It was not a cop-out when Sven said there is no Elano in England. The italians, Brasil and Germany have won the world cup several times since 1960. England just once. Ponder that instead of blamining Sven.

Swen Sjolin, Malmo, Sweden

So Mr samuels not really a worried united fan are you? Could it be that Sven having success at 'little City' scares you? A very bitter man I feel sorry for you.

Neil, Manchester(obviously),

Very good, Mr Samuel. Keep on having a pop at Sven and Manchester City, like any of us care.

Maybe you're deluded enough to believe that the English national side has a divine right to win every tournament they play in, but the vast majority can see clearly that the PLAYERS are not up to that task.

In the meantime I will continue to read your column to see what other tripe you're capable of coming up with. Well done!

Mick, Manchester,

Ok, ok Mr Samuels, rant over, can we have a report on the game now?

Sean Lehy, Ramsbottom,

What a crass comment "but he is not Ronaldinho. If he were, he would not be at Manchester City" The future is bright the future isis blue CITEH the only team IN Manchester!

barcabloo, Barcelona,

England is past - get over it (despite the fact that Sven actually had the best record since Sir Alf)! England's players were too busy writing books and earning money to win anything. Sven has an untouchable club record which he thankfully seems to be carrying on at CITY. Most journalists say 'never heard of his signings', which obviously means their knowledge of international football is extremely limited! It looks like they're starting to hear of them now?

John, St Austell, UK

Oh dear Mr Samuels, your report was going so well, but you belied your true feelings in the last line. Come to Manchester, have a walk around the streets, then tell us who the second biggest club in Manchester are, I dare you.

Geoff, Manchester,

Bitter, bitter, bitter. GET over England!!! It's you're crying over an old girlfriend who you've found out not only loves someone else but in a far better way!!!

And GET used to Citeh playing fast flowing football this season. West Ham were poor, but Citeh were class, passed the ball around and didn't look like a team that had only just been put together. We can only get better!!!

Paul, Manchester,

You can certainly tell this is a london based journalist even the most hardened local Manchester United fan will admit to you that Manchester City are not the "second biggest club in Manchester" maybe the second biggest Manchester club in LONDON,our poor adversaries ,who cannot get a ticket because of their worlwide and london following ,carry a large if not massive following in SALFORD which although "ap nawrf" is not Manchester so please stick to match reports and not cheap digs at Sven,just out of interest how many ENGLISH that Sven had available to play the systems you suggest are Manchester United accommodating in their first team ....... Oh there is one who Sven picked several years before Alex , Hargreaves ring any Bells? Management is about getting the best fromwhat you have and unfortunately if you think England underachieved you are deluded ,with a bit of luck yes Sven could achieved more,but give the guy some putting himself back in the firing line,the guy gets my respect!

Mark Brierley, Milnrow, Lancs

Performing at the highest level is about pressure, and our players cannot cope with that pressure, it is why we lose at penalties and its why we get players sent off in big pressure games. You can blame Sven for not overcoming that problem BUT he has done better than any other in the last 40 years. Its the players that are weak in the head at the highest level. Sven is a terrific manager who himself copes with pressure very well.

O'Fortuna, Preston,

Oh, come on, they've only beaten West Ham after all. Wait until they have to tackle a Reading or a Middlesbrough.

Frank Upton, Solihull,

Dear Patrik,
If you don't hear much complaint about the current England manager that must be becuase you've got Swedish cheese in your ears.

Instead of conjuring up non-existent anti-Swedish bigotry, instead try to think of any entertaining games Sven's England provided in the last four years in exchange for his £20 million.

No?

jo, york,

Sven tried to use this system with England...several times...it didn't work.

Peter Wennman of the Swedish paper Aftonbladet pointed this fact out to you when you approached him after the match as did Svennis himself... how did you not notice his attempts?

English players have a certain style of play..as do most countries and other styles are 'perhaps' uncomfortable, unnatural for them.

Perhaps...just perhaps.. this system requires a non English player in the role Elano took on the weekend.

What ever the case...well done Sven...well done City

And the best of luck in the rollercoaster ride of English football.

Svewi, Stockholm, Sweden

Let's go in reverse order.

