battling it out.

Sapphie, Langley, UK

Nani is a talented player we can all agree on that, he showed what he's about in that game we can honestly say that he's worth the money (£14million).. Arsenal just don't like being humilated and Arsene is one of the biggest winers we have seen in the league

Matt, Market Drayton, England

I love the way Arsene Wenger forgets about his own teams antics does anyone recall The Pires and Henry penalty farce against Man City, that was an absolute discgrace. That was humiliation for both teams. Talking of Nani's antics that was just pure entertainment and skill no one complains when a foreign team like barcelona or real madrid showboat when they are 4-0 up!!!!

Imran, woking,

On more then one occasion Wenger has "had a word" with some of his players about showboating, players including Henry, Bergkamp, Kanu and Vieira were reminded not to do it after games including fa cup and league games
It was disrespectful but Nani is a young and gifted player, these things happen and i'm sure Alex will have a word

jay, cardiff,

George Best is worshipped for far more provocative showboating...and rightly so. The very fact that it "isn't necessary" is what makes it so entertaining and Arsenal deserve to feel humiliated for such a gutless performance. Well done Nani and, er, keep it up.

Neil McF, Southampton, England

5 points clear, unbeaten against the big teams in the games that matter and without the distraction of the FA Cup. This of course is the positive spin to the aftermath of Saturdays mauling, but if Arsenal win the league nobody will care who wins the tin pot domestic cups. Interesting how suddenly a cup that United walked out on a couple of years ago for an overseas jolly up now holds such importance to their fans.
Two final points. No problem with Nani doing his tricks and flicks, all very nice and fancy. But ultimately they did nothing but wind the opposition up and he will end up with a broken leg.
Secondly, the next time the saintly Manchester United fans ask for respect for the boys of Munich, maybe they will remember not to sing vile songs about Arsenals manager or about those who lost their lives at the Hillsborough disaster. Disgusting.

Matt Nicolson, London,

The question that should be asked is about the Arsenal players desire. United won because they wanted it more, no other reason. Arsenal are reknowned to be the best technical team in the country, few fans of football would argue with that. The sound and deserved thrashing Arsenal received resulted from the arsenal players lask of interest, which I think we all agree is unacceptable. I am an arsenal fan of 25 years.

Mike, London, UK

Wenger needs to grow up (oh, and get some players who can do keepy-up!)

Charles Watkins, Sydney, Australia

As a neutral I can see that Gilbert Phiri is obviously an Arsenal fan who just can't accept that they were well and truly beaten by a better team on the day. And stop making excuses about not having a full team. Utd didn't play Tevez, Ronaldo, Hargreaves or Giggs.

George, Glasgow, UK

I never heard Wenger complain when Henry used to showboat

Justin Bilton, Telford, Shropshire

Football is about entertainment. Brilliant players always show us what they can do on the pitch. In our club, we all cheered Nani when he did his things on his day, including some few enlightened Arsenal fans. Someone saw the somersault? These critics just lack class and they want us to settle for that. They may have as well joined Gallas & Co. on the long list of Arsenal goons masquerading as football(ers) fans! Well done Nani and long live the football game.

Emmanuel, Kampala, Uganda

The game has shown that our deputy fullbacks Traore and Hoyte are not good enough to play for Arsenal. They are young and maybe they'll get better, although what I've seen from Hoyte so far doesn't make me think positive. Diarra should have been kept and maybe it would have been better to loan out Traore or both to get them some experience. But if Sagna or especially Clichy gets injured will be in big trouble. Two heavy cup away defeats should make the boss think about it.

Fleck Joachim, Vienna, Austria

Wenger humiliated by Nani's showboating? This is a poor excuse. If his players show more response to some meanngless juggling than a 4-0 stuffing he needs to enter the transfer market in a big way.

Tim Duffy, Belfast, N Ireland

From a neutral's perspective man u absolutely steam-rollered arsenal. They created chance after chance and if it hadn't been for Lehman and Rooney scuffing a couple of shots they could have been into double figures by half time.
Arsenal were woeful and it was interesting that both da silva and eboue (serial hacker that he is) had stud up tackles within minutes of 2nd half starting. A cynic may suggest a ploy to kick utd out of their rythm.
Nani's showboating - unnecessary but in no way condones the spiteful arsenal response. But we're all used to that once the heat comes on them. Bad winners, bad losers.
Well done utd.

Patx, Brisbane,

Putting the game in the proper perspective leads to the conclusion that 3 of the goals (Rooney and Fletcher's)came from Arsenal's own bungling than any real creativity from Man U. That Traore and Hoyte do not cut the mustard is apparent. If you are Arsene Wenger do you go out to buy better full-backs to compete with Sagna and Clichy, bearing in mind that any world class star wouldn't be content with being on the bench deputising, or you stick with the two inept deputies? After all, they can only play Carling or when the team is down to bare bones. The sale of the versatile Diarra to Pompey now looks so uninformed.

Gilbert Phiri, Swindon, UK

Enlish football needs to loosen up on their stupid unwritten rules. Obviously Arsenal players aren't gonna like it when their being shown-up but to go and condone them kicking at Nani for that reason is just disgusting. And for Sir Alex to bemoan him for expressing himself even though the job had been done was even more disgusting.

Ezee-T, Durban, South Africa

Ferguson told Nani "he didn’t need to do that", i.e. the humiliation was already complete by that point. Not so much a telling-off as an indication of the gesture's redundancy.

Sean, London,

There was a startling gulf between the sides, and Arsenal did well to keep it to 4-0. If Arsenal go on to win the league, it will be quite an accomplishment.

www.wickeddeflection.com

433, Boston, USA