1. If you think Hamann had the same game as Ireland and Johnson, you obviously know nothing about football.

2. One club is in Manchester, the other is in Salford.

3. Elano was referred to as 'the new face of Brazillian football' we are delighted to have him, but make no mistake, he would walk into any othe premiership side.

4. I doubt time in the England side ever 'ruined' anyone. Wait till you see Elano on the right, or left, or behind a front two. England didn't have Elano, or even a player in his mould. Gerrard is a world class player, but he is still not Elano. Apples and Oranges sunshine.

5. Sven has outthought, outwitted and beaten both Curbishley and his critics, and instead of finally having some class and giving him some credit, you prefer to beat down his door with accusations without basis, I know you literary genuises will know what I mean when I call you a straw man. On the other hand, you may have to look it up.

Slim, Perth,

Staggeringly lazy to bring up the England stewardship rather than give a report on the match or the quality of the play and new players.

It's yet another dawn of yet another era at City. Pretty much a whole new team. And hopefully we have a manager who will prove himself as savvy as his previous club career highlights would suggest. I for one am interested in City, not Sven's perceived limitations as English coach.

Besides, we now have the columnist's choice. A home-grown English manager. So, quite how well is that faring?

John, Glasgow,

Martin Samuel, this article, like most others that you write, is utter nonsense.

I find it amazing that having sent you to Upton park to write a match report on West Ham vs Man City your editor lets you write an article on what a cr*p manager England Sven Goran Eriksson was.

It's all been said. There's no market for it any more. It's all become very, very boring.

tosh, london, England

You are sad, so, so, sad. If Sven did deserve to go because of Ronaldinhos fluke goal, Fat Frank and co's inability to score penalties etc. then after this article you should be a man and resign. What did you write about Hargreaves whan Sven 'discovered' him? McLaren tried something new 3-5-2, a great success. You are looking more and more like Ljungberg. So it would be alright if Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard,Cole played in the middle with Lennon and Cole again down the flanks. That's to many, and even though it was Svens idea, you need Hargreaves in there as well. Now take your coat...

David Ihse, London, UK

So much analysis so early!! Let's have another look at City and Sven in 8 weeks.

Richard B., Melbourne, Australia

Why do the English press continually give SGE a tough time? There's not a manager in the world who could have done better with the England team with the players at his disposal. Now the press are expressing shock that his new signings for City have gelled. Maybe there's an underestimation of the amount of homework that Sven and his management team do?
Hindsight will show just how important Sven was to England. Does anyone expect Steve McClarens' England to make even a quarter final? Seriously? England's loss will definitely be City's gain.

Ktwin, Stoke,

I will accept that City are the second bigest club in the Manchester area (City are the biggest in Manchester if for no other reason than United are not based in Manchester and never have been) A plane crash and the having the luck to be doing well when Sky came along have seen to that. but things can change jst as they have in the past. I am 45 and in my life time United were the second club in Manchester, United were in the second division, United had less money than City. In my fathers life time United didn't even have a ground and had to borrow Citys. A pity we did not refuse to lend it and then we might have been rid of United forever.

blue joe, Manchester not old trafford, England

Martin Samuel reminds me of a an Swedish journalist once stated that Anders "Viking" Eklund once would be heavy weight champion of the world. Martin Samuel seems to belive that the England team is one of the big nations in tournament after tournament... interesting.

Magnus Semmelman, Stockholm, Sweden

Interesting article, but slightly disingenuous. I suggest it is English football that seems welded to 442. All the pundits scream endlessly about 442...the suggestion that it is the only way to play attractive attacking football. Notwithstanding the fact that only one of the semifinalists in the last world cup employed the staid formation. Some even suggest that for England to achieve international success they have to play in the same fashion as they do in the premier league week after week ! The myopic assertion that Man utd employed 442 in winning the league last season. Utter rot ! Giggs did not hug the left touchline as in his younger days, but spent most of his playing time ranging across the midfield in support of his three attackers: Saha, Rooney and Ronaldo, the latter two continually changing position.
But I digress. I am no fan of Sven
He should have had the bottle to defy the critics & removed the strait jacket from the English team. The players had the nous to adapt.

Ollie, Kingston upon Thames,

Elano who? The Copa America champion and ‘the new face of Brazil’ according to Brazil coach Dunga. Pshaw - for the same money you could have bagged English committed team-player Nigel Reo-Coker…

66-cap one-goal-every-five-games Bulgarian winger Martin Petrov for £4.7m, for an extra million you could have snared 8-cap one-goal-every-ten-games English winger Kieran Richardson

Rolando Bianchi (£8.8m), who scored 18 goals last season in one of the most defensively minded leagues in world football; and Valeri Bojinov (£5.5m), the youngest foreigner ever to play in Serie A and who has a goals ratio of one every other game at international level, or Championship strikers Michael Chopra (£6m) and Kenwyne Jones (£5m)?

The fact is, Sven didn't have the right players at England...we are not as good as we (you) think. All Sven is, is your way of avoiding admitting England are not in the top 6 teams in the world! We are only just in the top 10!

Didn't Sven only lose 3 competitive matches?

Jay Wilson, Blackpool,

sounds like the owe trafford mr samuels is a tad upset ..be even more upset next sunday when he sees where the quality players are in Manchester

paul keys, caistor,

Fourth/ Fifth biggest club in London 0
Only club in Manchester 2

B Pye, Alty, UK,

Not a Man U supported by any chance are we, Mr Samuel?

A Thorn, London,

How predictably boring. There seem to be no grey areas in journalism. "Sven was rubbish with England" and after one game you're saying he's some sort of tactical genius with Man City. Ridiculous. And this all comes after the glaring publicity around his expensive "foreign" signings which really smacks of the press wanting him to fail so they could further label Sven a bad manager. The press seem to be perpetually circling him like vultures. Had City lost no doubt you press-guys would have got all excited dragging out the old cliches about how inept he is etc.

Sven has always been a decent manager. He didn't do so badly with England; the same as Hoddle in more tournaments, better than Keegan, better than Taylor, not too far short of Robson and no doubt better than Maclaren. He's only one of a handful of Premiership managers who have won a league title.

Nev, Amsterdam,

The lack of natives perspectives and references are astonishing and very much reflected by Samuel. I don´t think no one outside the island consider England as a candidate for the title World Champion.

I do not see any "stars" from the United Kingdom representing other FC in other european leauges but I see several foreigners contributing to the success of the teams in the premier leauge. In relative terms England is far behind France, Spain and Italy and small countrys like Netherlands

I like english football but seldom due to the talents from englishmen themselves hence I appreciate the fighting spirit and sportsmanship of theirs (good physics). The expectations of a manager creating a model supporting the attributes of english footballplayers skills is therefore not very easy neither for SGE or Steve Mc Laren. Samuel risk to be branded as a fool due to the poor analysis based on assumtions from the past - but it is obvious enogh for beeing a journalist in England

Magnus Semmelman, Stockholm, Sweden

"And Eriksson looked a great manager on Saturday" Wow !! That almost looked like a compliment. But you have to read the complete article to realise that it isn't.

“I am not restricted as I was with England,” Eriksson said. “As an international manager you hope to make the best of the players you have because you cannot buy". I for one think he has made a very valid point.

Mr Samuel, isn't it about time that you started writing about Eriksson as the new Man City manager, rather than as the ex-England manager ?

RJA, Nottingham, England, UK.

Listen to you now, EATING YOUR WORDS. Second biggest club.. maybe, but the richest club in Manchester. In every sense of the word financially and supported, unlike at OWE Trafford. One poor season away from bankruptcy
Reading between the lines your more bitter than were supposed to be. Dry your tears and join the Blue revolution at City.

Petetheblue, Manchester,

Let's face it, it doesn't take much to out-think Curbs. Even with a settled squad he'd have been floundering on Saturday. With a cut and shut, expensively patched up squad of mainly disinterested re-treads he had no chance. Even against the dubiously inscrutable Swede.

tThis ersult did not so much showcase Sven's talents as expose West Ham's limitation. If the Hammer's don't pull themselves together sharpish it'll be a downhill season.

But my my, the City fans (see other entries here) have not lost any of the touchy, easily offended, off-at the deepend at the slightest perceived slight, lack of objectivity for which they are so famed have they!

Claret and Boo Hoo, London,

darlo - couldn't agree more.
Let's face it - Sven had the best England record since '66. How often did your English coaches beat Germany 5-1 away? Diff McL./Eriksson? Took Sven 4 yrs to lose & McL 4 games. Intl football today is more competitive than it's ever been. Latvia can draw with Germany and Senegal can beat France. Portugal can certainly beat England. We may have best league in the world but as Sam Allardyce (he's English so maybe his words are worthy a comment Mr.football-expert-Samuel?) commented in Sun.Times -when best ENG strikers beside Rooney are Crouch & Bent u r short of options...All foreign influence in our league has limited our chances of winnin another world cup. Perhaps u should ask more football players of their views on Sven-Goran? Most England players, former & current, still hold him in high regard & fact he could sign so many quality players - of whom he knew nothin according to "experts" like Samuel - so quickly speaks of his rep amongst pro footballers.

Robert, London,

There's no inferiority complex like a sky blue inferiority complex.

Relax guys, and enjoy the victory. The chaos and dissappointment will re-establish themselves soon.

Claret and Boo Hoo, London,

I have alot of time for Mr Samuel as a writer, but isn't it time to drop the same old story about Sven's England? I was as perplexed as any other Englishman when he took Theo W instead of Defoe or SWP, and sure, England were boring, but several commentators said what SGE could not - you can only work with the tools you have at your disposal, and many of those were broken.
He made a judgement call, and perhaps did worse than we expected, but would another manager have done better? Sven has the best England record for winning games bar none.

Give it a rest and move on people.

Shropshire Blue, Shropshire, UK

to be totally fair, no more than a quarter of football fans in manchester support city, with around half supporting united.

and sven was a useless manager for england, gutless and charisma-free. things are no better under mcclaren because (a) he doesn't represent any kind of change in direction and (b) he makes sven look like the life and soul of the party.

city looked good at the week-end. they may get a sterner test, say... next week-end. :0)

jem, london, uk

Don't blame Sven, we had another excellent coach - Sir Bobby. No one since Sir Alf has been able to win us a major international competition . We need examine our set-up from 5-11 yrs old to see why we are not producing high quality young talent.

Haider, London,

Mr Samuels, you are so tedious. Your comment about Mr Ljungberg being past his peak equally applied to Mr Scholes during Sven's tenure as England coach.

England does not have natural players like Elano and have not had one in a long time.

It was people like you who did not let Sven get on with his job and in fact, destroyed England's chances in the world cup. I dont hear much complaint about the current England manager who have an abysmal record both as England manager and as manager in general. Has he won anything.... No! And unfortunately never will.

It all smells of bigotry if you ask me, i hope I am wrong.

Patrik, London,

Comon Sven! I dont understand how long it will take the people in england to understand that their national team is overated with premadonas that aint good enough!

Gavin, Birmingham,

it seems i have to look elsewhere if i actually want a report of the match!!

Gareth, Cardiff, Wales / Chicago, IL, US / UK

Tad hard on Sven. English players do not respond well or work well at a tactical level. 442 is something that derives from our poor internal coaching & players lack of adventure, they want to be safe.

See what happened when Mclaren tried to play with system against Croatia, the players are not comfortable with it.

We are constantly holding up our league as the 'best in the world' maybe it is about time that we realised that it might be the richest in pounds, shillings and pence but it sure as hell is not in terms of English bred consistent quality.

Mr Samuel, let me ask you one question. If someone offered to pay you £5M a year to get trained chimps to try to rewrite Shakespeare are you telling me that you wouldn't even try?

Could it actually be that we are not quite as good as we (or more to the point Sky) would like to think we are or is that too radical thinking & not going to shift enough sky+ boxes?

Jeremy, Farnham,

Why are media punters so incessant in their criticism of Sven? Even now?

His record with England was excellent and under his management we all had confidence that the team would do well. Now Steve McClaren is in charge of the 'Golden Generation' that confidence has been replaced with a fear that the team will embarrass themselves.

Why did the media expect and demand the team to win a major tournament? A quick comparison of the England squad with that of France, Spain, Brazil, Argentina, etc makes it clear that such an expectation was hopeful at best.

I for one was extremely disappointed when the media hounded Sven out. The MOTD team comments in particular were so crude and disrespectful that I was left open mouthed.

James Whittle, Sheffield,

"we English think our national side is better than it is in reality" in the words of the great John Mcinroe you (Paul Burke!, Burke being the opperative word) cannot be serious. We have over the last 5 years had some of the worlds best players, evidence is how good englsih clubs have been in the champions league, turn out for england with no desire, shape and guide. It is the managers job to give them direction and let them perform. We had great players under Sven and we didnt perform. That is why it is constantly brought to our attention as it hurt everyone to watch these players underperfor,

Mike, London, Uk

Chief football Correspondent!! Chief bitterness correspondent more like!! Martin, can you not get it into your head that for England Sven did as well as he could with the players we had. I have no doubt his approach actually saved us from embarassment rather than caused it. Sven is correct, excellent technically gifted English players are few and far between and when they come on the market they cost a ridiculous amount of money, e.g. £16.5 million for Darren Bent! I will have Elano, Geovanni, Bojinov together with our own academy players any day!

Mike Roberts, Buckingham,

Vey strong defensive and well organised. Good movement, but it looked more like 4 5 1 to me. Against a midfield four of Boa Morte, Bowyer and Lunjberg (non of them now at their athletic best) plus young Mark Noble, trying his best, the result was no more than could have be expected.

City, who seem to be an upmarket Bolton, will frustrate many teams and do well. West Ham, well they have only spent £1m net so what can you expect.

Steve, Romford, Essex

Fourth/ Fifth biggest club in London 0
Only club in Manchester 2

B Pye, Alty, UK,

Same old anti Sven. No mention of how the same England players have not improved under McLaren. McL previously recognised as top coach but England team performances no better. Nothing to do with Sven. Stop looking back and blaming coaches. Players were and are still simply not good enough - except in minds of media. So get used to the idea and move on.

darlo, manchester,

Whilst SGE could have been a more courageous England manager, i'd actually like to see him do well at Man City. It was interesting to see him nearly lose his cool, during a post-match interview with the BBC. Perhaps he's going to show us all kinds of new personal traits, during his time at Eastlands.

Peter Koeb, Geneva, Switzerland

"Elano is not Ronaldinho, because if he were, he would not be at Man City". What an undeserved slur that is on both Elano and Man City. I think the months and years ahead will surprise you with who will be signing for us

MRA4, Manchester,

Second biggest you say...maybe, but the RICHEST.
At OWE Trafford their just one poor season away from bankruptcy. Who's bitter now.

Petetheblue, Manchester,

LOL, When the hell are the press going to get over
themselves, SGE was the most successful England
manager since Alf Ramsey, in fact he has a better record,
check it out before you continue spouting your vitriole.
City played well and won,nothing more to be said.

FairMinded, Manchester,

One supposes Samuel failed Geography and has the memory retention span of a goldfish. When Sven changed the England team formation from 4-4-2 the players at his disposal were crap and he (Sven) got slated. Judge Sven on a full season not a match.

richard skelhorn, tripoli, libya

Bitter anyone? Get over it mr Samuel!!

Marcus, Gothenburg,

Most unbiased appraisal of Saturday's game that I've seen in any report.
Glad you didn't rehash the "same old, same old" already-tired story about Sven "only" signing foreign players so far during the transfer window.....it's already getting boring reading that one in the press and this is only the first game of the season!

Ben, Manchester,

The only club in manchester!

Paul, ontario, canada

mr.Samuel
The other team you refer to does not play in Manchester...it has a Trafford postal address...get your facts right.
Also, the majority of footy fans in Manchester support CITY and consider it a privilage to do so.
Your blatant anti-Sven stance will not increase circulation in the north west of England....I for one will not be buying another issue and can only hope that your editor will have a word with you regarding customer alienation!!

fishface, niort, france

How far into the season to we have to be until we can get a match report that doesn't one sidedly bemoan Sven's time as England manager (turning a blind eye to the obvious - that we English think our national side is better than it is in reality)?

Yes, we're bitter. Can we move on now please?

Paul Burke, Norwich,

You've excelled yourselves again - another pop at MCFC and Sven. When will you get over it? Move on ffs

why do you hate city?, springfield,

very strange, all i ever herd from jurno's when sven was England boss was English players play 442 week in week out, their happy playing that way we shouldn't play like johnny foreigner, were English and we play 442 just like we always have, i was not a great fan of a lot of England's performances under sven but at least i like many fans can at least lay some of the blame at some of the over paid players not just the over paid manager.

paul , manchester, gr manchester